User talk:Sbaio/Archive 2022

Climate Pledge Arena capacity
Please elaborate on what you mean by "Temporary seating doesn't count" that you feel the need to make changes to the List of National Hockey League arenas page from an exact count to an estimation for Climate Pledge Arena. (saint0wen (talk) 07:51, 9 January 2022 (UTC)) Arena's website says – "Hockey: 17,100". I also see that NHL game logs list seating capacity at 17,151. Therefore, I assume that some seats are temporary, because why it would be different than what the arena official lists? If you have sources that would justify the 17,151 seating capacity as permanent then you should show them. – Sabbatino (talk) 16:37, 9 January 2022 (UTC)
 * There's no such thing as an assumption when it comes to fact. That you said you are assuming info immediately disqualifies your argument against what is officially provided by the NHL. With the link you referenced, this arena has capacities for each event buildout that "just happen" to all be rounded to the nearest hundred? It even contradicts itself by stating the arena is designed to have a maximum capacity of 18,100, yet says basketball capacity is 200 more than that. You don't really have grounds to tell me that I'm the one who needs to provide a legitimate source. Use what is officially provided by the NHL until you can provide proof that the Kraken are providing overflow seating, which "just happens" to be the same for every game. (saint0wen (talk) 05:14, 17 January 2022 (UTC))

Governor's Cup (Florida) revert?
I'm curious as to why you felt the need to revert my recent edit of this page, and why you referred to it as a nonsense test edit? All edits were accurate as the facts clearly bear out. With only one game remaining in the 2021-22 regular season series and Florida having achieved 5 total points thus far from two wins and one OT loss, Tampa Bay cannot "catch" them even if they win the final match on April 24, as the Lightning only has two points so far. Kind regards: --Kneedwont (talk) 16:11, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
 * First of all, you changed "2021–22" to "2020–21". Secondly, WP:CRYSTAL quite clearly says not to predict the future (even if it is true that Panthers have already won). – Sabbatino (talk) 17:00, 11 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Enlighten me. If the Panthers have already won the series, how does my edit predict a future event? Whether the Panthers file for bankruptcy today, or the remainder of the season plays out, the result I edited in is already a fact -Florida has won the 2021-22 season series. Moreover, no adjustments were made to anything concerning the remaining match. Conversely if what you postulate is true, then by that standard, other editors should not make edits to the "current" league standings in football, baseball, basketball, soccer seasons, etc., toward the end of those respective seasons, when they note in the league table section of an article that Team X has clinched a title, or won qualification to the playoffs, or won qualification to another tournament such as the UEFA Champions League before the season is completed. And yet I see it occur on Wikipedia in sport after sport in season after season, without being revised/reverted. Are those other editors all in error also? Kind regards --Kneedwont (talk) 17:16, 12 January 2022 (UTC)
 * You are comparing two different things. Game logs, standings and other sports-related content are updated after the game is finished. The Panthers and Lightning have not played their fourth game. Therefore, it should not be updated until they finish their regular season series. – Sabbatino (talk) 15:53, 13 January 2022 (UTC)

Reliable sources for filmography
First off, I am sorry for all the talk page reverting. Second, what are some reliable sources to check someone's filmography? It seems that the vast majority of filmography on Wikipedia is unsourced, anyways, so I was wondering if I even need a source. Thanks in advance. Mandomanny313 (talk) 17:41, 23 January 2022 (UTC)
 * You should probably ask at WP:FILM. I am not editing film-related content so I do not know which sources are considered reliable (but I do know that IMDb is not reliable). – Sabbatino (talk) 17:55, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

File:1975 NBA All-Star Game.svg
Hello. I noticed that you tagged File:1975 NBA All-Star Game.svg with Bad SVG. This template is to be used when an SVG file contains embedded raster graphics, which the aforementioned image does not. You may have meant to tag it with Bad trace, a tag used when an SVG file is poorly traced. Thank you. – Pbrks (t • c) 18:47, 25 January 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the heads up. I was not aware that some other tag existed. – Sabbatino (talk) 16:24, 26 January 2022 (UTC)

Uniform numbers
It also would not hurt for you to check the announcement before reverting this stuff. I generally give you the benefit of the doubt on your edits because you typically know what you are doing. I'd ask the same from you. Also, I DID use a link to the announcement when I updated the Nets roster template - just forgot to for the current roster. Rikster2 (talk) 17:17, 23 February 2022 (UTC)
 * First of all, my edit summary was not directed at you, because I did not see who added the number. Secondly, I am busy with work-related stuff so I do not have time to look at all the announcements. Thirdly, I always add a link to source in edit summary when adding a jersey number. – Sabbatino (talk) 17:23, 23 February 2022 (UTC)

