User talk:Sodabottle/Archive 1

Proposed deletion of Adrian Tchaikovsky


The article Adrian Tchaikovsky has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * Appears to fail WP:BIO. I found nothing on Gnews, Gscholar about this author.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing  will stop the Proposed Deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The Speedy Deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and Articles for Deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Ray Talk 00:07, 12 September 2009 (UTC)


 * removed prod warning. he is a published author from a well known publisher. reference provided is from the publisher's website.Sodabottle (talk) 19:53, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Elections
Hi... I am looking for some help to enter the "runner-ups" in Tamil Nadu election articles. I would greatly appreciate if you can help with that. -- Car Tick  15:21, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Of course i will help. where do i start? :-)Sodabottle (talk) 15:34, 9 November 2009 (UTC)
 * that is nice. you could start with Madras legislative assembly election, 1952. This is the reference . I will create two rows for that. Thanks a lot. By the way, there is no hurry, take your time. you could add and remove the Under construction tag as you like. -- Car Tick  15:38, 9 November 2009 (UTC)


 * please note that there are some constituencies which have two winners. please enter the third person as the runner up in that case. -- Car Tick  16:58, 9 November 2009 (UTC)

1967 election
I am not sure how much more we could improve. If you are done, I am going to nominate it tomorrow after some minor work. -- Car Tick  04:22, 17 November 2009 (UTC)


 * It looks good now. since i am new (actively editing for only 40 days), i dont know about GA/FA quality :-) (theoretically yes, but practically not enough experience). I think anna's first cabinet of ministers can be added to the article.


 * this will be my first too. I had a look at the criteria. common sense. we will have to add as much relevant information as we can possibly find. should stick to all fundamental wikipedia rules. Cabinet is a good idea. Pls do add if u can, i will also look for it. guess, i will wait till the end of this week. -- Car Tick  05:37, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

Your recent edits
Hello. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( &#126;&#126;&#126;&#126; ) at the end of your comment. You may also click on the signature button located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your username or IP address and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when. --SineBot (talk) 04:43, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

you have a mail
i just sent you one. -- Car Tick  13:49, 17 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Replied to it. And it was highly flattering :-)))--Sodabottle (talk) 14:27, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

Hereditary Education Policy
with little more work, you could potentially nominate this for a GA review. -- Car Tick  15:13, 18 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks! that was the product of nearly two years research and what finally prompted me to create a wikipedia login and contribute. But GA reviews are backlogged 3 months and where will i get reviewers for that (the six or seven of us who know TN stuff seem to be very very hard :-)). For instance i asked ravichandar84 for a review early on, he didnt even respond. others i can ask are you,spacemanspiff,wikiality123,harish89. --Sodabottle (talk) 15:35, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * you can just try. others also can help. one doesnt necessarliy need to be an expert to be a reviewer, atleast here in wikipedia. -- Car Tick  15:42, 18 November 2009 (UTC)


 * ok will first do some re reading and copy edits. then will look for reviewers.--Sodabottle (talk) 15:46, 18 November 2009 (UTC)

Flag of India
(In case you don't watch CarTick's TP where I posted for you too) It's up for featured article review, interested in helping out? It needs some work, specifically trimming out the excess content and then referencing/copy-editing. - Spaceman  Spiff  04:49, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok. question : if an article is undergoing FAR can i edit it?. or should i stick to making review comments and wait for consensus?--Sodabottle (talk) 05:34, 19 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Technically you can edit, but it's better to document in the talk page, because large scale content changes would be problematic. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  05:35, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

BTW, if you're interested in a really oddball candidate to expand -- Kollangudi Karuppayee. I created the page a while back as part of an exercise on creating pages for people who no one cares about. I've used pretty much all the sources I could find, but there probably are a lot more that I just didn't find. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  22:22, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

you are a great asset...
-- Car Tick  00:39, 25 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks!!!!.. my first barnstar :-)))

Image Jinnah Periyar ambedkar.jpg
Hi there. I noticed that you have uploaded image which already. I thought its best brought to your notice. Best wishes Wiki San Roze†αLҝ 20:03, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * oops. i didnt see that. i searched in commons and not in wikipedia. so missed the earlier image.Anyway since it is PD, let it remain in commons also. Thanks for reminding me about this. next time i will check wikipedia also before uploading anything in commons.--Sodabottle (talk) 20:13, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, usually copies of the same image are best deleted. I will leave it to your discretion to decide which one goes. Although I was the uploader of the earlier image, it really doesn't matter for me. BTW you are doing a great work on here. Cheers Wiki San Roze†αLҝ 20:58, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * ok. will delete the one i uploaded. and redirect to your version. Thanks for the compliment!--Sodabottle (talk) 21:01, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * sorry to butt in. I believe the newer has a better resolution (though small). -- Car Tick  21:05, 26 November 2009 (UTC)
 * OK. Although I can't see much difference in resolution per se, the new one has more people in it (if that counts). My only reservation would be the watermark like lable on it. Wiki San Roze†αLҝ 09:21, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

