User talk:Purgatory Fubar

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Karen Bausman
Hi,

I'm sure I'm missing something, but I don't see any overlap between the text of her article, and the link you provided in the speedy tag. What parts are copyvio, exactly? Best wishes, Xoloz 03:59, 9 May 2007 (UTC) This section is copy and past "copy vio". A rewrite would keep it from CSD G12. I will check back in a couple of days to see if any progress has been made, otherwise I will tag it again.

"Bausman's indelible mark on contemporary architecture has been widely acknowledged. In 1994 she was awarded the Rome Prize at a White House ceremony . In the same year, she was awarded The Cooper Union Citation for Outstanding Contributions to the Field of Architecture. She was elected a Fellow of the American Academy in Rome in 1995.

In 2005 the city of New York awarded Bausman a Design and Construction Excellence contract as part of Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg's ambitious effort to improve the architectural quality of government-financed libraries, community centers, and other structures in New York ."

Bausman undertook some high-profile interior work early in her career, including the New York headquarters for private clients Warner Bros. and Elektra Entertainment Group, offices that serve as important incubators in New York's vibrant entertainment scene [12]. She also executed commissions for numerous private residences. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 23:46, 9 May 2007 (UTC)

Jeff Shamrock
Sorry that you think my post is not relevant.....but I can assure you that it is.

Just ask the 90 thousand people that listen to my morning radio show every day.

thanks

Please readWP:BIO also Wikipedia is not an advertising service. Promotional articles about yourself, your friends, your company or products, or articles created as part of a marketing or promotional campaign, will be deleted in accordance with our deletion policies. For more information, see Spam. Thank you. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 20:03, 10 May 2007 (UTC)

indian (motorcycles): Fubar edit-reverts "explanation"
Dear Fubar

Your "explanation" on 6 May about the reverts to my edits to this page still does not constitute an explanation - you have simply made the same bald assertion as before, that "the page is correct as it stands". It is demonstrably not correct, and you can see this for yourself by visiting this company's website. May I ask, are you in some way connected with this company? It is hard to thimk of any other reason why you would allow them to use a wikipedia page to advertise their product. Can you please address the issue I have raised in a way that is supported by facts, rather than as dogmatic assertion unsupported by any facts or explanation. Regards, TIM —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 144.120.8.67 (talk) 23:26, 10 May 2007 (UTC).


 * Comprehension level, grade school. The article Indian (motorcycle) is about the company history and the name Indian (motorcycle) then and now. Purgatory Fubar  Converse or Snafu 18:18, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Akash page edits - not me!
Dear Fubar - further, on 6 May you seem to be attributing to me some edits that have occurred on a page about "Akash". This is not me. I have never visited this page, nor do I have any interest in its subject. Why have these edits been attributed to me?

Regards TIM —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 144.120.8.67 (talk) 23:29, 10 May 2007 (UTC).


 * The edit to Akash was reverted by MartinBot for page blanking from your IP. Purgatory Fubar  Converse or Snafu 18:18, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

User:Bobabot1
Greetings.

Thank you for your informative inquiry. I did not realize that my username was in conflict with Wikipedia policy. The origins of my username stem from the name of an autonomous robot I made for a robotics competition when I was younger. It has then transferred over into my username on the Internet. I would like to keep this username and I hope that this quells your concern over the matter.

Regards, Bobabot1 00:54, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

You may then want to go to WP:RFCN as the policy is clear. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 01:06, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

indian (motorcycle) reverts - thanks for explanation, but now for facts!
Dear Fubar, Thanks for providing some explanation that at least now allows me to understand your viewpoint, which had been hidden from us up 'til now. However please note that I do not dispute the presence of information about this new "Indian" company on a page about the original Indian company of 1901 - 1953. What I dispute is (1) this new company placing an advert for its products on this page (which appears to go beyond "neutral"), and (2) the new company purporting to have the same founders, foundation date, and city location as the original company, which is plain incorrect and is contradicted by their own company website. I propose edits (see my previous "talk" entries above) which would allow the material they placed on the page to remain, but with the true founders, true year of foundation, and true location, substituted for the erroneous information that is there at present. Please, please, pretty-please, may I be allowed to make these changes? Regards, TIM —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 144.120.8.67 (talk) 05:39, 12 May 2007 (UTC).


