User talk:SilkTork/Archive2/Archive 47

Hi
Hi, SilkTork. Sorry for dropping by, but I wanted to express my thoughts that I agree with your assessment of me in your ArbNotes. If you have any pointers (on how to become a better asset to the committee) for me as a former member, I would appreciate any advice. Thank you for your time, and happy holidays! Alex Shih (talk) 19:15, 19 December 2017 (UTC)


 * Well done. I didn't expect you to get in. Best advice? Stay friendly and polite with the rest of the Committee even when disagreeing. Don't suggest changes or new ways of doing things until you've been on the Committee for at least a year. Don't join in discussions unless you have something meaningful to contribute. You don't have to speak just for the sake of it. But do speak up when you have an insight that's worth sharing, even if it seems obvious. Sometimes the obvious can be overlooked.
 * Decide if there's some areas that you feel you might be best not getting involved in - such as considering unban requests, or auditing the advanced permissions. Or some areas you feel you might be good at, such as handling the unblock request emails. Let the others know which areas you are interested in working in, and which you'd rather not work in at all or want to wait for a bit longer before getting involved. Remember, that you can always change your mind about your work load, as long as you notify the others. There are no open case requests at the moment, so nothing to worry about there. But when one does come up, don't feel that you have to get involved straight away. You may want to sit out the first one, and just observe the internal discussions. You'll get a good feel from that of what is expected, and you'll soon be itching to join in to give your own opinion! On the other hand, don't be afraid to get involved in the first request that comes along. The experienced Committee members will take the lead, and prepare the case. Your job will be to cross-examine the evidence that has been presented, do some research of your own so you feel confident that the evidence and facts presented are appropriate. Then support or oppose the proposals based on your own feelings about the case. Don't be afraid to go against the flow. Better to go against consensus with your reasons laid out, than simply to follow the pack. It's also OK to change your mind.
 * While the work load is greatly reduced these days, it's still OK to take a break. Just let the others know. Better to take a break than to get stressed, or - worse still - just drop out completely. And don't take anything too personally. Whatever decision you make, someone will disagree with it, and will likely let you know, so you will always be making "the wrong decision". Such is life as a Committee member. But do treat with respect everyone you come up against. There is never any need to be rude or disrespectful to people going through an ArbCom case - even if the decision is that they did something wrong, and are banned. Most people are actually well intentioned. We are banning them to protect the project as a whole - not as a punishment. As far as I'm concerned if the person behind the banned account came back under a different name, didn't tell anyone, and did good work, I would see that as a positive result. Of course, if they are then dumb enough to contact you (which some do!), you have no choice but to block their account, inform the rest of the Committee, and make a public note. You can't, as a Committee member, keep those sorts of secrets. Anyway. Good luck. Just relax and enjoy the experience. SilkTork (talk) 22:07, 19 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Wow, thank you! Will do. Alex Shih (talk) 04:59, 20 December 2017 (UTC)

Merry Christmas!
 Merry Christmas !!

Hi, I wish you and your family a very Merry Christmas and a very Happy New Year,

Thanks for all your help and contributions on the 'pedia! ,

– Davey 2010 Merry Xmas / Happy New Year 14:09, 24 December 2017 (UTC)


 * Cool. I do like a Christmas card! SilkTork (talk) 14:15, 24 December 2017 (UTC)

Your recent edits to Ross-on-Wye
I find it strange that you've removed the climate information box from this page, since it instantly provides the viewer with valuable information without having to visit another site. Many other towns have this information on their page, therefore I propose that the deletion is reversed? How do you feel about this? I know you've left the link to the Met Office data, but if all information on here was given in the form of links, then Wikipedia would just become a hyperlink repository! CrackDragon (talk) 04:14, 3 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Hi CrackDragon. From previous discussions on this matter, I have found opinions are divided. There are some folks who love stats, and some who hate them, and there are those who take a mid course, and find them useful in certain situations. I am one of those who take a mid course. The essential climate information is still there in the article: the weather in Ross-on-Wye is similar to the rest of the UK. For those who would like more information, there is a link to the latest up to date information from the Met Office. I think finding the correct balance of detail and readability is a constant concern on Wikipedia. Sometimes we get it right, but not always. Given that the essential encyclopedic information is present in the article, and there is a link to the greater detail for those who wish it, I would not support returning the climax box; but mine is only one voice. As I say, some folks like it, others don't. There is no general agreement on when such stats are helpful, and when they are not. On the whole, when things other than vandalism are added to an article, they tend to stay. Most folks like a status quo. Removing extraneous data is always more difficult than adding it! SilkTork (talk) 10:22, 3 January 2018 (UTC)


 * The key to the need for met data is here.
 * A Met Office weather station provides long term climate data for the town.


