User talk:Sanfranman59/Sowers

Copied discussion from Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Baseball/Players 3/8/2007:

I've just completed a substantial rewrite of the Jeremy Sowers article and am posting this message to solicit comments about it before I replace the existing article. You can find my rewrite here: User:Sanfranman59/Sowers. As this is my first substantial article contribution, I'd appreciate any and all feedback.

I'd particularly like guidance/thoughts about the following:
 * I deleted the Stats table. It doesn't seem to me that it belongs in an encyclopedic article, but I feel a little reticent to dump it since someone seems to have put a great deal of effort into it.
 * Dead link - I deleted the reference link to Rick Bozich's Courier-Journal article because the page no longer exists on the website. Since the reference wasn't linked to any specific statement(s) in the article, I didn't see a reason to keep it there. Is this reasonable or would it be better to leave the reference there and note it as a dead link? (Aren't references supposed to be linked to statements in the article?)
 * Categories:
 * WP categories are a little overwhelming. Is there a standard set of categories that should be used for player articles?
 * More specifically, Sowers was born in Ohio, but grew up in Louisville, KY. I wasn't clear about whether I should use Ohio or Kentucky as the "Major League Players from" category.
 * Is it appropriate to include the "People from Louisville" category in this type of situation?
 * I'm surprised that there's not a category for people who attended/graduated from/are associated with Vanderbilt University ... at least I couldn't find one. How does one search WP for such a category?
 * Finally, what is the protocol for doing a complete overhaul of an article like this? Is it considered bad form to simply overwrite what's out there and wait to see if anyone complains? Is there a way to be more proactive in soliciting input before doing so (e.g., what I'm doing here)?

Thanks in advance for your input! Sanfranman59 02:50, 7 March 2007 (UTC)
 * stats table - good call to delete the stats that were there.
 * dead link - if there are no statements that need references in your updated version, then it was probably ok to delete it. People can put references without using inline citations, but I think it's considered bad form.  Inline citations are much better.
 * Categories - I agree that there are a ton of categories that need to be considered, but I think you've got them covered. I'm not sure what the standard procedure is for the "People from" and "Players from" categories. As far as Vanderbilt people, there is a List of Vanderbilt University people, but no category as far as I could tell.  I just went to the page on Vanderbilt University to find it.
 * protocol - I don't know the technically correct way of doing an overhaul like this, but you are right to seek input from others. Before you overwrite the old article, you should check to make sure you aren't removing any information that was added to it since you started your work.
 * Other suggestions - I'm not really a fan of the "Other Highlights" lists and would rather see them better integrated. Also, it's generally not good form to have a "Trivia" section.  You might just consider putting that sentence at the end of the "Major League" section, since it does relate to the Major Leagues.  One minor thing - I don't think you need to list his stats from his first major league game.
 * These are just my opinions, and it would probably be best to get advice from others as well. Great work on the article!
 * - Mattingly23 18:38, 8 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the very helpful feedback, Mattingly23. I found the list of Vandy U people also but didn't know what to do with it. Do you think a link to this list should be included in the article somewhere? Regarding the "Other Highlights" lists, imho, it can be cumbersome to put factoids like this into sentence form and make the language flow. I thought it might be appropriate just to list them for quick reference. I'm going to wait and see if I get any other feedback about this before changing it. I moved the sentence about his brother to the end of the intro paragraph. I think it fits there pretty well. As you suggest, I'll probably end up dumping the stats from his first game.


 * Another protocol question from this newbie: Does this type of discussion belong on the talk page where I have the article in my User space? Or is it best to leave it here in case other newcomers to the project might benefit? Sanfranman59 19:15, 8 March 2007 (UTC)

I think the best thing to do with a smaller article is to have the discussion on the original article's talk page. I did a major rewrite of Babe Ruth where I had the discussion on the sandbox talk page, but I knew from the outset that was going to be a huge conversation. Then you can leave a not on the relevant project talk pages, directing interested editors to the discussion.

As for the rewrite, you've done a great job of bringing this article up to standards. I wish more of our articles on mid-level Major Leaguers were this concise and well sourced. My only comment is that, since you have the Baseball Cube link, the college and minor league stat lines might be taken out. However, they in no way violate policy, and I have a decided prejudice against stat charts, so take my opinion with a grain of salt. Thanks for seeking out feedback.--Djrobgordon 19:31, 8 March 2007 (UTC)