User talk:Red Sunset/Archive 5

Lifty thing
Also struggling for a reference for the table, numbers must have come from somewhere. Worst that can happen is a 'citation' tag but it is a likely target for questions. Will keep looking. Added a nice 'undiscovered' image, check it out (is it a better one for the infobox?). Did some pyromania earlier in the rain! Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)   23:20, 5 November 2008 (UTC)


 * It can go to 300px in the specs section, there is a guideline on that somewhere in the av project. Will try it. Just looking at 'categories', aircraft engine seems to be likely but that doesn't seem quite right to me. Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)   23:45, 5 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Looks like the F136 has been cancelled according to this, may need some adjustment to the wording!! Looks like your question won't get answered (editor given up?) Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)   10:38, 10 November 2008 (UTC)


 * But why has this contract just been awarded? Very strange. Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)    10:53, 10 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Tweaked it a bit more, added 'see also' (see if you think they are all relevant) and found another category. I thought the table might get trimmed (how did they know the F136 figures if they've only just ground tested it?) Interesting that the figures are slightly better than than the F135 ;-). Some political undertones emerging, don't think we have heard the full story yet. Reminds me of the F-4 and BAe/Spey fiasco. Nimbus (Cumulus nimbus floats by)   01:27, 11 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Now hovering at 500ft! Will see what develops. Thanks a lot for all your help, I was a bit overwhelmed by the early 'mess'. Can go back to Shakespeare now! I need to look at the other RR redlinks soon. Cheers Nimbus (Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   00:21, 12 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Yep, not too bad. Got a nice lecture about trademarks ;-). Snowman seems to have rated it B class from the edit summary, the talk page is showing 'start', the article is showing as B class with the navigation pop up gadget turned on? More later (bit busy at the moment). Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   20:20, 12 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I think there is a bug in the template, which needs fixing. Has it been modified recently? Snowman (talk) 21:52, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Thrust Figures
Though I do not recall entering the thrust values for the F135 and F136 (I do remember converting them to kN though), I found one page that confirms the numbers for the F135 here. AAK (talk) 03:51, 12 November 2008 (UTC)

Your DYK submission
I looked at the DYK nomination page and discovered that the Stratford nomination is a "may be". I think that you could respond with something like "page has been updated" when you are ready. Just in case you were busy and did not notice. Snowman (talk) 23:37, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Someone suggested a small change to the hook, so I thought it was better to change the hook back to what I suggested on 19 November 2008 and hopefully not get behind in the queue. Snowman (talk) 10:11, 22 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I did wonder how much was wood and how much was bricks. I nearly changed it to in parts. "brick-by-brick" not being used literally here. Snowman (talk) 21:28, 22 November 2008 (UTC)

Happy New Year!
Who woke you up! Cheers, that's an interesting article. Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   22:08, 13 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Still working ridiculous hours, but in a moment of weakness I took a quick peek at what wos 'appnin'. Yes it is interesting, and since old habits die hard it got the better of me and I just had to rattle the keys a bit.  I'm tempted to dabble a bit more in the article when things quieten down in real life. Cheers for now. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et    20:29, 14 January 2009 (UTC)


 * It was quiet on here over Christmas, now it's got busy when we are all back at work! Take it steady. Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   23:30, 14 January 2009 (UTC)

Lebaudy Patrie
Hi, I've noticed that you have been improving the Patrie article recently, which is great - many hands make light work. I'd like to get the article to GA (or even FA) status in the near future, so if you have any experience of the process(es) involved and can spare some time (ha! ha!) to do some assessment, that would be great. I'll have a go at standardising the references next, I think, so I'll have to get to grips with the various citation templates. I'm not sure how one references a web page which contains a pdf archive of e.g. Flight Magazine (a fantastic resource, as you most likely already know). Anyway, I look forward to your contributions. If I say "thank you" it might smell a bit like "article ownership", but I really do look forward to more editors helping to get the Patrie to "fly" again ... this time up the rankings! Cheers. --TraceyR (talk) 19:38, 26 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the note. Yes, I have decided to use the citation templates, if only for the fact that this approach might suit some of the stricter reviewers. I'm through most of the refs now - a longer process than I thought, but one which has thrown up new sources and details which I had overlooked earlier. One snippet still eludes me: I'm sure that I read somewhere online that the sighting off Torr Head, Ireland, had been reported by the Lloyds telegraph station, but can I find it now? I really should know by now that these things should be noted down immediately: not everything is searchable. Grrr. --TraceyR (talk) 19:33, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

