User talk:QuakerIlK

Orphaned non-free image File:Josef Čada 1920.jpg
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Orphaned non-free image File:Josef Čada 1920.png
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Orphaned non-free image File:Stanislav lndruch 1920.png
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Orphaned non-free image File:Jan Karafiát 1920.png
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Orphaned non-free image File:Jan Koutný on High Bar circa 1925.jpg
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Orphaned non-free image File:František Erben ca 1920.jpg
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Unspecified source/license for File:Map of selected castles of Scotland.png
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File:Map of selected castles of Scotland.png listed for discussion
A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Map of selected castles of Scotland.png, has been listed at Files for discussion. Please see the to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. Whpq (talk) 23:50, 16 July 2020 (UTC)

Hi there! I addressed your concerns as best as I could, in addition to the concerns articulated in the bot-generated message that is featured immediately preceding your message on my talk page. I did these on the talk page you specified. QuakerIlK (talk) 02:05, 17 July 2020 (UTC)

License tagging for File:Map of selected castles in Scotland.png
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Deleting images you uploaded
You can request the deletion of an image you uploaded by tagging it with db-author -- Whpq (talk) 11:28, 18 July 2020 (UTC)

Thank you. QuakerIlK (talk) 04:40, 24 July 2020 (UTC)

Unspecified source/license for File:Map of Selected Castles of Scotland.png
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This is an automated notice by MifterBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Media copyright questions. NOTE: Once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. --MifterBot (Talk • Contribs • Owner) 18:45, 23 July 2020 (UTC)
 * Did you meant to license it CC0? There is no valid license tag on it right now. -- Whpq (talk) 19:36, 23 July 2020 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Popular castles of Scotland


The article Popular castles of Scotland has been proposed for deletion&#32;because of the following concern: "This is all original research. Please see the talkpage and this discussion."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Bishonen &#124; tålk 15:26, 28 July 2020 (UTC)


 * I see that you've participated in the discussion on the article's talk page. While I believe that the page is original research and should be deleted, I do wish to remind you that anyone, including yourself, may remove the proposed deletion notice from the page. If you choose to do so, someone will probably nominate the article for a full deletion discussion, which might attract a broader range of opinions and give you another chance to make your case. pburka (talk) 21:31, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

Nomination of Popular castles of Scotland for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Popular castles of Scotland is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Popular castles of Scotland until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article. Bishonen &#124; tålk 14:14, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:Siberia and Him - official movie poster.jpg
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Proposed deletion of Suzanne Vega: Sessions at West 54th


The article Suzanne Vega: Sessions at West 54th has been proposed for deletion&#32;because of the following concern: "Fails WP:NALBUM and an implausible search term so a redirect would not make sense."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

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Please consider improving the page to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. AleatoryPonderings (talk) 01:31, 9 October 2020 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Suzanne Vega: Live in London 1986


The article Suzanne Vega: Live in London 1986 has been proposed for deletion&#32;because of the following concern: "Fails WP:NALBUM and an implausible search term so a redirect would not make sense."

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, pages may be deleted for any of several reasons.

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Nomination for deletion of Template:Most Popular Castles of Scotland
Template:Most Popular Castles of Scotland has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Star cheers peaks news lost wars Talk to me 00:33, 10 October 2020 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:František Erben in 1907.png
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Orphaned non-free image File:Zdeněk Růžička.jpg
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Links in filenames are impossible
As you requested a filename including a link for File:Zdeňka Honsová, from the Official 1948 Summer Olympics Report.jpg. This is not possible. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 14:28, 2 December 2020 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Zdeněk Růžička (disambiguation)


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 * disambiguated only one extant Wikipedia page and whose title ended in "(disambiguation)" (i.e., there is a primary topic);
 * disambiguated zero extant Wikipedia pages, regardless of its title; or
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Disambiguation link notification for December 12
Hi. Thank you for your recent edits. An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Artistic gymnastics, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Gymnastics at the Alternate Olympics. Such links are usually incorrect, since a disambiguation page is merely a list of unrelated topics with similar titles. (Read the FAQ* Join us at the DPL WikiProject.)