1962 election
I can hardly find any information on this. -- Car Tick  07:24, 27 November 2009 (UTC)


 * there is a lot of tamil stuff i think. i will post sources later (currently back to my usual cinema haunts :-)) i can remember some bits from what i have read (searching using these phrases might help):


 * 1)all sitting dmk mla's except karunanidhi (including annadurai) lost
 * 2) kamaraj concentrated in ousting dmk mla's and took his eyes of the ball and dmk elected 50 more mlas
 * 3) annadurai lost and got himself elected to rajya sabha
 * 4) dmk success alarms nehru. so nehru passes the anti secessionist 16th amendment to constitution
 * 5) evk sampath split from dmk before elections in 61 and contested with a seperate party - tamil national party
 * 6) swatantara's first election

--Sodabottle (talk) 07:39, 27 November 2009 (UTC)


 * great. thanks. -- Car Tick  07:44, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

Anti-Hindi agitations of Tamil Nadu
as you might have noticed, I have nominated the article for peer review. let us see how it goes. -- Car Tick  04:50, 30 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks!!--Sodabottle (talk) 04:51, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Good work

 * Thanks!!--Sodabottle (talk) 09:15, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

Members
do u have access to the list of MLAs and MLCs before 1952 election. -- Car Tick  06:31, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Nope. But i am looking for the 1946 and 1937 lists. Will exist in Madras Province annual who's who gazettes published. But most are offline. Seen them in the central library here in Coimbatore. Probably in a couple of weeks i might get them--Sodabottle (talk) 06:38, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * great. if you dont have time to enter them urself, pls scan and send it to me. i would also like to know what constituencies existed and who got to vote and how many actually voted. all kind of statistics. -- Car Tick  06:39, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * CarTick - most of the gazettes would be available at a major academic library close to you too - Worldcat, especially if they have political studies as a discipline. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  07:13, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * that is a good idea. will check it out. -- Car Tick  12:57, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Faruqi dynasty-Review
Thanks for the review. I will try to improve the article based on your suggestions.Joy1963 (talk) 18:07, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Note
. Have a try at assigning the grade. :) Btw, have you considered joining the team at WikiProject_India/Assessment? Ncmvocalist (talk) 07:56, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
 * My bad. I have done this mistake for all the three articles i reviewed. I got confused between peer review and Wikiproject assessment. I read in peer review that i have to spread some love by reviewing first and then asking for a review. Since i had added an article i had edited to the Wikiproject assessment request list, i came back and started reviewing the other articles listed there, but forgot that the entire point about reviewing was assessment. I will do that now. I should have added my name to the list before and waited to be accepted. I have added my name now.--Sodabottle (talk) 08:05, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
 * No harm done. :) It's good to have your name on the new members list so experienced members will keep an eye out for things and respond more quickly with feedback where appropriate. It's a very good way to gain experience too. Other than that, I do hope you will maintain your interest and work in this area. Your detailed reviews are impressive. :) Regards, Ncmvocalist (talk) 18:29, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

Rajaji Government
I created this article and the idea is eventually to create articles on all Governments which can specifically focus on what really their administrations did as opposed to what they did. your help will be appreciated. -- Car Tick  16:25, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * great idea. will do what i can. a minor point - the title could be "Chief ministership of Rajaji" or "Rajaji Administration".--Sodabottle (talk) 16:31, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * you know what. i thought about all options and infact, created all possible redirects. I have no problem for the title to be any way. let us think about it over a few days and get input from others before. -- Car Tick  16:39, 6 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Presidency of Bill Clinton. This looks like a good template to base the articles upon.--Sodabottle (talk) 17:01, 6 December 2009 (UTC)


 * great. I had a chance to look at it. u r right, the article looks in great format. we could get a vote on Chief Ministership of Rajaji or Rajaji administration or the current name. There are not many people, who seem interested in this area. we might have to decide on the name between ourselves. I am going to let you make the decision. infobox from this article is not exactly suitable for a Tamil Nadu Chief Minister. I have no experience in producing infoboxes. may be i should ask someone like Spaceman... -- Car Tick  17:08, 6 December 2009 (UTC)

