User talk:Roman Spinner/Archive 5 (2014 and 2015)

ENGVAR listed at Redirects for discussion
An editor has asked for a discussion to address the redirect ENGVAR. Since you had some involvement with the ENGVAR redirect, you might want to participate in the redirect discussion (if you have not already done so). John Vandenberg (chat) 02:53, 13 January 2014 (UTC)

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February 2014
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 * this title is indicated with uppercase "C" in all references which are appended to the article IMDb, BBC Online, British Comedy Guide, Phill.co.uk Comedy Guide, etc.  Nowhere else is

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 * MOS:CT; analogous to This Is Tom Jones (not This is Tom Jones) and discussed at length Talk:A Boy Was Born. Deletion of this redirect

Page moves including spelled out middle name
Please refrain from moving pages from the version with the middle initial only to the version with the spelled out middle name based on unreliable sources like "Find a Grave" or "Political Graveyard". The Congress Bios (also quite doubtful, full of numerous mistakes, but considred "reliable" by some) are being rewritten with the spelled out version, but the original version (including the original journals) had only initials. Contemporaneous newspapers, and original documents use the middle initial version only. Search engines will turn up zero results (except wiki mirrors) with the spelled out version. Please cosult the guidelines about WP:RS and naming conventions at MoS. Kraxler (talk) 14:58, 24 February 2014 (UTC)
 * 1. While I appreciate the concerns expressed in your posting, such a wide variety of individuals from wide-ranging time periods cannot be shoehorned into a one-size-fits-all middle-initial format. There are references to J. Q. Adams and John Q. Adams as well as references to F. D. Roosevelt and Franklin D. Roosevelt, but the main title headers of their entries give their full names. Abraham Lincoln's signature was, primarily, A. Lincoln, but the header indicates his full given name. On the other hand, no one argues that John C. Calhoun should be indicated as plain John Calhoun or as the full John Caldwell Calhoun, even though he is listed as "John Caldwell Calhoun" at the Biographical Directory of the United States Congress. Inconsistencies abound — the main header indicates Lyndon B. Johnson, not simply Lyndon Johnson, but his successors are Richard Nixon, not Richard M. Nixon, and Gerald Ford, not Gerald R. Ford. The blue links to all of the above names, plus numerous others, demonstrate that there should be no concern over search engines' ability to find names, since each move leaves behind a redirect.
 * 2. All sources are, in one way or another, inconsistent, but while The Political Graveyard, which is compiled by volunteers, may be somewhat unreliable, I'm surprised that you would consider Biographical Directory of the United States Congress, maintained by staff in the Office of the Clerk's Office of History and Preservation and the Office of the Historian of the United States Senate, as not meeting the standards set by WP:RS. While the Directory is now, indeed, listing all of its subjects with a full middle name, it falls to Wikipedia editors to provide references demonstrating which of those subjects, such as John C. Calhoun, should continue to be listed with a middle initial, rather than the full middle name. Likewise, Find a Grave, which depicts subject's name as it appears upon his or her own gravestone (and not necessarily the accompanying biographical write-up by contributors to, and editors of, Find a Grave), is among the most reliable primary sources that one can submit.
 * 3. As for contemporary newspapers and other publications, those are also inconsistent, most frequently referencing subject simply by his given name and surname, without the use of middle name or initial. Many, if not most, Wikipedia entries for less-well-known political figures, append solely an external link to Biographical Directory of the United States Congress or additional links to Find a Grave and/or Political Graveyard. If you are able to append inline references to sources which meet WP:RS, indicating that subject was, indeed known by the use of his middle initial, then you should do so, otherwise, one cannot presume that the middle initial takes precedence over the full middle name or, in cases where subject opted not to use his middle name or middle initial, over the use of neither.
 * 4. Finally, since you mentioned original documents, by all means, provide links to those in order to buttress your arguments and, if you possess any such documents yourself, consult the guidelines at WP:OR before using them. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 00:42, 25 February 2014 (UTC)
 * 1. There's no problem with widely known people, anybody will find their article at whatever name, because we know it must be there. Lesser known people, like Jane H. Todd for example, who is listed as such everywhere in WP:RS had an article at Jane Hedges Todd. The middle name was nowhere listed, and did not appear anywhere in search engines, I stunbled about it after some time by chance at the existing Wikipedia article, because the version with the middle initial gave a red link.
 * 2. The printed version of the Biographical Directory has in the vast majority of entries only middle initials, the Congress historian is now mirroring Wikipedia. Fond a Grave is good, when there's a photo of the gravestone, if not the content is doubtful. It's not a WP:RS for middle names, in about 98% of gravestones I've seen there the middle name is given as an initial. Political Graveyard is also not a WP:RS, but it's a good place to get info which then needs to be confirmed by other sources which fulfill the RS criteria.
 * 3. When I say "original documents" that refers to the on-line available scanned copies of journals of the Houses of Congress and State Legislatures where the politicians are mentioned, mostly without spelled out middle names. Wikipedia (or any other encyclopedia) is meant as a reference work: Somebody who reads John A. Doe in some historical context, and wants to get more info on this person would look up John A. Doe, and would see no entry, or a red link, because he failed to type in the full name "John Artaxerxes Doe". The user would then have to use a search engine and only god knows whether he will get any results.
 * 4. Finally, I'd like to quote from WP:Middle names: "Generally, use the most common format of a name used in reliable sources..." If you have any doubt about reliable sources, please ask me. Kraxler (talk) 11:20, 26 February 2014 (UTC)

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Redirects
Hello, Roman. I hope you received the notifications on thr RfD for Lisa Walker, Beth Walker and Elisabeth Walker. You seem to be creating a number of redirects without looking at what links to them, and this is causing quite a few issues. I see you recently made some chances so William R. Cox has more incoming links not intended for him than those which are. I made a hatnote to the dab and to the main target of the incoming links, WIlliam Ruffin Cox, and resolved some of the incoming links, can you please resolve the rest? I also wonder if the writer is definitely the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC?