So far I have gone with, even for the odd eBook. It also provides url and access date, along with publisher etc., so it has entries for all the info I have so far gathered. Thanks for looking for the Toor Head source. I should be able to find it in my browser history, but there is so much! --TraceyR (talk) 20:22, 28 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I think that I have found what I saw (two weeks ago, it seems!), in the Times online archive searching for "french airship" - it confirms that it was a Lloyds signal station in Co. Antrim, but not which one. I assume that there wouldn't have been too many along that coast; Torr Head provides a splendid view across to Scotland. There's a lovely picture here. The Times report was printed on 3/12/1907. If you can find anything more precise that would be very useful. --TraceyR (talk) 20:58, 28 January 2009 (UTC)

Done the Steering and propulsion section - good idea.

I'm thinking about the bibliography subsection - it looks a bit odd with one book and four New York Times archive links, at least one of which is also referred to separately in the article. They may have to go. There are also some Project Gutenberg etc eBooks available which deserve to be mentioned. I have found a list of Lloyd's signal stations around the British Isles and there are/were several along the Antrim and Donegal coasts; it seems certain that Torr Head is the one, since in is mentioned in that caption. --TraceyR (talk) 19:34, 30 January 2009 (UTC)


 * re Lebaudy 1-2-3-4 we share the same misgivings. I altered the Lebaudy template for good measure, leaving just 1 and 2. As fas as I can make out, it was just the one ship, which metamorphosed into the later numbers. The deciding factor for me today was a source which said that it was handed over to the army as Lebaudy 2! All very French, somehow! Anyway, we need to find a sound set of sources for whatever number it is. For me the Patrie really is the second, ordered by the forces on the back of the 1-2-3-4's performance; I'll have to have a thorough look at the better sources. If you look at a contemporary French source (Le tour de France en aéroplane_(misleading title) - Gutenberg, so you'll need to download it to look at it), the story runs from Nov. 1902 to Oct. 1906, when the Patrie was ordered, mentioning only the one airship, the "Lebaudy". I think that I'll change it back tomorrow, giving that ref as the source! I'll leave it to the Lebaudy Lebaudy (how about that for an article title!!) article to sort that lot out! Perhaps Lebaudy Jaune would be better, even though it was really a nickname. The Patrie was yellow too, of course. --TraceyR (talk) 22:44, 30 January 2009 (UTC)


 * [Here it is:] This source enumerates the 4 stages (5 actually!), from 1 (1902) to 1bis (1903) to 2 (early 1904) to 3 (early 1905) and finally to 4 (3/7/1905). That's way to much detail for this article, so I think the Patrie should be the second Lebaudy airship and the template sould be restored so that 2,3,and 4 all point to 1, as it was earlier today. Maybe it should include the 1bis. Any views? I'm off to ZZZZZs now! It seems that the whole envelope was replaced by a longer one on the 4. What constitutes the airship? It's a bit like the grandfather's knife, with a new blade and a replacement handle! --TraceyR (talk) 23:01, 30 January 2009 (UTC)


