User talk:Sandstein/Archives/2012/December

Carl Hirschmann
(Disruptive content by removed)
 * This user is vandalizing my talk page as well as User talk:Favonian (an admin's). I've asked Favonian the same, but would it be possible to block my talk page against anonymous edits? Thanks! This ip is clearly a sock/one trick pony. Asav | Talk (Member of the OTRS Volunteer Response Team) 15:05, 1 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Yep, likely a reincarnation of, who was blocked for the same kind of non-BLP-compliant obsession. Done, and IP blocked.  Sandstein   16:38, 1 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks a bundle! Asav | Talk (Member of the OTRS Volunteer Response Team) 16:41, 1 December 2012 (UTC)

The Helvetii as a Gallic people
Perhaps i was a little bit quick with adding the Helvetii as Gauls. I thought it would be uncontroversial as they were originally on the List of Gallic tribes here on Wikipedia. They are also mentioned as such in several books. It's confusing because Gallic tribes are often simply listed a Celtic. Like the thoroughly Gallic Arverni in this article on Encyclopedia Britannica. Sorry if i disturbed you. Krakkos (talk) 23:14, 1 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks. I am not very familiar with the issue, but you changed a cited attribution without also changing the citation. Perhaps the issue of how the tribe is described should be elucidated in the article, with a discussion of who calls them what.  Sandstein   07:59, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

TTR World Snowboard Tour
You deleted this page. Can I ask why? This is an international organization that Qualifies snowboarders for the world snowboard championships. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Robindmacdonald (talk • contribs) 05:18, 2 December 2012 (UTC)
 * was deleted for the reasons given in the deletion log.  Sandstein   08:00, 2 December 2012 (UTC)

List of Indian castes
In your recent close of this AFD, you seem to base your action upon two particular points. One is the issue of sources and the other is the issue of the recent compaction of the list. On the issue of sources, please note that multiple good sources were, in fact, presented as being a reasonable basis for improved sourcing of the list. I have one of them here by my side now: Caste, Society and Politics in India. This is a work of recent scholarship which forms part of the New Cambridge History of India and is dedicated to the topic of caste. I have not yet finished reading it but can already see that it is quite satisfactory as a source. For example, it has a glossary with entries such as "Ahir - caste title of non-elite north Indian 'peasant'-pastoralists known also as Yadav (q.v.). Note that we have a corresponding article, Ahirs, which opens "Ahir is an Indian caste...", just as the source says.  Furthermore, this one book has a bibiliography of 24 pages which contains hundreds more sources such as The development of caste organisation in South India and so the claim that we lack sources seems absurd.

Now I observed the action of another editor in compacting this list. His action seemed a reasonably bold one and it seemed that he was just getting started. Perhaps he, like myself, has been busy with other matters in these last few days. It would have been an easy matter for me to expand the revised format of his list but I just didn't have free time as it was the end of the month and a variety of work and personal matters had to be attended to at this time.

Please userfy the article for me and I will then expand it soon as I have more sources coming in the mail and have some leave to take before the end of the year.

Warden (talk) 23:08, 2 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Done, at User:Colonel Warden/List of Indian castes. Good luck, this is going to be difficult to create and maintain.  Sandstein   01:55, 3 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Many thanks. I'll expand this greatly in my copious free time... Warden (talk) 15:39, 3 December 2012 (UTC)

Signpost: ASOIAF Wikiproject interview
As you may know, a Signpost interview is planned for the ASOIAF wikiproject, see Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/WikiProject desk/Interviews6. It could still need some input from people editing the TV articles, and since I've seen your work, maybe you want to provide your opinions there. Maybe you know other editors as well. Danke. – sgeureka t•c 11:18, 4 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I'll reply there when I have time.  Sandstein   13:38, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Deletion vs redirect of Post-processing Hell
Hi Sandstein: for the AfD you just closed, recommendations were split between delete and redirect and were surprisingly contentious. As a new editor, I am still learning Wikipedia norms and I'd like to understand why you chose delete.