I also spent several hours yesterday resolving the edits you made to Elizabeth Walker. My main concern is that you were fully aware that your edits go against the guidelines. As you get notifications when I revert such edits, you must have had over 100 messages from me on this, and I know you also have from other editors. I don't feel good about reverting you - in fact I hate it, and hate feeling I need to send you a message like this - but your edits are disruptive and very dispiriting for other editors. I have asked you many, many times, that if you disagree with the guidelines (and you clearly do), then you should start a discussion on them. That way you may get what you feel is best - and you wouldn't spend so long making these unless you felt they made the pages better, would you? Hopefully, you would accept the consensus either way, and put your time and considerable energies to better use within Wikipedia. You are always polite, which is appreciated, but polite wording doesn't change the fact that you are ignoring other editors and the guidelines and you know you are causing lots of people a considerable amount of time correcting you. Yesterday, I spent 3 hours sorting out the wrongly redirected titles, incorrect entries etc at Elizabeth Walker. I shouldn't have had to do that.

I once again, beg you to look at Disambiguation (where you will see that linking to Mabel Walker's article, just because her (pretty much unused, even) middle name is Elizabeth is not valid. I have also directed you to MOS:DABENTRY on dozens of occasions in my reverts, as copied below: ''Keep in mind that the primary purpose of the disambiguation page is to help people find the specific article they want quickly and easily.

Example:

Interval may refer to: ...
 * [Interval (mathematics)], a certain subset of an ordered set
 * [Interval (music)], the relationship between two notes

Keep the description associated with a link to a minimum, just sufficient to allow the reader to find the correct link. In many cases, the title of the article alone will be sufficient and no additional description is necessary.''

You must be aware that you don't keep to this at all - in fact I recognise a page you've edited immediately because of the short paragraph for each entry. I have said this to you countless times, but I'll try once again: the guildelines are borne out of the community's consensus. That should be respected and it is disruptive not to do so, especially on an almost daily basis. You have the right to challenge the consensus - of course - so please do so, or accept that you may disagree, but disruptive editing won't help and concentrate on other parts of Wikipedia there are enough projects where you must agree with the guidelines? And I appreciate the fact that you volunteer your time on WP - but right now, you're wasting a lot of editors' time.

I am also very concerned as to why you would create huge numbers of disambiguation pages in your userboxes, to try to get round the guidelines? You can't think you're really in the right, as you don't challenge it when editors revert your edits, and you have consistently ignored my suggestion you start a discussion on the issue. So why create a large number of disambiguation pages in the style you'd prefer? It seems bizarre to me.

I once again beg you to consider fully what I'm saying. I've been in the position where I've been sure I was right and carried on, not really open to listening to other editors on that issue - and I've realised later that, right or wrong, I was putting other editors off volunteering their time here. I monitor the changes on disambiguation pages, which means that every time I see your name, I know it's going to take me a long time to clean up the mess - invalid entries, overlengthy entries, invalid redirects - it sucks all the joy out of it for me, not that I'm doing it, but that you're deliberately doing it, and that you know that I monitor the pages and that I will undo your edits. I hate all this kind of stuff and I hate confrontation, but I have tried so many times, via Talk page messages, edit summaries in revert notifications etc. Please stop and use your talents elsewhere or in a different way. If you persist, I will start a discussion at RFC about it, but I would hate to do so. I want both of us to enjoy editing WP, and also the many other editors I've seen correcting your work. The idea of opening a discussion to criticise another editor makes me feel sick, but you cannot keep ignoring the consensus and it isn't fair that I spend so long cleaning up. You have told me before to just revert you, but I never want to remove the (small amount) of good entries often added - and as your dabs are hard to see the wood for the trees, it takes a long time to even read throgh the dab.

Please think over what I have said. I hope to see you starting a discussion on MOS:DABENTRY soon - you clearly feel strongly about it, so why not? If not, please, please stop this and move on. Again, I appreciate the effort you put in, but that doesn't give you the ride roughshod over others, and that is what you are doing.