Jimmy Butler
I'd prefer not to bother with dispute resolution so I thought I'd just message you here. The image upon which you're insisting is extremely grainy and low quality. Also, the conversation to which you linked and claimed shows a consensus that lead images shouldn't show players wearing "hats or accessories" actually discusses images of players wearing masks, which is an entirely separate issue. I'm thinking you might just prefer the current image because it shows Butler making a funny face? I hope that's not the case. --Dennis C. Abrams (talk) 15:28, 7 March 2022 (UTC)
 * It is best that this is discussed at WT:NBA so more people would give their opinion. Therefore, I started a discussion at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Basketball Association/Archive 42. – Sabbatino (talk) 18:13, 7 March 2022 (UTC)

NBA All-Star pages
Hey why did you revert these changes? It wasn't a big change. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 49ersthebest (talk • contribs) 20:10, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
 * It was not a big change, but it messed up the tables. – Sabbatino (talk) 14:58, 10 March 2022 (UTC)

Edits
What have I been doing “at least once every year”? Also I am the one who originally changed that sentence in the opening paragraph in the Knicks article, so why can’t I change my own edit? Banan14kab (talk) 17:01, 11 April 2022 (UTC)
 * First of all, you keep changing the location when it was pretty much agreed by WT:NBA that current formation is good. Secondly, you do not own the page so you ought to get consensus first before trying to force the change. – Sabbatino (talk) 17:23, 11 April 2022 (UTC)

Play-in postseason discussion consensus
Hello, do you know where may I find an NBA teams seasons pages discussion consensus regarding the situation about the play-in tournaments and the postseason, if there is one? I'd like to contribute to the talk page for such one. Thank you.--GalaxyFighter55 (talk) 04:38, 15 April 2022 (UTC)
 * The NBA said it themselves multiple times that "play-in" games are not playofs (posteason = playoffs). There was a discussion somewhere at WT:NBA, but have no time to search it at this point, because it is already Easter in my country and I am kind of busy with other things. – Sabbatino (talk) 05:43, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia talk:WikiProject National Basketball Association/Archive 41 and Articles for deletion/2021 NBA Play-in Tournament were the supposed discussions that I had in mind. The play-in games are reminiscent of NBA's tie-breaker games games that were held in the 1940s and 1950s. I really suggest for you to start a new discussion at WT:NBA and see if other editors' opinions changed. Because NBA quite clearly said more than once that play-in games are neither regular season or postseason (playoffs). – Sabbatino (talk) 17:20, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

2010 FIBA Asia Stanković Cup revert
Re: your revert of the edit to the 2010 FIBA Asia Stanković Cup article ... The year was added to the date in the infobox in the article for two simple reasons: Including the year with the date has benefits, and causes no harm. Would you please reconsider your revert. Thanks. Truthanado (talk) 16:41, 17 April 2022 (UTC)
 * 1) It is recommended by WP:DATE to include the year with each date for clarity and to avoid any confusion
 * 2) The year in an event name or article title may not be the year in which the event is held. Witness the 2020 Summer Olympics that were held in 2021. There are also leagues in which games (in particular, playoffs and championships) may be held in January or February of the following year.


 * First of all, MOS:DATE says that Omit year only where there is no risk of ambiguity. If it took place in another year (like the 2020 Summer Olympics) then it would be indicated. In addition, I am very well aware of sports seasons starting in one year and ending in the next so your little "lecture" can stop right there. — Sabbatino (talk) 03:51, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry you thought it was a lecture, it wasn't. I was simply explaining why I added the year to the date. I agree that, in a paragraph where all dates are in the same year, there's no ambiguity and no reason to add the year to each date. But in an infobox where it's the only date shown, how does a user know there's no ambiguity? Truthanado (talk) 14:01, 18 April 2022 (UTC)
 * For example, 2021 World Junior Ice Hockey Championships and 2021–22 NBA season. From NBA's season year it is clear that it takes in 2021 and 2022 and that is clearly noted in the infobox to avoid confusion. Meanwhile, a different situation is with IIHF WJC as it usually starts in late December and ends in early January, which is clearly indicated. Now regarding, 2010 FIBA Asia Stanković Cup, if it happened in a different year than the page's title suggests then that would be a good idea to indicate it. But right now it looks like (at least to me) WP:ASTONISH to include the year. – Sabbatino (talk) 17:15, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

NHL All-Star Games
Hello! I recently added to the 2022 NHL All-Star game the Celeb goalies that participated. You reverted the edit saying "rvt per older seasons"

Maybe instead of just reverting and leaving a four (More 3 1/2) word response we, move the footnote elsewhere in the article. Or try adding a different section to the rosters. Or say "That doesn't belong in that spot, see if you can reword it and put it somewhere else"

Instead of just removing properly sourced content that belongs somewhere in the article. We should find out how to put it in, As I said in my Edit summary. "not sure if that's a good spot, I didn't think it fit it rosters, Please move if you can think of a better spot, or to add Jocelyne Lamoureux-Davidson who participated in the Fountain Face-off. " Do you think non NHL guest players should be in rosters? Do you think we should add a paragraph describing the breakaway challenge like the Fountain Face-Off has to mention Lamoureux-Davidson?

