User talk:Soetermans/Archive 2020

Unblock request
, does this work? I'm on my phone and I am not positive. I don't really know what is described at Template:Autoblock means. soetermans. ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 00:00, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * You must try to edit a page, like the Sandbox, and copy the unblock-auto request from there. It contains the information required to look into the autoblock. When you try to edit the Sandbox, the unblock request we need should be "under the "IP blocked?" section. This is usually hidden within the "What do I do now?" section. If so, just click the "[show]" link to the right hand side to show this text." I don't know how it looks on Mobile, but you might try "Show Desktop" at the bottom to switch to desktop mode. -- ferret (talk) 00:08, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, I really don't know what was going on, maybe it was just a fluke, but now it seems I can edit properly on mobile again. Thanks for your time and input. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 00:20, 12 January 2020 (UTC)
 * If you're on mobile, there are many many mobile IP ranges blocked due to the amount of vandalism seen from them. However IPs switch frequently for phones so you must have moved off the bad IP. -- ferret (talk) 00:32, 12 January 2020 (UTC)

The work
After I deprodded Energy Airforce Aim Strike!, I have noticed you are doing a great work on cleaning out the cruft on a lot of video game articles recently, kudos! Keep up the good work! Jovanmilic97 (talk) 12:44, 17 January 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi ,


 * Thank you for your kind words. I love taking out the trash. It's a dirty job, but somebody has to do it. It's good to be back! Good work on de-prodding and improving Energy Airforce Aim Strike!, I was overzealous with that one. Kind regards, soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 13:06, 17 January 2020 (UTC)

Singles 2: Triple Trouble
Just wanted to tell you that I have restored the article and added some sources for GNG pass (and there are several more I will add tomorrow). However, the article is in a dire need to be cleaned up. Regards, Jovanmilic97 (talk) 00:26, 22 January 2020 (UTC)

Renaming timeline of tabletop role-playing games
Can you please explain the point of this edit? There is already a very similarly named page (List of role-playing games, which is almost exclusively a list of tabletop roleplaying games, but alphabetically), and the most important aspect of the timeline page is that it lists the games by year. Thus, the former title of the page makes a lot more sense to me.

-Andreas — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.11.88.79 (talk) 16:22, 24 February 2020 (UTC)


 * Because "chronology" is just unnecessary. All other "list of [x games] are called that as well, so per WP:CONSISTENCY, there's no reason to maintain a strict chronological list. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 16:28, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

I'm not sure I follow your point. There are lots of timelines / chronological lists on Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_timelines - and they certainly serve a purpose. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.11.88.79 (talk) 16:37, 24 February 2020 (UTC)
 * Sure, WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS, but we're talking about video games. Titles of articles (and lists for that matter) tend to be similarly titled, for WP:CONSISTENCY's sake. So if similar articles about video games are titled in a certain way, it's only logical to do so for others. The link you provided has a very old redirect listed, Chronology of console role-playing games, which redirects to List of role-playing video games, which was moved in March 2011 (see link). These are just lists of video games, which happen to list dates of release in a chronological manner. The main point of these lists are that they mention every type of game; not that it is done so chronologically. For instance, I've nominated Chronology of Nintendo 64 games for deletion, because there's already a List of Nintendo 64 games. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 17:20, 24 February 2020 (UTC)

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Talk:BioShock 2: Minerva's Den/GA1
Letting you know I've gone through your comments with responses and changes. Thanks, Der Wohltemperierte Fuchs  talk 21:57, 6 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, thanks for letting me know. I've got some errands to run today, if I can squeeze it in I'll go through the review. If not, I'll probably will be able to finish it on Monday, if that's okay. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 09:09, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
 * Hey, I've checked the references and left some comments about those. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 13:33, 7 March 2020 (UTC)

A barnstar for you!

 * Hi, thanks for the barnstar! Happy to help out. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 08:08, 10 March 2020 (UTC)

Mass Effect characters
What specific additional in-depth information would you infer be added prior to including the list? Do you mean individual character sections be added (as they have yet to be) for characters from Galaxy, Andromeda and Paragon Lost? 2A02:8084:88BC:EE00:1800:5C0D:3215:68FC (talk) 17:44, 11 March 2020 (UTC)

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Predator Hunting Grounds
Now I understand, I didn't even notice you edited in the middle of my edits in my sandbox, I got totally confused yesterday, thinking where did I get a word like asymmetrical from! heh. Govvy (talk) 08:26, 4 April 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi ,