Best wishes, Boleyn (talk) 08:30, 14 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Hello Boleyn. I am most appreciative of your heartfelt posting and I thank you for the time you devoted to composing it and for the detailed nature of your arguments and presentation.
 * I did, indeed, see in notifications the ongoing RfD for Lisa Walker, Beth Walker and Elisabeth Walker and, as soon as I finish typing this reply to you, I will proceed there and present a detailed explanation as to why those redirects should remain. I do, always, observe whether the redirects I create engender any links and ameliorate, whenever possible, any inconsistencies. In regard to William R. Cox, I had already changed twelve misplaced links pointing to the incorrect William R/William Ruffin Cox and will, as soon as possible, attend to the remaining ones. While at it, I am most grateful to you for aiding in the effort. As to the question of which William R. Cox is the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC, the answer is: neither. We don't have a William R. Cox sub-disambiguation page for William Ruffin Cox and William Robert Cox --- we only have the all-inclusive William Cox disambiguation page which should include both William R. Cox [sic] and William Ruffin Cox [sic]. As to the form of these two similar names, we are fortunate, in both cases, to have (at Find a Grave) photographs of the gravestones of both subjects, with one clearly engraved as "William R." and the other as "William Ruffin". Furthermore, "William R." was also the writer's pen name and all of his many writings always reflect that form, with none indicating "William Robert" (his article includes a link to Guide to the William R. Cox papers 1914−1980 at the Special Collections and University Archives, University of Oregon Libraries). On the other hand, while there is no denial that the Civil War general was occasionally referenced as "William R." (as evidenced by the two short-lived World War II liberty ships, SS William R. Cox (November 1943) and SS William R. Cox (December 1943) [there was also a third one, named simply William Cox]), the key sources, in addition to his gravestone inscription, include the Biographical Directory of the United States Congress and the encyclopedia of his native North Carolina, NCpedia, in all of which, as well in a number of others, his name appears as "William Ruffin". Any other uncertainties are definitively resolved by your addition of the hatnote at William R. Cox, for which I again thank you, although the second hatnote, {otherpeople|William Cox}, is not really necessary per WP:NAMB.
 * And now, to your second point regarding having to spend several hours resolving the edits I made to Elizabeth Walker. I am mystified as to why it should have taken so long. If you had been satisfied with the five previously-existing entries on the page (as it appeared prior to my edit [last edited in April 2011]) a revert would have taken one second. If you accepted my addition of eleven new names (expanding from five to sixteen entries), but decided to delete the descriptive write-ups, the cut text function should have taken you  less than a minute, and if you decided to eliminate some of the entries, that also should have taken no more than a few seconds. Incidentally, I am puzzled by some of your choices: why delete Elizabeth Claire Walker of the Los Angeles Ballet, but retain Elizabeth Walker of the New York City Ballet or why change Elizabeth Neff Walker to Elizabeth Walker (author), when a glance at the plentiful on-line reproductions of the covers of her books confirms that her pen name is, indeed, Elizabeth Neff Walker. Also, why keep Elizabeth Harrison Walker among the main entries, but consign Elizabeth Pupo-Walker of Tuatara (band) to "See also"? After all, some women hyphenate their maiden name and married name (or use a hyphenated family name), while other women use their family name as middle name without a hyphen (Hillary Rodham Clinton). Those who prefer to use a hyphen should be treated equally with those who do not, instead of being banished to "See also". While on the subject, why delete the family name of writer Elizabeth Oakleigh-Walker (pen name Elizabeth Buchan)? The birth names of numerous notable personalities appear as a standard feature in numerous disambiguation pages. An entire disambiguation page (Myrna Williams) was, in fact, created for only two entries: Myrna Williams (politician) and Myrna Adele Williams, the birth name of movie star Myrna Loy. As for Tippy Walker, although she was "nee Elizabeth Tipton Walker", her alternative stage name (billed more frequently than "Tippy Walker") was Elizabeth Walker (actress) (she never used "Tipton" as part of her stage name). Furthermore, why delete actress Liza Walker? I can only presume that you may have intended to include her either in your Lisa Walker or your Eliza Walker disambiguation pages, but since you haven't done so as of this writing, I am at a loss for an explanation. On a side note, since there are only two Wikipedia entries for notable women whose middle name is "Elizabeth" and surname is "Walker", Mabel Elizabeth Walker and Susan Elizabeth Walker, I would have thought they might be allowed to remain under "See also" for the sake of completeness, but I will leave such decisions for others. Finally, you inserted a duplicate entry under "Politicians": Liz Walker (politician) and Liz Walker, political candidate for Newton—North Delta are the same person. The redirect, Liz Walker (politician), which I did not create, should not be used since it discourages the creation of an article. My five-person list (under section header "Political figures") had public officials and a member of a political dynasty who were not all politicians:
 * Mabel Elizabeth Walker (1889−1963), American public official, known as First Lady of Law, or "Prohibition Portia"; served as U.S. Assistant Attorney General from 1921 to 1929, handling Bureau of Federal Prisons as well as violations of Volstead Act and tax collection; highest-ranking woman on Federal level
 * Elizabeth Harrison Walker (1897–1955), American lawyer and publisher whose political dynasty credentials as daughter of President Benjamin Harrison and his second wife, Mary Scott Lord Dimmick, extended into her own marriage to James Blaine Walker, grandnephew of 1884 presidential candidate James G. Blaine
 * Susan Elizabeth Walker (born 1951), British-born Australian political figure who represented electorate of Nedlands in Legislative Assembly of Western Australia between June 2001 and September 2008; member of Liberal Party since 1978, she was defeated in 2008 after running as Independent
