User talk:Sthenel/Archive 3

AEK position
I could ask you the same question about if the actually determine the final position. It's not exacly clear in the league's official site but if you read the structure section in the wikipedia article (Super League Greece) you see it says In the play-off for UEFA Champions League. Moreover in other leagues with playoff systems such as the Dutch Eredivisie it is clearly mentioned that the playoffs are for the European places (Eredivisie). If you read it you will see that This happened in 2005-06; AZ, 2nd in competition, had to play for the UEFA Cup, while Ajax, 4th in competition, went into the Champions League qualifying round. Also if you look at the champions section (Eredivisie) you will see that for the 2005-06 AZ are mentioned as runners-up. Darth21 (talk) 21:21, 13 January 2009 (UTC)

AfD nomination of Arsenal and Chelsea football rivalry
I have nominated Arsenal and Chelsea football rivalry, an article that you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Articles for deletion/Arsenal and Chelsea football rivalry. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time. Chris Cunningham (not at work) - talk 21:13, 29 January 2009 (UTC)

An article you created maybe deleted soon: Tools which can help you
The article you created: Arsenal and Chelsea football rivalry may be deleted from Wikipedia.

There is an ongoing debate about whether your article should be deleted here:
 * Articles for deletion/Arsenal and Chelsea football rivalry.

The faster you respond on this page, the better chance the article you created can be saved.

Finding sources which mention the topic of your article is the very best way to avoid an article being deleted Findsources3:
 * Find sources for Arsenal and Chelsea football rivalry: google news recent, google news old, google books, google scholar, NYT recent, NYT old, a9, msbooks, msacademic ...You can then cite these results in the Article for deletion discussion.

Also, there are several tools and helpful editors on Wikipedia who can help you:
 * 1. List the page on Article Rescue Squadron. You can get help listing your page on the Article Rescue Squadron talk page.
 * 2. At any time, you can ask any administrator to move your article to a special page. (Called userfication)


 * 3. You can request a mentor to help you: Wikipedia:Adopt-a-User. But don't wait for a mentor to respond to you before responding on the article for deletion page.
 * 4. When trying to delete a page, veteran editors love to use a lot of rule acronyms. These acronyms don't need to intimidate you. Here is a list of acronyms you can use yourself: Deletion debate acronyms, which will help you argue that the article should be kept.

If your page is deleted, you also have many options available. Good luck! Ikip (talk) 12:33, 31 January 2009 (UTC)

Souliotes
Hi, I incorporated on Talk:Souliotes the discussion held in Talk:Cham Albanians, which was actually the consensus. Please read it and if you find other references than feel free to add them.Balkanian`s word (talk) 14:12, 18 February 2009 (UTC)

A proposal
Please can you see the proposal I have made in Talk:Chameria page.Balkanian`s word (talk) 15:53, 8 March 2009 (UTC)

Olympiakos
Sportin (talk) 07:54, 16 March 2009 (UTC)
 * All Greek cup finalists rosters (gr)
 * Olympiakos basketpedya.com
 * olympiacos.org The Championships Teams

The WikiProject Greece April 2009 newsletter
The April 2009 issue of the WikiProject Greece newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. Thank you.--Yannismarou (talk) 02:42, 11 April 2009 (UTC)

Greek princesses
I think the current category is fine, as it represents Modern Greece. "Greek princes/ses" for the modern royals conforms to what we have for other similar categories (Danish, Dutch, Prussian, Austrian, etc) I think what you're doing with the subcategories (having subcats for antiquated royals) works, but the current category is fine for modern princesses. Maybe this is something to take up over at WP:ROYAL. Morhange (talk) 01:37, 22 April 2009 (UTC)

Bubulina
Whats the problem with that? If "the person should be associated with his/her nation/country", than she should be an Ottoman, cause she lived in the Ottoman Empire. She is arvanite per sources and thats all.

By the way, why do all Greek editors here hate Arvanites?Balkanian`s word (talk) 18:13, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Ancient Macedonians
In response to your note, I'm trying to figure out what is going on here. I tried to find the most recent case where Future Perfect at Sunrise reverted one of your edits. I found this, in which he reverted two separate alterations of yours. Your first edit made an unsourced assertion that a certain view is generally agreed-upon. As a personal aside, I remember asking an editor to cite something about an obscure matter in 19th century American history. He insisted it was common knowledge and needed no citation. Few things from 100 or 2600 years ago can be assumed to be common knowledge. So, getting back to the matter, writing that a bunch of ancient historians all agree on something is an assertion and all assertions should be verifiable. For example, if I were going to write, "Many reports say that....", I'd make sure that it either has "many" footnotes or one footnote that says "many". Does that make sense? It's less important if you're going to say something uncontentious, like, "Sophia Loren was seen by many as the greatest Italian star of the 1950s."