 * I worked in Ross, way back in the 70s and met Clement Grant Dixon, a physics teacher who knew the story of the unique met station. Throughout the Second World War, it was the only volunteer run weather station to be accepted by the met office. Every night throughout the conflict, it was the only land-locked station to be included in the Shipping forecast on the World Service. The anecdotes go that- even when in the Pacific- the soldiers from Ross would know exactly what the weather was like around at their mothers. I am not sure if Grants family actually ran the station- or if I have distorted the facts, but I do think that in this case weather information is notable in its own right.ClemRutter (talk) 18:06, 4 January 2018 (UTC)


 * I am so pleased that I can go one stage further. Here is the supporting reference Ross on Wye Weather Station. When they say 'a short break in the way' they meam 1914-1918 not the later one. I think there is enough for a full article here too. ClemRutter (talk) 18:14, 4 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Go for it Clem! SilkTork (talk) 19:38, 4 January 2018 (UTC)


 * So Clem, does this mean, like me, you think the climate data should be restored!!? CrackDragon (talk) 13:41, 9 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Yes please. But lets not go over the top.ClemRutter (talk) 14:44, 13 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Well, just put it back to as it was then? CrackDragon (talk) 15:49, 15 January 2018 (UTC)


 * Done! CrackDragon (talk) 04:49, 17 January 2018 (UTC)

Mail
Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 22:42, 12 January 2018 (UTC)


 * The answer is yes. SilkTork (talk) 08:24, 13 January 2018 (UTC)

Advice
If this an inappropriate question on your talk page, I apologize. I am confounded regarding the effort to prepare the Vagina for GA review. If you have advice, I am ready to hear it. Best Regards, Barbara (WVS) ✐ ✉  23:45, 20 February 2018 (UTC)

SilkTork, I know we have been discussing via email, but see this section and the one immediately above it. All Axl and I are suggesting is that substantial changes be discussed before being added. And we have suggested this for valid reasons. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 23:58, 20 February 2018 (UTC)


 * I'll take a look. SilkTork (talk) 09:38, 21 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you. Best Regards, Barbara (WVS) ✐ ✉  12:33, 21 February 2018 (UTC)

@SilkTork: Please check "As a non-expect I am relying on those who are expects" at Talk:Vagina. That has a typo, should be "expert" (twice). Johnuniq (talk) 10:19, 9 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Ha! Thanks for the heads up. :-) SilkTork (talk) 10:27, 9 March 2018 (UTC)

Good cop bad cop?
I'm fine with it. I hope it works. I'd be interested to know why User:HJ Mitchell decided to downgrade from a previous two week block to a 72 hour one, all of two weeks after the fact. Mitigating circumstances? G M G talk   01:26, 19 March 2018 (UTC)
 * Oops. For context re: HJM.  G M G  talk   01:29, 19 March 2018 (UTC)


 * I suspect that editor is not going to be around for long. I'm idly going though their contributions and not seeing much that is useful while there is plenty that is unhelpful and disruptive. SilkTork (talk) 01:37, 19 March 2018 (UTC)


 * Well I just got back on desktop, where I can actually look into things, but this isn't encouraging. Appears they've been having similar problems on zhwiki.  G M G  talk   01:52, 19 March 2018 (UTC)

Greene King
Hi. What's the naming convention you've applied when moving Greene King to Greene King Brewery? The company's name is Greene King, and as far as I'm aware it's commonly referred to as such. Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 14:30, 2 May 2018 (UTC)