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Orphaned non-free image File:Vlasta Děkanová among other Czechoslovakian Leaders in 1948.png
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Disambiguation link notification for December 26
An automated process has detected that when you recently edited Gymnastics at the 1948 Summer Olympics – Women's artistic team all-around, you added links pointing to the disambiguation pages Dorothy Smith and Pat Evans.

(Opt-out instructions.) --DPL bot (talk) 06:08, 26 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Thank you, DPL bot. Error fixed.QuakerIlK (talk) 06:12, 26 December 2020 (UTC)

Malformed Filing at DRN Deleted
You filed a malformed case at DRN. I was not entirely sure what the nature of your complaint was, and so I deleted your filing rather than modifying it. It would have confused the archival bot. Please use the template that we provide, and follow our instructions. Robert McClenon (talk) 06:40, 27 December 2020 (UTC)

Image tagging for File:Vlasta Děkanová on the Uneven Bars 1936 Olympics Official Report.png
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 * This makes zero sense to me as I fully documented the origin and creation of this image when I originally uploaded it. Now that there have been some back-and-forth edits, and I reconsulted the Wikipedia basic policy on image size, as well as considered that it is a non-free image which merits an exception to this file size, I merely re-uploaded this image with the same display size, but very significantly-reduced file size.


 * I am not sure how to bring this to an attention to a bot, rather than an actual person, so I am hoping that the concerned edit will stand and that this response will go noted. QuakerIlK (talk) 16:11, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
 * Besides the bracket you missed which caused the bots to come after you, I can't find Vlasta Děkanová in https://web.archive.org/web/20180612162843/http://library.la84.org/6oic/OfficialReports/1936/1936v1sum.pdf. You say she's on page 867 but the report doesn't even have that many pages. Also, I believe the image is not actually compliant with WP:NFCC, in particular the "Minimal usage" section. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 18:19, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
 * The issue with findability has just now been fixed. I used the original source (from when I actually first downloaded the PDF) URL, which had expired, so I had to go back to the host website and look for the new version and get that URL, which I did.  Additionally, the photo was from the 2nd part of the report, which was in the 2nd (of 2) PDF files for the report, hence page 867 (which it was in the original BOOK) being extended beyond the number of page numbers in the document.  So, I made this more clear in the appropriate field on the file page for the image.


 * As for your belief of the image not being compliant with minimal use, I went back and read Non-free_content_criteria which covers that minimal use and read both 3a and 3b, and I honestly don't see how it doesn't comply. I stated in the minimal use field "This photograph will likely only be used in the subject's biography page and will likely be linked to by, at the most, only a handful of other pages.", and this is true, although if it is linked-to in other pages or used by other users, as long as still within a fair-use framework, I can't control that - it is incumbent upon future Wikipedians, whose work might intersect with this file, that they remain compliant with fair-use legalities.


 * P.S. I know it's my responsibility to try my best to comply with Wikipedia etiquette and standards of legality, but I truly am constantly improving on here.  I have spent now, definitely a few hours between today and when I first uploaded this the day before yesterday, just trying to get this one file up on here and 'battle with bots' and technicalities, reverting, re-uploading, etc etc.  I would really love it, if you see any more problems with it, continue to help like you already have.  QuakerIlK (talk) 18:45, 26 January 2021 (UTC)
 * 3a: Minimal number of items. Multiple items of non-free content are not used if one item can convey equivalent significant information.. Vlasta Děkanová already has a fair use image in the infobox. Usually articles have only one fair use image, though exceptions exist. I'm no sports expert so I can't say for sure. You could ask for help at the teahouse. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 19:02, 26 January 2021 (UTC)