The second part of the edit is where you wrote: "..besides Alexander the Great is presented to name himself the Greek viceroy of Macedonia while speaking to the Persians." That's sourced, but the source is Herotodus. Herotodus was an important but flawed historian, and we should always attribute the reports of the famous old historians. The other problem is that the word "besides" seems to be trying to prove a point or draw a conclusion, which is never desirable. It'd be much better to say, in a sentencce of its own and using the neutral point of view, that, "Herotodus reported that Alexander presented himself..." Then everyone knows who said it and there's less of an appearance of trying to prove something. So the two issues in that part would be drawing a conclusion, and failing to attribute a somewhat questionable source.

Finally, regarding Future Perfect at Sunrise. Please remember that while he's just an editor like anyone else, he's had a lot of experience on Wikipedia and has been judged by the community to be reasonably responsible. He's also been criticized. I've never paid enough attention to his edits to judge whether he's good or bad but either way the only behavior you can control is your own. Whatever you do avoid edit warring and incivilty, and try to develop consensus on the talk page. Ask about folks' objections and try to meet them. Likewise with your own concerns. there are many places to go for community input. There are the regulat channels like the noticeboards for specific issues (WP:RSN, WP:NORN, etc} and tools like WP:RfCs, plus special ethnic/nationalities noticeboards and even Centralized discussion/Macedonia. Don't that Wikipedia is a long term project. We don't have to get everything right today. As an editor, your most important task is staying around until next week and next year. Sometimes the best way of doing that is by taking a break of a week or two, either from all of Wikipedia or just the article.    Will Beback    talk    09:35, 28 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I really don't have time to do investigations of this. If you want me to look at an edit you'll have to give me a diff and tell me exactly what I'm looking for.   Will Beback    talk    16:51, 28 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Did you read what I wrote above, in response to your first request?   Will Beback    talk    19:23, 28 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I took the time to write a long response to your first request, but you seem to have ignored what I wrote. I don't have more time to spend on giving advice that isn't read.   Will Beback    talk    21:43, 28 July 2009 (UTC)


 * I don't think we're communicating very well. I suggest using one of the steps in WP:DR. Best of luck.   Will Beback    talk    23:24, 28 July 2009 (UTC)

Derby of the eternal enemies
Hi Sthenel, it was me who added yesterday the play off match between Olympiakos and Panathinaikos (Volos 1982). You think that this match doesn't have to be in the list of the games between the two clubs? Dimitrissss (talk) 16:43, 11 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Ίσως έχεις δίκιο, αν κι ένα μπαράζ τίτλου είναι εκ των πραγμάτων σημαντικός αγώνας. Και βέβαια και στο ματς αυτό οι δύο αιώνιοι ήταν... οι δύο αιώνιοι και όχι κάποιοι άλλοι. Άστο για την ώρα και βλέπουμε. Ίσως μπει σαν υποσημείωση ή σαν ξεχωριστή ενότητα, όπως πρόσθεσα πρόσφατα και το League Cup του 1990. (Αστεία διοργάνωση, ωστόσο επίσημη...) Dimitrissss (talk) 10:00, 12 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Και να σκεφτείς ότι ο συγκεκριμένος ..... (από μέσα μου ο χαρακτηρισμός) με έστειλε στους διαχειριστές για βανδαλισμό! (Εκεί που μας χρωστάγανε μας πήραν και το βόδι). Dimitrissss (talk) 11:12, 12 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Ναι, λεπτότητα, όντως. Αν και τους έχω φάει στη μάπα στην ελληνική Βικιπαίδεια τόσο καιρό, δεν είναι η πρώτη φορά. (Το τι έχουν σκαρφιστεί για να προσθέτουν τίτλους στους συλλόγους, δεν περιγράφεται!). Δεν περίμενα ότι αυτό θα γίνει εξαγώγιμο προϊόν. Το ξέρω ότι θα επανέλθει. Όχι για τα κύπελλα καθεαυτά, αλλά για το γινάτι. Δεν πειράζει. Θα μπουν ξανά οι αντικρουόμενες πηγές και θα καταντήσει άρθρο - τσίρκο. Δεν γίνεται όμως να μην παρατεθούν οι επίσημες ελληνικές πηγές. Κι όποιος θέλει ας βγάλει τα συμπεράσματά του. Dimitrissss (talk) 11:43, 12 August 2009 (UTC)

The book by Mr. Spyridon Sfetas
Hello Sthenel. One of the references in the article Macedonians (ethnic group) is the book by Mr. Spyridon Sfetas, originally published in Greece in 2009. I am not experienced with the Greek alphabet, so I ask you to add the original name of this book along with the Bulgarian translation. Thanks in advance. Relativefrequency (talk) 23:12, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
 * Now the original name can be found here. Thanks! Relativefrequency (talk) 09:43, 19 August 2009 (UTC)