 * Liz Walker (born 1954), Canadian environmentalist who, as candidate of Canada's Green Party, has contested British Columbia's federal electoral district Newton—North Delta in 2008 and 2011 Canadian federal elections; Chemical Technician at BC Hydro's Research and Development Laboratories during 1980s
 * Lisa Walker (born 1977), English Conservative councillor for Bramhall North (Stockport electoral ward) Metropolitan Borough Council; has chaired Bramhall & Cheadle Hulme South Area Committee and served on Corporate Parenting Working Party, Council Meeting and Licensing, Environment & Safety Committee
 * As another point, I doubt the usefulness of creating multiple sub-disambiguation pages (Lisa Walker, Elisa Walker). Such and other names (Beth, Lizbeth) are contained within the core name and, even if the given name is Lisa and not short for Elisabeth, the name is still basically the same. Analogous arguments may be made for numerous names which have variants (some women are actually named Kathy, Cathy or Kate, rather than as nickname for Katherine) or Ed, Edwin or Edward or Al, Alan, Allen or Alfred. Such sub-disambiguation often results in duplication and confuses, rather than aids, users.
 * Having put the subject of Elizabeth Walker behind us (for the time being), there is a pressing need to address some of your other concerns. As far as knowing fully well that my edits go against the guidelines, I support the guidelines and the concept that the write-ups should be brief, as I believe mine are. I count the characters in each write-up and limit myself to 100 characters and spaces, with a top limit set at 140 characters and spaces. Each write-up, as it appears on my 16x9 screen, set at medium (100%) font size, occupies no more than half a line of text. I realize that various users use different fonts, font sizes, screen sizes and formatting. Such matters, however, vary from user to user and present differing issues not simply for users of disambiguation pages, but also for users of all Wikipedia entries. Continuing with the main theme, I believe that disambiguation pages should be more than just a random jumble of similar names, but a rigorously arranged (in chronological order, by birth year or earliest period of activity for individuals from antiquity, or for those whose specific details are lost to history) listing which gives the names, vital dates, nationality and key point(s) of notability, which is especially useful for individuals who are not the main topics of their own Wikipedia articles. It would seem that any user would be happy to find all the details quickly at his/her fingertips without having to guess which entry is the correct one. Thus, I feel no need to start a discussion on the guidelines, which I do not consider to have violated.
 * Now to the matter of notifications --- since my first edit in January 2006, I have had five postings about the length of my descriptive write-ups, two of them (including the present one) from you, which I am most happy to receive. I tried to explain, each time, the reasoning and philosophy behind my edits and have had no further arguments. These five postings have been the sole communications I have had on this subject in my 8 years, 2 months and 23 days of editing Wikipedia. As for occasional notifications of other editors' edit summaries, virtually all of them give no reason other than a vague reference to MOS:DABENTRY, without explaining what was objectionable. I also hate confrontation and am chagrined that you feel I engage in "disruptive editing" and am "causing lots of people a considerable amount of time correcting" me and writing to me that I "ride roughshod over others, and that is what you are doing" and that "right now, you're wasting a lot of editors' time", without explaining what mistakes I made that would require such extensive corrections. If you "spent 3 hours sorting out the wrongly redirected titles, incorrect entries etc at Elizabeth Walker", then you must have considered such time to be wisely spent, rather than taking the simple step of reverting. Again, I cannot comprehend what it was that I did (which "wrongly redirected titles, incorrect entries" etc?) that would force you to devote such massive expenditure of time to correct my putative "errors".
 * You also note that I engage in such "disruptive" editing "on an almost daily basis", but the fact is that I correct and revise (such as Elizabeth Walker's "is the name of"→"may refer to", or multiple blue links or duplicate/incorrect entries), an average of only one disambiguation page per month (the previous one being the brief dab page The Hills Run Red on March 23, more than three weeks ago) and write about being "very concerned" as to the reason for my creating "huge numbers of disambiguation pages in your userboxes, to try to get round the guidelines". As a matter of fact, all of those disambiguation pages were not directly created for my userboxes, but were initially entered as my contribution to the main body of Wikipedia. Your words in relation to these userboxes are, "It seems bizarre to me", but there is nothing bizarre about these pages, nor am I trying "to get round the guidelines". The fact is, like you, I spend a lot of time on Wikipedia. From January 22, 2006, until today, I have tried to make one or more edits every single day of these past 8 years, 2 months and 23 days, although I have occasionally missed a day or two. These disambiguation pages do not come easily to me and I spend hours, sometimes days, working on single long one (such as William Lawrence). After all that work, it would seem a waste that no Wikipedia users could appreciate a strongly-detailed disambiguation page with all the links tested, all entries in chronological order, with vital dates and nationalities clearly indicated and sorted (in the case of longer pages) by professions or genres. Surely, some users must feel that it is of use to them, since there are indications that the pages have been visited.
 * There is more to be said, but I will end this already-overlong response at this point and invite you to post on my talk page any time you feel you wish to discuss any of my edits or any other matter. I appreciate your many years of dedication to Wikipedia and despite any problems or disagreements, look forward to a long working relationship.
 * All my best, &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 22:57, 14 April 2014 (UTC)

