User talk:STAIDCONTEXT

Reply to: "I disagree with you rolling back my revision 1029352740 June 20, 2021"
[Your Message]: It was the article 'List of marines and naval infantry forces', not 'List of special forces'. The naval infantry (hải quân đánh bộ) is simply a force that fights by landing on land from sea or river. 'Đặc công' is just how the Vietnamese military calls 'Biệt kích', or in other words, they are two synonyms. Translated into English, there is only 'Commando'. In the viwiki, there are no articles on the term 'Đặc công', they all lead to the article 'Biệt kích'. It can be said that your English translation of the word "đặc công" is incorrect because "biệt kích" is the original word, and when compiled incorrectly, it will be easy to be confused between Đặc công ('biệt kích', 'commando') and 'Lực lượng đặc biệt' ('special forces'). Conceptually, commandos are not simply amphibious operations from the sea, they are a separate fighting force, performing special operations. By having identical operations, commandos and special forces are almost the same. However, in the Vietnamese military, units like the 126th brigade or the 5th brigade, they call it commandos. So it was better to keep calling those two special brigades as commandos. Its more better to remove those two special brigades from that list, since they are not pure naval infantry, in the article "Naval Special Forces (People's Army of Vietnam" or the Vietnamese version "Binh chủng Hải quân Đánh bộ, Quân đội nhân dân Việt Nam" also explain the difference between naval infantry and commandos. STAIDCONTEXT (talk) 11:04, 20 June 2021 (UTC)


 * Dear friend STAIDCONTEXT, I'm really sorry you do not agree with my rollbacks. Let's see your points one by one:
 * The term "commando" is a british word derivated from SA/dutch. In british it have gained a new meaning similar to "Special Forces", and is now used in this sense also in french. But we are *not* translating a SA/dutch, british or french term, we are translating a *vietnamite* term, and the best literal translation of the term "Đặc công" is "Special Forces".
 * The term used in vietnamite sources to indicate the 5th and 126th Brigades is "Đặc công", not "biệt kích". See [] and []. Wikipedia articles, as you certainly know, are *not* considered a valid source for other wiki pages, but anyway even in the *generic* vi.wiki article Biệt kích that you quote the vietnamite equivalent are clearly indicated as "Đặc công Việt Nam". And if you take a bit of time to check the *specific* vi.wiki articles about the 5th and 126th Brigades you will see that their names are indicated using the term "Đặc công" (see Lữ đoàn Đặc công 5, Quân đội nhân dân Việt Nam and Lữ đoàn Đặc công Hải quân 126). So even vi.viki (if you really want to use it as a source) confirms that "Đặc công" is the term to be translated. And the best literal translation of the term "Đặc công" is still "Special Forces".
 * About the fact that the 5th and 126th Special Forces Brigades are not "pure" naval infantry, that of course is in part true. The point is that they are neither "pure" naval special forces unit (i.e. small, dedicated underwater assault unit, like the italian COMSUBIN or the spanish Fuerza de Guerra Naval Especial etc.). On the contrary, they are fairly large units that specialize in all kind of amphibious operations and that *also* include small underwater assault detachments. So while the COMSUBN, the FGNE etc. have not been included in List of marines and naval infantry forces, as they are dedicated UDT/combat swimmers/SF outfits, this two vietnamite brigades, like the Syrian Sea Commandos Regiment, or the iranian Naval Special Forces, or the greek Amphibious Raiders Squadron etc. *do* have a specific amphibious assault role as part of their main mission (both currently and historically), and as such IMO can properly be included in the List of marines and naval infantry forces article.
 * I hope that my position now is a bit more clear then what I've managed to squeeze in the edit summaries of the rollbacks. As you can see from the article history, I've been putting a lot of time and research efforts in the List of marines and naval infantry forces article, and please believe me, I have considered *very* carefully the inclusion or exclusion of some "borderline" units: of course it is hard to identify generic clear-cut criteria and it is therefore largely a matter of a case-by-case-judgement, but I'm fairly well convinced that all the included units are in their proper place.
 * I hope there is not any bad feeling on your side about the rollbacks, I've tried to stress in the edit summaries that there is *no intention at all* to be rude in any way, on the contrary I really appreciate your contribution exactly as everybody else, but honestly *in this specific case* I do not consider them as accurate. That's all. Hope to hear from you again. All the best --Arturolorioli (talk) 15:18, 20 June 2021 (UTC)

Vietnam People's Navy Region 3 Command moved to draftspace
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 * I just translated from the Vietnamese Wikipedia article "Bộ Tư lệnh Vùng 3 Hải quân Nhân dân Việt Nam", which is an article in a series of articles about the 5 regional commands of the Vietnam People's Navy. STAIDCONTEXT (talk) 07:03, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

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Mobile Police Command moved to draftspace
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Naval Infantry Arms moved to draftspace
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 * STAIDCONTEXT (talk)

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