User talk:SuzanneOlsson/Archive 6

Topic ban
Hi - following the recent ANI discussion, you are now subject to a topic ban on all Roza Bal related article edits, broadly construed. Regards, GiantSnowman 10:16, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

If I understand this ban correctly, I can still contribute here, just not on the main page. Best wishes, Sue     SuzanneOlsson (talk) 15:57, 19 February 2013 (UTC)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk) 15:57, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Hi Giant Snowman (cute!) I fully expected a topic ban since I did acquire the domain 'RozaBal'. This now clearly constitutes a COI (conflict of interest) that no one paid any attention to before. I am delighted to see the page has been noticed by new minds and is improving daily.That's all I ever hoped for, a fair and balanced and expanded page about the Roza Bal tomb. Thank you all who have been helping.
 * Please note that "broadly construed" means that you're not only banned from editing the main article but also that you must not edit anything else that touches on the subject. E.g. editing articles or lists that mention the Roza Bal is also not allowed under the topic ban. De728631 (talk) 19:45, 19 February 2013 (UTC)

All these edits to Talk:Roza Bal was done after this notification of the topic ban: 11:40, 19 February 2013, 11:41, 19 February 2013, 11:43, 19 February 2013, 14:33, 19 February 2013, 14:38, 19 February 2013, 14:40, 19 February 2013, 14:45, 19 February 2013. — raeky  t  20:24, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * She's allowed talk page edits, just not article edits. Killer Chihuahua  20:53, 19 February 2013 (UTC)
 * To clarify - the close clearly states "article edits" i.e. talk pages are OK. If they become disruptive then we can re-raise at ANI and look to spread the topic ban further. GiantSnowman 20:38, 20 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Actually everything is just fine. Meeting some really great editors too! The ban was never necessary, highly over-reactive to something very minor, a conflict with just two editors over exactly the same things. They both tend to edit religious historical pages with their own unresearched slant. Following them around Wiki reveals others have exact same problems with them. No one lese, no other topics were ever an issue here. My edits were so seldom and so insignificant as to be negligible. Tell me GiantSnowman, is this ban for eternity or can we lift it or modify it eventually?  You have a nice day, and don't get too close to the heat lamps. ;-) SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)

Speedy deletion nomination of File:FidaHassnain.jpg


A tag has been placed on File:FidaHassnain.jpg requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This has been done under section G12 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the article or image appears to be a clear copyright infringement. For legal reasons, we cannot accept copyrighted text or images borrowed from other web sites or printed material, and as a consequence, your addition will most likely be deleted. You may use external websites as a source of information, but not as a source of sentences. This part is crucial: say it in your own words. Wikipedia takes copyright violations very seriously and persistent violators will be blocked from editing.

If the external website or image belongs to you, and you want to allow Wikipedia to use the text or image — which means allowing other people to modify it — then you must verify that externally by one of the processes explained at Donating copyrighted materials. If you are not the owner of the external website or image but have permission from that owner, see Requesting copyright permission. You might want to look at Wikipedia's policies and guidelines for more details, or ask a question here.

If you think that your page should not be deleted for this reason, you may contest the nomination by visiting the page and clicking the button labelled "Click here to contest this speedy deletion". This will give you the opportunity to explain why you believe the page should not be deleted. However, be aware that once a page is tagged for speedy deletion, it may be removed without delay. Please do not remove the speedy deletion tag from the page yourself, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. ukexpat (talk) 16:10, 14 February 2013 (UTC)
 * I have had permission from Fida Hassnain to use that jpg- photo of him for many years. He gave me this copy in India personally and I still have the original. With his permission I used this photo on my website (until I took that website down a few years ago), and a copy was contributed to the TOJ website- all done with his approval and gratitude. He is 95 years old now. I am not too sure if he accesses computers much these days. He does have volunteer students who come to his home several times a week to assist him with emails and letter writing. By what means would you like me to verify I legally own, and have full permission to use this JPG? I can try to contact Hassnain and get a direct reply for you. Would that do?  Because there is clearly no copyright infringement  here. Since this now represents a COI for me, I wont re insert the jpg. I hope someone else will. 66.177.27.120 (talk) 12:56, 15 February 2013 (UTC)Suzanne Olsson66.177.27.120 (talk) 12:56, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * See WP:IOWN.--ukexpat (talk) 19:51, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Your recent edits
Hello. In case you didn't know, when you add content to talk pages and Wikipedia pages that have open discussion, you should sign your posts by typing four tildes ( &#126;&#126;&#126;&#126; ) at the end of your comment. You could also click on the signature button or  located above the edit window. This will automatically insert a signature with your username or IP address and the time you posted the comment. This information is useful because other editors will be able to tell who said what, and when they said it. Thank you. --SineBot (talk) 07:13, 22 February 2013 (UTC)