AHA
the questions by the second reviewer regarding the reliability of the two websites need to be answered. In my opinion, they wouldnt pass for an RS. we either need to back those information with other reliable sources or remove it. -- Car Tick  21:45, 7 December 2009 (UTC)
 * could you pls also list all the requested modifications you have already made in the peer review page, so we can keep track of what else needs to be done. -- Car Tick  04:38, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * backed up both sources with scholarly work. In both cases, they represent primary (sort of) sources for the information 1)sangam.org link points to a lecture by Sachi Sri Kantha (a scholar with numerous Gscholar hits, but in another field), where he is quoting from an original document. He is explaining the motivation for the kallakudi protest. So he is quoting from a DMK official publication defending and explaining their motives. Since we have not used this as a reference for "what happened" (for that i have used sumathi ramaswamy's book) but for "why they claimed they did it". This document would be more appropriate as it becomes primary source. But since sangam.org would be deemed doubtful, now i have added another book for verifying the same point 2) DMK.in - official DMK website. Again the same issue, i have reworded the article to state "DMK claimed" instead of as fact. Also added two more references (a jstor journal article and a recent deccan chronicle news item) to back that up. Again this becomes a primary source for "what DMK claims". For actually "what happened" we have other sources. I feel for "what DMK claimed" primary DMK sources should be included (now that they are backed up by others)--Sodabottle (talk) 05:00, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * and for listing the modifications already done, will do that now (forgot to do that!)--Sodabottle (talk) 05:00, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * good job. i will look at them more carefully tomorrow. -- Car Tick  05:09, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * pls list you comments separately as a response. intermixing will lead to confusion and dont think it is liked much. -- Car Tick  05:16, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

CR formula
Your comments and suggestions are welcome on this article. Thanks Wiki San Roze†αLҝ 09:55, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

copyediting
AHA still needs to be copyedited. I am thinking about listing it WikiProject Guild of Copy Editors. just not sure if it is a good idea to list the article in two places at the same time. -- Car Tick  16:33, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * since we have finished fixing the comments raised by the two reviews, i think we can go ahead and list it in copy editors guild.--Sodabottle (talk) 16:35, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * i took a look at the copyrighter's guild page. seems heavily backlogged. we should canvass individually. someone non-indian/tamil preferably--Sodabottle (talk) 16:45, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Ask Drmies, he normally helps out when asked. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  17:08, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks Spiff. Will do.--Sodabottle (talk) 17:09, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * BTW, I took a look at the article earlier today and one thing I noticed was that the lead is too long and too elaborate for a summary. You might want to chop it off a bit before you ask for ce help. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  02:09, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks Spiff for the suggestion (Drmies suggested the same). I have cut down about 20 percent now. We earlier had a 10 line summary which the first peer reviewer said was not enough. so we went overboard and wrote a looong summary. --Sodabottle (talk) 05:02, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

<--I'd still suggest cutting down passage 3. It goes into too much detail for a lead. Also, the lead lists too many organizations, that may not be necessary, just list the primary one (in this case I'm guessing it's DMK) and remove references to the others with some blanket statement like "many activist groups" or something like that which is supported by content in the article. You may also want to run AWB on the article to fix typos and any MOS issues. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  05:08, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

K. Mahoharan
from Chennai South (Lok Sabha constituency). Is he Nanjil K. Manoharan? -- Car Tick  19:18, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes he is the same guy. was MP 3 times (62,67 and 71). MLA 4 times (77 ADMK, 84,89,96 DMK). jumped to ADMK in 77 was finance minister, jumped back in 80. lost the 91 elections for assembly. he has two duplicate entries - Krishnan Manoharan and K. Manoharan--Sodabottle (talk) 19:31, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * all done by me. thanks. i will merge them all. -- Car Tick  20:11, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * i dont have access to information on Cabinet. could u pls update when u get time. -- Car Tick  22:22, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Ok. but it gets tricky after 71 - cabinets were changed several times. For instance in 2001-06 amma atchi, cabinet was reshuffled about 20 or 22 times. (i myself had seen JJ driving to raj bhavan in guindy atleast thrice to change the cabinet - lived in Sardar patel road, so she went by often when dropping ministers)--Sodabottle (talk) 05:04, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Mid-day Meal Scheme
i was researching its history and the wikipedia article cites three years 1923, 1960s and 1982. however, it is not clear what was really done during each time. this front line article does not even mention the 1923 and 1960 events. Nandan Nilekani just copied from wikipedia. -- Car Tick  23:05, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * There might be a reason Dreze and co don't mention the earlier efforts (Dreze can be considered an authority on social welfare schemes in India. He is to social sector spending what P. Sainath is to rural affairs). Kamaraj's and the earlier attempt in 1923 where limited and not implemented everywhere. The 23 effort was almost a stunt, while the Kamaraj scheme was limited in the number of schools and the type of food provided (they gave mavu urundai's i think). And regarding Nilekeni, that is a coffee table book / PR effort. Don't take it too seriously. Probably didn't pay the ghost writer very much :-) --Sodabottle (talk) 04:54, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