Image tagging for File:Vlasta Děkanová on the Uneven Bars 1936 Olympics Official Report.jpg
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Orphaned non-free image File:Vlasta Děkanová on the Uneven Bars 1936 Olympics Official Report.png
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== List of individual medalists in Artistic Gymnasts at the Olympics and World Championships before 1952 moved to draftspace ==

An article you recently created, List of individual medalists in Artistic Gymnasts at the Olympics and World Championships before 1952, is not suitable as written to remain published. It needs citations from reliable, independent sources. (?) Information that can't be referenced should be removed (verifiability is of central importance on Wikipedia). I've moved your draft to draftspace (with a prefix of " " before the article title) where you can incubate the article with minimal disruption. When you feel the article meets Wikipedia's general notability guideline and thus is ready for mainspace, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page. John B123 (talk) 11:37, 7 February 2021 (UTC)


 * This is an interesting action from you, John B123. Neither am I familiar with, nor have I ever even heard of Draftspace before.  I like that rules surrounding it are so much more flexible than rules regarding articles that have been proposed for deletion.  As it stands, the list (now a draft of a list) is something I wanted to collate and publish and have for ready reference.  It is an *idea* at this point - perhaps something to build upon and further integrate into Wikipedia, somehow.  I think that perhaps further things can be done with it (not 'merely' adding references), but at this point, I am not sure exactly what.  I would love it if I could find other editors that are interested in it, but I have not yet actively pursued trying to find any or bringing it to anybody's attention, just yet.QuakerIlK (talk) 15:28, 7 February 2021 (UTC)
 * Hi QuakerIlK, you could try asking at WikiProject Gymnastics to see if any of the editors there would be interested in improving the article. Regards. --John B123 (talk) 15:34, 7 February 2021 (UTC)
 * I had thought about doing specifically just that, John B123, but somehow felt a little reticent about it. But as per your suggestion/encouragement, I did just that, now, via its talk page.  QuakerIlK (talk) 15:51, 7 February 2021 (UTC)

Replaceable fair use File:Alois Hudec from 2016 Science of Gymnastics Journal article.jpg
Thanks for uploading File:Alois Hudec from 2016 Science of Gymnastics Journal article.jpg. I noticed that this file is being used under a claim of fair use. However, I think that the way it is being used fails the first non-free content criterion. This criterion states that files used under claims of fair use may have no free equivalent; in other words, if the file could be adequately covered by a freely-licensed file or by text alone, then it may not be used on Wikipedia. If you believe this file is not replaceable, please:


 * 1) Go to the file description page and add the text  below the original replaceable fair use template, replacing   with a short explanation of why the file is not replaceable.
 * 2) On the file discussion page, write a full explanation of why you believe the file is not replaceable.

Alternatively, you can also choose to replace this non-free media item by finding freely licensed media of the same subject, requesting that the copyright holder release this (or similar) media under a free license, or by creating new media yourself (for example, by taking your own photograph of the subject).

If you have uploaded other non-free media, consider checking that you have specified how these media fully satisfy our non-free content criteria. You can find a list of description pages you have edited by clicking on [ this link]. Note that even if you follow steps 1 and 2 above, non-free media which could be replaced by freely licensed alternatives will be deleted 2 days after this notification (7 days if uploaded before 13 July 2006), per the non-free content policy. If you have any questions, please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you. Whpq (talk) 12:50, 12 February 2021 (UTC)


 * Hi, Whpq. I have followed both of the steps that you suggested.  Please fully consider my rationales.  A further investigation of file alternatives, if undertaken given the link, to the Czech National Archives, that I provided for the satisfactions of both steps 1 and 2, should reveal that in light of the rationale I have given (more fully on the file discussion page), my endeavors have brought this file into full fair-use compliance.  Thank you.  QuakerIlK (talk) 17:37, 12 February 2021 (UTC)
 * An administrator will review your objection and take that into consideration when making a decision. Having said that, I don't think you have much of case to override WP:NFCC.  Having a better non-free picture does not negate the fact that there is a freely licensed image. -- Whpq (talk) 18:14, 12 February 2021 (UTC)

Nubia
Hi QuakerIlK. I noticed that you introduced a lot of opinion-type phrasing into the Nubia article. Some of that was changed back to the version before my recent changes, and some is new. The only new source you added was a comic book, which is obviously a primary source and not something that can be used to support your personal opinions. Please read No original research to understand why I reverted these changes. Thank you. Benicio2020 (talk) 20:18, 4 June 2021 (UTC)
 * I am becoming increasingly comfortable and confident in my edits. I am also becoming increasingly comfortable with being able to make a claim of you engaging in an edit war in a deletionist-style manner.