 * You still just don't get it. The new company is originated from the old. The copyrights ect.. from the old, belong to the new. There may be a better way to explain this, but for now, trust me, the article is correct. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 15:51, 12 May 2007 (UTC)


 * "For now, trust me, the article is correct"&mdash;could you provide more explanation, please ~ Anthony  17:58, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

The first part of the article is about the old Indian motorcycle company and it's founders, {George M. Hendee and Carl Oscar Hedström) the decline and demise followed by the rebirth of the company "A new company with facilities in Gilroy, California began manufacturing motorcycles badged under the famous "Indian" name in 1999 after purchase of the Indian trademark". It's in the article, just need to read it. Purgatory Fubar  Converse or Snafu 16:19, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Dear Fubar - me again (Tim). Two comments, one on a matter of substance, and one on a matter of style. Substance - purchase of a trademark does NOT mean the new company originated from the old. There is no corporate connection whatsoever. From the late fifties the Indian Sales Corporation simply stopped defending its rights to the Indian name and trademark, because they had no products with which to defend it. The Indian name became a flotsam of corporate America, with a number of firms laying spurious claim to it at one time or another but without clearly and definitively purchasing it from anyone. In the nineties two corporations both simultaneously laid claim, went to court over it, and Gilroy won (because they hurriedly made Harley clones with Indian badges to prove they had "Indian products"). The present company bought the "copyright" from Gilroy, and now plan to make another batch of Harley clones. Apart from the fact that they lucked out in getting rights to the Indian name which had gone undefended by the successors of the original Indian company for some fifty years, there is NO connection between this new "Indian" company and the original one that traded from 1901 to 1953 as manufacturers, and then traded for a further 10 years or so as a sales organisation selling British imports. This is a point that enthusiasts of "real" Indians feel passionately. The announcement of a new "Indian" is made at the end of the article - this ought to suffice. There is no need for an "advertisement" containing misleading information to also appear at the top of the article. I still propose that this misleading information be corrected, by substituting the information that appears in the company's own website.

On style - it is better that you do not make offensive comments that treat us like idiots, e.g. when you say things like "You still just don't get it". I feel that this approach is not within the spirit of wikipedia, to remain neutral, to carefully consider and to respect other people's opinions. We certainly do "get it" when it comes to Indian history, we know our stuff. I know you probably do have to deal with a lot of idiots on a daily basis, but don't assume that all newbies are idiots. You are supposed to be encouraging newcomers to become worthwhile wikipedians with words of guidance. We are willing to help improve the quality of the wikipedia entry, however you have no call to treat us like idiots. This is not the first time that this issue of style and behaviour has been raised with you. Regards- TIM

We? Who's we? Do you have the facts to back up your claim? Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 21:17, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I do. It is set out in a number of Indian marque histories, for example, The Iron redskin by Harry Sucher, Indian Motorcycles by Jerry Hatfield, and Illustrated Indian Buyers Guide also by Jerry Hatfield. If you wish, I can scan relevant pages and email them to you. Best regards, TIM P.S. "We" are enthusiasts of the original Indian company's products.

You can leave links here on this talk page. And if you don't mind me asking how many of you use your user name besides you? Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 21:37, 13 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Also could you please sign your comment by typing four tildes. Thank you. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 21:41, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Dear Fubar - I'll gather some material at home tonight and lodge it here tomorrow. Thanks for taking the time now to consider my point of view. User name - do you mean my IP address? I work for a University which has about 2000 employees, all sharing this IP. This is why I opened a wikipedia account now.

Tim, read my last comment please. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 21:46, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Okay, I'll try doing that now - TIM 144.120.8.67 03:31, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

AND NOW, LINKS:

This first one is by the loser of the Gilroy case, and sets out the whole history since 1953:

http://www.indiantrademark.net/

A short discussion of Indian trademark use and abuse appears at the end of this page by an impartial motorcycle historian - he makes the point that a lot of companies have done this, but none (including those recently successful in court)were a successor to, bought outright, or had any unbroken corporate link with, the original Indian Motorcycle Company founded by Hedstrom and Hendee:

http://www.kiwi-indian.com/100-years.html

According to this site, rights to the original Indian trademark fizzled out with English company AMC, who themselves ceased trading in the 1960s. US companies who "puchased" the trademark in the 1990s were actually in a race to claim in court a name that was owned by nobody in particular at that time.

http://www.totalmotorcycle.com/compendium/I.htm

Here's another summary of all the attempts to cash in on the Indian name by companies with no connection to the original Indian company.