R. K. Narayan
I think you said somewhere that you live on Sardar Patel Rd, Madras. Will it be possible for you to contact Indian Thought Publications and ask them for a couple of photographs of R. K. Narayan to be released to the public domain? The company is run by his grand daughter (Minnie) now, and they don't even have a website or email id!! I can't find the phone no online either, my copies of the books are before Madras got 8 digit phone nos, so it's likely wrong. You should be able to find a phone no on a book jacket at Odyssey or Xanadu (if they still exist!) or some place. If you can, I'll send you the relevant links to OTRS, image donation pages. I definitely need a couple of images to move it up from GA to FA. cheers. - Spaceman  Spiff  18:26, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
 * sorry tough luck spiff. I lived in sardar patel road (AU hostels to be precise) during 98-02. not anymore. i live in Coimbatore now. even my copies of RKN - 17th reprint editions from 2006 - dont have phone/email of Indian thought. (odyssey still exists. was there last year. and it has acquired the practice of not shooing people out if they try to read books. they even have a couple of chairs)--Sodabottle (talk) 18:56, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Sorry...
...to be so picky. Drmies (talk) 18:35, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
 * thats okay doc. it is one of the reasons we wanted a non-indian/tamil editor to take a look.I am too involved in this issue - i know for a fact that school students were involved (mom was among the students burning hindi books in madurai:-)), so i put down stuff without sourcing it with RS first. couldn't achieve "strategic distance" myself :-)). --Sodabottle (talk) 18:47, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Wait--are you aware that I am an honorary Tamil? Ask Spiff. Drmies (talk) 19:19, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
 * hee hee.. i remember him mentioning it.. what to do.. have to work with what he have got.. :-). Tamils seem to be everywhere these days.--Sodabottle (talk) 19:21, 14 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Doc, I take it you now know why, as a Tamil, you are so proficient in English. - Spaceman  Spiff  20:52, 14 December 2009 (UTC)

Madras Legislative Council
what a surprise. i was thinking about working on it too. it was in horrible state. good job. i would also want to work on Politics of Tamil Nadu at some point of time which is also in a similar state. you could nominate it for DYK as u have expanded it 5 times. -- Car Tick  16:12, 23 December 2009 (UTC)
 * hee hee. i was feeling too lazy today to read the rest of rajaraman's book and what i am reading offline (jared diamond's collapse) was making me sleepy. So i decided to pick off an easy target, where only copy paste was involved and chose this. And i ended up writing about vennira aadai nirmala. Check out the Abolition section, it is absolutely funny. I can nominate this for DYK, but Randor Guy's blog which is one of the sources for the nirmala episode is blacklisted (as self published). It would be a huge pain in the butt to get it whitelisted (ravichandar has gone through the process earlier for Lakshmikanthan Murder Case. we would be explaining all over who randor guy is. I have currently circumvented the blacklist by providing a wrong URL. DYK scrutineers go for the inline references and are bound to catch it. Explaining to them would suck my soul out. Will think with a clear head tomorrow what to do about this.--Sodabottle (talk) 16:25, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

PS. We could target the biggies - Politics of Tamil Nadu, DMK, ADMK, Annadurai, Kamaraj etc once we are done with all the elections. Elections make better articles for piecemeal research and we can paint the over all picture later.
 * I have a faint memory that the abolition was done during the president's rule (the interim government after one of the TN government dismissals (most of them unconstitutional), in fact, we could make an article on Tamil Nadu government dismissals by Indian government.) share your enthusiasm about other articles. agree, i want the all the election articles (atleast a basic framework) done first. -- Car Tick  16:38, 23 December 2009 (UTC)
 * nope. abolition was in nov 86. MGR dies in dec 87. prez rule jan88-jan89. you are right about the of the article 356 dismissals - Would make for a great article. There have been 3 so far i think - 76 karunanidhi, 80 MGR and 91 Karunandhi.--Sodabottle (talk) 16:45, 23 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Janaki Ramachandran was also dismissed or was it just dissolved because she lost majority. -- Car Tick  17:14, 23 December 2009 (UTC)
 * yes janaki in 89 should be added. she got the majority, but still rajiv gandhi dismissed the govt as horse trading was rampant.--Sodabottle (talk) 17:19, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