 * To begin with, your original deletion of my *entire* edit was a claim of it being original research, yet you failed to articulate any specifics about that and ignored how my edit was based on already-sourced material that was already in the article (moreover, I also provided evidence that it was not original research). Additionally, in your first response to me, you quoted Verifiability with the quote "Any material that needs a source but does not have one may be removed", but even with application of that statement, you 1) made the mistake of failing to recognize that my edit was, indeed, based on already-sourced material within the article and; 2) probably did not pay close enough attention to a key term in that short quote - "may".  The quote does not state "MUST be removed" or "SHOULD be removed" - it merely says "MAY be removed".  That does not give somebody carte-blanche permission to delete whatever they want on Wikipedia for whatever reason they want.  A continued pursuit of this, especially against the same material from the same editor, with reasons that 1) change and 2) are not very rooted in much specificity or good reason, looks really bad on the part of the instigator (in this instance - you).


 * In this most recent reversion of yours, some of the material you deleted, you articulate a reason here on my talkpage for doing so, yet other material you reverted/deleted *for no stated reason, whatsoever*. Additionally, there are two problems with your stated purpose for reverting/deleting my recent addition - "a primary source and not something that can be used to support your personal opinions":   1) primary sources are not categorically disallowed from Wikipedia and 2) you fail to demonstrate having consulted the source yourself so that you can even offer a difference of opinion.  (Edited to add:  Not even an hour-and-a-half went by between my making that edit and you 1) deleting some material for no stated reason, whatsoever, and 2) making a deletion without any demonstration of consulting a source to determine its relevancy).


 * Also, by questioning my edits, as well as the reliability of both my edits and the reliability and relevancy of multiple sources, you open to door to making an edit war personal. I did respond to your revisions/reversions of my first edit, but not your revisions/reversions of my second and third edits (because I would rather do the work and get something accomplished rather than arguing about it) - in your revisions/reversions of my second and third edits, a *number* of questions arise as to the legitimacy of your revisions/reversions, and those can potentially be catalogued and added up against your favor in a Dispute resolution.  This is my last warning to you before I initiate one of those.QuakerIlK (talk) 22:06, 4 June 2021 (UTC)

Orphaned non-free image File:DC Comics Presents No. 41 January 1982 Wonder Woman Insert page 7.png
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Orphaned non-free image File:Wonder Woman number 211 April and May 1974 page 52.png
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June 2021
 You have been blocked from editing for a period of 24 hours for edit warring, as you did at Nubia (character). Once the block has expired, you are welcome to make useful contributions. During a dispute, you should first try to discuss controversial changes and seek consensus. If that proves unsuccessful, you are encouraged to seek dispute resolution, and in some cases it may be appropriate to request page protection. If you think there are good reasons for being unblocked, please read the guide to appealing blocks, then add the following text below the block notice on your talk page:. NinjaRobotPirate (talk) 07:13, 28 June 2021 (UTC)

This is a test. QuakerIlK (talk) 07:37, 28 June 2021 (UTC)

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Jelica Vazzaz
Before you start another edit war over your insistence on adding superlatives that aren't supported by reliable sources, I suggest you take it to the talk page first. It was only June 28, 2021, that you were last blocked for this behavior. Let's not repeat that please. Benicio2020 (talk) 19:01, 30 August 2021 (UTC)

I'm the one who created the article, fed tons of text through translation, compiled a number of resources, uploaded images following all normal Wikipedia protocol, formatted it, and put the whole article together. YOU have merely made a few tiny insubstantive edits, even admitting to mistakes in the process, therefore YOU cannot claim that it's an edit war that I instigated because it's not material that you put up and you are the instigator/deleter. You also have made multiple deletions of the same material with reasons that vary from one deletion to another. First, you delete this material because you claimed only one author/source, WHICH WAS WRONG to begin with. Now, you call into question the reliability of the sources with a factually inaccurate rationale.