And this, showing that the latest company is British, with NO connection to the original Indian company, who bought the Indian name from a company who won the name in court afetr several competing claims were settled between companies ALL of whom had NO connection wiht the original Indian company.

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2006/11/27/8394338/index.htm

I can find more if you want it, however web links are less authoritative than print sources which have been through an editorial process. Do you want me to provide print sources too, or do these websites provide enough evidence for this purpose?

Regards TIM 144.120.8.67

Dear Fubar - I checked my library at home last night, and found that print sources provide the most succinct summary of the Indian trademark story. Please allow me to quote from Illustrated Indian Motorcycle Buyers Guide by Jerry Hatfield, a noted American motorcycle historian.

"The English firm Brockhouse began financing Indian in mid-1949, when Indian started importing several brands of English motorcycles to be sold in Indian dealerships. A new marketing organization, Indian Sales, was formed to handle these English bikes.  In early 1950, Brockhouse took control of Indian, and installed a new management plan which included killing [Indian] 220cc singles and drastically reducing vertical twin production.  Beginning in 1954, Indian dealers offered only the Brockhouse-built Corgi folding mini-bike and Royal Enfield motorcycles .... re-labelled as Indians.  1959 was the last year of the Royal Enfield charade.  1960-1963: Although no  Indian-labeled motorcycles were forthcoming, for purposes of historical continuity I'll mention in passing the next phase of the Indian trademark.  Associated Motorcycles (AMC) of Great Britain, manufacturers of AJS and Matchless motorcycles, bought the right to the Indian name in 1960. National Headquarters remained in the Springfield, Massachusetts, area to keep up the connection with Indian's roots. To their credit, AMC didn't bother to stick the Indian logo on any motorcycles. The AMC connection lasted until 1963, at which time the national distributorship for Matchless motorcycles passed into the hands of the Berliner Motor Corporation, and all references to the Indian name were dropped. This marked the last period in which the Indian logo could be continuously traced from its historic beginnings."

What happened next is described in another book "Indian motorcycles" by Jerry Hatfield and Hans Halberstadt.

"In 1959, the remnants of the once mighty Indian firm passed on to Associated Motorcycles, the British builders of Matchless and AJS. What the British bought was the network of Indian dealerships, which now became "Matchless-Indian dealers".  From 1959 through 1962, these dealers sold Matchless motorcycles that were never labelled "Indian".  In 1962, Associated Motorcycles sold their American operation to Joseph Berliner, who, thankfully, laid the Indian name to rest - at least for the time being.

So powerful is the Indian name that various attempts have been made over the years to resume production of the American-made classics. These efforts have varied in sincerity and effort, ranging from obvious scams to fruition in the form of prototype machines. In 1968, Floyd Clymer, former publisher of Cycle magazine, wasn't contested in his use of the Indian name on several imported two-wheelers. Following Clymer's death in 1970, his widow sold the so-called trademark rights to the new Indian Motorcycle Company of Gardena, California. This outfit imported minibikes and for a while operated its own factory in Taiwan before going broke in 1976.

From 1978 through 1990, in subplots to complicated to report here, the trademark supposedly passed through the hands of Mr Carmen De Leone, Derbi Motor Corporation, back to De Leone, then a half-interest to Phillip S. Zanghi [the author goes on to list a string of other entities laying claim to the Indian name].

"The others have made much ado about trademark claims. These claims are murky at best, each reaching back to the estate of the late Floyd Clymer, who apparently didn't purchase the trademark from "The Indian Company" of Chicopee Falls, Massachusetts, last known legitimate trademark holder and importer of British-built Matchless Motorcycles."

Hatfield goes on to mention in an "Appendix: Indian timeline" that "The Indian Company" of Chicopee Falls, mass. went into liquidation in 1962. They did so without disposing of the Indian trademark or authorising its use by anybody else.