conversation about image use
dont know if you noticed my conversation with User:Angusmclellan. interesting stuff. looks like we can save a lot of the images. -- Car Tick  04:30, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
 * great. had a similar discussion in one of the film images i had uploaded at commons. a user said the same thing to me . he added the tag angus refers to but added yhat there is still no consensus how to treat files like these.--Sodabottle (talk) 04:38, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Lakshmi Holmström
Just a quick "thanks!" for this excellent article :). Ironholds (talk) 10:25, 5 January 2010 (UTC):
 * Thanks!!--Sodabottle (talk) 11:30, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Re:List of Chief Ministers of Tamil Nadu
Sodabottle, thanks for your edits to TN CMs article. Can you please add a reference for your edit that added Panagal Raja's second term? The worldstateman reference shows only a single term. Thanks, Ganeshk  ( talk ) 05:15, 7 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I have added them. It was a continuous term. he became cm in 1921. council duration was 3 years. next election came in 1923. justice won and he continued as cm--Sodabottle (talk) 06:08, 7 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Great...Thanks! Ganeshk  ( talk ) 13:24, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for your co-opration and guideHibayathullah (talk) 20:39, 16 January 2010 (UTC)

thanks
for expanding the 1991 and 1996 elections. -- Car Tick  13:06, 20 January 2010 (UTC)
 * slowly every election is getting filled in now. soon we can fill out the articles on parties. i see you have started work on justice. will join you there soon :-)--Sodabottle (talk) 13:09, 20 January 2010 (UTC)


 * great. i really want to finish 2001 and 2006 runner-ups. i have a lot of material for justice, just dont have enough time to read all of them... i have to admit that your enthusiasm keeps me motivated too. -- Car Tick  13:17, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Dravidian Parties
Hi Sodabottle,

The question that confuses me most is the classification of PMK and DMDK as Dravidian Parties. When I did the first draft of Dravidian parties article I had extensively used materials from Tamil Tribune website. According to that online magazine these two parties are part of the DP family. Nevertheless, I had to remove the citations after this discussion (Tamil Tribune used to be on geocities earlier). I do not know if you can use Tamil Tribune as RS now. Anyways, the question is about PMK and DMDK as DPs. The funny part is, I wrote that thing down and now am not sure if it is right at all. lOl. Cheers <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 17:17, 20 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Tamiltribune and Thanjai nalankilli are the fringe of the fringe. even quasi separatists of pazha nedumaran's ilk dont associate with them. They are very good for pointing to sources but their research and opinion is well IMO in cuckoo land :-).--Sodabottle (talk) 04:55, 21 January 2010 (UTC)


 * (butting in)Interesting discussion. MDMK should be considered Dravidian purely for the nature of their activity, but I don't know if any new studies have been done to classify them as such. However, I'm not sure that the PMK or DMDK would classify there. The PMK is more a caste based party, although their philosophy is part of the Dravidian philosophy, the venn diagram shows a very minor interaction IMO. Same with DMDK, although that's lest caste based and more fan-based. There's also the other bit about most contemporary news sources automatically classifying any TN/Pondy regional parties as Dravidian. The term Dravidian itself has evolved to mean more than what it used to. Sure this doesn't address your comment, but I felt like rambling :) - Spaceman  Spiff  17:24, 20 January 2010 (UTC)


 * I would say to be on the safe side - anything born out of a caste sangam or a political arm of a caste organisation should not be considered as a Dravidian party. PMK is also the political successor to [Tamilnadu Toilers' Party]] and Commonweal party of the 50s. MDMK and DMDK are not born out of caste outfits (though caste loyalty forms the base of their support) and claim to be dravidian (at least in their names). Trouble is latest research work always comes from two camps - 1) outsiders who have no idea what is going on in TN, who get their base knowledge from cho ramaswamy, N. Ram (people with their own axes to grind), sanjay pinto, jennifer arul, alophia zoyab etc (whose idea of tamil nadu starts with nungambakkam and ends at adyar) 2) Kazhaga kanmani/jalra goshties.. who write about "thanai thalaivar doctor kalaignar", "puratchi thalavi manbumigu amma avargal". blogs have better quality of research than the latest research/newspaper articles --Sodabottle (talk) 04:55, 21 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks guys. So am assuming that we conclude that PMK is not a DP. DMDK is a tough call. Vijaykanth himself called it a Dravidian party, but later he anounced that his party will be seen as an alternative to the Dravidian politics. Added to the confusion he also thinks Hindi should be used as the link language in India. Would it be a better idea to take this discussion to the DP talk page? <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 08:51, 21 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Can you comment on this please? <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 11:48, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

A little shiny thing

 * -))). Thanks!!!!--Sodabottle (talk) 14:39, 29 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Agree with Wikiality123, this barn star is very well-deserved.
 * Can you guys take a look at Pandithurai Thevar? cheers. – Spaceman  Spiff  16:20, 29 January 2010 (UTC)