 * WP:Brewery name. It was set up because a beer can have the same name as the brewery - Heineken, Guinness, Foster's, etc. The idea is to avoid confusion, and introduce consistency. Also, Greene King Brewery is a WP:Common name for the company -, , , , etc. SilkTork (talk) 15:18, 2 May 2018 (UTC)
 * But there is no such beer as "Greene King". I also dispute that "Greene King Brewery" is the common name. The BBC calls it "Greene King", as does the Guardian , the Telegraph ,The Times , and local newspaper, the East Anglian Daily Times . "Greene King Brewery" tends to refer to the actually brewery buildings rather than the company (which is what is referred to in the first link you cite).Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 08:33, 3 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I agree with your points. The convention was set up by the then much more active Beer WikiProject. Though not all breweries have beers with the same name, the thinking was to introduce consistency as that is a part of our naming policy: WP:NAMINGCRITERIA. While there are examples of just Greene King, there's also Greene King plc, Green King brewery, and Greene King Brewery in use. Something I have wondered now and again, and perhaps we can raise the issue at the Beer WikiProject, is if the titles of our brewery articles should be "Foo brewery" rather than "Foo Brewery". Having the word brewery with a initial capital letter does give the impression that it is a formal part of the name. Shall we start that discussion? SilkTork (talk) 08:53, 4 May 2018 (UTC)
 * I have started the discussion: Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Beer. SilkTork (talk) 09:30, 4 May 2018 (UTC)
 * It seems to me that WP:COMMONNAME is the main policy to follow. If disambiguation is needed, wouldn't the usual format be "Foo (brewery)"? Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 06:09, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

I've started a move request for this page - Talk:Greene_King_Brewery. Ilikeeatingwaffles (talk) 08:45, 10 May 2018 (UTC)

Vagina article
Ready. Pulled it until you're clear you're ready. I'll also go ahead and email you about it. I would have started sooner after the ANI stuff if I hadn't been busy, needed a break, and got caught up with the Jessicapin stuff regarding the Clitoris article. I'm still dealing with her on that, but I want to go ahead and get on with the Vagina GA. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 07:41, 7 May 2018 (UTC)


 * Catching up on my big watchlist today and possibly having to deal with other contentious topics, plus the real-life stuff I have to tend to, I don't think I'll have time to take on the GA stuff today. Because I'll be tempted to reply to you and do things you've requested, I haven't yet read your latest replies. But I'll get back to the matter tomorrow. Just try to hold off on posting more inquiries or requests until then. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 17:28, 23 May 2018 (UTC)

you made the best comment ever
Please read Wikipedia:Contributing to Wikipedia carefully and work your way through the tutorials. Try editing some less sensitive articles before returning to Clitoris. 2600:387:8:7:0:0:0:9F (talk) 06:30, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Thank you very much
The RfC discussion to eliminate portals was closed May 12, with the statement "There exists a strong consensus against deleting or even deprecating portals at this time." This was made possible because you and others came to the rescue. Thank you for speaking up.

By the way, the current issue of the Signpost features an article with interviews about the RfC and the Portals WikiProject.

I'd also like to let you know that the Portals WikiProject is working hard to make sure your support of portals was not in vain. Toward that end, we have been working diligently to innovate portals, while building, updating, upgrading, and maintaining them. The project has grown to 80 members so far, and has become a beehive of activity.

Our two main goals at this time are to automate portals (in terms of refreshing, rotating, and selecting content), and to develop a one-page model in order to make obsolete and eliminate most of the 150,000 subpages from the portal namespace by migrating their functions to the portal base pages, using technologies such as selective transclusion. Please feel free to join in on any of the many threads of development at the WikiProject's talk page, or just stop by to see how we are doing. If you have any questions about portals or portal development, that is the best place to ask them.

If you would like to keep abreast of developments on portals, keep in mind that the project's members receive updates on their talk pages. The updates are also posted here, for your convenience.

Again, we can't thank you enough for your support of portals, and we hope to make you proud of your decision. Sincerely,  &mdash; The Transhumanist   22:53, 25 May 2018 (UTC)

P.S.: if you reply to this message, please ping me. Thank you. -TT

Discussion at User:Kudpung/What do admins do?
You are invited to join the discussion at User:Kudpung/What do admins do?. Kudpung กุดผึ้ง (talk) 05:32, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

WP:INCOMPETENCE and WP:HARASS demonstrated by O1lI0 again following a one-month-long block
Hey, SilkTork, in the past months, I know you had dealt with O1lI0 for his annoying behaviors and he/she had got a one-month-long block. Nevertheless, it seems that O1lI0 hasn't learnt from this lesson. According to the contribution history, O1lI0 has recently removed an OR tag from an article without any legitimate reason. More severely, O1lI0 has removed a totally descriptive sentence which basically says It is a Chinese Ministry of Education Class A Double First Class University. from a number of Chinese university articles (see his/her most recent contributions) claiming that the sentence introduces link spam. The fact is, however, the source that the descriptive sentence cites is a government document of the Chinese Ministry of Education (i.e. http://www.moe.gov.cn/srcsite/A22/moe_843/201709/t20170921_314942.html, and as you can see, the URL includes www.moe.gov.cn which further indicates it is a government website rather than a so-called spam link.). He/She has also discouraged the editor who added those information by leaving a warning message in the talk page.(see this diff). I would appreciate it if you can deal with such behaviors again. Thanks!--221.13.92.137 (talk) 09:14, 20 June 2018 (UTC)