The websites above, and a quick google search using "indian motorcycle trademark", will soon illustrate what happened in the 1990s. Essentially the Indian name, not defended by any legitimate successor of the original company since 1962, was now "up for grabs". All the rival competing claims were consolidated into a single court case, and the judge found in favour of the company that was actually producing motorcycles bearing the Indian name, rather than just t-shirts or belt-buckles. The lucky winner was the Gilroy company, who has now sold this name to the present company mentioned in the wikipedia page.

I do not challenge the right of this company to use the Indian name on new motorcycles. I wish them all the best in their endeavours. I simply want to correct the impression created by the "advert" placed on the indian (motorcycles) wikipedia page that this new company has the same founders, date of foundation, and location, as the original Indian company that ceased manufacture in 1953. This is patently untrue. The corporate thread was broken in 1962 when Joe Berliner liquidated the company that was the last direct descendant of the original Indian company.

I propose that the edits I made earlier be allowed to stand: that the founders be "Steve Heese and Stephen Julius" not George M. Hendee and Carl Oscar Hedstrom, that the founding date be "2004" not 1901, and the founding location be "Kings Mountain, North Carolina" and the reference to Springfield, Mass., be deleted.

Best regards, TIM 144.120.8.67 22:04, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Well, the main part of the article is about the old indian founded in 1901. You can start a new article but I am assuming that eventually it will be merged back into the original article. As for the "Indian trademark use and abuse " you can always add a Controversy section to the article that claims to have purchaced the trademark, example, insted of the header, "The new Indian (1999-2003)" it could be "Controversy" and you can add the citations to this section. How ever, the date of 1901 and the founders "George M. Hendee and Carl Oscar Hedstrom" are historically correct. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 23:14, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Dear Fubar, please take the time to read the above print sources, and my editorial recommendations, carefully. There is no controversy from me that this new "Indian" company has purchased the Indian trademark and is entitled to use it (although there is certainly controversy from the Cow Creek Band- refer to the first link provided above). Rather, the controversy from me is whether or not this new "Indian" company is the same company as the original Indian company, with same founders, year of founding, and founding location. I have provided proof that it is not. The date 1901 and the founders Hendee and Hedstrom are only historically correct for the original Indian company that ceased manufacture of motorcycles in 1953 and was finally liquidated in 1962 without disposing of its trademark. No "Indian" company since 1962 has been entitled to claim 1901, Hendee & Hedstrom, and Springfield Mass., as its founding date, founders, and location. By adopting the small, simple editorial changes I have proposed, the indian (motorcycle) page can accurately reflect this. There is no need to start any new article, or add a controversy section. No other party is disputing here. Only you are disputing. You seem reluctant to adopt simple editorial changes, even when provided with clear evidence in support. You have me extremely puzzled. I ask again, can my proposed editorial changes be adopted? A simple "yes" or "no" will suffice, and if "no", then you need to provide sound reasons. Regards TIM 144.120.8.67 06:19, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * The main part of the article is about the old Indian founded in 1901 and the founders "George M. Hendee and Carl Oscar Hedstrom". I would make no since to have Seve Heese and Stephen Julius as the key people when they are not. Seve Heese and Stephen Juliusare are not now nor have ever been the founders of the Indian (motorcycle) company that the article is about. The article is about the Indian (motorcycle) company that George M. Hendee and Carl Oscar Hedstrom founded in 1901. If you want to create an article about The new Indian (motorcycle) founded by Seve Heese and Stephen Juliusare you are free to do so but, what I said above would most likely happen. Purgatory Fubar  Converse or Snafu 19:37, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Dear Fubar - okay, you make a good suggestion here, which I will be happy to have adopted if you are also in agreement. Following your logic to tackle the whole issue from a different direction, may I now propose that we leave intact the references to Hendee&Hedstrom, Springfield, and 1901 in that text-box at the top of the article, and simply delete from it the references in that same box to "Kings Mountain, North Carolina" and the web-link to the new company's web-page. This web-link is also present in the "external links" at the bottom of the article, so there is no need for it to be duplicated at the top in this text box. There is already sufficient information about the new Indian company in a short section at the bottom of the article, so I see no need to create a fresh article about this new company.