 * thanks spiff.. I will take care of pandithurai thevar in the next couple of days. had him as a subject for a tamil lesson in standard VII..so he is a fairly well covered personality in Tamil lit.. shouldnt be difficult to rewrite and reference.--Sodabottle (talk) 17:41, 29 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Isn't he the one who torched copies of English translations of kural because he considered it erroneous? <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 17:47, 29 January 2010 (UTC)


 * yes he did that. he bought out and torched all copies of a "simplified" edition of tirukkural--Sodabottle (talk) 17:54, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

I just deleted the page as it was a copyvio from http://www.sangam.org/articles/view2/?uid=1073. I hadn't read it completely when I first asked you to look at it. Anyway, feel free to recreate it, there wasn't any content on the page that isn't on the link, so I don't think userfying will help you any. cheers. – Spaceman  Spiff  17:56, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

ATP
Is it Arogiyasamy or Annasamy? I read your Tamil text as Annasamy. Also, I don't know if this is a problem only for me, but I'm having some wiki-Tamil-rendering, I see rra as ra and nna as na and all that... &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  07:40, 4 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Annasamy. I copied that from Tamilpedia. It says annasamy is his paternal grandfather's name. and confirmed by the justice party golden jubilee issue.--Sodabottle (talk) 07:43, 4 February 2010 (UTC)


 * aw crap.. his law degree says Arokyasamy.--Sodabottle (talk) 07:49, 4 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Yeah, that's why I was asking, when I dePRODded, I found a source that had Arogyaswamy in it, and I think Ravi and CarTick were also of the same opinion. I would normally not trust ta.wiki, but in this case, has written bits of the article, he's written a lot of FAs here on en.wiki, so I'd trust his word on the name. Maybe we just need to find proper sources. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  07:53, 4 February 2010 (UTC)
 * for now i will revert to plain A. T Panneerselvam till i find a reliable source.--Sodabottle (talk) 07:58, 4 February 2010 (UTC)


 * BTW, you may want to add WP:TWINKLE and User:John Vandenberg/Deletion sorting tool; since you've started AfDing, this will make it easier for you. cheers. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  18:16, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks.. will add them. Not planning on doing many AfDs though. --Sodabottle (talk) 18:27, 5 February 2010 (UTC)
 * It's helpful for a lot of stuff, single click for AfD and PROD process. Anyway, I've created WikiProject India/Unreferenced BLPs/Sorted, so you can track down the people based on your interest, and also extract refs from the ta.wiki articles. cheers. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  04:49, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Started using it already. It is of great help!.--Sodabottle (talk) 04:54, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Harold Laski
Hi, well done with all your work on Laski on 17 January. I just thought you might like to check the spelling of Clement Attlee - two Ts. Thanks and best wishes, DBaK (talk) 01:10, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Thanks Disillusioned!. will watch out for Attlee with the double T in the future--Sodabottle (talk) 04:14, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

President of DMK party
Hey. I remember being told (or reading somewhere) that DMK party did not have an official party president until the death of EVR. In that case Annadurai could have never held that position. <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 15:25, 9 February 2010 (UTC)
 * One claims Annadurai as founder president whereas other says he was the General Secretary . mmm <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 15:59, 9 February 2010 (UTC)


 * I think, the periyar as "honorary president" of DMK is an urban legend created by DMK themselves. During early days of DMK they used to put an empty chair in the dais and claimed it was for periyar and said they were conducting business in periyar's name. DMK's first two years were a flux - they were still laying down rules for the intra party organisation. The first general body conference was held sometime in 51 or 52. They went for the entire "intra party democracy" to differentiate themselves from DK and its "authoritarian" style of leadership. Annadurai was the first Gensec and sampath was the first chairman/president (the tamil term was thalaivar. some translate it as president and some as chairman). Anna was Gensec till 57 i think (when he got elected to assembly). The Gensec was the real power and Chairman was dummy (one of the reasons sampath was dissatisfied with the party). After anna's death in 69, situation changed. After karunanidhi won over the MLAs with MGR's help, nedunchelian and madhavan were miffed. Nedunchelian refused to take oath in karunanidhi's ministry. So they stuck a compromise - party power will go to nedunchelian, govt with karunanidhi. So in late 1969, MK became "thalaivar" and navalar becomes gensec. But within a year, MK took control of the general and executive councils and made the gensec post dummy. From then on "thalaivar" pulls all the strings in DMK.--Sodabottle (talk) 16:30, 9 February 2010 (UTC)