The Roaring 20's (TV series).
The Roaring 20's (TV series) has been removed per CSD:G6. Please let me know if you have any questions. Nakon 05:08, 19 April 2014 (UTC)

Article should not be moved
Bob Brown Greens leader is the primary noteability of Bob Brown compared to Bob Brown ALP MP. Therefore the article should not be disambiguated. Timeshift (talk) 06:29, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Yep. Roman Spinner, I suggest that if you're really determined, you should join the discussion at the article's talk page. HiLo48 (talk) 06:36, 21 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you for specifying the disambiguation circumstances applicable to this biographical entry. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 07:02, 21 April 2014 (UTC)

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 * | Seventh Heaven, Street Angel and Sunrise: A Song of Two Humans  Seventh Heaven, ''[[Street Angel (1928 film)|Street

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Um, title of Winston Churchill's My Early Life ...
Hi, I think there's been a bit of a muddle at My Early Life.

The book has always been known as My Early Life in the UK, no other title or subtitle ever having been used.

The book was ALSO published in the USA by Charles Scribner's Sons as A Roving Commission: My Early Life.

The current title has, I believe, never been used anywhere.

Would you be able to put the article back to My Early Life? - since it was an English book by an Englishman, it seems reasonable that that should be the primary title.

It would then be perfectly sensible to add a redirect from A Roving Commission: My Early Life and to mention that as a redirect target in the article's lead, as the American variant title.

with best wishes, Chiswick Chap (talk) 21:31, 28 May 2014 (UTC)
 * BTW, the titles can be verified at WorldCat. Chiswick Chap (talk) 21:33, 28 May 2014 (UTC)
 * With my apologies, I will defer to your knowledge in this matter and take immediate steps to restore the title to its earlier, original form. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 21:39, 28 May 2014 (UTC)

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Wallace Akers
Hi. I see you've moved the above page to Wallace Alan Akers. I presume you've done this on the basis of the London Gazette references. Unfortunately your being on the other side of the Atlantic has misled you as to the correct form. When people are mentioned in a paper of record like that, their full name (including names they would not normally use) is given. This is so that there can be no ambiguity about exactly whom the King plans to invest as a knight or otherwise honour. However, as you'll see from the other two references, in everyday life he was merely known as Wallace Akers, and later Sir Wallace Akers (or just Sir Wallace). Please would you undo your move. Thanks in advance. RomanSpa (talk) 13:58, 6 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I appreciate your kind posting and will immediately put the Wallace Akers entry through the WP:RM process, thus properly returning it to its original form &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 14:56, 6 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks, and have a good weekend! RomanSpa (talk) 15:03, 6 June 2014 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion declined: Don May
Hello Roman Spinner. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of Don May, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: Please clean up the incoming links before requesting a move such as this one. Thank you. — Malik Shabazz Talk/Stalk 00:58, 5 July 2014 (UTC)

July 2014
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 * 1953, had also been adapted for the screen under the same title, The Robe .  The film was shot at Universal-International studios but released by Buena Vista, the

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BNA Access
Hey Roman Spinner, I sent you an email about access to WP:BNA about two weeks ago, with instructions on how to register for access. Please follow the instructions in the email, Sadads (talk) 16:19, 18 July 2014 (UTC)
 * My thanks for the reminder and for the access. I will attend to the registration. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 16:49, 18 July 2014 (UTC)

The oldest/youngest notes on the acting winners by age
Hey that is pretty neat how you did that-think you can do that for the director page as well? Thanks. Wgolf (talk) 22:49, 12 August 2014 (UTC)
 * And my thanks to you for the appreciation. I intended to complete the List of Best Director winners by age at the same time as the other articles, but was sidetracked by other matters. Since you were kind enough to remind me, I will attend to it as soon as possible. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 23:41, 12 August 2014 (UTC)

Thanks-now an odd case is Josephine Hull, she was not listed as the oldest winner that long until just recently when her year of birth is now listed as 1877. (For a long time it said that Margaret Rutherford and Ruth Gordon held the records until Peggy Ashcroft broke it) Granted many older actresses likely lied about there ages to be younger then they really were so yeah that is a issue, but that is a interesting case right there. (Also would be interesting to see a record of how long someone had the record of longest living post win, post nomination) Wgolf (talk) 03:51, 13 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Josephine Hull's birthdate is given as January 3, 1877 on IMDb and as January 3, 1884 here at Turner Classic Movies. The earlier IMDb listing also indicated 1884, but later made her seven years older (1877) on the basis of, I believe, increased access to past centuries' census figures as well as millions of birth records. TCM, however, made no adjustment on its website to reflect the revised birth year.
 * In the footnotes at the bottom of each entry (such as List of Best Actor winners by age), I already included the longest and shortest lifespans as well as the longest and shortest lifespans after the win, but the longest and shortest lifespans for nominees is an upcoming project. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 04:38, 13 August 2014 (UTC)

Well Richard Attenborough just died so he wont be the oldest living director anymore, rip for him. The youngest director looks to never be broken though. Well good luck for when you get to it! Wgolf (talk) 21:28, 24 August 2014 (UTC)
 * I just saw the news on a Times Square news screen a couple of hours ago. The related reminder about the list is welcomed and I will definitely attend to it within a day or two. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 03:14, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