With those two small changes made (i.e. delete "Kings Mountain, North Carolina" and the web-link from the top box) the text box at the top of the page will then relate to the original Indian company, it will cease to be a surreptitious advertisment for a modern-day company's products in what is supposed to be a historical article about the Indian company of old, and the historical accuracy of the indian (motorcycle) page will be restored. Are you in agreement with this proposal? Regards TIM 144.120.8.67 20:48, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

That sounds great. It's what I said yesterday...smiles... Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 21:16, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

To just let you know, the article like it is now is similar to indianchiefmotorcycles.com past and present. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 21:47, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

So ... what happens next? Should I go ahead and make these two edits, without worrying that I may be banned from the face of the earth? TIM 144.120.8.67 22:10, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

That sounds great. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 22:12, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Dear Fubar - I may need your help to delete the word "Headquarters" - the html is not co-operating with me. This word still appears in the text box when saved, but doesn't appear in the html code. Regards TIM 144.120.8.67 00:07, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

It must be the nature of the info box. I tried to remove that section but failed. Best idea is to just leave it blank. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 00:18, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Okeydokes. TIM 144.120.8.67 01:22, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Akash edits - still not me
Dear Fubar, the Akash edits are not by me, however my IP belongs to an organisation with hundreds of employees so it is conceivable that someone else here did these edits. I have read the wikipedia "advantages of registration" page and now understand that registering with a user-name will help avoid me being punished for the sins of others. I have now registered, and will use my user name in future. Regards, TIM —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 144.120.8.67 (talk) 05:44, 12 May 2007 (UTC).

Very good. I hope you enjoy editing under your registered accout. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 15:43, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Administrator's noticeboard
I have appealed against you false allegation against me on the above page. Varsdra 19:50, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Commented there. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 16:42, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

God's Graveyard
I fail to see how the above username is in any way offensive. The username doesn't imply anything about God, not to mention, it's not specific to any religion. It only has the word "god" in it. From a google search, apparently "God's Graveyard" is a potential translation of Alabama, and as near as I can tell is not used anywhere in a derogatory way. At the very least, this is nothing like a blatant violation, so if you have a problem with the name, you need to discuss it with the user. And if they have good-faith contributions and you can't make a clear explanation as to why this name offends you, I'd just drop it. If you think it might potentially offend someone else, but it doesn't offend you, I'd still drop it. See WP:BITE. (And, btw, the place to report usernames these days is WP:UAA, not WP:AIV). Mango juice talk 17:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for the heads up on WP:UAA. Im not sure why we even have Inappropriate usernames in the policy if we are not going to follow it verbatim.Does WP:BITE trump policy? But never the less, I will drop it. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 17:34, 13 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Reread WP:U. It prohibits usernames that are offensive, not really all usernames in all those subcategories.  Also, re: Ganan, apparently it's been taken care of.  Mango juice talk 18:33, 13 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Who decides if the user name is offensive? I had help with restoring the page moves from, but thanks anyway. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 18:40, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Also, BITE does not apply as the account is almost 6 months old. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 22:55, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Apology.
Allow me to apologize. I just get mad when users ruin other peoples' hard work through vandalism. Won't hpapen again ;]. Pwnz0r1377 20:22, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

You need to change all of the ones that you have done. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 20:25, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Question about deletion
I would like to know why you deleted the page for WhyAbe.com First off, WhyAbe.com is a non-profit website and we get lots of questions about what it is used for and why it is free. It would be good to have in the Wiki world since many people ask questions about it.

Secondly, there are plenty of sites on wiki that are actual blatant advertisements and they are allowed to stay. Take for instance http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iasta which is actually a for-profit company that sells the same things that whyabe offers for free.

Or look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse_auction which is mainly an advertisement for another reverse auction vendor, carefully written so that it looks like a definition for something.

Or how about Ebay http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebay, which has pages and pages dedicated to it. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Sourceone1 (talk • contribs) 15:05, 14 May 2007 (UTC).