 * here is a snippet that confirms the power struggle in 69 for gensec post . searching DMK + Nedunchezhian in gbooks seems to confirm my above theory.--Sodabottle (talk) 16:33, 9 February 2010 (UTC)


 * OK. I raised this question since I don't think ECI would have ever agreed for a party to be void of a President. <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 17:09, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Article for you to check
KaveriSelvan -- notable? can't say without knowing the real name. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  08:59, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Haven't heard of him even in the literary journal circles. It is possible he was active in 50s and 60s (a period i am not that familiar of). But definitely not a talked/written about name in literary circles.--Sodabottle (talk) 09:05, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok, will search tomorrow and PROD then, meantime feel free to PROD. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  09:23, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation
Your nomination at Articles for Creation was a success, and Dinanath Gopal Tendulkar was created. Thank you for helping Wikipedia!  fetch  comms  ☛ 16:02, 15 February 2010 (UTC)
 * The article has been assessed as Start-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see what needs to be done to bring it to the next level.
 * Please continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. Note that because you are a logged-in user, you can create articles yourself, and don't have to post a request.
 * If you would to help us improve this process, please consider
 * Yeah, I know you didn't actually submit it originally, but good work anyhow.  fetch  comms  ☛ 16:02, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

Form
Hi Sodabottle - I think that the Americans are certainly still attached to their dots. But Commonwealth countries usually go for no dots, and OSCOLA just happens to be a good standard, that lots of courts are adopting. I've got a few Indian law books which do the dots - and the older English ones do too. But I think the reason we're moving to dropping that is this: just think how many hours, days of your life you will save if you add up all those little dots that you don't really have to do! Anyway, all the English legal cases I write are like this. Here's an example of the standard form for cases I follow: Carlill v Carbolic Smoke Ball Company (as a very long example) or Hadley v Baxendale.  Wik idea  14:48, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

S. R. Bommai v. Union of India
wasnt aware of this. but i tend to agree it might have had some influence on the constitutional culture in which Federal government functions. -- Car Tick  19:48, 17 February 2010 (UTC)
 * it has done much good. after the judgment 356 dismissals have reduced greatly. i think there has been only one in the last ten years or so.--Sodabottle (talk) 20:21, 17 February 2010 (UTC)

Copyright doubt
I have a doubt. has been uploaded to commons from english wikipedia by you and points to as the source. The second file sort of points to itself as the source. I had used the image for Madras State legislative assembly election, 1967 and a GA reviewer has raised doubts that it is not clear who the copyright owner. Can you update the image with a more clear copyright owner information?. Thanks!--Sodabottle (talk) 06:41, 17 February 2010 (UTC)


 * The original file uploaded to English Wiki was deleted as it is generally done. What should have been done is to copy the summary and uploader information to commons. If someone has admin access, they can look at the original uploaded version at http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Special:Undelete&target=File%3AMgrshotat.jpg&timestamp=20061025122534 The uploader was User:Kumarrajendran. He had released the image under PD-self. -- Sundar \talk \contribs 06:01, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

P.S. By the way, I appreciate your effort in writing about such historical political events.


 * Thanks Sundar. I will ask an admin to restore the summary and uploader information. I had guessed it was from Kumar Rajendran's collection (from the subject and metadata), but wasn't sure. --Sodabottle (talk) 06:07, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

S. P. Adithanar and S. T. Adityan
I am pretty confident the guy who won the 1952 election is S. T. Adityan. I am still confused about the 1957 election. the ECI statistics calls him S. B. Adityan. the more i research, the more I am confused including who really started Dina Thanthi. -- Car Tick  20:22, 20 February 2010 (UTC)


 * You are right about S. T. Adityan winning the 52 election. I am pretty sure about the 57 election it was S. B. Adithyan and he was the founder of thanthi. Thanthi adithan was elected in 57 on the "madras renaming"/ "border agitation" plank. S.B adithan and S. P adithan are the same. the initials expand to "sivanthi balasubramanian", which the thani thamizh propoenents wrote as si. paa. adithanar, which when tranliterated back into english has become S.P Adithan. --Sodabottle (talk) 05:05, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Dinanath Gopal Tendulkar
Hello! Your submission of Dinanath Gopal Tendulkar at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know!  Jujutacular  T · C 01:05, 21 February 2010 (UTC)

Rollback
I've given you rollback rights. You can use that to revert vandalism instead of undoing with edit summaries. (e.g. your recent edits on MK and IKG). It shouldn't be used for reverting edits that are not vandalism, read the policy to familiarize yourself with the rules and guidelines. cheers. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  16:31, 25 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok. Thanks!--Sodabottle (talk) 16:44, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