You also seem ignorant of the Wikipedia policy that just because someone has been blocked before, that doesn't mean that they are to be treated with prejudice.

You're giving me a really good argument to make against you for hounding.

If you persist in turning this into a second edit war, you will get a much more vociferous fight this time.

Do you really want to minimize the importance of a sports figure of national importance who was a World War II Concentration Camp Survivor? QuakerIlK (talk) 19:58, 30 August 2021 (UTC)
 * One of the sources is her anonymous 2007 obituary. The other source is a thesis from a college student that lifted that same line word-for-word from the obituary. (Basically plagiarized) I'm going to ask you one last time to discuss this on talk and get other editors' opinions on it. Please understand that you creating the article does not give you authority to veto other editors' fixes. See WP:OWN. Benicio2020 (talk) 16:13, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

August 2021
You currently appear to be engaged in an edit war&#32; according to the reverts you have made on Jelica Vazzaz. This means that you are repeatedly changing content back to how you think it should be although other editors disagree. Users are expected to collaborate with others, to avoid editing disruptively, and to try to reach a consensus, rather than repeatedly undoing other users' edits once it is known that there is a disagreement.

Points to note: If you find yourself in an editing dispute, use the article's talk page to discuss controversial changes and work towards a version that represents consensus among editors. You can post a request for help at an appropriate noticeboard or seek dispute resolution. In some cases, it may be appropriate to request temporary page protection. If you engage in an edit war, you may be blocked from editing. Benicio2020 (talk) 16:17, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
 * 1) Edit warring is disruptive regardless of how many reverts you have made;
 * 2) Do not edit war even if you believe you are right.


 * This is a clear case of hounding. Benicio 2020 has made changes or deletions to my edits on 3 different articles, all unrelated to each other, and all previously unedited by him/her.  During this most recent dispute, he/she essentially threatened me saying "Before you start another edit war over your insistence on adding superlatives that aren't supported by reliable sources, I suggest you take it to the talk page first. It was only June 28, 2021, that you were last blocked for this behavior. Let's not repeat that please." suggesting that I was aiming to be blocked again.  I repeat, this is a clear case of hounding.  QuakerIlK (talk) 23:20, 31 August 2021 (UTC)

Another thing to avoid in the future: Attacking another editor in your edit summary, as you did here: "Either Benicio2020 doesn't know how to use "Google translate" or Benicio2020 is an outright liar". I was not happy to read that. Benicio2020 (talk) 16:08, 1 September 2021 (UTC)


 * That's what you're likely to bring out in a person if you are hounding them, which you are clearly doing, and which is why there are policies here on Wikipedia for doing such a thing. QuakerIlK (talk) 16:23, 1 September 2021 (UTC)

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An automated process has detected that when you recently edited 1913 World Artistic Gymnastics Championships, you added a link pointing to the disambiguation page Pietro Bianchi.

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CS1 error on 1931 World Artistic Gymnastics Championships
Hello, I'm Qwerfjkl (bot). I have automatically detected that this edit performed by you, on the page 1931 World Artistic Gymnastics Championships, may have introduced referencing errors. They are as follows: Please check this page and fix the errors highlighted. If you think this is a false positive, you can [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?action=edit&preload=User:Qwerfjkl/Botpreload&editintro=User:Qwerfjkl/boteditintro&minor=&title=User_talk:Qwerfjkl&preloadtitle=Qwerfjkl%20(bot)%20–%20QuakerIlK&section=new&preloadparams%5b%5d=&preloadparams%5b%5d=1223257228 report it to my operator]. Thanks, Qwerfjkl (bot) (talk) 22:11, 10 May 2024 (UTC)
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Speedy deletion nomination of Hendricus Thijsen


A tag has been placed on Hendricus Thijsen requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G4 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the page appears to be a repost of material that was previously deleted following a deletion discussion, at Articles for deletion/Hendricus Thijsen. When a page has substantially identical content to that of a page deleted after a discussion, and any changes in the content do not address the reasons for which the material was previously deleted, it may be deleted at any time.