Zaid Abdul-Aziz / Don Smith (basketball, born 1946)
I noticed that you changed the link for "Don Smith" at 1968 NBA draft and 1968 NCAA Men's Basketball All-Americans from "Zaid Abdul-Aziz" to "Don Smith (basketball, born 1946)." I am interested to know why this would be the proper procedure per WP policy. In the case of Lew Alcindor/Kareem Abdul-Jabbar I understand why you'd do this because we are not piping that link, we are instead letting the stand-alone redirect do its job per WP:NOTBROKEN. However, with Abdul-Aziz/Smith, we must pipe the link anyway since "Don Smith" is a DAB page - what is the wisdom behind piping it to a redirect that links to the article as opposed to the article directly? I checked WP:PIPING and see no guideline that suggests this must be done. I didn't revert you edits, but I was inclined to, I just wanted to understand if I missed something first. Thanks. Rikster2 (talk) 10:47, 19 August 2014 (UTC)
 * I appreciate your interest/concern, as well as your courtesy in waiting for my reply, and would like to use this opportunity to expand on the reasoning underpinning the edits in question. Basically, since both entries — 1968 NBA draft and 1968 NCAA Men's Basketball All-Americans — concern the year in which Kareem Abdul-Jabbar and Zaid Abdul-Aziz were still referenced on team rosters and in the media by their original names, it is quite appropriate that they should be listed by those original names within these two articles (and, in similar circumstances, within other articles). As you point out, while Lew Alcindor, which redirects to Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, is a unique name, Don Smith is one which is common to such a degree that it even includes four basketball players: Don Smith (basketball, born 1910), Don Smith (basketball, born 1920), Don Smith (basketball, born 1946) and Don Smith (basketball, born 1951) and, when these Don Smiths are mentioned within various articles, the links, of course, would not be "Don Smith (basketball, born XXXX)", but the piped "Don Smith (basketball, born XXXX)|Don Smith".
 * In the case under discussion, the point of contention thus appears to be the parenthetical qualifier, "(basketball, born 1946)". Since you agree that, in an article referencing the year 1968, when his name still appeared as "Lew Alcindor" on the team roster, it is reasonable to use Lew Alcindor as a redirect to Kareem Abdul-Jabbar then, by the same reasoning, it would be appropriate to use Don Smith (basketball, born 1946) as a redirect to Zaid Abdul-Aziz, who did not adopt his new name until 1976. When a user clicks on the link Lew Alcindor, underneath the main title header Kareem Abdul-Jabbar is the small-font indicator "(Redirected from Lew Alcindor)" and, analogously, when one clicks on the link Don Smith (basketball, born 1946), the small-font indicator underneath Zaid Abdul-Aziz states "(Redirected from Don Smith (basketball, born 1946))". Both are proper redirects and it would seem counterintuitive to use it for Lew Alcindor, but to jump directly from "Don Smith" to "Zaid Abdul-Aziz" via WP:PIPE without the small-type "(Redirected from Don Smith (basketball, born 1946))" serving as an explanatory note. The redirect, "Don Smith (basketball, born 1946)", thus not only provides a clear disambiguation from the other three Don Smiths, but also underscores the fact that Don Smith (basketball, born 1946) used the name "Don Smith" for the majority of his career, from 1968 to 1976, while the new name was only part of his basketball career for its final two years, from 1976 to 1978.
 * Ultimately, my reasoning was guided by two sentences from Piped link — "It is generally not good practice to pipe links simply to avoid redirects" and "Keep piped links as intuitive as possible". To what degree these are applicable to the case at hand may be the subject for a subsequent discussion. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 06:50, 20 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Roman Spinner - I am not pasionate enough about this to really argue it (both seem right enough to me at the end of the day), but I would disagree that "It is generally not good practice to pipe links simply to avoid redirects" has any bearing here. I think that is the Lew Alcindor example.  in this case there will be a pipe either way, so the purpose isn't to avoid a RD.  The second is one with a little more grey area, but in the end I don't think a direct link to the individual you wish to know more about is misleading.  Your point about his using the Zaid Abdul-Aziz name only for the last two years of his career is interesting, but I guess in my mind it is more than balanced by the fact that historically he has been known by his Muslim name both by the NBA and at Iowa State (where he clearly never played under the name) for the last 35 years. Rikster2 (talk) 12:43, 22 August 2014 (UTC)

Speedy deletion declined: Katharine Blake
Hello Roman Spinner. I am just letting you know that I declined the speedy deletion of Katharine Blake, a page you tagged for speedy deletion, because of the following concern: '''I think that this request is a little too complex for speedy mainly because of the variety of spelling on the disam page (3) means that the primary topic and the target isn't clear. I'd suggest raising it at WikiProject Disambiguation .''' Thank you. Ged UK  11:52, 12 September 2014 (UTC)

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October 2014
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 * (footballer, born 1898)]] (1898–1964), Scottish forward who played for Airdrie, Manchester United 1921–25 (36 matches, 17 goals), Preston North End, Clapton Orient, others

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The Sleepwalkers
Hi. You wouldn't consider stopping being a waste of time on The Sleepwalkers, would you? William M. Connolley (talk) 21:57, 31 December 2014 (UTC)
 * I am most appreciative of your promptness in contacting me regarding any possible disambiguating uncertainties surrounding The Sleepwalkers/The Sleepwalkers (Koestler non-fiction book)/The Sleepwalkers: A History of Man's Changing Vision of the Universe. Rather than offer personal views on the subject, it would seem appropriate to submit it for WP:RM and seek consensus among our fellow users and contributors. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 22:24, 31 December 2014 (UTC)

Catherine Bailey
Thanks for the notification, not sure what I can bring to the discussion though. GiantSnowman 10:09, 11 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Even if you decide that there is nothing further to be contributed to the discussion regarding this proposal, the fact that you took the time to examine it and then write a response here is most appreciated. I also thank you for submitting the example of Catherine Bailey as representing a page analogous to that of Catherine Blake (disambiguation), yet without the need of creating an unnecessary WP:PRIMARYTOPIC with the attendant use of the qualifier "(disambiguation)" &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 18:25, 11 January 2015 (UTC)

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Charles Gordon (actor) listed at Redirects for discussion
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Talk:Elevator to the Gallows
You edited this article in the past. I invite you to a move discussion. --George Ho (talk) 01:15, 21 March 2015 (UTC)

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Proposed deletion of Calum McNab
The article Calum McNab has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * Fails WP:NACTOR

While all constructive contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons. You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page. Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. In particular, the speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. § FreeRangeFrog croak 16:41, 21 April 2015 (UTC)

You've got mail!
Nikkimaria (talk) 02:23, 9 May 2015 (UTC)

Adding lenghty explanations on disambiguation pages
Hello Roman Spinner, I have already noticed a couple of times that you are adding lenghty comments to disambiguation pages, as you did here. Since you're apparently not aware of it, I'd like to let you know that dab pages should, I quote, ''Keep the description associated with a link to a minimum, just sufficient to allow the reader to find the correct link. In many cases, the title of the article alone will be sufficient and no additional description is necessary'' MOS:DABENTRY. So you may find that many dab editors will remove them again. I'm just letting you know so that you're not unpleasantly surprised. Best regards, --Midas02 (talk) 17:50, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * I am most appreciative of your kindness in taking the time to communicate with me regarding this matter and for your commitment to upholding Wikipedia's quality. Over the years, a few editors have left messages on my talk page regarding this matter and, rather than reword my answers to them, permit me to provide links to a couple of these communications:
 * User talk:Roman Spinner
 * User talk:Roman Spinner
 * &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 18:43, 1 June 2015 (UTC)