 * I do not have the power to delete articles, that is left up to Wikipedia administrators Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 16:06, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

re: Online colleges
Sure, but don't take my word for it, I'm not particularly interested in the subject. I proposed the merge since the content currently at Online colleges isn't very well-written, but something from it could be incorporated somewhere else. The singular Online college already redirects to the same article, so I just figured it could be a decent enough target. - Bobet 15:37, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

County Hall (Surrey)
Would love to hear your basis for the tags. For source, though not on the web, the published material by the couty archivist seems more WP:RS than lots of material on the web. And since it is not about him, it is about a building, it is like believing the congresional record for info about congress. For POV, suggest you just edit out whatever you think is biased.Obina 18:16, 17 May 2007 (UTC)
 * The section under "Today" is very much, a POV statment. Since I don't know much about the subject, I will let those who do fix the problem. This keeps me from stepping on other peoples toes. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 18:19, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Don't template the regulars
Hi. I noticed that you transcluded or substituted a template to respond to or notify a regular editor with whom you disagree. The main purpose of many of these templates is to inform the receiver of policy (e.g., that there is a numerical limit to reversion on content of an article within a time period, that personal attacks or vandalism can result in a block, that they can edit a page constructively without permission, etc.) It is likely that this editor knows this, and if he or she has breached or ignored these, please respond with a personal message. Thanks! KillerChihuahua?!? 19:02, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Onassis Foods
(error..I mentioned the wrong company. I'm a bit busy and losing track of things) I edited the article as best I could, using my own words.

I'm in no way affiliated with this company. It is a Greek company that employees Greeks and contributes to the Greek economy and is part of the country's history for almost 50 yrs. --Freecyprus 22:44, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Is it ok to recreate this article as it is part of the Economy_of_Greece topic? I'm not affiliated with any of the companies I've added to the List of Greek companies, I just like creating and editing articles about topics that relate to Greece and Cyprus. Cheers, FC. --Freecyprus 11:12, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

READ BEFORE REACTING
It would be a good idea to first read changes before reacting on your idea of information, not very good if one wants to have the truth of the orign of information, im a bit sick and tired of the editors in chief on this website that think they know more than the people who understand the orgins of the subjects that are listed. READ BEFORE REACTING! THANK YOU

THE ORDER OF THE DEFEATED DRAGON not just the order of the dragon.

I have made certain corrections on this artical firstly the 0rder was not created in 1408 but 1418 please see page 181 of the chivalry book ORDERS OF KNIGHTHOOD AWARDS AND THE HOLY SEE by Peter Bander van Duren, there have been many mistakes on the orgin and history of this order, it would be common sense of the writer of this artical to first verify the orgin of the order its true date and why it was created, it would be a bit strange if the sovereign lords who were the orders first members joined to protect the royal family of hungary? not a sensible reason for the time! The true history is as folllws the Order of the Defeated Dragon was formally established in the year 1418 by the Holy Roman Emperor Sigismund, after the Council of Constance, to defend the Church against the heretics, especially the Hussites. The defeated dragon is a symbol of the destruction of heresy. The Order flourished in Germany, and Italy. the order is not a order of the kingdom of hungary but the holy roman empire please note the aforementioned information. thank you

Please DO NOT delete content from Wikipedia. Please read welcome page to learn how to contribute to articles. Thank you. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 20:33, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Ervin Santana
No worries.Chris Nelson 21:41, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

read please!
It would be nice if you could contact me not just make threats on a subject you quite clearly know nothing about, thank you


 * Try to be a little more Civil when using the Edit summary and also please read No personal attacks like you did here

Also please read Verifiability before adding to articles. Thank you. Oh and one last thing, please sign your posts by typing four tildes ( &#126;&#126;&#126;&#126; ) at the end of your comment. You may also click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your name and the time you posted the comment. Thank you. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 20:02, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Shoreline and Morris Ruskin
Hi,

I'm wondering what I can do to make my pages on "Shoreline Entertainment" and "Morris Ruskin" permissible for use. You mentioned that the photo is the one from imdb.com, but because it belongs to our company I figured it's ok. Let me know what I must do to correctly have the page up and running. Thanks

Please read the comment I left on your talk page reguarding Copyright violations. Thank you. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 22:22, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

I did what I think should cover it. Please let me know if the pages are now cleared or what else I must do. Thanks.

Although I have taken the aforementioned changes, I have not heard back regarding the status of my new pages, so I am concerned they may be deleted without notice. What can I do to ensure that these pages are not deleted without my having a chance to work out their issues? I am doing my best to meet the Wikistandards but this is my first time and I would appreciate your guidance and reciprocity. Thank you.