 * Sorry about that, I meant to leave a reply at WT:VG, but I forgot to do so. I do think the version can be moved to the actual article. Happy editing, soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 09:50, 4 April 2020 (UTC)

About that clone wars edit
Yeah I was in the discussion and was already changing the plots for the other films mentioned. I will copy paste the plot onto my user page no make it around the sizes of the plots on the other articles now. Ocelot Creeper ( ta lk ) 14:30, 7 April 2020 (UTC)

Stop that edit a page marvel super war
Can you stop that edit a page video game please. Blackknight1234567890 (talk) 09:27, 12 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, I'm afraid that's not going to happen. Please follow Wikipedia's guidelines on editing. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 09:29, 12 April 2020 (UTC)

Second opinion...
Just wanted to thank you for holding Wikipedia content to a high standard. It's a thankless job that's near and dear to my heart, and something I was pretty involved in back when I was an active editor.

I've come back to improve a few articles, aiming for GA status. The Ur-Quan article is one of them. My motivation for that, besides writing a good article, is to also give it some protection from devolving into a WP:COATRACK. When I imagine the worst case, I imagine a slippery slope, where someone says "let me make a list of every character in the game", then "let me list every character in every game", and then you have a monstrous pile of trivia that is just waiting to be deleted. In my mind, if I have a GA article, then someone who tries to WP:COATRACK it is actually harming high quality content, with a consensus that it's better as a focused, referenced article.

I saw you made a few edits to the article. If you have a few minutes, can you take a look and tell me if I am on my way to GA status? Compared to other high quality articles about video game characters, is there anything troubling about the article that needs urgent fixing? Shooterwalker (talk) 21:50, 4 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi, thank you for your kind words. That certainly used to be a common thing a couple of years ago, when a lot of video game articles had a separate article about the in-game characters, often barely sourced and just repeating the plot points from the characters' point of view. But not anymore! About the article Ur-Quan is in a fairly decent shape. For video game characters, we try to establish notability apart from the media they appear in; origin, creation, development, and most importantly, reception. Those areas are fairly covered. While not as important, the Ur-Quan section is unsourced. The lead section, a summation of the article, can be expanded a bit. I'll try to go over it later this week, it's Bevrijdingsdag today here and from tomorrow until Friday I've got to work. If you have any questions, feel free to ask and I'll try to answer them in the meantime. Kind regards, soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 11:28, 5 May 2020 (UTC)


 * I'm glad you think the article is on the right track. Enjoy your time off. I'm trying to figure out how to handle the "background" section too, and I've heard that people can let those slide as being sourced to the game itself. But with some effort, I could probably pull up a combination of instruction manuals and third party sources. They could also use an image, if you're familiar enough with the game, the upload process, and the fair use rationale. Any help is greatly appreciated. Shooterwalker (talk) 22:04, 5 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi, I went over the article. I've added the character infobox (shamelessly copied from Combine (Half-Life)!) and added an image of developers Reiche III and Ford (shamelessly copied from Star Control!). The background section is properly sourced, it's neutral in tone and has well-sourced development and reception section. I think it looks pretty good. Uploading other images I have no experience with, but you can always ask at WT:VG. Let me know if you need help with anything else. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 08:40, 9 May 2020 (UTC)
 * I also created . I noticed there isn't a main article on the Star Control series, that is also an possibility. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 09:14, 9 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for jumping in. The role of Legend is a touchy subject among fans, and the Stardock IP is just a totally different universe under the same name. The IP is a mess, so I've been trying to nibble at the edges, starting with the Ur Quan and Star Control 3. But I'll get to it. I'm going to ask around about the image policy, so we can get an image of the Ur Quan in there. The game's content has been released under a Creative Commons license, but it's an old version of the license compared to what Wikipedia does (v2.5 vs v4.0). Either way, I think one well-placed image of the Ur Quan character would be essential for the article. I'll see who can help. Shooterwalker (talk) 17:51, 9 May 2020 (UTC)

Heartbeat (video game)
Thanks for helping to re-edit the page Heartbeat (video game), because the asshole trying to remove it, I believe it was one of Heartbeat game dev members. I just tried to add the page for good FriendlyTamer (talk) 02:31, 23 June 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi ,


 * While I thought it was pretty weird for an IP address to prod the article less than an half hour after you created it, please do remember to assume good faith and do not use personal attacks. The IP user is apparently from Finland and not based in the United States. A quick Google search brought up some additional sources, but I'm not totally convinced WP:GNG has been met yet. But again, I don't think it should've been prod'ed just like that either. Thanks, and happy editing. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 07:38, 23 June 2020 (UTC)