Hell,, Roman Spinner has been being warned about this for years but persists regardless. He won't consider discussing it at an appropriate venue either, seeing as he is determined that the consensus is not to be followed. Boleyn (talk) 20:38, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Messages from such a valued longtime contributor as User:Boleyn, who has visited my talk page previously (one of the above links details my exchange with Boleyn in April 2012), are always welcome. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 21:02, 1 June 2015 (UTC)
 * It is duly noted Roman Spinner may well not be a Roman Spinner, but a Dab Editor Spinner then. --Midas02 (talk) 01:07, 2 June 2015 (UTC)
 * Humor is an equally welcome contribution to my talk page and may it also be duly noted that Midas02 has the silver touch for it. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 01:21, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

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The Cannon Group, Inc.
It is improper per WP:NCCORP to add "Inc." or other legal status suffix of a company in the article name. Nor is "The" general included. Spshu (talk) 13:22, 31 August 2015 (UTC)
 * You raise a valid point which should be discussed at Talk:The Cannon Group, Inc. Upon moving The Cannon Group to The Cannon Group, Inc., I entered the following edit summary, "enhanced main title header will display company name as it appears on-screen at the start of the opening credits of films produced by the company". Although an illustration of the company logo, depicting the single word, CANNON, is appended to the article, it may be compared to such single words as DISNEY, PARAMOUNT or COLUMBIA, which are one-word identifiers for those entities. In the case at hand, the on-screen appellation for this production company is The Cannon Group, Inc.. Many of these films' opening credits may be found online, including, most obviously, on YouTube. One example of the opening "the Cannon Group, Inc. presents" is here. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 19:24, 31 August 2015 (UTC)

Katrina Richardson listed at Redirects for discussion
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Wikipedia email re Newspapers.com signup
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Saturday October 3: WikiArte Latin America Edit-a-thon @ MoMA
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Re: Categories for discussion/Log/2015 June 21
Hey there. Just was revisiting this CfD. I asked this same thing of a couple other people involved in that discussion. I find the deletion to be inconsistent. Why delete only these four categories (the most populated ones at that) and keep all the hundreds of others in Category:Deaths by cause?? I'm tempted to take this to WP:DRV but on the other hand, I don't want to risk getting the entire lot of 'em deleted for consistency's sake. Is it worth it? What do you think? -- &oelig; &trade; 04:53, 6 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I agree as to the inconsistency of this four-category deletion and would support the categories' restoration. We would, no doubt, see the same participants as in the previous discussions, but much (everything?) depends upon who attends to the closing. If, rather than jc37, this all-encompassing "trainwreck of a discussion" was closed by Good Olfactory, we might have actually had the entire lot of 'em deleted. Good Olfactory went into considerable detail explaining the decision to delete and pointed out that, having closed as "Delete" two such previous discussions, the same reasons apply here (despite the vote count: 8 "Keep" and 5 "Delete" [including the nominator's vote]). Ultimately, both this discussion and the earlier "trainwreck" one appear to demonstrate that there are strongly held views on each side but, since the categories are already in existence (including possible restoration of the six [four and two] which have already been removed), there doesn't seem to be a consensus to delete any of them. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 21:29, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

Thursday October 15: Women in Architecture Edit-a-thon @ Guggenheim (drop-in any time, noon-8pm!)
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Thursday October 15: Women in Architecture Edit-a-thon @ Guggenheim (drop-in any time, noon-8pm!)
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Russian women architects
Thanks, Roman, for your interest in this enterprise and for adding long lists of names from the Russian, Ukrainian and Polish wikis. The main reason I started this list was to facilitate access to information on a selection of really notable architects for use by either newbies or seasoned Wikipedians. I have just been looking through your list of Russian names and have not been able to find anything at all in English on the first seven or eight I researched. This will probably make it very difficult for people to compile new articles. Even if they were created, they would probably run up against problems of notability in the absence of reliable sources and could well be deleted. For those who are really notable, it would be useful to have links to information outside the Russian Wikipedia so that people can draw on third party sources. If you can find any such links, particularly in the literature, it would be useful to have them appended to the list. I have in fact spent quite some time going through the Polish names and have removed those which would probably have caused difficulties but as you will see most are still there.

Another point: Am I not right in thinking than in English, the patronym in Russian women's names is rarely used. If so, the red links should follow the pattern Reemma Aldoneena rather than Reemma Pyetrovna Aldoneena, otherwise the articles will have to be moved once they are created. I hope you will not find these remarks too critical. Please continue to help with the project and, if possible, contribute articles for the coming editathon.--Ipigott (talk) 13:11, 13 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I appreciate your contacting me to discuss the issues raised by this project and, specifically, regarding the names added so far. At first glance, one might assume that, analogous to entries listed within Category:American women architects or Category:German women architects, the mere appearance and continued existence of these biographical articles, constitutes Wikipedia's stamp of approval and endorsement of their notability. Such is obviously not (necessarily) the case in either the English Wikipedia or other Wikipedias, as illustrated by the fact that the entry for File:Варвара Мельникова.png (Varvara Myel'neekova) (ru:Мельникова, Варвара Владимировна) has been deleted four times from Russian Wikipedia as "non-notable" and "пиар" (PR). As for Galeena Balashova, despite a fairly substantial entry in German Wikipedia (de:Galina Andrejewna Balaschowa), there still appears to be no enthusiasm for her in Russian Wiki. And, while Meeleetza Eevanovna Prokhorova, does have an entry in Russian Wiki (ru:Прохорова, Милица Ивановна), she is barely categorized (missing from Category:Soviet architects (ru:Категория:Архитекторы СССР), with her name appearing in only three most basic categories).