AHA
nominated for GA review. -- Car Tick  03:24, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Add the Indian English tag before you get questions on that :) cheers. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  03:28, 26 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks CarTick, now all we have to do is wait 3 months :-).--Sodabottle (talk) 06:26, 26 February 2010 (UTC)


 * That is right. In fairness, i always wanted to help out with GAR backlog. hopefully will get there one day. -- Car Tick  12:19, 26 February 2010 (UTC)


 * me too. i almost took up one GAR, but then had to admit, i was in no shape for doing reviews. hopefully with more experience, i might be able to help with the backlog.--Sodabottle (talk) 12:21, 26 February 2010 (UTC)


 * well, it is impossible to do a fair review on topics we are not familiar with (but that is what we get) and needs a great deal of good faith assumption. It becomes even more complex when the references are not online accessible. -- Car Tick  12:26, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Dog story in the anti-Hindi issue.
Hi ,

i saw that you have done excellent job in wiki concerning tamil's .....so i stopped by to inform you that i have restored the earlier infos about the dog story & added ref's .....i suppose it as the main thing / speech / example by Annadurai so it does need a place here .....it's indeed a nice speech with good examples .... --  Doctor muthu's muthu    wanna talk ? 26 February 2010 (UTC)

regards


 * While doing the rewrite, we (me and cartick) agreed not to use Tamil Tribune site as a source, as it has been contested as a RS and as a POV source before many times (because of the inflammatory separatist statements it carries).The chennaionline link has copied it from Tamil Tribune. The dog story as far as i can determine comes from one of Anna's medai speeches and not his Rajya Sabha speeches. I am looking for a book reference (and will eventually find it, when i go through enough library books). We are aiming to take the article eventually to FA status and Tamil Tribune or Chennaionline would not be acceptable to FA reviewers. I will remove the story for now. I will DEFINITELY add it back, when i find a published book that mentions the story. --Sodabottle (talk) 05:55, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Thanks buddy, sure will try to fetch more references to support the info's cause it is a must for the people & the next generation to know the reality & this info addition would bringin the realmeaning to why the Anti Hindi issues were raised & why we dont speak Hindi In Tamilnadu ....--  Doctor muthu's muthu    wanna talk ? 10:40, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Hello
<div style="border-style:solid; border-color:blue; background-color:AliceBlue; border-width:1px; text-align:left; padding:8px;" class="plainlinks">

Hello Sodabottle, Logicwiki has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling at someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Go on, smile! Cheers, and happy editing! Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message. Hi, Saw you at WP:IND/UBLP. Great job! Are you from Chennai / living there currently? Wondering if we can have a meetup in Chennai. WP:MBL is proving to be great success.  Srikanth (Logic)  13:16, 26 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks Srikanth!. I am from and live in Coimbatore. But will be visiting chennai in the near future. Will let you know, when i am next in town.--Sodabottle (talk) 15:17, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

அன்பு நண்பரே விக்கிப்பீடியா முதற் பக்கத்தில் என்னைப் பற்றிய சிறு அறிமுகம், புகைப்படத்துடன் இடம் பெற்றுள்ளது. பார்க்கவும்.--Hibayathullah (talk) 20:13, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Kudos

 * Thanks! :-)--Sodabottle (talk) 06:09, 1 March 2010 (UTC)

Sara Khan
Thank you for your efforts in improving Sara Khan. The article is in much better shape, thanks to your edits. Cheers, Cnilep (talk) 17:24, 2 March 2010 (UTC)


 * You are welcome :-)--Sodabottle (talk) 17:27, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Madras Tamil
Can you take a look? Some of the words included seem fishy to me, never heard them before. (CarTick and Wikiality too, since you watch this page) cheers. &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  17:40, 4 March 2010 (UTC)


 * i have watchlisted it. will go through it.--Sodabottle (talk) 18:18, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Should we need a list of phrases and words in the first place. It is just a slang! <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 19:44, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't think it's needed, a few select differentiators should suffice IMO; apparently my Madras Tamil is not as good as it should be :) &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  19:49, 4 March 2010 (UTC)


 * should ask "Loose" Mohan to do some copyediting. -- Car Tick  00:33, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Sethampa aha! Wonder why we don't have a wiki entry for "Loose" Mohan. He used to be quite a well known comedian. <b style="color:orange;">Wiki San Roze</b><i style="color:green;">†αLҝ</i> 07:44, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Must be there somewhere. I was once searching for Chandralekha and found out that someone had redirected her article to a movie title! It gets annoying sometimes, I created Chandralekha (dancer) after that, I just have to move it back to the primary. Such things happen only here! &mdash; Spaceman  Spiff  07:47, 5 March 2010 (UTC)