Also, so what if the article wasn't absolutely the same and perfectly lined up compared to the other articles? the other All-Star games didn't have guest goaltenders. Which, we also don't have Coyne Schofield in 2018, I would add it, I want to add it. But how am I to know where to put it so it doesn't get revoked. One line that has an ambiguous place in the article does not ruin how it looks, ruin flow, ruin formatting.

I understand that you want to keep Wikipedia looking nice. But it feels like, especially with this revert, that you just want the article to look how you want it, instead of keeping information in it.

How do you want me to add this relevant information to these articles. MatthewNewHouse (talk) 17:08, 19 April 2022 (UTC)
 * I rarely edit pages of NHL All-Star Games, but I try to maintain the format of older pages when I end up in one of NHL All-Star Games pages. You ought to ask questions regarding the format, ideas and other things related to ice hockey at WT:NHL, because that project is responsible for everything related to ice hockey. – Sabbatino (talk) 17:19, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

Porin Ässät
What was the problem with the "Notable alumni" list there? --Cheers! Kilaseell - Message me! - 10:21, 14 May 2022 (UTC)

And is it okay to add a list of Ässät pkayerd in the NHL? --Cheers! Kilaseell - Message me! - 10:33, 14 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Such lists are subject to WP:OR, because there is no clear criteria for the inclusion of players. – Sabbatino (talk) 04:06, 15 May 2022 (UTC)

Help
I couldn't think of anybody else so i'll just ask you. I uploaded a logo for Helsingin Jääkiekkoklubi on wikimedia commons. I forgot to list what type of license it has and i don't know how to change it. Also, im actually not sure what to put there since the website of the team just says that "here you can download the logo" and just lists different forms of the file. --Cheers! Kilaseell - Message me! - 10:58, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I am not familiar with license changes at Wikimedia Commons. Maybe you should ask at Village pump or Help desk. – Sabbatino (talk) 15:00, 23 May 2022 (UTC)

Lithuania
Maybe one would care to explain why Latvia and Estonia are considered to be a part of Nothern Europe, but for Lithuania somehow different rules apply? Last time I checked, all three Baltic States possess the same geographic affiliations. Double standards much? SeriousThinker - 13:50, 27 May 2022 (BST)
 * First of all, you should read WP:RUDE and WP:CIVIL, because you clearly are unaware of these policies and you should also get familiar with WP:CON and WP:V. Secondly, editors at Latvia and Estonia pages probably have their own consensus regarding it. Thirdly, there is a note at Lithuania, which quite clearly explains the difference so it was decided to use is a country in the Baltic region of Europe. in the lead paragraph in order to avoid WP:EW as in the past some editors used to change it from northern Europe to eastern Europe and vice versa (or even list northeastern Europe). – Sabbatino (talk) 13:25, 27 May 2022 (UTC)

Stanley Cup Finals
Thanks for updating all of the team season links in all of these articles. Deadman137 (talk) 01:56, 2 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks. However, there are also other sections in those pages that need link changes (for example, links to other teams at "Path to the Finals"). I will get back to it when I have more time. – Sabbatino (talk) 03:11, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

Quick heads up
User:Nanerz has been adding player names to traded draft picks in team season articles again after you warned them about it last year. I've removed what they've done so far, but we'll probably need to keep an eye on them if they try to do it again. Deadman137 (talk) 23:42, 22 July 2022 (UTC)


 * I am aware of that, but I just do not have time for that now. In addition, the editor in question has been reinstating the transactions format on teams' pages (without consensus), which has been changed about 4 or 5 years ago at WP:NHL. – Sabbatino 08:16, 25 July 2022 (UTC)

Non-sense
Seriously, do you think this reversion is something constructive or collaborative? Please, tell me why the change is unuseful from your point of view so I can understand why you procede like that. Fma12 (talk) 09:14, 12 August 2022 (UTC)
 * There is no reason to change the color of the "nest" since it is different for a reason. And thanks for showing that there is a WP:TCREEP on that page. In addition, you claimed "style, alignment", which is misleading since you did not change the alignment. – Sabbatino 14:34, 12 August 2022 (UTC)

Reverts involving start date and age template
Why are you reverting the edits to basketball teams that indicate how old they are utilizing the Template:start date and age with no reason given for the revert?

