User talk:Steven Crossin/Archive 24

Note
I just wanted to let you know I reviewed, Administrators%27_noticeboard/Arbitration_enforcement and I decided to ban Rumiton for 1 week. Cheers, -- Chet B. Long Talk / ARK 05:30, 1 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Okay Chet, thanks for looking into the situation and coming to a decision so quickly. Steve Crossin (talk) (contact page) 05:34, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Not urgent
But have fun your vacation. Could use one myself. —[ DeadEyeArrow – Talk – Contribs ] 07:04, 1 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Heh, thanks. We're leaving in about half an hour :). And you forgot an "on" ;) Steve Crossin (talk) (contact page) 07:22, 1 August 2008 (UTC)

Couldn't get to work on the two merges
Sorry about that, got caught up in other wiki stuff, but by all means keep going, this project needs a heck of a lot more merging. :) Remind me when the conversations come up, I'll chime in. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 04:34, 5 August 2008 (UTC)
 * By the way, the 24 game article is a strong one, and with a few copyedits and a sentence or two more development/reception, I think it could become the projects first featured article. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 04:41, 5 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I would check the manual of style, because in all the years I've been here they've said section headers are not wikilinked. undue it if you like, but I would not be surprised that if you took an article to FA, for example, they would say that. Judgesurreal777 (talk) 04:54, 5 August 2008 (UTC)

ze lessons
just FYI, I've finally gotten around to importing the lessons, and I did a thorough read through the whole textbook and made a few minor changes, updating some things, fleshing out some things. feel free to update yours if desired. nice work with the assignments, i'll see about writing some for the lessons you didn't cover. – xeno  ( talk ) 01:32, 8 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi there. Thanks for letting me know. I think the new user rights (IP block exempt) and accountcreator still need to be added, as well as info on the new C class. I'll get around to it at some point. And I think a lesson on our really important policies, like WP:OR, WP:3rr, WP:NPOV and policies like that, could also help if it was in a lesson. Best, Steve Crossin (talk) (contact page) 05:54, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Vandal
Steve, the vandal is. A recent checkuser uncovered another batch of his socks. He's reacted this way before. See Requests for checkuser/Case/Primetime. Thanks for your help. ·:· Will Beback ·:· 16:47, 10 August 2008 (UTC)

Best wishes
Well, good luck Steve with retirement. If you decide to come back, you will be welcomed. Malinaccier (talk) 23:52, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Echo Malinaccier here. I've of course seen you around, and I find your contribs to be valuable and necessary. Regardless, real life is more important. Wishing you well, thanks for your selfless efforts here, and of course, you are welcome back if you ever feel so inclined.  Cheers, Keeper   76  23:55, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Nooo! Don't go! Oh well, your contributions here are valued, and we'll be waiting here with open arms and an open edit window should you want to come back. Best of luck with your future RL. Juliancolton Tropical Cyclone  00:04, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I, too, wish you well in all your future endeavors. Useight (talk) 00:06, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Sorry to see you leave over this. And I still think you need to post what we talked about, if only for other editors. Regardless, I wish you well.  Syn  ergy 00:07, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I considered it, but I decided that I'll leave my rep intact rather than starting a campaign. Steve Crossin Contact/24 00:24, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm really sorry to hear you say that Steve. Its the reason your leaving, and I think others need to know. Its just something we are going to have to disagree on....  Syn  ergy 00:28, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * To be honest, I blame the community for what has happened. As i said in my retirement statement, there is a lot of suppressed anger that I have. If the community was tougher on harassment, this never would have happened. The community protects the harassers, and extradites the harassed, and this is the result. First Mel quit, and now me. Steve Crossin Contact/24 00:36, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Regardless. I'm still here to help if you need it. Best wishes.  Syn  ergy 00:51, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You're a great editor Steve, the project will miss ya and so will I. Best of luck to you. —[ DeadEyeArrow – Talk – Contribs ] 00:09, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for all of your help mediating. You did an impressive job with a difficult task. Best wishes for your next adventure. You're always welcome back. ·:· Will Beback  ·:· 00:10, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