 * I'll take a look. SilkTork (talk) 09:17, 20 June 2018 (UTC)
 * He has changed his IP, a few days ago it was 221.13.92.178, now is 117.158, anyway, he will continue to change, I will continue to stop the sock puppets to destroy wiki. I also want to know how many accounts he can register.--117.19.64.109 (talk) 10:44, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Who are you talking about? And who are you? SilkTork (talk) 14:57, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Possible sockpuppets of O1lI0
Hey, SilkTork! Thank you for your patience while dealing with O1lI0. Yet judging from the history of Communication University of China, 101.13.192.0/20, 115.82.64.0/20, 101.15.144.0/20, and 49.215.160.0/20 are all possibly sockpuppets of O1lI0. --123.161.170.160 (talk) 15:15, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

Update: 49.218.0.0/17 and 101.15.128.0/20 could also be. --123.161.170.160 (talk) 15:18, 23 June 2018 (UTC)
 * OK, I saw enough reason to run CU, and while the IPs are certainly edit warring (I blocked one of them) I can confirm there is no socking from what I can tell. I'll leave the IPs to you, SilkTork. Drmies (talk) 15:26, 23 June 2018 (UTC)


 * I took a look at some of the activity, and I don't think I have the time to find out what is happening. It may be that we need to semi-protect all articles related to China as that IP and new account activity is destabilising a lot of articles. SilkTork (talk) 22:33, 23 June 2018 (UTC)

Wanted to make sure you saw this...
I think it very important to note that I completely reject the idea that my opposition to Article 13 as currently written is in any way involves "supporting the notion that other websites... may steal other people's work". That's a pretty outrageous take on the matter. Badly written laws proposing measures which are not likely to help, while at the same time imposing burdens on innocent people, can be opposed even when the alleged goal is noble. We might as well say that opposition a law mandating mandatory breath tests before getting behind the wheel of a car is supporting the notion of drunk driving.--Jimbo Wales (talk) 08:57, 5 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Considering that thousands of people die every year from drink-driving related accidents, I don't think you've chosen a good analogy. We totally accept airport checks to prevent a terrorist attack, but we are somehow more blase and liberal when it comes to individuals causing random deaths when driving intoxicated. The chances of you or I being killed by a drunk driver are something like 1,000 times more likely than us being killed by a terrorist. So I would support mandatory breath test, and I would see objections to such tests as supporting the notion of drink driving. People need to take a bit more responsibility for their actions.
 * And, yes, I do see objection to Article 13 as unreasonable because artists are currently being ripped off by people who are a bit blase and liberal about using other people's material without their permission. We should be supporting it, not opposing it. That is the decent thing to do. The right thing. I assume you've seen Paul McCartney's letter?


 * If you can outline your objection in realistic terms rather than the vague "imposing burdens on innocent people" (such as checking that they are not taking someone's work without their permission), I will of course apologise. But at the moment I can only see that Article 19 is the right thing to do. Something I would have expected you to support. SilkTork (talk) 09:54, 5 July 2018 (UTC)
 * If you can outline your objection in realistic terms rather than the vague "imposing burdens on innocent people" (such as checking that they are not taking someone's work without their permission), I will of course apologise. But at the moment I can only see that Article 19 is the right thing to do. Something I would have expected you to support. SilkTork (talk) 09:54, 5 July 2018 (UTC)


 * This letter is also useful:


 * As much as I love the idea of a free exchange of ideas and art, unless the art and idea creators are remunerated so they can spend their time and energy on creation rather than working as car mechanics, social workers or accountants in order to live, then creativity will die, and all we will be exchanging is old ideas. SilkTork (talk) 10:55, 5 July 2018 (UTC)
 * As much as I love the idea of a free exchange of ideas and art, unless the art and idea creators are remunerated so they can spend their time and energy on creation rather than working as car mechanics, social workers or accountants in order to live, then creativity will die, and all we will be exchanging is old ideas. SilkTork (talk) 10:55, 5 July 2018 (UTC)