 * I've made the change and cited the Swiss site, but I'd like some thoughts about the predecessor airship(s) WRT the template. Some sources refer to the Lebaudy, some to Lebaudy 1,2,3,4 etc, so should the template give those names and link them to the "Lebaudy Lebaudy"? BTW, the Swiss site has a UK flag pointing to the English version of the website, provided via the Google translation service - v. interesting: "Its asymmetric envelope, inflated with hydrogen, is attached by ropes to a platform of steel tubes, a 1st in the world of football..."! One may laugh (I did!), but apart from the howler it's a surprisingly good sentence. Is automatic translation becoming feasible? Back to the template: since it is early days, I'll just edit it; we can always sort it out later. It shouldn't contradict the article's statement that the Patrie was the second! Another thought. This thread should really be on the Patrie talk page! Can it be moved there without offending WP rules?--TraceyR (talk) 12:39, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

While looking for info on the more obscure "Lebaudy Tissandier", I stumbled across the axishistory forum - well, Google took me there. One of the knowledgeable contributors there goes by the name of Jempie. He is the originator of a series of airship images, including many Lebaudys, at www.earlyaviators.com; this means that Jempie is none other than Jean-Pierre Lauwers, the source of the caption under the image of the Patrie's propeller! I have signed up to the forum and sent him a long message, asking for info re the sightings of the Patrie and their order! I'm now in "wait and see" mode! It's a long shot but we might have clarification.

One of the contributors there recommended the Gallica collection at the Bibliothéque Nationale de France, where I found this: a picture of the man whose trousers caught in the Patrie's distributor gearing, thus leading to her loss! Have a look here! "Au bout de vingt minutes d'une marche très régulière de 8 km avec évolutions au-dessus de la ville de Verdun, près du fort Saint Michel, c'est la panne d'allumage provoquée par la prise du pantalon de l'Adjudant Girard dans l'engrenage de la magnéto." --TraceyR (talk) 17:18, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Brilliant! --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   17:44, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

Thanks very much for sorting out today's edits so neatly - a big improvement. I too can take a step back from the Patrie now - well, I'll try, anyway. I must admit that finding that Alice Guy film so unexpectedly was like hitting the jackpot. Absolutely amazing! And to think it all started (for me) with seeing a postcard photo of a weird but oddly elegant airship on a market stall in Annecy, the same photo that now graces the infobox! Shame about the assessment, but it is very much a niche subject. --TraceyR (talk) 22:23, 23 February 2009 (UTC)

Welcome back to the Patrie - the more the merrier, if it means a better article. The non-breaking spaces in dates: It was just a spur-of-the-moment thing actually; I didn't like the idea of a day being separated from its month! Maybe I should change the MoS accordingly!! I'm going to suggest on the talk page that a sort of epilogue be added (a sort of aftermath para) - what do you think? --TraceyR (talk) 05:46, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Sparring
Just about done I think, getting a bit technical but it looks much better, nice tweaks! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   17:16, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Ta ever so, but you did the heavy lifting! Yeah, it looks much more logical, believeable and complete now, with understandable tech bits. Good stuff, and not a single edit conflict either!!! --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   17:25, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * There was one but it gave me thinking time! I noticed that some of the other component articles could do with a 'Trinny and Susannah' job, one at a time. Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   17:57, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Sorry 'bout that – didn't realise! Let me know when you're ready (as long as it's not a 'Gok Wan'!!!);-) --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et    18:02, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm ready for my tea and that's about it for today. Did you have a twiddle in the Spitfire article? Like his glasses! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   18:13, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Just back from tea! No, I decided it requires a bit more time than I want to commit at the moment; one for another day I think when the resident eds have had a chance to address some of the issues and I won't tread on too many toes! Movie tonight. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   19:09, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry, I couldn't think of a better phrase than 'biological activity'! Actually looks quite good that bit now. Best way to describe the Spitfire spar is like this. There is a Haynes manual on the 'Spit' now, only a couple of squids and very interesting. Allegedly doing the TM soon, will come in handy! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   20:36, 1 February 2009 (UTC)