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Very short articles about gymnasts
Hello. Please note that WP:SPORTCRIT is a policy that contains the following: "Sports biographies must include at least one reference to a source providing significant coverage of the subject, excluding database sources". Please only make sports biographies that follow this policy. Geschichte (talk) 10:18, 16 May 2024 (UTC)


 * Hi, Geschichte. Can you please be item-specific?  Thank you.QuakerIlK (talk) 11:52, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
 * From looking at my contributions page and at the edit history of most (or all?) of the articles that you draftified, it appears that you did so without any discussion or raising any questions or getting any sort of consensus. I did provide "at least one reference" from the most authoritative legislative organization within the sport.  The question remains as to whether the source is a tertiary or secondary source, because sometimes these lines can be blurred.  In any event, the reference that I consistently used for every article creation or move from draftification to mainspace was an official 125-year FIG anniversary document, which is not "merely a database", much less that of "Sports Reference's college football and basketball databases", and I am using it to create stubs ONLY for individual medalists at the World Championship and/or Olympic level.  Being a world championships individual medalist, in and of itself, out to be enough to satisfy notability guidelines.  Would you care to have an actual discussion on this?QuakerIlK (talk) 12:26, 16 May 2024 (UTC)


 * The consensus is very well established. The discussions spanned several years. The result of that discussion is outlined in WP:SPORTCRIT which I already quoted, and linked. Significant coverage equals biographical information about the person, which being mentioned in a table of medalists does not satisfy. Biographies that lack the requisite sources belong in draft space, where they can accrue the desired sources over time. Geschichte (talk) 13:15, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
 * According to WP:SPORTCRIT, "The guidelines on this page are intended to reflect the fact that sports figures are likely to meet Wikipedia's basic standards of inclusion if they have achieved success in a major international competition at the highest level." The guidelines that follow therein are guidelines and not hard-and-fast rules.  Guidelines and rules are not the exact same thing.  Furthermore, the information source is neither merely a database, nor a primary source, nor a fan site or blog; rather, the information source is the 125th anniversary publication of the International Gymnastics Federation and could not possibly be more official.  Furthermore, ALL of the individuals whose article stubs I created yesterday and who you draftified were individual medalists at a World Championships, including:
 * François Walravens - silver medalist with his team and silver medalist on the rings at the 1903 Worlds
 * Eugène Dua - silver medalist with his team and bronze medalist on the parallel bars at the 1903 Worlds
 * Karel Sál - gold medalist with his team and bronze medalist on the pommel horse at the 1907 Worlds
 * Armand Coidelle - gold medalist with his team and bronze medalist in the all-around at the 1909 Worlds
 * Angelo Mazzoncini - bronze medalist with his team and bronze medalist on the rings at the 1909 Worlds
 * Stane Vidmar - bronze medalist on parallel bars at the 1911 Worlds and silver medalist with his team and silver medalist on the parallel bars at the 1922 Worlds
 * Miroslav Karásek - gold medalist with his team and gold medalist on the rings at the 1922 Worlds
 * Vladimir Simončič - silver medalist with his team and silver medalist on the parallel bars at the 1922 Worlds
 * Just for the record, that makes 8 individual world championship medalists (ALL of whom were ALSO team medalists), who were briefly blue active links, who YOU singlehandedly and without discussion or consensus moved from article mainspace into draftspace, thereby turning them into red inactive links that would lead at least the casual reader to believe that there is no further information on them on Wikipedia, and which also lessens that chance that they will actually grow from stubs into anything even remotely resembling an article.QuakerIlK (talk) 14:30, 16 May 2024 (UTC)
 * Just my opinion, but I think taking them to AFD would be better than draftification. At AFD at least you've got some people looking for coverage; draftification is a death sentence as no one's looking. BeanieFan11 (talk) 17:58, 16 May 2024 (UTC)