Greek Orthodox
Μεγάλε αφού δεν τα ξέρεις σωστά γιατί πειράζεις το άρθρο;;;87.202.69.140 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 19:06, 3 September 2009 (UTC).
 * φίλε βαριέμαι να τσακωθώ μαζί σου ... απλώς σου λέω ότι το να αλλάζεις το άρθρο χωρίς να πολυκαταλαβαίνεις τι λέει είναι τουλάχιστον βλακώδες. Γιατί δεν το καταλαβαίνεις αυτό μου δείχνεις όταν (π.χ.) αλλάζεις τον τίτλο της "Ελληνορθόδοξης εκκλησίας του όρους Σινά" σε "Μοναστήρι της Αγίας Αικατερίνης".87.202.69.140 (talk) 22:17, 3 September 2009 (UTC)


 * ε δε με παρατάς αφού σ'αρέσει το άρθρο έτσι τι να σου πώ είσαι μεγάλος βλάκας (με περικεφαλαία που λένε) τι να κάτσω να σου εξηγήσω αφού εσύ το δικό σου θα κάνεις (τι να πω ρε παιδί μου και δεν είσαι ούτε καν ξένος) για να μην καταλαβαίνεις ότι αποδυναμώνεις το άρθρο... κάνε το όπως νομίζεις και συγχαρητήρια σε όποιον σού 'δωσε πτυχίο.87.202.69.140 (talk) 23:16, 3 September 2009 (UTC)

Templates
The templates were much better before they were changed. That is why I changed them back. I don't what else to say other than that. It is nothing more to it than this. Wiki Greek Basketball (talk) 08:27, 10 September 2009 (UTC)
 * I didn't change it back. But to be fair here, you are changing it just because you don't I guess like the other one. Have it however you want it to be, but I'm just answering you. I changed it because the "new" box to me is inferior and poor. No problems, I was just answering the question why you asked me why I changed it. Wiki Greek Basketball (talk) 09:35, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

Euroleague in Basketball
Hi Brother! you don't understand me. This is not nationalistic edit...if you know Serbia have ,in time of Yugoslavia, some players which play for this country. The FIBA considers separate SFRJ Yugoslavia from Serbia becouse consider only the result of Yugoslavia and Serbia but in team of Yugoslavia playing some serbs...and becouse Serbia are consider the successor of this medals. It's not nationalistic edit is real editing brother :)

Greeting to you!! Long life to Greece! —Preceding unsigned comment added by South.Gate1970 (talk • contribs) 18:58, 10 September 2009 (UTC)

ok bro! is not problem...i think that beocuse Serbia was a part of Yugoslavia and win the title with player of other countries in ex-yugoslavia ;)

Greetings —Preceding unsigned comment added by South.Gate1970 (talk • contribs) 12:12, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

hey bro! excusme. can you put Soviet Union, Yugoslavia and Czechoslovakia under the name of Russia , Serbia and Czech Republic and than put a references in whic you can describe that this team is consider separate but now the successor is the new former republic of Russia...and another squad. Thanks :)

Greetings —Preceding unsigned comment added by South.Gate1970 (talk • contribs) 12:25, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

yes bro i know :) but it's the same thing :) becouse Serbia will be the center of federation in age of yugoslavia :)

GreetingSouth.Gate1970 (talk) 17:39, 11 September 2009 (UTC)

Alexander
Hi there,

The most recent consensus on the lead of Alexander the Great was the result of this discussion:. The reasons for the discussion can be found littered across the article's talk page. The use of Ancient Greece rather than Greeks to wikilink "Ancient Greek" is simple: it avoids some of the otherwise inevitable conflict that the article attracts.

As I'm sure you know, whether Alexander was "Greek" or "Macedonian" in a modern sense of usage is both a) a hotly-debated subject, and b) interminably boring. To avoid this conflict spilling over onto Alexander's article, it is preferable to go for something less ambiguous, and easier to reference. Whilst the notion that Alexander was an Ancient Greek still causes some problems, he at least self-identified as a hellene - and this can easily be backed up by published work.

At any rate, this is basically of a matter of semantics: to the disinterested reader, the text of the article still says "Ancient Greek"; the only difference is where that link leads. I realise this is not a solution that pleases everyone (or perhaps even no-one), but it is a compromise, and one that maybe is acceptable to the most people.

