User talk:Rentaferret/Archive 2007-01

Please accept this Barnstar as representative of the praise due you

 * No need to blush, this was a great call by you. From your note, I gather you also worked on the article too. More kudos. Too many take the easy path! My very best wishes! // Fra nkB 23:29, 1 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you so much. I appreciate the acknowledgement and hope the article survives. The happiest of New Years. &mdash; Chidom   talk   00:08, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

Nominations for deletion


Hi. While I certainly share your desire that Wikipedia be a place for good articles about valid subjects, I'd ask that you refrain from nominating articles for deletion while they're being actively edited. This would be particularly true in the case of newcomers.

In my opinion, it would be much better (although more work) to go to the editor's talk page and notify them of your concerns. If they're a newcomer, include the welcome template and suggest that they review all the articles at those links with regard to their article.

Thanks. &mdash; Chidom   talk   23:58, 1 January 2007 (UTC) 

While I appreciate your concern, you should be aware that unless an editor places an tag on his article, there is no way to know it is being edited. It is important for all users to be aware, yes, even new ones, that something fairly substantial should be in place when submitting a new article. It is very likely that one-liners will receive the assent of two administrators for deletion very quickly. I do not consider this a bad thing. If you spend any time at all at New Pages, you will see for yourself the enormous amount of really bad stuff we get. Editing resources are far from adequate at Wikipedia, so it is important to deal with the worst of the material as quickly as possible so as not to tie up help needed urgently in other areas to maintain the articles which show promise.

I would also note that on New Pages, which is where I spend a good deal of my time, about 30% of submissions are made by people with no userpage or talk page. I welcome quite often, as a matter of fact, particularly in circumstances where it seem likely the user is trying to create a userpage but creates it in articlespace. However, it is my experience that only a minority of articles ever grows much better than the condition they were in when they arrived, so I have no hesitation about deleting articles which cannot at least stand on their own when they arrive. Denni talk 01:19, 2 January 2007 (UTC)

And just how is the newcomer supposed to "be aware" of inuse among all the other information they need to process? And whose consensus is it that an inuse tag needs to be placed on an article being drafted? I just found out about the tag a week ago and I've been here more than 6 months. The tag isn't the only way to know it's being edited; a quick check of the history will show how recent the latest edit is. How difficult is it to check the page history before nominating it for deletion?

One need only leave a comment for the new user to create their talk page. It's possible that they know nothing about creating a user page or are more interested in starting a new article or contributing to an existing one.

As for your experience being that "only a minority of articles ever grows much better", a couple of things: first, your experience doesn't necessarily reflect Wikipedia as a whole; secondly, perhaps articles could "grow" if left alone to do so.

I realize that we all have to make assumptions in order to make decisions. I'd just rather assume good faith more often than not; I forget to do so more frequently than I would like.

There are other and usually better ways to go than immediately nominating an article for deletion. (I've been guilty of this lately as well, I've had my mind changed quite a bit.) There are a number of different tags regarding notability, sourcing, etc. Unless the article is blatant advertising or gibberish, it deserves the courtesy of allowing the editor to correct errors and omissions about which they may be unaware.

Also, please bear Please do not bite the newcomers in mind at all times. Your actions on the Tory Mason article have been characterized by the administrator closing that AfD as looking like a biting. There may be some truth in that; it bears thinking about. &mdash; Chidom   talk   12:52, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Error in template
I was reading the article about Troy, the movie. In the "External links" section there was the link "Troy at Box Office Mojo". Clicking on Troy would redirect to the appropriate page at BOM. However, clicking on Box Office Mojo, would redirect to the same page as Troy. Normaly, it should link to the internal article for BOM. When I tried editing the contents I found out that I had no idea on how to correct this. Even after I figured out it should be a "template" (didn't know Wikipedia had such until today), I could not find the template anywhere.

Thank you, Outsid3r 02:14, 5 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm not sure what you were doing, the links work fine as far as I can tell. I also can't find any fault with the template; perhaps you were just clicking too closely to "Troy" instead of clicking on "Box Office Mojo"?


 * I'm not sure how you stumbled across me as a person to ask, either. I'm happy to help if and as I can, but I've never edited the article and had never encountered the mojo title template before.


 * Good luck. &mdash; Chidom   talk   03:49, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

Accusations of bypassing results
Please see Wikipedia's no personal attacks policy. Comment on content, not on contributors; personal attacks damage the community and deter users. Note that continued personal attacks may lead to blocks for disruption. Please stay cool and keep this in mind while editing. Thank you.