Hans Nagelin moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Hans Nagelin. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:01, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Leo Schürmann moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Leo Schürmann. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:01, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Kurt Krötzsch moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Kurt Krötzsch. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:02, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Charles van Hulle moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Charles van Hulle. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:04, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Georges Wiernicks moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Georges Wiernicks. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:05, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Josef Sykora moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Josef Sykora. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:05, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Heinz Sandrock moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Heinz Sandrock. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 17:06, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Marcel Adatte moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Marcel Adatte. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar 💬 19:32, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Jaroslav Kolinger moved to draftspace
Thanks for your contributions to Jaroslav Kolinger. Unfortunately, I do not think it is ready for publishing at this time because it needs more sources to establish notability. I have converted your article to a draft which you can improve, undisturbed for a while.

Please see more information at Help:Unreviewed new page. When the article is ready for publication, please click on the "Submit your draft for review!" button at the top of the page OR move the page back.  Waqar <span style="background:#0000FF;padding:2px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">💬 19:32, 17 May 2024 (UTC)


 * Iwaqarhashmi, you are still relatively new to Wikipedia. You have been on Wikipedia for less than 2 years, however I have been on Wikipedia for over 15 years (either as QuakerIlK or as Miloluvr), so I will out of courtesy explain the following to you.  Since the various moves you made to 9 of the article stubs I created today (Friday, May 17th 2024) and Wednesday (May 15th, 2024) are, whether you mean them to be or not, partial negations of the work that I have done, I would like to briefly explain a few things to you.  For one, there is no single hard-and-fast RULE that in order for an article to exist on Wikipedia that it has to have more than one source.  Now, you don't mention anything about "notability" in your sources, but in our exchange a couple of days ago, Geschichte argued that my articles don't meet all of the guidelines for "notability".  However, those are guidelines and not rules.  In terms of the reliability of my source, a 125-year publication from the International Gymnastics Federation (FIG), it is of the very highest possible reliability as it is THE official governing body of the sport of gymnastics.  All of the articles that you moved from mainspace to draftspace are of gymnasts.  Moreover, whereas notability is concerned, ALL of the individual gymnasts whose articles you moved were/are individual world championship medalists, to say the very least.  As I explained to Geschichte, the main thrust of the guidelines for WP:SPORTCRIT states "The guidelines on this page are intended to reflect the fact that sports figures are likely to meet Wikipedia's basic standards of inclusion if they have achieved success in a major international competition at the highest level."  All of the individuals whose articles, that I created, that you moved, achieved success in a major international competition at the highest level''' - they are all individual World Championship medalists.
 * I have come to the conclusion that whereas Geschichte is concerned, I absolutely need to furnish an additional reference for these articles to belong in the mainspace. I am going to assume that you hold the same standard.  I might find an additional reference or multiple references for some or all of these individuals, however, that is more likely for those who were medalists at the world championships in the 1930s through the 1950s than for those who were medalists at the world championships pre-WWI and during the 1920s.