The template's Usage in Articles section states: "This template is most often used in infoboxes in articles about buildings or organizations, identifying when they were started/founded/opened or dissolved/ended/closed."

This clearly indicates that consensus on use of the template has already been achieved. The template was created 14 years ago in 2008 for the explicit use of identifying how long a building or organization has been in existence, which is appreciated by Wikipedia readers ... it's useful to know how long a building or organization has been in existence at a glance, without having to do a mental date calculation.

Since each basketball team is an organization, usage of the template is clearly compliant with the template's guidelines. It also is consistent with usage of the template for founded dates and ages in several other sports' infoboxes in Wikipedia, most notably soccer clubs.

Would you please justify your action and reconsider the reverts. Truthanado (talk) 02:35, 13 August 2022 (UTC)
 * There is no consensus for that in either the NBA or NHL pages. – Sabbatino 02:37, 13 August 2022 (UTC)

Brock Nelson
Howdy. As you can see, we've an IP willing to edit-war, to add Brock Nelson as an alternate captain. GoodDay (talk) 22:11, 17 October 2022 (UTC)

Scoring leaders
I do in fact know what a top 10 is, but more importantly, I know a rigid adherence to it is not the standard. The phrase "If there is more than 10 players, nonetheless list all the leaders" has been included in the leading scorer table since 2010–11; hell, there's a top 11 for 2012–13 as a result. If you have a problem, open a talk page discussion to get it removed, but you can do without the snarkiness when you haven't even bothered to read the table. The Kip (talk) 14:49, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
 * It cannot be any clearer than what wrote in this revision. In addition, your example of the 2012–13 scoring leaders is silly because Getzlaf and Datsyuk were tied in goals, assists and points (obviously). Meanwhile, Zuccarello (4 goals and 6 assists) and MacKinnon (3 goals and 7 assists) are only tied in points. Looks like you are the one who should read what other editors indicate to you instead of edit-warring. – Sabbatino 15:04, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Funny that you accuse me of edit-warring when nobody has had a problem with this in past seasons besides yourself and occasionally Ho-ju, but I’ve come across more than a few massive egos on this site so I suppose there’s always room for more; the chart swelled as big as 15-16 players at various times in past seasons with no issue. I’ll keep doing things my way as I’ve kept doing for several years with minimal complaints, and if you want to continue your unnecessarily snarky edit warring feel free to do so. The Kip (talk) 15:08, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
 * You got reverted by other editor so you must start a discussion per WP:BRD. In addition, go show your WP:RUDEness somewhere else. And your messages also indicate that you are WP:NOTGETTINGIT. – Sabbatino 15:26, 26 October 2022 (UTC)
 * I agree with you, Sabbatino. I hope this edit-warring can come to an end. Ho-ju-96 (talk) 15:44, 26 October 2022 (UTC)

NBA current place standings
Where do you get the notion that you can't place them in their current division and conference place? The NFL does it, and as far as I've seen the NBA articles have had it done multiple times after the first month or so in previous seasons. Unless you show me a consensus that shows otherwise, I will not yield to this revision. GalaxyFighter55 (talk) 05:58, 22 November 2022 (UTC)


 * I have removed them from the articles in question to prevent edit warring from you and come to a talk page consensus for the time being. Make your case.--GalaxyFighter55 (talk) 06:11, 22 November 2022 (UTC)
 * The NFL is a very poor example, because teams play their games once a week. Meanwhile, in the NBA and NHL teams play 2–4 games per week and the schedule is different. Wikipedia is not supposed to be up-to-date by the minute and there is a "Standings" section for a reason on the season pages of teams. Therefore, it is best not to edit the standings in the infobox until the end of the season to avoid mistakes. This approach has been used in the NHL infoboxes for as long as I remember. Regarding the "edit warring" part – you are the one that likes to do that and this is not the first when you are WP:RUDE towards me for no reason. – Sabbatino 19:14, 23 November 2022 (UTC)
 * That is very untrue and actually that reply applies to WP:RUDE as well, so probably shouldn't have used that one.--GalaxyFighter55 (talk) 04:46, 24 November 2022 (UTC)
 * That being said, I think there needs to be a user consensus for this as it has been poorly applied for many years and inconsistently enforced as there is no guideline to base this on.--GalaxyFighter55 (talk) 04:48, 24 November 2022 (UTC)