The hang on tag is good enough right now, however you may want to address the issue on the articles talk page where an Wikipedia administrator may have time to review your comments also two other things. please read Conflict of interest and please sign your posts by typing four tildes ( &#126;&#126;&#126;&#126; ) at the end of your comment. You may also click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your name and the time you posted the comment. Thank you. Purgatory Fubar Converse or Snafu 23:05, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks--Mikey younesi 23:30, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

am sorry sir i am a real fan of boro n i just wanted to point out we r the best team in the north east, i wasn't intending to vanalise the page once again i am realy sorry

Hi there

Can I ask why you requested the article on UEFA Champions League 2008/09 be deleted. I can't quite understand why this should be, it may not be the next one that is coming up, but there are a lot of articles on this website that do this

e.g. F1 is in the 2007 season now, but there are pages created for the 2008, 2009 and 2010 seasons.

another example is the Olympic Games, this has articles for 2008, 2012 and even 2016 (which doesn't even have a venue yet)

I'm not upset or moaning in this message, but I just want an answer pure and simple, why is it everytime I do something on wikipedia you go ahead and delete it, when 99% of the things I do are accurate.

Please explain

Sheephead

About the 'Dragon Order' of Hungary
I included some months ago exact informations about the Orders current state, and the promintent members of today. I see after i did that some people fully deleted it claiming its 'pseudo-aristocratic propaganda', but he also removed a huge part of other things. (some were already restored as i see, but not anything)

In Hungary the Order is a legal, existing thing also today. It is true some other nations deny it, but as it exists I don't know to react to its deletion, I am right now simply suprised.

I am a Knight of the Order myself, that is why I thought a refreshing of the informations might be good on Wikipedia.

If needed I can proove it, or you can ask about the Order in the Hungarian Parliament or in any other way from the State.

I hope the deleted part will be restored, it was mostly about the current situation.

What i don't understand is what that person meant under 'pseudo-aristocratic', as nobility is existing today in Hungary, just as in many other nations, like UK too. Hungary is not a Kingdom anymore, but that doesn't mean that after the end of the communistic era some things weren't restored.

As i never edited Wikipedia before this I was not able to include the current (a bit modern) seal of the order.

Thank you for listerning to me.

PS: the Order was created in 1408. december 12 by the King and his wife, with the aid of Bishop Albeni Ébenhardt. I see even the creation date is disputed what is nonsene. Also it was started by the ruler, thus the Holy See only later acknowledged it (the Bishop was who 'allowed' it, but the Pope didn't know about it then yet)

last time I didn't write a hungarian 'expansion' to the hungarian Wikipedia, only to the english in the hopes that it gets to more people this way, still here I link the hungarian page so you see the current informations reflect what I said about the creation date (above) and that the order was restored and that it is legitime in Hungary today (at the end of the page you see 2001, the date of the formal resurrection when one of the relatives of II.Rákóczi Ferenc himself became a knight)

http://hu.wikipedia.org/wiki/S%C3%A1rk%C3%A1ny_Lovagrend

Also the Order has no 'defeated dragon' mentioned anywhere in its name, only 'dragon'.

Again, köszönöm (thank you) for your understanding, and sorry if my english isn't correct. please contact me about further informations if needed:

jorian@freemail.hu

good bye

EDIT: just as an extra proove about the creation time:

http://www.honvedelem.hu/hirek/kiadvanyok/honved_altiszti_folyoirat/nagy_magyar_kitunteteskonyv

a link to the Hungarian Army's homepage, an article about past deeds and awards.

I think you don't understand hungarian, but if you click 'search' in Firefox/Explorer (or anything else) and then you type 'sárkány' (what means dragon in hungarian) you get as result the place where the date is stated : 1408

Wikipedias very own article about the Rákóczi family to show that part is also true about the relative

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A1k%C3%B3czi

As you see the army homepage is real, so I hope this is enough to assure you that I say the truth. If not, then please just contact me via e-mail, as i meantioned it before.

