User talk:Sugar Bear/Archive07

Other rock band genres
I have seen that you changed the genres in the Disturbed albums to just simply "rock". So why don't all that other rock bands articles have the simple label of either "rock" or metal"? 72.129.154.83 (talk) 22:21, 24 April 2009 (UTC)
 * Note - I moved this section here from your archived talk page.—  Dæ dαlus Contribs  22:25, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

WikiProject Films April 2009 Newsletter
The April 2009 issue of the Films WikiProject newsletter has been published. You may read the newsletter, change the format in which future issues will be delivered to you, or unsubscribe from this notification by following the link. If you have an idea for improving the newsletter please leave a message on my talk page. --Happy editing! Nehrams2020 (talk • contrib) 07:45, 1 May 2009 (UTC)

Copyedit
(Give me 10 minutes and you'll have my undivided attention!) HJMitchell    You rang?  22:42, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Hey, I've done a little fiddling. A little bit of punctuation- speech marks like "this". as opposed to "like this." are the only continuing thing. Whether or not the MoS says that's how it should be, I don't know, I've read the essentials and, frankly, have better things to do than read the whole thing!! I've had several editors tell me it's a read to fall asleep to and I have a pretty good grasp of English. I've fiddled with grammar here and there- just to make it sound more academic and make it more readable. The referencing, as far as I've read, is faultless. I haven't checked the links themselves, but, for a FAC and a standing GA, I doubt I'd need to, really. The only thing I'm not liking is the last sentence of the third paragraph. It seems too abrupt- would it be any better kicking off the next paragraph, perhaps? Regards, HJMitchell    You rang?  23:47, 14 May 2009 (UTC)
 * OK, it's almost 0130 here. I got as far as "Shift to fantasy film" and will have to look at the rest at a more sociable hour. I've left pretty descriptive edit summaries so feel free to review my efforts. Best, HJMitchell    You rang?  00:25, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

(<--) It's seems like HJ Mitchell already did the request for you. Cheers,  The New  Mikemoral  ♪♫ 22:51, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Talkback
 The New  Mikemoral  ♪♫ 22:58, 15 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Once more. -- The New  Mikemoral  ♪♫ 23:36, 15 May 2009 (UTC)

Copyedit request
Hi there. I need some help on the FAC Ralph Bakshi. Could you take a look at the article and see if there's any work you can do in regards to the prose/etc.? Thanks. (Ibaranoff24 (talk) 17:38, 15 May 2009 (UTC))


 * I'll be happy to look at the article, but I fear it may be later in the weekend. :) - sinneed (talk) 04:36, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

One last thing
That sentence I pointed out sounds a lot better- it was just very abrupt before. I've finished now- a few little bits of punctuation and I've changed the structure of one or two sentences- the edit summaries will show where (I did it by section), a little bit of punctuation etc. I also left one fact tag- impressive that I only needed one!- I marked it in the edit summary so you can stick a ref on it. The sentenced seemed to be bordering on POV, though that might be fixed by a ref. All the best, HJMitchell    You rang?  16:09, 16 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Very well, I've already chimed in on the discussion and I'll take a look at our friend's list and get in touch with him- as soon as I've finished gaining idle amusement at Quadminton's AfD!!! HJMitchell    You rang?  16:45, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

Back to the drawing board
Oh, I'm very cooperative. After you claimed the copyediting process was complete, long after you claimed "no more work needs to be done", and months after you claim, in the face of a mountain of contrary evidence, that this article was FA ready ("three nominations ago", to quote you), I identified ten specific areas in the "Fritz the Cat and Heavy Traffic" subsection alone that need improvement.

Oh, and here's a little advice: Watch it with telling people what they "need to do". I don't need to do a thing for you or for this article. But if you ever want this article to receive that little FA star, you need to do something. You need to write an article that meets the standard. You are fooling yourself to think it even comes close at the moment. And apparently you've been fooling yourself for quite some time. The day you choose to stop fooling yourself is the first day Ralph Bakshi will have a serious shot at being Featured. Believe it or not, I'm rooting for you.DocKino (talk) 23:24, 16 May 2009 (UTC)


 * So, you "probably would have more eager to help implementing the changes you requested sooner if you weren't as rude and uncooperative as you were." ["Would have more eager"! That's how to show off your awesome writing skills! "To help implementing"! What's that--Esperanto?] We'll file this right next to your other delusional claims: "No more work needs to be done" and "It's as complete and factually accurate as it could ever get" and "It should have been listed as a FA three nominations ago." Keep 'em coming brother, you're a regular laugh riot. Not quite as funny as Gallagher, I'm sad to say, but you definitely kick Carrot Top's ass.DocKino (talk) 07:51, 17 May 2009 (UTC)


 * OK, having a FAC archived is a real disappointment (I know), but can we maintain civility here? My advice to Ibaranoff is to work with the opposition and not to fight them. Graham. Graham Colm Talk 22:04, 17 May 2009 (UTC)

Metal Archives
The "delete" was overturned. See here. Evenfiel (talk) 17:55, 22 May 2009 (UTC)

Nosawa
I used that ref for Nosawa being a juggalo because he is saying (in the music section) that "ICP is the number one music group. [They are] my family." So, while he doesn't say the word juggalo (because there is no japanese writing for the word), he says that he is a fan of ICP and considers himself family. The only other sources refer to his nickname "The Japanese Juggalo Sensation", such as here and here. Even his page doesn't have a ref for the claim due to the multiple visible tatoos he has of them (ie, the Hatchetman on his neck, the Dark Lotus cross on his chest, ect.) I understand why you removed it, no need to jusify yourself, I just wanted to explain why I used it there in the first place. It seemed like the best ref coming straight from him.