 * One thing I want you to understand is this - Once you move those articles to draftspace, they are no longer in the mainspace. The wikilinks turn from blue back to red, from active to inactive.  To the casual onlooker or novice, they would quite likely assume that nothing else exists for these individuals, yet such is not actually the case.  Imagine being a descendant (for example, a grandchild or great grandchild) who is researching their ancestor, and discovering the red link which essentially tells them that nothing about them is on Wikipedia.  Not only that, but if they are a casual onlooker or a novice on Wikipedia, they might not have the skills or know-how to add any information that they might actually have to the article (which is now a less accessible draft due to your actions).  What I do when I create these articles is not only add a very brief stub body treatment, but I also add an infobox (specifically, a gymnast infobox) that helps with formatting and automatically has fields, such as birth date and place and death date and place, for data population.  Your draftification of these articles negates their ability to do such a thing and to turn them from drafts into articles because they don't even know they exist.
 * FOR THE RECORD, you unilaterally and without discussion or consensus draftified (essentially negating to a certain extent) 9 individuals who were all individual world championship medalists including:
 * Hans Nagelin - silver medalist with his team and bronze medalist on the vault at the 1938 Worlds
 * Leo Schürmann - silver medalist with his team and bronze medalist on the pommel horse at the 1938 Worlds
 * Kurt Krötzsch - bronze medalist with his team and bronze medalist on floor at the 1934 Worlds
 * Charles van Hulle - silver medalist with his team and on the horizontal bar at the 1903 Worlds
 * Georges Wiernicks - silver medalist with his team and silver in the all-around at the 1903 Worlds
 * Josef Sykora - gold medalist with his team and bronze in the all-around and on the horizontal bar at the 1913 Worlds
 * Heinz Sandrock - silver medalist on the horizontal bar at the 1934 Worlds
 * Marcel Adatte - gold medalist with his team and silver in the all-around and pommel horse at the 1950 Worlds
 * Jaroslav Kolinger - silver medalist with his team and bronze on rings at the 1934 Worlds
 * In summary, I just want you to be clear about what it is that you have done. I noticed that all of the edits you made regarding this, you made rather swiftly.  I just want to make sure that with such swift editing you were also clear about the technicalities and your own reasoning for doing this.  Why did you actually make this series of edits? QuakerIlK (talk) 21:47, 17 May 2024 (UTC)
 * I agree that notability is a guideline, not a rule. However, for biographies of athletes, especially those from earlier eras, it's important to demonstrate notability with multiple reliable sources. While the FIG publication is certainly a credible source, having just one source can make the article vulnerable to deletion discussions (AFDs) in the future. Focusing on including a few additional reliable sources to strengthen the articles would be more beneficial than creating a large number of stubs. Thanks!  Waqar <span style="background:#0000FF;padding:2px;box-shadow:0 1px 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.2)">💬 07:38, 18 May 2024 (UTC)
 * With deletion discussion, there are multiple outcomes - one of which is "keep" which keeps the article in the mainspace. Your unilateral, undiscussed and without consensus moves of 3 of these articles (specifically Hans Nagelin, Leo Schürmann and Kurt Krötzsch) to draftspace were performed by you less than an hour-and-a-half than they were put up on the mainspace, not even allowing a time for review one way or the other.  You didn't even let the articles remain in the mainspace for an hour-and-a-half before moving them unilaterally and without discussion or consensus.  You did not open the articles up for discussion to where a "keep" consensus could be reached.  The other 6 of the articles were also removed in a pretty swift fashion, without any substantial review by you or actions or discussion on the article talk pages first.  Your move of them to draftspace makes them vulnerable to complete deletion, especially if no additional sources are found within 6 months.  Furthermore, you admit that the one source I did use was credible.  You also ignore my headline rationale that, according to Wikipedia's standards for inclusion sports figures are likely to meet Wikipedia's basic standards of inclusion if they have achieved success in a major international competition at the highest level, and that DOES apply to ALL of the 9 individuals whose stubs you draftified and removed from Wikipedia mainspace.  It is possible that the FIG publication is a tertiary source, however it could also be a secondary source.  It is NOT a primary source.  Even if it is "only" a tertiary source, tertiary sources are a great place from which an article or research can begin.  By moving these articles out of mainspace, you are making it look like there has not been a beginning on the articles.  The basis for your actions regarding these draftifications is very selective reasoning, and your actions result in negation more than they do in protection. QuakerIlK (talk) 08:00, 18 May 2024 (UTC)