You were a great editor, and I give you the best of wishes for everything you do hereafter. —Animum (talk) 00:21, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Steve, you've certainly been one of our best editors around, and not to mention one of the nicest and funniest. :) I just wanted to thank you for all the help you did when you adopted me. Your help has not gone unnoticed. You've helped the RyRy before become the RyRy who is today. I've learned so much from you, during that long three month adoption, and it has really paid off. Thank you, Steve Crossin, for helping me, the community, and Wikipedia. Have a good life, and if you do decide to come back, we'll all be here, we'll all be here cheering for you. Best wishes, RyRy (talk ) 00:32, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks. But knowing how Wikipedia works, I'll be forgotten in a week :). Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 00:36, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You'll only be "fogotten in a week" if you actually disappear/retire. If you're leaving, fine, do it for the right reasons, which are your own reasons, and not because you feel you are being forced out. I don't know the underlying motivations behind your retirement, but do what is best of course to you, and your family, and your real life..  Don't ever let something from your wikiproduction be the reason because of some on wiki whatver.  Wikipedia attracts so many trolls and other trollish behavior that to quit over their post(s) only adds fuel to their fires.  <font color="#21421E" face="comic sans ms">Keeper   <font color="#CC7722" face="Papyrus">76  00:44, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I somewhat feel forced out of the project, rather, the project has forced me into a corner and I've had to choose between protecting the one I love, or contributing to an area that brings me a lot of joy and satisfaction. This wouldn't have happened if Wikipedia did more to protect our editors. It hurts to leave. There are "ties" to sever, and to sever each one, it's hurt. Some a lot more than others. I've not ruled out IP editing, there are just some areas that I'm so attatched to I can't sever myself completely from. Keeper, if you wish to know my reason for leaving, email me. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 00:51, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I personally choose to not use email (I don't even have it "enabled"), and I never will. Whatever your motivations for leaving, I trust that they are reasons strong enough to keep you posting in this manner.  Whatever your reasons, and in good faith I believe they are the right reasons, I wish you well in whatever you choose to do. Wikpedia will have a gap when you leave, but we will survive.  What's infinitely more important is that the editors here are content, motivated, and thriving; and that those who leave are doing so in order to be more content, motivated, and more thriving.  This is only a webpage, nothing more.  I wish you well SC, wherever you land....<font color="#21421E" face="comic sans ms">Keeper   <font color="#CC7722" face="Papyrus">76  01:07, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Keeper, thanks. :). <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 01:09, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your excellent service Steve, it will not be forgotten. <font color="#CC0000">seicer &#x007C; <font color="#669900">talk  &#x007C; <font color="#669900">contribs  01:14, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * It will be in a month =) <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 01:17, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * You see? A couple posts ago, you were going to be remembered for a week. Your making progress here! Juliancolton <sup style="color:#666660;">Tropical <sup style="color:#666660;">Cyclone  01:44, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * WAAAAAAAAAAAH! I'LL MISS YOU! <3 --  ɔɹǝɐ <font color="#000080">ɯ <font color= "#808000">ʎ! Talk 01:19, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes! Can't wait to see you back in a month whenever! :) Malinaccier (talk) 02:51, 12 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Steve I can't wait to see you back on wiki again, and I'm sad you'll have to take a wikibreak. You're a great asset to Wikipedia and you will be missed. I think I'll take you up on the "call" offer. Cya when you come back, - Chet B. Long Talk / ARK 03:23, 12 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm glad to see you've reconsidered retiring - Wikipedia needs great editors like you. Hope to see you return soon! SeanMooney (talk) 03:25, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Request for mediation accepted
[bot message removed]

Silly bot goes bonkers with templates :) Well, at least you now know that Requests for mediation/Prem Rawat 3 is open. Cheers, Daniel (talk) 05:29, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Just FYI
I moved your comment from User talk:Xenocidic/RFAQ to User_talk:Xenocidic and replied. – xeno  ( talk ) 13:57, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Message from WikiProject Media franchises unofficial coordinator
Dear Steve Crossin...I am so happy that you are willing to help WikiProject Media franchises. I am still reaching out to other WikiProjects to see if we can get some more interest, so I would like to depend on you and the others to do things like get articles assessed and find other articles which might need our attention by placing WikiProject Media franchises on their talk pages. Another thing is to start using Infobox Media franchises on franchise articles. I trust you to use your best judgment and hope that you have some time to spare.

If you haven't already done so, you can add User WikiProject Media franchises to your user page or dedicated user box page. When enough people have that, or WikiProject Media franchises participants on the user pages, I will start that category.