 * Returning to notability, there is no analogous Polish Category:Polish women architects or Russian Category:Russian women architects. There is a Ukrainian (but not Russian or Polish) equivalent to Category:Women architects (uk:Категорія:Жінки-архітектори), which lists 21 names, almost all of them Ukrainian. It seemed to me that Wikipedians who are participating in this endeavor should at least see all the entries that other Wikipedias consider worthy of retention. The process of winnowing out those who are notable by English Wikipedia standards would represent the next, higher, step. I had initially planned to follow this format using entries from numerous other Wikipedias: Category:Estonian women architects, Category:Latvian women architects, Category:Lithuanian women architects, Category:Belarusian women architects, Category:Bulgarian women architects, Category:Moldovan women architects, Category:Czech women architects, Category:Slovakian women architects, Category:Slovenian women architects, Category:Serbian women architects, Category:Croatian women architects, etc, but the practicality of such lists can be judged from the recently-added entries.


 * Finally, as to the point you raised regarding Russian and Ukrainian patronyms. Those are, indeed, rarely used in English Wikipedia, for either men or women. My inclusion of them was designed to recreate as exactly as possible, the original form of those names' appearance in their native Wikipedias. Such re-creation extends to non-traditional (overly literal) transliteration (Ol'ga Eevanovna Lapeena, rather than the standard Olga Ivanovna Lapina) in order to approximate the proper pronunciation of those names. If/when the articles are actually created, virtually all of my Russian and Ukrainian transliterated redlinks would have to become redirects, while traditional (but inexact) transliteration of names (without patronyms) will have to be used for main title headers (in his play Great Catherine: Whom Glory Still Adores, Shaw transliterates Potemkin as the properly-pronounced Patiomkin, but Shaw's much-more-exact variant has not gained wide acceptance). There is always more to be said but, for now, I will thank you for your kind closing words and apply myself to expanding the list with a few more names from Russian Wikipedia. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 06:03, 14 October 2015 (UTC)
 * I should have known Ian had a hand in this. Thank you for adding the Russian women architects. Just thought I would pop over and let you know of ill if you were not familiar. Saves a bunch of time and I use it often not only in making lists, but within articles in place of red links.  ru  which can also be written as  ru  to provide a single name in the text. It will render as a name in English and a link to the appropriate language page like this . The red link can be used to create an article with the first named field. If the name of the two articles is to be the same only one field need be input, like  pl  Didn't know if you knew this and didn't mean to butt in. I use it often and find it very helpful and a time saver. Mostly I just wanted to say thanks. SusunW (talk) 13:55, 14 October 2015 (UTC)

Disambiguation link notification for October 17
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Oct 28: WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC
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The Go-Getter (film)
Hi there- if you're going to create a disambiguation page at this title, could you please do so and then fix any incoming links? If not, could you please move the page back to the better title? Thanks! Josh Milburn (talk) 13:03, 1 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I appreciate the reminder. When I moved The Go-Getter (film) to The Go-Getter (2007 film) on May 26, I did intend to fix all the incoming links and attended to five of those (List of films at the 2007 Sundance Film Festival, List of American films of 2007, List of films set in Oregon, File:Go getter 07 poster.jpg and creation of The Go-Getter disambiguation page) on that same day, over five months ago. However, some interruption prevented completion of the task and, unfortunately, I neglected to return for the remaining links. Again, my thanks to you for having noticed it, thus giving me the opportunity to complete what I had started. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 18:24, 3 November 2015 (UTC)

Featuring your work on Wikipedia's front page: DYKs
Thank you for your recent articles, including Piotr Domaradzki, which I read with interest. When you create an extensive and well referenced article, you may want to have it featured on Wikipedia's main page in the Did You Know section. Articles included there will be read by thousands of our viewers. To do so, add your article to the list at T:TDYK. Let me know if you need help, Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 01:51, 10 November 2015 (UTC)
 * I am grateful for your kind words. I have never before submitted an article for the DYK section but, if Wikipedians are eligible to submit articles which they did not start, and you feel that the Piotr Domaradzki entry has the potential of being accepted, then I would certainly welcome your experience in such matters being put to such commendable use. &mdash;Roman Spinner (talk)(contribs) 02:16, 11 November 2015 (UTC)

Sunday Nov 22: Soviet Jewry Edit-a-thon & Women In Science Edit-a-thon
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ArbCom elections are now open!
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Talk:Second Thoughts are Best
I invite you to an ongoing RM. --George Ho (talk) 17:10, 28 November 2015 (UTC)

== Dec 9: WikiWednesday Salon and Skill-Share NYC; Dec 12: Art & Law editathon + Dec 13: Black Film editathon == (You can subscribe/unsubscribe from future notifications for NYC-area events by adding or removing your name from this list.)

DYK for Piotr Domaradzki
Graeme Bartlett (talk) 00:01, 5 December 2015 (UTC)

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December 2015
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 * move|Paul O'Neill (politician)|per Naming conventions (identity) subject's own signature, as reproduced in Wikipedia, indicates the middle initial "H." and all

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