User talk:Submixster

Michelangelo
Would you please delete what you know to be erroneous, rather than simply commenting? Comment as well, by all means!

Re Raphael, the removal was appropriate. On the other hand, the story goes that Bramante let Raphael in to see the unfinished ceiling, looked at the prophets and went back to the prophet he was painting at Sant'Agostino's, scraped it off and started again. He was a great imitator, and never ashamed to copy others. With Michelangelo, there is a much greater gap between what he was doing and what his contemporaries were doing. While Raphael's dependence upon Perugino is very obvious, it is hard to see a connection between Michelangelo and Ghirlandaio, except that, like Ghirlandaio, Michelangelo was obviously very concerned about the chemistry and the technique that he employed in painting his frescoes. One sees in Michelangelo's works nothing of the linear perspective, compositional elements, naturalism, meticulous portraiture, and attention to detail that concerned Michelangelo's principal teacher. By the time he was seventeen, he was heading a very different direction.

Michelangelo created "The Battle of the Centaurs" at an almost impossibly young age and about 8 years before Signorelli commenced work at Orvieto. It is clear that complex figure compositions with naked figures was the direction he was going, and it can't be put down to "shamelessly imitating Signorelli".

Amandajm (talk) 01:14, 15 December 2013 (UTC)
 * And there is no prove, that Raphael "imitated" anything from Michelangelo. Some of his early works closely follows those of Perugino, but better find one which follows Michelangelo. There is a big diference between "imitation" and "influence". Raphael was influenced by Michelangelo and Michelangelo was influenced by Signorelli (by his own words) and there is no sense to state about "shameless imitations" at all. Now, about Parmigianino and Pontormo being influenced by Last Judgement and Capella Paolina frescoes - I only pointed out obvious fact - Parmigianino was already dead by the time Michelangelo finished LJ and started Paolina frescoes and as I knew Pontormo never was in Rome at the time and later. Probably those things comes from Kenney Mencher online lectures, filled with timeline errors. He even thinks Correggio (d. 1534) was influenced by LJ, which is bizarre. As for "Battle of Centaurs", there is well known earlier print by Antonio del Pollaiolo which is usually pointed out as possible influence on laster masculine florentine art.

--Submixster (talk) 17:27, 20 December 2013 (UTC)