I may not be the best coordinator around, but I am doing my best. I hope that you approve. LA @ 19:58, 14 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi LA. Got your message before but I'll reply now. I'll give the project a hand when I can, as for infoboxes and 24 articles, I think it might be something the two of us projects (WP:24 and Media franchises would have to discuss. I'll get back to you when I can. Best, <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 00:45, 15 August 2008 (UTC)


 * And as for the co-ordination bit, don't worry about it. I know where you're coming from, and reviving an inactive Wikiproject is hard to do, and requires a lot of effort. It will get easier in time :). If you need any advice there, just ask. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 03:02, 15 August 2008 (UTC)

Steve...We now have a liaison page for people to sign up as a liaison from another project. Please add yourself to that list. LA (If you reply here, please leave me a message on my talk page.) @ 23:32, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

Done. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 23:36, 16 August 2008 (UTC)

Since others are doing it, I might as well too.
Just to see who watches this page. I spose we're all curious as to who's watching our page. Well, you know how this works :) If you watch this page, please, (~) :) <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 14:47, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 1) —<font face="Trebuchet MS" size="2px">Cyclonenim <font face="Trebuchet MS" size="1">T@lk? 15:07, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 2) Kipoc (talk) 15:09, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 3) kthxbai. –Juliancolton <sup style="color:#666660;">Tropical  <sup style="color:#666660;">Cyclone  15:10, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 4) Malinaccier (talk) 16:47, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 5) Yep I'm watching you veddy veddy closely :P —— RyanLupin • (talk) 16:50, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 6) you stoles some of my talk header!!! though since i stole your lessons, i guess we're even =0 –  xeno  ( talk ) 16:52, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Indeed I did, Indeed I did :). <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 17:03, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 1) I don't know why - I think I left you a message ages ago and watched it in case you replied here ¡<em style="font-family:Bradley Hand ITC;color:#999FFF"> Dendodge  .. Talk Contribs ! 16:54, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 2) SeanMooney (talk) 17:35, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 3)  ·:· Will Beback  ·:· 17:50, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 4) Useight (talk) 18:31, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * 5) EdJohnston (talk) 06:13, 20 August 2008 (UTC)

Which vandalism suspicion?
Regarding Editor assistance/Requests, which sort of vandalism do you suspect? My first guess was that this was spamming unrelated to Wikipedia and Astray (formulated for the Help desk) might be relevant. PrimeHunter (talk) 19:28, 19 August 2008 (UTC)


 * I was thinking something from Grawp. It's sorta hard to explain unless you've seen it. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 22:51, 19 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Okay. I guess I haven't seen it. PrimeHunter (talk) 22:58, 19 August 2008 (UTC)

RfA thank you
<div style="background-color: white; border: #5B92E5 solid 2px; margin-bottom:.5em; padding: 5px; font-family: trebuchet ms, sans-serif; color: #084C9E">, I wish to say thanks for your support in my successful request for adminship, which ended with 82 supports, 3 opposes, and 1 neutral. I will do my best to live up to your expectations. I would especially like to thank Rlevse  for nominating me and  Wizardman  for co-nominating me. &mdash;  JGHowes <sup style="color:darkblue;">talk  -  19 August 2008

Thank you
...for the script. It will be very useful in this particular case, I'm sure. I'll get brave and edit my monobook for the first time, and probably watch you to see how it works before I use it for real. Cheers again, Ka renjc 20:31, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * No problems. As for how it works, you enter a user's contributions and you see a red "revert all" tab at the top. You click it and a message pops up. You then type in rYes and click OK. Make sure you have popups enabled. A mass rollback then occurs, and popup windows come up. It's more clear how it works once you actually use it, but it should only be used for reverting banned users edits, reverting a severely malfunctioning bot, or for a string of IP vandalism. Best, <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 20:43, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Aha, that makes sense. Wouldn't dream of using it unless in exceptional circumstances as outlined.  As someone to whom script is foreign language, and who gets a glow of achievement when she manages to get anything more than a simple citation to display properly, I raise a virtual glass of wine to this neat new thingy.   Ka renjc 20:55, 21 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Heh, :D. Best of luck, and hope this makes things easier. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 21:05, 21 August 2008 (UTC)

User talk
Any objection to me restoring your user talk page? Deletion of such a page is not generally done. It looks like it was due to a retirement or something? But I see that you're not retired. Friday (talk) 18:38, 22 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Not really, but an undeleted talk page would basically be a number of red links...... <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact/<font color="#CCC000">24 18:42, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Situation on AN
Your input to the thread regarding your actions is woefully insufficient. Considering that a block/ban has so far only been held back by the promise of an explanation from you, I'd say you are definitely obligated to post more. Glass  Cobra  22:24, 22 August 2008 (UTC)