No worries, I'm sometimes the world's worst when it comes to finding elegant wording! I'll try and think of a suitable alternative. Thanks for the example of Spit spar costruction – yeah, I'm sure the Spit has a lot on common with the TM (Lol)!!! I've changed "thicker diameter" to "larger diameter" BTW; makes more sense;-) --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   18:15, 2 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Yep, looks better, I'm a 'bit busy' at the mo! ;-) Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   20:48, 2 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Have to admit to being a bit slack today, did not get round to the BR2, went flying instead! :-) Will have a look next week. The DYK went through, thanks for suggesting it. Cheers Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   18:38, 8 February 2009 (UTC)


 * That's ok – everyone should enjoy themselves as much as possible, and there's no rush anyway! I never gave DYKs a thought until recently – glad to be of help. :-) --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et    18:23, 9 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I got to the BR2 eventually, what is a Deerhound anyway?! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   20:58, 12 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for checking out my work on stagger (that Tiger in the background looks a bit familiar...hmmm!!!) and decalage; the latter was just an unreferenced sentence before I set about it (not much more now!). A Deerhound is a large rough-haired Scottish version of a greyhound, and as the name suggests was bred for coarsing deer. I think it may have been an aero engine as well (Lol)! --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et    18:28, 13 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Where a dear hound is one like mine that eats a lot! Bit strange that they changed to dog names as all the others were big cats (except the Mongoose, not sure what they are related to, rats?!) Yes, there is a rusty brown Tiger lurking in there. Will see if I can find a simple ref for the purpose of decalage, will have a wade through that report first as it might be in there as you say. Cheers Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   20:12, 13 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Nice pun (and pic)! Looking at an MIT report as we speak! --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   20:52, 13 February 2009 (UTC) Take a look at the findings at the end of p.10 and onto p.11 – any good? --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et    21:06, 13 February 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes, very useful. I just looked up Mongoose (it's all about learning here!) and it is a cat (sort of). Good one for a pub quiz! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   22:01, 13 February 2009 (UTC)

Jet engine image
Do you have any views on this image? Wikipedia:Picture peer review/Turbofan Labelled. Snowman (talk) 16:56, 18 February 2009 (UTC)


 * It's a good image, however there is nothing I could add that hasn't already been commented on:


 * Most importantly, for the direction of rotation of the shaft as depicted in the gif, the orientation of the compressor and turbine blades (excepting that of the final LP turbine blades) is backwards and consequently the engine simply wouldn't work.
 * A better means of portraying combustion within the chamber would be beneficial.
 * I'm not sure that repeating these points would help since the creator seems to have taken note of them. I'll watch to see if they are addressed. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   20:16, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

DYK for HMA No. 1

 * Worthy. Snowman (talk) 10:07, 11 March 2009 (UTC)

R23X class
Hi Red Sunset; all looks good to me! The problem in the past was not the reliance on a single source, but that the bulk of the articles were essentially cut-and-pastes of that source with a few words switched around. Thanks for filling this gap! :)

Cheers --Rlandmann (talk) 02:21, 14 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Many thanks RL! :-) --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   08:37, 14 March 2009 (UTC)

DYK for SS class blimp
Shubinator (talk) 03:35, 29 March 2009 (UTC)

NowCommons: File:NorthSea8.jpg
File:NorthSea8.jpg is now available on Wikimedia Commons as Commons:File:North Sea Class Derigible NS8.jpg. This is a repository of free media that can be used on all Wikimedia wikis. The image will be deleted from Wikipedia, but this doesn't mean it can't be used anymore. You can embed an image uploaded to Commons like you would an image uploaded to Wikipedia, in this case:. Note that this is an automated message to inform you about the move. This bot did not copy the image itself. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 23:40, 7 April 2009 (UTC)

Simulation
See this about simulation. Snowman (talk) 20:41, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I think a little perspective is in order – but I've removed the banner in case it "upsets" anyone. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   21:10, 28 May 2009 (UTC)
 * I like the cat on-the-computer images. Snowman (talk) 21:13, 28 May 2009 (UTC)