About the Grue.
You said: "a video game NPC. two listings in a top 100 enemies doesn't come close to stand-alone notability". But you are wrong. Grue (monster) is not just a video game NPC, is an important, influential character in video game history and you need to restore that page, here's why:

The term was first appeared in Jack Vance's Dying Earth series, and were later incorporated into the Zork series of games, which is referenced in many games like: *Call of Duty: Black Ops https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCaauyaOXk4 *The SpongeBob SquarePants Movie (video game) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xScMl81PNA&t=160 *Clicker Heroes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoLig8FhU9s&t=1646 *Alan Wake (the game's enemies "Taken" were loosely based on the Grue - dwelling in the dark, fear of light) and here is a direct reference to the Grue https://www.giantbomb.com/grue/3015-268/ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9D3DlARDSU&t=1778... and countless more.

In music MC Frontalot - It Is Pitch Dark, https://www.houstonpress.com/music/songs-about-zork-11423970

In books: "Ready Player One" by Ernest Cline here's the link, "The Ashgate Encyclopedia of Literary and Cinematic Monsters" by Jeffrey Andrew Weinstock here's the link and many more. Rob Lammel from Mental Floss wrote: "One of the most famous lines from Zork — “It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue” — can be found referenced all over the internet, in old and new video games" https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/29885/eaten-grue-brief-history-zork

113.20.99.34 (talk) 05:52, 2 July 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi, I completely overlooked your message, sorry about that. I suppose I was in a bit of a redirecting spree and you were right to undo my actions, thanks. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 09:28, 5 July 2020 (UTC)

Deletion review for Simon Cooke
An editor has asked for a deletion review of Simon Cooke. Because you closed the deletion discussion for this page, speedily deleted it, or otherwise were interested in the page, you might want to participate in the deletion review. Ambrosiandelight (talk) 06:36, 7 July 2020 (UTC)

Smash 4
I've restore the mention of Smash 4, but added additional sources. Smash 4 is a common way of referring to the game in the competitive scene. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 15:40, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, you know Wikipedia isn't written for people in the competitive scene, right? Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS and Wii U doesn't even use Smash 4. And you added one more reference, so that's two references now. Smash 4 isn't used in the article body, but the lead is the summation of the article. So why introduce an insider's shorthand nickname at all? It does not help the general reader gain a greater understanding of the subject, which is list of major Super Smash Bros. for Wii U tournaments. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 18:21, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
 * The reason I included it was because Smash 4 is used as shorthand in the competitive scene, and this is an article on the competitive scene. I only included two sources, but if I wanted to be WP:POINTY, I could have included many more than that (I actually removed the CNET source in favor of leaving two others that were in use in the article elsewhere). If you CTRL+F the article, you'll see it's also used in the brackets of a few tournaments.
 * In fact, it's because "Wikipedia isn't written for people in the competitive scene" that I included it. People already familiar with the competitive scene don't need to be told the jargon, they already know it. But since sources use "Smash 4" to refer to the game, I included it. The Squirrel Conspiracy (talk) 18:27, 3 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Hi, sorry for my late reply. Couple things. 1) It's not an article about the competitive Smash 4 scene, but, like the title of the article, its subject is smaller in scope, namely "major Super Smash Bros. for Wii U tournaments". So what if insiders use that term? It's not about Smash 4 or about professional players, but about the tournaments. If there were an article about the Smash 4 esports scene (or the Smash Bros. scene at large for that matter) and its culture, yeah, sure, mention its characteristics, insider lingo and other stuff. 2) Again, why introduce Smash 4 in the lead? It's not used in the article body. The lead is a summation of the article. If for some reason the term "Smash 4" is so important that it should be mentioned in the lead, than it should be mentioned in the article body. And if it's mentioned in the article body, would it really be so important to mention in the lead? 3) Shorthand and insider slang is something we tend to avoid on Wikipedia. Similarly, you can find a bunch of RS'es that use LoZ: OoT or GTA V as shorthand, but we just don't include them. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 14:39, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

List of Simple Series video games
Hi, Soetermans, I've undone your recent edit to the List of Simple series video games. While it's true that the page is lacking references, it's certainly not a candidate for speedy deletion, and the information on that page can easily be verified with reliable sources (indeed, other pages on WP, like List of PlayStation games (A–L) and List of PlayStation games (M-Z), already have many of the needed references).