I hope this clarifies the rationale for my edit, Best regards, MinisterForBadTimes (talk) 13:09, 21 September 2009 (UTC)

"Bad editing"
I am not the one that is doing "bad editing", making up non existent rules, making up how articles are supposed to be, and constantly sending unwarranted complaints to other users. So please don't start accusing me of acting how you are. Wiki Greek Basketball (talk) 10:54, 25 September 2009 (UTC)
 * Your words seems accusatory and you seem to always complain about anything. Regardless, you are complaining about things that you alone by yourself have a problem with. It gets really annoying and you should be able to figure that out on your own. I do not have to personally explain every contribution I make to the site. Wiki Greek Basketball (talk) 11:43, 25 September 2009 (UTC)

Macedonian (Greeks)
Hello, I am disputing whether the "Preface" portion should be included in Macedonians (Greeks). I am not disputing ancient times, it is well known the ancient historians distinguished between Macedonians and Greeks, and that Macedonians were Hellenized much like the rest of the ethnicities of the Balkans during that time.

I am disputing if Macedonians (Greeks) are descendants of the ancient Macedonians, and would like you to prove the Greeks of Macedonia identified as Macedonian during the Greek revolution/Greek battle for Macedonia/nationalism during Ottoman Empire. Mactruth (talk) 23:28, 27 September 2009 (UTC)


 * I already did. Mactruth (talk) 00:26, 28 September 2009 (UTC)

Comment
Can I get your comment/opinion in the piping of Infobox Peri GR with Infobox Settlement? El Greco(talk) 21:40, 29 September 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks, if you want to add any further input, leave your comments here: Template talk:Infobox Peri GR. El Greco(talk) 16:22, 1 October 2009 (UTC)

You're right
Edit warring is wrong. Next time I want to edit that template, I'll open a discussion first. Sounds good?--Iwillremembermypassthistime (talk) 21:21, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Crete
What was the point of this revert several days ago? Two other users had been edit warring inappropriately and been warned...why did you feel a need to jump in and make another revert with no explanation? r ʨ anaɢ talk/contribs 23:11, 2 October 2009 (UTC)

Category deletion
I could not approve your request to delete Category:Olympiacos footballers, because the speedy deletion guidelines specifically prohibit speedy deletion of a category that has been emptied without previous discussion at WP:CFD. Accordingly, I have started such a discussion at Categories for discussion/Log/2009 October 27, and you are welcome to participate. --R'n'B (call me Russ) 20:05, 27 October 2009 (UTC)

Olympiacos F.C.
I cut, you put back, I clean up, you clean up my clean-up, and the article is better as a result. Nice work. What I'd like to see is more sources from books--don't you have anything on your shelf? They don't have to be in English, of course. Drmies (talk) 18:18, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your note. I like this much better than edit warring--and I do apologize if I sound terse in these edit summaries; you only have a few characters to get a lot across. Take it easy, and let's see what we can find to improve the article. Drmies (talk) 18:48, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Re:Warning
Don't template the regulars perhaps... And still, your edit is inconsistent (Seeing as it only shows old names on 2 out of 3 teams). Fifa recognizes Czechia and Slovakia as successors just as Russia, and in the latest edit it also shows the predecessors chandler 21:10, 1 December 2009 (UTC)
 * If you look at the UEFA pages for Slovakia, Cezch Republic, Russia and Germany (and Serbia). Look at their "National team competition record", you'll see that all matches are handed down to those teams. The reason to have them on the template it to show that FIFA and UEFA recognize them as winners of the competition. chandler 01:17, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

3RR
I observe you in violation of 3RR on Macedonians (Greeks). Stop. Toddst1 (talk) 17:52, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Not really, be more open-eyed. - Sthenel (talk) 18:03, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Nope - you had 4: 1 2 3 4. This is a simple content dispute. Please seek WP:DR and stop edit warring. Toddst1 (talk) 18:08, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

The first was not, I didn't remove what he added. The third case was not a bare reversion either. - Sthenel (talk) 18:16, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I'm not going to argue with you. They were all reversions of 's edits in whole or in part. Toddst1 (talk) 18:22, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

In the first case, I didn't undo his edit, I didn't restore the page to a previous version and actually I didn't revert his edit (Help:Reverting). I didn't remove what he added, I just corrected his syntax. Editing and reverting are two different actions. I don't want to argue with you either. So, this is over and thanks for the intervention. - Sthenel (talk) 18:34, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * It was 3. What you're mistaking as the 4th is indeed syntax. ♪ daTheisen(talk) 19:04, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Just to inform, I've posted to continue the discussion since there are some serious issues I think need to be addressed. Stopping it now vs it being brought up later would be good. ♪ daTheisen(talk) 21:38, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Reply on template
I was just muddling through myself. Try looking for other similar templates (try rooting around politics infoboxes). Sorry I can't be of more assistance. Lockesdonkey (talk) 18:10, 3 December 2009 (UTC)