 * There will be a full explanation in due course. I wish to wait until the Committee has decided how they will punish me. I'm also extremely tired, due to lack of sleep, and I feel that now isn't the right time for me to make such a post, given my current state of mind, and the fact the committee has not finished discussing what will happen to me. Once that is done, I will give an explanation. I doubt it will make any difference anyway, but I will post one, when the time is right. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Talk/<font color="#CCC000">24 22:29, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Considering that your "punishment" might well be affected by a statement that you do or do not release, I would advise you change "in due course" to "as soon as possible." It's not really that complicated, Steve; the community is just looking for an apology, and some contrition. Glass  Cobra  22:35, 22 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Very well. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Talk/<font color="#CCC000">24 22:39, 22 August 2008 (UTC)

Additional explanation
Please see Administrators' noticeboard. Thanks. Glass  Cobra  09:33, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Chin up, you'll learn and move on :-)
I just wanted to make a little note that may reflect a perspective out there, even if not widely represented in the rather histrionic discussions on noticeboards. Personally speaking, I just don't have it in me to get overly upset about three mates sharing a password around a bit, and doing some stuff. You may reflect, in due course, that the expression of overly personal reactions to your behaviour (which yeah, was foolish to the point of sounding like something I might've done!) - really is more to do with others' relationship to the project than any big nasty evil thing you may, in a 'down' moment, feel that you've done.

Our american friends have a couple of phrases which may apply - first 'no harm, no foul' - which certainly kicks in when thinking about the actual encyclopedia, although you've clearly upset some folk, and eroding trust is always a bit of a bummer - the second is 'what doesn't kill you makes you stronger' - which manages to be both complete nonsense, and quite true all at once!

You'll be right, mate - and I certainly care more about the physical and mental health of folk like you than I do about a silly password swapping incident. Take it easy, take the slings and arrows with dignity if you can, and all this will come out in the wash in due course (time's an ever rolling stream, you know!) :-) Privatemusings (talk) 23:54, 22 August 2008 (UTC)
 * Seconded. Xavexgoem (talk) 14:27, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Yes, less distress, regardless
Here, take this flowerchip. El_C 18:08, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Talk/<font color="#CCC000">24 18:09, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

User page
Just FYI, NVS created it again and I asked him on his talk about it. rootology ( T ) 19:29, 23 August 2008 (UTC)
 * No, its fine. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Talk/<font color="#CCC000">24 19:32, 23 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I commented on my user talk, Steve or I can request its deletion if that is preferred. It was a matter of laziness on my part.  NonvocalScream (talk) 20:04, 23 August 2008 (UTC)


 * It is OK. No need to tag it for deletion. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Talk/<font color="#CCC000">24 20:14, 23 August 2008 (UTC)

Request for review
I'd ask that this be cross-posted to the Administrators Noticeboard at the appropriate time,

To the members of the community,

About a month ago, myself and the Arbitration Committee had discussion, after an AN discussion, where issues with myself, and my editing, was raised (accessing administrator accounts with their knowledge, using their sysop tools, sharing of private logs, and poor management of the situation on AN, and not being completely transparent with the community.), and it was decided that I was to refrain from editing until such a time that the committee allowed me to re-edit, and that their decision may be to ask the community. Over the past month, I've had time to reflect on my actions. Needless to say, I feel a lot of regret. A lot of people on Wikipedia know me, and know of my past work on the pedia. The situation I am currently in, is one I am struggling with. Needless to say, I am addicted to Wikipedia.

I have contacted the committee about a week ago, asking for a review, I have not, however, received any response. Therefore, I am asking that the community review my situation, make a recommended decision, which may or may not be reviewed by the Committee. I have been in some discussion with a few Wikipedian's recently, and I think mentorship would be something that would help me. I would agree to not edit anything except my mentorship pages, until such time that the community and/or committee thinks I am fit to edit again. I would also agree to restrictions to one account, and any other restrictions that the committee deems necessary.