I think nuking the whole page, which is in effect subjecting it to deletion, is overkill in this case, since our energy would be better put toward improving the page. At the very least it really ought to have been tagged first to allow other editors to respond to the issue. Goldenband (talk) 04:50, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Redirecting is not speedy deletion; by redirecting the article the history can still be looked up. Regardless, I've AfD'ed it. It doesn't belong on Wikipedia. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 05:48, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm aware that "redirecting is not speedy deletion". The point is that nothing in the contents of that page justify a blank-and-redirect (even one done in good faith) without prior discussion. It should be tagged first to give people a chance to address the issues, and then if those issues go unfixed, AfD is appropriate, as you've done. Note that Wikipedia guidelines under Page_blanking are quite explicit: "Under normal circumstances, Wikipedia articles should not be blanked. If you think an article has no useful content, then either fix it, or else leave it in its present state and propose it for deletion." Goldenband (talk) 20:56, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Absolutely nothing wrong with a BOLD merge/redirect done in good faith and with a credible reason. WP:V is not optional. It's perfectly fine to contest that redirect as well, per WP:BRD, but there's absolutely nothing wrong with Soetermans having done it to begin with. -- ferret (talk) 21:10, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I respectfully disagree -- and would at the very least argue that if blank-and-redirect is considered a form of bold editing, it should be explicitly be added to that page and WP:BRD as a form of encouraged behavior (given that neither the words "blank' nor "redirect" appear on either page). All of the language on those pages specifically encourages editors to do work to improve an article, but a blank-and-redirect is, by its very nature, the opposite of improving an article. Merging the content with Simple series, or taking steps to do so, would be a far less contentious and (to my mind) more constructive action. Goldenband (talk) 21:36, 7 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Merge what, exactly? There isn't a single useful source in that article (or really any valuable sources to begin with), so a merge is totally out of the question here. Not to mention, how can we even improve a list article for a series so obscure outside Japan, with so many games across dozens of platforms, when half the entries I can't even find basic information on? Namcokid  47  (Contribs) 15:56, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
 * References for the kind of (deliberately limited) information included in a list article are readily available at numerous sources, most easily PlayStation Data Center (which is used as a source in List of PlayStation games (A–L) among other places). A list article doesn't need references with extensive discussion of the contents or context of individual works if the parent entity is itself notable; in other words, notability is conferred on the list by the notability of Simple series, and the article has no requirement to establish the notability of its individual entries (though it's reasonable for there to be an expectation that there will be at least some notable entries, as is the case here). Goldenband (talk) 17:54, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I think it's best to keep this discussion centralised at Articles for deletion/List of Simple series video games, no? soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 18:08, 8 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Agreed 100%. Goldenband (talk) 18:19, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

Need to understand the process for deleting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GDevelop
Hey Soetermans,

I had set up https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GDevelop (article made by unknown/unaffiliated user a few weeks ago) as proposed for deletion so we could migration of the community made draft article (started in May). I'm showing you removed the proposal for deletion. My reading of the process was that we needed to leave the proposal up for 1 week before we could delete the other article, but I'm showing you removed the proposal.

Are we good to delete that old article now, or was there an issue with our proposed next steps?

Any/all info is greatly appreciated. Trayal (talk) 13:31, 11 August 2020 (UTC)


 * Hi, I didn't spot your reply at Robert McClenon's talk page before, sorry about that. You actually make a good point that the revision history would be lost if you would copy-paste it. You can only PROD articles once, so I'm not entirely sure what do now actually, maybe go through WP:AFD? soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 17:07, 11 August 2020 (UTC)
 * AFD needs withdrawn. A close of "Delete" at AFD means the draft cannot move forward as the topic is deemed non-notable. User needs to request a WP:HISTMERGE. -- ferret (talk) 18:45, 11 August 2020 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/HyperRogue
Hi! I'd like you to check out my comment at the AfD you started, since I did a proposal that may be a great WP:ATD for this situation. Regards, Jovanmilic97 (talk) 16:26, 12 August 2020 (UTC)