Even the bosnian 'wikipedia bot'was making a connection to it after I made my edits on the article, but before it got vandalized and a huge part deleted, even that states 1408:

http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ordem_do_Drag%C3%A3o

(but i have to admit I don't understand bosnian, the date can still be seen perfetly)

Thank you, and bye again

Hello concerning the Order of the defeated dragon not just of the order of the dragon
Please can you show your source reference concerning your own view that it was just called the order of the dragon my reference is shown on the comments page at the base, thanks, ps unless you can give the above i will seek wikipedia attention on the true title of the order.

Life Fitness article
Hey I just wanted to ask if the speedy deletion had been avoided on my 'Life Fitness' article. On my talk page it says so but I just wanted to double check. Thanks

The Townsend 9
I don't understand what's wrong with the new page 'The Towsend 9'. It's an article about a unique type of sport/golf course. If is the advertisement of the tournament date, that has been removed. Otherwise, please clarify.

Wasn't an attack. Was an opinion. As are all these articles.

This Burning Earth
There may not be a ton of 'notable' places to find information about This Burning Earth, but that's mostly due to the fact that their album is not signed by a major label. They are as of now still self-producing every album and t-shirt sold.

Yep
Thanks for seeing that. I restored Bob Richardson (photographer). CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 05:40, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

I understand LoveStill might not be a known term in neologism, but what i have done is create a word that describes not only people in the present but also from the past. There are many people in this world who undergo this type of confusion and pain I only wished to put it into words so that maybe others can understand their not alone and maybe break their LoveStill. Its not something i just came up with in a whim, I discovered LoveStill doing case studies for my pyschology class and wished to only receive peoples collective input in which only Wikipedia offers

I understand LoveStill might not be a known term in neologism, but what i have done is create a word that describes not only people in the present but also from the past. There are many people in this world who undergo this type of confusion and pain I only wished to put it into words so that maybe others can understand their not alone and maybe break their LoveStill. Its not something i just came up with in a whim, I discovered LoveStill doing case studies for my pyschology class and wished to only receive peoples collective input in which only Wikipedia offers.--Jojogl 08:16, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

You suck

Acorralada
The reason I wanted to know about Acorralada is because I wanted to know what U.S. state that the telenovela was filmed in, who the characters were and things like that.

whatever
I cannot find secondary sources for Celio, partly because I live in America and do not know French, and even though probably there are articles and pages on Celio in English that are secondary, I really do not know what "Secondary" means. I think that my sources are credible enough. Look at Alfred Dunner. I created that article and it only sights the website, but yet there is no problem there.--Lollypoplollypopohlollylollylolly 05:21, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

sorry i sent this to the wrong user.

Why it is a cartoon series some guy made!! I think every one has the right to make what they want

Prod
Hey, you know that if you agree with a prod of an article, you can use the prod2 template to show this. --Haemo 06:27, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

Joseph McManners
Are you an admin? Do you have banning powers? These vandals have been at it all night Ryan|(talk) 06:17, 9 July 2007 (GMT)

I don't understand what the problem is with 'The Townsend 9' page. Please leave a message for me to tell me how to fix it.

I'm confused by why sources documents are being deleted?
I'm confused by why sources documents are being deleted?

mpn

The God Who Wasn't There
Just to let you know that this wasn't vandalism - we have a knowledgeable editor on this page who prefers to edit as an IP. Not quite sure why you thought it was bearing in mind the title of the article but thought I should warn you as he may look like a persistent vandal as he does edit on a semi-regular basis to such pages. Sophia 06:47, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

article
Why is my article about Jack Barakat from All Time Low marked for deletion?

AllxTimexLowxRocks

Edits
Whoever made the edits you claim were me about Current etc. was not me. Thank you, Dave F —Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.233.193.66 (talk) 03:33, 14 September 2007 (UTC)
 * also regarding the Beyonce page I did not make any link to myspace Tommy22028 20:13, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Not me!
Dear FUBAR friend, I did not make the changes you mentioned in messages to me. I myself am a calm and pleasant 49 year old working wife of a 50 year old husband and mother of three adult sons, and a PT RN student. I drive a rather tired 2K Chevy van, and dream of an original red Karmann Ghia coupe convertable. I would appreciate your lifting the undeserved censure and ban on me. I didn't do the reprehensible deed. Sincerely, Vicki142.161.49.49 (talk) 16:57, 25 June 2008 (UTC)

ArbCom elections are now open!
MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 16:37, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

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