Respecfully, <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Talk/<font color="#CCC000">24 10:33, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Blocked as enforcement of ArbCom ban
Steve Crossin, I blocked your account per the agreement that you were under a ArbCom ban that restricted you from editing and this was enforceable by a block. This was well understand by you at the time of the Committee's decision. An appeal of the situation was understood not to happen for 6 months. FloNight&#9829;&#9829;&#9829; 12:45, 27 September 2008 (UTC)

Sydney, with all due respect, I emailed the Arbitration Committee a week ago. My request was simple. I asked for the committee to assign me a mentor. I acknowledged I'd stay banned. You replied, acknowledging receipt of the email, then ignored it completely. I understood the ban would stay in place, but I did not expect the committee to ignore me entirely. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact 12:49, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Flo, why was this ban reset?  Maxim (talk)  12:50, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Steve Crossin was given a ban that was enforceable by a block. So I enforced it since he started editing again. Recently, he wrote to the Committee wanting a mentor. I replied to him in a prompt manner, but since he was under a ban that was intended to last 6 months there was no urgency in working out the details of a mentor for him. He needs to understand that he is under a ArbCom sanction and it will be lifted when the Committee feels that it is in the best interest of the Community. FloNight&#9829;&#9829;&#9829; 12:57, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I think the communty are plenty capable of deciding whether his unbanning is in our best interests. -- how do you turn this on  13:05, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I echo the above, We are quite capable of deciding what is in our best interest, we are not stupid either and dont need this dicatated to us by arbcom and more importantly, there more of us hence we are more likly going to come to a decision that reflects the community.... hell we are the community.  « l | Ψrometheăn ™ | l »   (talk) 13:18, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I made it clear to the Arbitration Committee that I understood my ban would not be lifted, and that mentorship would be in addition to the ban. This is the email that I sent the committee (linking to it in a pastebin, as I wrote the email, I can paste it.) <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact 13:04, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * The point of the ban/break was for you to disengage from Wikipedia, right? Nothing gives me reason to think the ban/break was a poor decision and for that reason I request that you honor it. Mentoring is not needed if you are away from Wikipedia.  I have other Committee work that I must do today and that is the reason that I can not talk to you even if I'm on line. I truly do not have time to talk with you on IRC today. FloNight&#9829;&#9829;&#9829; 13:44, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Sydney, I have always had a lot of respect for the Arbitration Committee, and I continue to have respect for them. I accepted the committee's terms, frankly, I wanted an end to the whole drama. I'd not slept in over 40 hours, and I'd collapsed earlier in the evening, nearly breaking my nose. The consensus on the administrator's noticeboard was that while what I had done was inexcusable, and that I'd lost my trust from the community, they felt that was punishment enough. I would ask the committee to consider the community's input, while I agreed to a six month duration, I have struggled with this ban. I have seen the 24 project slowly fall to pieces, my key area of editing. While what I did was wrong, I don't see how this ban, which has also been reset, prevents damage to the community. I think the community is the best judge in this circumstance. I dearly hope that there is no revolt, as I think may happen if the committee overrides a consensus that may or may not form at the Administrator's Noticeboard.. That said, my respect for the committee has not lessened, but as a wiki, which is run by the community, I feel that they are the best judges in this situation. Of course, if the community decides that the ban should stay in place, I'd of course respect that decision. I feel the principle of consensus is a good one, as are many Wikipedia policies, some of which I use in daily life. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact 14:14, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Is there any reason he should still need to keep off Wikipedia? If so, I'd like to know it. -- how do you turn this on  13:48, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * A very good point, What is arbcom achieveing here?  « l | Ψrometheăn ™ | l »   (talk) 14:11, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * For the user's own wellbeing? Is anyone who, by their own admission, had "not slept in over 40 hours, and I'd collapsed earlier in the evening, nearly breaking my nose" after being caught doing something they shouldn't have been doing really suited to a project such as this? I personally think not. George The Dragon (talk) 14:30, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * (ec)On that day, when the committee first posted to AN, I was rather tired. My input was requested, on my talk page (see here), I made a comment that I wanted to wait until I heard from the committee, and that I needed sleep. This request was rejected, and I was basically demanded to respond at AN immediately, or be blocked. I was tired, I collapsed sometime later. I was extremely stressed. I wanted the fiasco to end. There could've been a formal RFAR, but this was the fastest way to end the discussion. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact 14:38, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * That all happened ages ago. What is established though is this block is punitive and serves no actual purpose. -- how do you turn this on  14:34, 27 September 2008 (UTC)
 * With such a reasoning, we could unban almost all banned users. <font color="#000080">Cenarium <font color="#000090"> Talk 14:40, 27 September 2008 (UTC)


 * I've asked my talk page be protected. <font face="Verdana" color="blue">Steve Crossin Contact 14:43, 27 September 2008 (UTC)