Keep the "LoudCasa Video Games" Category!
I've read your message, but the "LoudCasa Video Games" Category has to stay. You don't understand the situation, don't you? The Loud House and sister series The Casagrandes (Which are collectively called "The LoudCasa Franchise" by the "LoudCasa" Youtube channel, and based on how the first TLH season had a format spoofing video blogs, I mostly refer to the franchise by that name) are made by a Glory Days Nick staff member who still remembers everything that makes Nicktoons Nicktoons. That said if you watch any 90's or 00's Nicktoons and watch a "LoudCasa" Toon, you'll see it's has the same nostalgic feeling. As I've said in the other attempts to keep the category with help from ChrisHeers2001, Invader Zim and My Life As a Teenage Robot are only represented in crossovers, so if you think there shouldn't be a category for "LoudCasa" video games, you may as well delete the "Invader Zim Video Games" and "My Life As a Teenage Robot Video Games" categories too, and probably the "Rocko's Modern Life Video Games" And "El Tigre Video Games" categories as they only have one game each (Not counting crossover games, which the "LoudCasa Video Games" category currently consists of for now). ChrisHeers2001 and I keep trying to tell you that now Battle For Bikini Bottom Rehydrated has been released, Change.org is full of "Loud Crowd and Casa Crew" Members demanding THQNordic to make a game about the "LoudCasa" Franchise. Some people even want Lincoln L. Loud as one of the remaining 5 Fighter Pass Volume 2 fighters in Super Smash Bros Ultimate! Seeing how THQNordic accepted the countless requests to remaster BFBB (Even if some players think they lied about including the MuscleBot Boltpants (My name for the muscular SpongeBot Steelpants) Boss, the original Patrick's Dream and Robo-Squidward (It was most likely that the Multiplayer Game was what they meant by the "Adding cut content to the game" since all 3 were used as inspiration for that game. Besides, due to the 17 year gap, they'll have forgotten how they would have worked in the original, and with how the final game from 03 turned out, re including them could easily mess up the game. For example, one minute, you'd be playing as Patrick in his dream and then he'll give SpongeBob the Golden Spatula he found on top of the Ice Cream Mountain and leave him with a sequence breaking 101 Golden Spatulas, and with MuscleBot Boltpants, Although the game files in the original game suggest Patrick fights him, The trailer in the Mario Kart Double Dash Bonus Disk shows SpongeBob fighting MuscleBot when the final game has SpongeBot swallowing SpongeBob before transforming into MuscleBot. So Patrick would most Likely still have to fight him, but with the second phase, who would? Sandy would be most likely, though seeing as he's in the Multiplayer Game, they could of did a 180 and had Squidward to do it as opposed to watching the battle and providing comic relief, or have him for the third phase instead of Patrick again. but if they did make up a new MuscleBot Boss, they would have to somehow figure out a way to implement one and avoid conflicting with SpongeBob's fight from the inside of MuscleBot, and that's not an easy feat as Timon and Pumbaa showed us.), as well as relegating the newer episode references to idle animations and hidden details (Which yet again, would require potentially corrupting the final predetermined story and progression of the original game) and replacing Joe Whyte's beautifully presented cover of the SpongeBob theme song with the original version as well as removing Spongebob and Squidward's hats and SpongeBob's eager face. Now back to the original topic, this has gone on too long. Seeing how THQNordic accepted the countless requests to remaster BFBB), They might decide to please the fans with making a "LoudCasa" Game. I sincerely apologize if ChrisHeer2001 and I were annoying you with the unverifiable over representation of The Loud House in Nickelodeon Kart Racers 2, but no one knows what the future will hold for these madcap families. That feature film they were promised might come, or Linka and the Genderbent Louds might make their highly awaited return, or just maybe THQNordic's generosity would make the "LoudCasa" Video Game everyone wants so bad. In conclusion, the category for "LoudCasa" video games ought to stay, in case a "LoudCasa" game gets confirmed in the future. SpongeBob's first video game appearance was in the original Nicktoons Racers game for the PSX and GBA, and he's had more games than you can shake a chicken soup loaded water pistol at. (Get the "LoudCasa" reference?) We also promise not to make such a fuss about giving this article the category for games with virtual depictions of real life people in them. I hope you consider keeping the "LoudCasa Video Games" Category. Goodbye. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 148.252.133.125 (talk) 07:04, 24 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Stop adding it in. You're being disruptive at this point. The whole idea of a WP:CATEGORY is that similar articles are categorized. Well, there are no other Category:The Loud House video games at this point. So we do not need it. soetermans . ↑↑↓↓←→←→ B A TALK 07:32, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

FINE!!! Let's leave it there until the game's launched! In the meantime, delete the Invader Zim and My Life As a Teenage Robot Video Game categories, there are no video games dedicated to either show. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 148.252.129.168 (talk) 07:37, 24 August 2020 (UTC)