It is my understanding that redirects are cheap and preferred; they delete the content of the page, but preserve the page history for others to look at and understand. Whereas deletes are expensive--it is WP::TNT, removing all traces of the page and forcing folks to start over from scratch. Thanks, Mark viking (talk) 18:48, 13 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, "delete" implements what all participants agree about: we don't need this article; and nobody who advocated a redirect mentioned any particular need to maintain the history of this really awful stub. Whether we need a redirect, on the other hand, is not clear from the discussion, but you can go ahead and create one editorially. When we say "redirects are cheap", we mean in terms of server storage and bandwidth; in this sense a deletion is no more expensive.  Sandstein   18:55, 13 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Thanks for your explanation. I will remember for future AfDs to recommend history preservation if I deem it useful. Mark viking (talk) 19:18, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

Deletion of Touché (quartet)
In deleting Touché (quartet) you offered no comment. What were your specific reasons for deleting the page, presumably based on the page's content and the discussion over its proposed deletion? —ADavidB 20:18, 14 December 2012 (UTC)
 * The reason for my closure is that the discussion established consensus that the coverage of the article's subject isn't substantial enough to establish its notability, and nobody was convinced by your argument that the competition the band participated in is significant enough for that purpose.  Sandstein   20:54, 14 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Given that Touché is an a cappella vocal quartet – not a band – and its competition judged (only) voice-only quartets and choruses, it seems clear to me that you didn't actually read much of the article or its sources before deletion. As such, I question the veracity of your consensus interpretation. —ADavidB 03:39, 15 December 2012 (UTC)

Hand-coding
Hey all :).

I'm dropping you a note because you've been involved in dealing with feedback from the Article Feedback Tool. To get a better handle on the overall quality of comments now that the tool has become a more established part of the reader experience, we're undertaking a round of hand coding - basically, taking a sample of feedback and marking each piece as inappropriate, helpful, so on - and would like anyone interested in improving the tool to participate :).

You can code as many or as few pieces of feedback as you want: this page should explain how to use the system, and there is a demo here. Once you're comfortable with the task, just drop me an email at and I'll set you up with an account :).

If you'd like to chat with us about the research, or want live tutoring on the software, there will be an office hours session on Monday 17 December at 23:00 UTC in. Hope to see some of you there! Thanks, Okeyes (WMF) (talk) 23:20, 14 December 2012 (UTC)

What do you mean by that?
That is the official genealogy of that aristocratic family. I am not associated with this in any way (and not related or part of that family). There is no better source material nor can there be. D is for... (talk) 22:51, 17 December 2012 (UTC)


 * What source, exactly, do you refer to?  Sandstein   22:58, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Second question
I don't understand why information is being removed that is correct. It is common practice (yes, also on wikipedia!) to publish genealogical information on aristocratic families. D is for... (talk) 22:55, 17 December 2012 (UTC)


 * In Wikipedia, information must not only be true, but also verifiable through reliable published sources, particularly in the biographies of living persons. I recommend that you read the policy pages WP:V and WP:BLP.  Sandstein   22:58, 17 December 2012 (UTC)

Paul Bedson RfC
I commented regarding this RfC closure at WP:AN, in case you're interested. dci &#124;  TALK   21:13, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

Sandstein, thank you for the close. Several editors will have more time for constructive editing after today. Mike Christie (talk - contribs - library) 00:24, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Offensive/Fabricated information on wiki page "Hazem Salah Abu Ismail"
Dear Sandstein,

I noticed that you reverted several offensive and fabricated edits to the wiki page about "Hazem Salah Abu Ismail" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hazem_Salah_Abu_Ismail). It seems that the wiki abusers are at it again and have updated that wiki page with statements such as "enjoyed popular support by ignorant sheep".

I don't know Hazem Salah Abu Ismail, and am not sure I share any of his political, economic, or social views, but language like this has no place on wikipedia.

Please help revert this web page once again to its non-offensive state. This is the first such request I make on wikipedia, so apologies if this is not the proper channel for such requests.

UPDATE - I have modified the web page to remove abusive and fabricated information.

74.73.122.72 (talk) 04:33, 20 December 2012 (UTC)AM


 * Thanks for watching out for violations of our policy WP:BLP. As you have noticed, you can undo problematic edits yourself. See also WP:REVERT.  Sandstein   11:19, 20 December 2012 (UTC)

Deletion review for Touché (quartet)
An editor has asked for a deletion review of Touché (quartet). Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. —ADavidB 21:13, 22 December 2012 (UTC)

Maximilian von Götzen-Itúrbide
Could you restore Maximilian von Götzen-Itúrbide? Articles for deletion/House of Habsburg-Itúrbide did not voted for its deletion on the article House of Habsburg-Itúrbide. This article should go under its own deletion proposal. Thanks.--The Emperor&#39;s New Spy (talk) 00:50, 23 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but no. The AfD discussion did include the Maximilian article, which was properly tagged for deletion.  Sandstein   10:39, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

A user possibly seeking a deletion review
Following a conversation with a user whose Laravel article had been a CSD G4, I have suggested on their Talk page that they contact you as closing admin on the previous AfD. Thought I should let you know. AllyD (talk) 21:31, 27 December 2012 (UTC)