By the way, you can't use google to translate the page, the Japanese translator thinks the text is Chinese, so it really messes with the translation.Juggalobrink (talk) 11:53, 23 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I meant that google switched the order of the words, causing more confussion than already there in the first place. It made it sound like he is saying that he doesn't want to hear ICP. Anyway, I just finished the Gathering of the Juggalos page. I'm posting it in the WikiProject page so people can help provide some clean up.Juggalobrink (talk) 21:36, 23 May 2009 (UTC)
 * Alright, thanks.Juggalobrink (talk) 03:00, 24 May 2009 (UTC)

Bakshi
At the end of the last FAC, I identified ten issues in the "Fritz the Cat and Heavy Traffic" subsection alone. Nine Three remain unresolved:

*Repeated bad punctuation and callout placement: everyone."[5];   //   audacious",[5];   //   adjacently[21], *"Bakshi used many of the well-known film-making techniques he had used previously." Redundant--the article says, just two paragraphs above, that in Fritz the Cat "Bakshi used experimental animated film production techniques that he would continue to use throughout his career". *"During the production of the film, Bakshi and producer Albert S. Ruddy became friends at a screening of The Godfather." The structure of this sentence--in the context of the preceding two sentences of the paragraph--leaves the reader confused as to who was the producer of Heavy Traffic. *The New York Times and The Hollywood Reporter are each linked twice in same subsection. *"though it went on '...However, it is also an authentic...'" Use either "though" or the quoted "however"--not both. *"Ralph Bakshi became the first person in the animation industry since Walt Disney to have two financially successful films released adjacently[21], despite the film being banned by the Film Censorship Board in the province of Alberta, Canada upon release." Non sequitur. In 1973, the entire province of Alberta had a population about half that of the city of Chicago. It's hardly a shock that a film could be financially successful "despite" loss of access to such a small share of its potential market. In addition, the use of "adjacently" is nonidiomatic.
 * "The film was the first independent animated feature to gross more than US$100 million worldwide." Sure, according to a single Variety obituary. See my earlier notes from the FAC. Differing WP:V-standard sources have been completely ignored, even in footnote.
 * Forbidden Animation, by Karl F. Cohen: In 1973, the Hollywood Reporter said that the film had grossed $30 million worldwide (p. 83).
 * Who's Who in Animated Cartoons, by Jeff Lenburg: Fritz the Cat "went on to gross more than $90 million worldwide" (p. 15).
 * Planet Cat, by Sandra Choron, Harry Choron, Arden Moore: "The movie grossed $25 million in the United States and over $90 million worldwide" (p. 96).
 * Ultimately, the claim about Fritz the Cat's worldwide gross needs to be both clarified and moderated. If you're serious about Variety as a source, don't rely on a passing sentence in an obituary; Variety publishes cumulative box office figures--you can go and find them. In lieu of that, respect what the preponderance of the WP:V-standard evidence is saying.
 * "Reviews of the film were largely positive." Yet, of five reviews quoted or summarized, two are positive, one is mixed at best, and two are described as "mixed". That's largely mixed. Rephrase, cut the general description, or find another positive review. And did the film receive not a single negative review that might be referenced?
 * "In 1973, Bakshi began production on Heavy Traffic, a personal tale of inner-city street life." OK, but "personal" could mean several things. It could mean he wrote the tale. It could mean it had a lot of personal meaning for him. It could mean it was autobiographical. It would be helpful to the reader to be a bit clearer and more specific here.

Without commenting on the general qualifications of the copyeditor who applied himself to the article during the past week, I observe that he comes from a British English background, which is not ideal for an article on an American subject composed in American English. As a result, new problems have appeared. Here's three that I noted immediately:
 * Unnecessary and distracting lead-in ellipses have been added to virtually all of the quotations. These need to be removed.
 * In the lead: "He is well known for his fantasy films, which include: Wizards in 1977". The colon is ungrammatical.
 * Also in the lead: "Bakshi's last cinematic film, released in 1992, was Cool World." Nonidiomatic. If we need to assist the reader in distinguishing Cool World from Bakshi's television work, the idiomatic term would be "feature film" or "theatrical film". DocKino (talk) 16:35, 16 May 2009 (UTC)

I see Steve has done some copyediting on the article--that's great. He's about as good as it gets. He's resolved most of the problems noted above, but three of a substantive nature remain. They require a bit of research--or simply rechecking sources that have already been accessed--so they fall to you, rather than to a copyeditor. DocKino (talk) 15:54, 29 May 2009 (UTC)

Culhane query
Did Bakshi really replace Shamus Culhane twice in 1967--first at Paramount, then again at Grantray-Lawrence? The Michael Barrier article cited in both cases doesn't mention Culhane at all. Please check your book sources to confirm this. If Baskshi did indeed replace Culhane twice, the second sentence needs to be recast to acknowledge the fact, along these lines: "Steve Krantz employed Bakshi (once again, to replace Shamus Culhane) at Grantray-Lawrence Animation" DocKino (talk) 18:23, 29 May 2009 (UTC)