Sitakunda Upazila
Thanks for taking an interest. If you don't mind, I'd like to make a request to you (in fact I've trying get some to make that request successfully for quite some time now). Would you lend hand in formatting the citations appropriately? The article failed an FAC largely because of the mess the citation format is in. One editor tried to fix them, and unfortunately managed to mess them up even further. This is kind of beyond my capacities, and needs an expert hand. Would you lend that hand, please? Aditya (talk • contribs) 05:37, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Hi Aditya; I wouldn't call myself an expert by any means but I'll chip away at it nevertheless; however, you'll need to be patient as I tend to work for brief periods at a time. The first thing to do is to get the refs going to the relevant footnotes, which I thought I had sorted out last night, but those in the "Society" section now seem to have other ideas! I'll at least try and get that sorted out tonight. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   18:06, 29 May 2009 (UTC)
 * No worries, dear. I have been working on the article on and off for two years now. Does that say I have the patience that's required? I think it does, lolz. In the intervening time you are probably the third person who has shown any interest in fixing an article with pretty good potential. I am already down on my knees in gratitude. Take your time. And, if you any help anywhere, I'll be there. Promise. Aditya (talk • contribs) 03:51, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

Motto of the Day
<p style="font-weight:bolder;">Hi there, Red Sunset! Thought you might be interested in Motto of the Day, a collaborative (and totally voluntary) effort by a group of Wikipedians to create original, inspirational mottos. Have a good motto idea? Share it here, comment on some of the mottos there or just pass this message onto your friends.

MOTD Needs Your Help!

Delivered By –p joe f (talk • contribs) 08:09, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

An exciting opportunity to get involved!
As a member of the Aviation WikiProject or one of its subprojects, you may be interested in testing your skills in the Aviation Contest! I created this contest, not to pit editor against editor, but to promote article improvement and project participation and camraderie. Hopefully you will agree with its usefulness. Sign up here, read up on the rules here, and discuss the contest here. The first round of the contest may not start until September 1st-unless a large number of editors signup and are ready to compete immediately! Since this contest is just beginning, please give feedback here, or let me know what you think on my talkpage. -  Trevor  MacInnis   contribs  05:03, 23 August 2009 (UTC)

Merlin FA
Hi Rob, would appreciate your thoughts here, once it's done I can get on with painting the house! Cheers Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   13:23, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
 * That's one way of putting the job off Lol! Response on talk page. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   13:45, 25 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Ta, promoting the history of this engine has got to be more important than painting the house! That's my excuse anyway! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   14:00, 25 August 2009 (UTC)

Happy Birthday
Vatsan34 (talk) 08:22, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Birthday's over!

 * Cheers, I would be lost without you! Thought I'd wait till it went quiet to award my special, almost original, prize. That was a big push but an amazingly smooth passage through the Sargasso Sea in the end! Could you have a look through the Rolls-Royce R 'R'ticle. It's a bit of a Frankenstein, pasted in from a dying website, I'm halfway there with it. It's a monster engine close up. A fair story behind it. Cheers Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   02:45, 16 October 2009 (UTC)


 * That's brilliant! Thanks very much – I don't have one of those in my toolbox so it will come in very useful, especially where brute force and ignorance are required!!! ;-) Indeed, it was a lot more straightforward than I dared to expect – must have been well-written or something! Now, when I've tracked the beastie down to its lair we'll see how effective my new weapon is against monsteRs... :-) --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   17:15, 16 October 2009 (UTC)


 * YouRe veRy welcome!! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   17:45, 16 October 2009 (UTC)

A small thank you
It's the most apt one that I could find, cheers and all the best. Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   12:05, 25 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Very kind of you, and much appreciated! How about the Tumansky R-29 now? ;-) Cheers. --Red <font style="color:#AA0000;">Su<font style="color:#DD0000;">ns<font style="color:#FF0000;">et   19:22, 25 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Maybe next year (which isn't so far away now)! Nimbus <font style="color:#2F4F4F;">(Cumulus <font style="color:#708090;">nimbus <font style="color:#D3D3D3;">floats by)   19:50, 25 November 2009 (UTC)