Deletion request for List of breakfast drinks
You have participated at List of breakfast drinks. Therefore, you might be interested in the deletion nomination of the article Articles for deletion/List of breakfast drinks (2nd nomination) --Tyw7  (🗣️ Talk • ✍️ Contributions) Please ping me if you had replied 16:10, 24 July 2018 (UTC)

ANI
I've opened an ANI thread, Administrators%27_noticeboard/Incidents. EEng 02:10, 1 August 2018 (UTC)

Contested deletion
Hi there, I had a page deleted before I even had time to put it up properly. I had a long argument with the deleting editor. In short (very short!), it appeared that by declaring a conflict of interest, I had doomed myself to immediate deletion - no quarter given, no questions asked. I feel this is unfair, there was no interest in the content or suitability of the article, the only stumbling block was my own conflict of interest. I have subsequently learned that - despite Wikipedia asking you to do so - declaring a conflict of interest leads to immediate deletion with no discussion. This is really bad. What made it worse was that the deleting editor was rude, insulting and contemptuous, there was no attempt to discuss the merits of otherwise of the article, it was all about attacks on me personally and my own ethics and honesty. I felt as if I had been caught selling crack to pre-schoolers. It was a horrible experience. I still feel, however, that the article has merit as an encyclopedia entry. How do I fix this? Obviously you are going to want more information, but I really just wanted to get the conversation started. PS - Thanks for the cup of tea. It is just roundabout that time of day! Niki Moore (talk) 13:43, 26 September 2018 (UTC)


 * Hi Niki Moore.  Looking at your edit history, I assume you are talking about The Foundation for Professional Development which has been restored as Draft:The Foundation for Professional Development. Personally I don't have the same level of concerns with someone being paid for writing an article on Wikipedia as I do with someone writing with an emotional investment in the topic - fans and followers, etc. In my experience, emotional conflict of interest is much more damaging and destabilising than financial conflict of interest. However, the community is very sensitive on the subject, so it is an area rife with difficulty. If you wish to edit Wikipedia as a professional, then you need to learn the rules, and ensure both that you are complying well within all guidelines and policies, and that you are treating the unpaid volunteers with professional respect and politeness. Entering into arguments with Wikipedia volunteers is not going to assist you. With Auger architectomics you went through the WP:AFC route, and you put in reliable sources that supported the article's notability. With The Foundation for Professional Development you skipped WP:AFC, WP:RS and WP:N, and then you got into a petty argument with a fellow editor. While with Auger architectomics you did things the right way, with The Foundation for Professional Development  you kind of did everything the wrong way. If you wish to continue as a professional writer on Wikipedia, then learn from your mistakes, and move forward. SilkTork (talk) 17:16, 26 September 2018 (UTC)

Deletion
Greetings. Thank you for taking the time to read this message. I do not consider myself as a long-term member of Wikipedia nor am I familiar with all the protocols and processes. I simply wanted to write and share my experiences. I am a contributor to the page Siding (Rail). I am in Canada. I worked for one of the railroads for my entire career. I felt that I could add a regional piece that would highlight the problems and resolutions encountered behind the scenes during different parts of my career. I tried to put these memories on Wikipedia. I tried to supply supporting sources. The sources that I referenced were documents issued by the railroad to its employees. These documents were not published for public consumption. The problems and processes related were accurate. Recently an editor has examined this page. This person has removed large portions of my writing commenting that it is "irrelevant" or "utterly irrelevant", has stated that my descriptions are too detailed and that there is a lack of proper sources. I will admit it did hurt for these parts to be referred to as irrelevant but apparently, that is an acceptable Wikipedia term? Detail on the railroad is very important. It is engrained in us, from our jobs, to ask questions and ensure that all parties have a clear understanding of an action in order to prevent accident or injury. I still ask for detail and I write with detail. If that is a fault, then I am guilty. I also cannot provide further sourcing as the documents I used in my job were not available from a retail source. So with all these deficiencies in mind, I felt it best to remove my entire contributions from the page Siding (Rail) and end any controversy. Even there I appear to be running into roadblocks. Can you assist me in that regard? Thank you. Jetson9207 Jetson9207 (talk) 20:33, 10 October 2018 (UTC)


 * I will take a look. I may not have time today, but I should have a response for you by tomorrow. SilkTork (talk) 08:14, 11 October 2018 (UTC)