Accusing me of bypassing a result is a personal attack and completely unwarranted. Then new category has a more limited scope cannot be considered a respost. Tim! 07:36, 5 January 2007 (UTC)

I also recommend that you never use your bot to revert my edits again. Tim! 07:41, 5 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Last things first—I forgot that I was still logged in under my bot account until I had started everything; I didn't want to stop, delete, and start over. Perhaps I should have.


 * As for bypassing results: your comment was "Keep but restrict to regular and reccuring actors who appear in JAG"; the outcome was to delete the category and listify its members. It looked like you were trying a bypass by recreating a category in line with what your recommendation was when that recommendation wasn't the outcome of the discussion. I think there was every opportunity for editors to emphasize keeping the category and limiting its members; that's not what the comments said. The other comments along those lines were predicated on the category being kept; it was fairly clear that the desired outcome was not to have a category, but to have a list.


 * Please excuse my lapse in assuming good faith. You've been around long enough to know that there are editors who will try any possible manipulation to have things their way; I should not have assumed you were of that ilk. There was no personal attack intended. &mdash; Chidom   talk   02:07, 6 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks and sorry to you too. Apology accepted and please accept mine as I also did not assume good faith, I did not realise that the bot was run on AWB so I can see what happened now. Tim! 12:08, 6 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Ditto apology accepted. I appreciate your understanding; I'll certainly be more mindful of which account I'm logged in under in the future. I'll also try to assume good faith more often. Unfortunately, I get in the habit of assuming the exact opposite as I maintain the List of gay porn stars article, which attracks endless amounts of vandalism.
 * Again, I'm glad we got this cleared up. Could you make a note that the matter is resolved at Administrators' noticeboard? Thanks, and have good days. &mdash; Chidom   talk   18:06, 6 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Ok done. Good luck with the porn ;-) Tim! 19:01, 6 January 2007 (UTC)

Emil rex Cruz
Hi. You deleted Emil rex Cruz on 10 December 2006; however, Talk:Emil rex Cruz survived. Just thought you'd want to know. (Out of curiosity, as this is the second instance of this I've found lately from different administrators, do you have to choose to also delete the talk page the way that you have to choose to move it?) Thanks. &mdash; Chidom   talk   19:48, 7 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks, it's now deleted.
 * When we delete a page, if there is a talk page associated, we get a little notice on the confirmation page saying there is a talk page there too. I usually see that and delete the talk page too, but occasionally miss it. Stifle (talk) 21:22, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

"List of gay porn stars"
Hello, Chidom! This is a bit frank, but I was wondering whether you would be ready to rename the page soon. The reason I ask is that there is a point that I am trying to make at the Talk page of an article which currently has heteronormative bias. I would love to be able to use this article as an example of how encyclopedic language often differs from colloquial speech. You can reply here rather than at my talk page, if you wish. Thank you for reading! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Joie de Vivre (talk • contribs) 23:37, 9 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I've been ready to rename the page for quite some time; however, I feel it only fair to allow at least five days—and preferably a full week—for comments. That means that the absolute earliest I'd be comfortable in the move is two days hence and I would really rather wait until the weekend. The template only mentions reaching clear consensus "after a few days". I'd really rather err on the side of allowing time for more folks to see the proposal and comment on it than rushing to do something that will need undoing somewhere down the road. Thanks.

Talk:List of gay porn stars
Now you are really making a mess. You made Exploding Boy's comment about Buck Angel's gender look like a rebuff of ME, when it was really a rebuff of what YOU said. Also, now you're trying to fork off and dissipate a discussion into subtopics by giving each of them their own top-level header, when in fact all of those original subtopics are all relevant to the same original top-level header. Please stop. Joie de Vivre 22:07, 15 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I didn't move Exploding Boy's comment at all. That is exactly where he put it; you typed your comments above his. I've started a discussion about reorganizing the talk page on the talk page; let's keep it there. Thanks. &mdash; Chidom   talk   22:08, 15 January 2007 (UTC)

Talk:List of Anglican Church of Canada dioceses
As to your suggestion "Merge with List of dioceses of the Anglican Church of Canada," it would appear that insofar as anyone takes much interest in the matter there is a consensus that you should indeed go ahead and accomplish this. If I knew how to do it I would do it myself. Masalai 03:05, 20 January 2007 (UTC)

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