Draft article
Howdy! It struck me, having another look at it, that you might not have been aware of the discussion at Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Wikipedia:WikiProject Abandoned Drafts/Suzanne M. Olsson. I commented on the difficulties created by recent events but volunteered to fix the article and publish it at Suzanne M. Olsson. Everything else aside, I thought you should be aware of the discussion and be given the chance to comment on the general merits of such an article. I agree with SilverSeren's suggestion that notability could be established. But I also have no want to cause drama. Cheers, Stalwart 111  22:50, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Dear Stalwart, I just got some emails (updates) that my Bio page (Sandbox) was also deleted. Had I known you volunteered to fix it, I would have been most grateful and supported your efforts with any updated sources and info you required. We were al afraid to touch it for fear of yet more attacks about COI- my lack of 'notability' and so forth. However, I see the page has just been deleted anyway.
 * The usual reasons are given, that I am not noteworthy, and people were 'self-promoting' my ideas..this seems a circular argument- posting an article about anyone is also usually explaining their 'ideas' and what their lives stood for. Someone has taken the time to go methodically through Wiki and delete any and all  references to me, my book, or my research, although most links  had been here at Wiki for years and were certainly NOT inserted by me. Once in a while from my Stats counter,I saw that  someone would enter my website from Wiki, and I was  curious to see where they came from. That's how I realized my name or this work was of interest to others elsewhere. I am sorry to see everything go. One does like a little validation for a life's work and efforts, if not as international best sellers, at least honorable mention on a Wiki page. Can you tell me how long these bans last? Am I going to be banned for life? What would you recommend? I feel this is such over-kill!  The only two pages(Roza Bal and Yuz Asaf) and the only two editors I ever tangled with in a negative way( DougWeller since 2005) and History2007)- both encountered similar problems with others on Wiki. I was not unique in pointing out problems with their points of view.  I am thrilled at the progress being made on the Roza Bal page...so many really valuable historical facts now appear there. That's all I ever hoped for. Thanks again for all your help. 66.177.27.120 (talk) 23:29, 26 February 2013 (UTC)Suzanne Olsson66.177.27.120 (talk) 23:29, 26 February 2013 (UTC)


 * Well, I'm glad you have no substantive objection to the article being created (almost the opposite, it seems).
 * On the ban - in an environment built on consensus, the community determined that on balance, your conflict of interest or your personal beliefs (the distinction is probably irrelevant) were impacting on your editing. In reality, editors with a conflict of interest are usually encouraged to limit their editing on those subjects to article talk pages, to avoid both the perception and actuality of conflicted editing. Given Roza Bal has been a key part of your academic work, limiting yourself to the talk page is probably a good idea regardless of enforced topic bans. There you can have broad discussions with other editors about content, discuss sources, history, academics, etc. Then neutral editors can add sourced content and no one will be accused of conflicted editing.
 * Indefinite does not mean infinite - you can ask to have a topic ban lifted (usually at WP:AN). But they will likely expect you to demonstrate that you understand why you were banned in the first place and (given your conflict) they would probably ask that you voluntarily limit yourself to talk pages (for articles where you might have a conflict) as other COI editors are expected/asked to do. Stalwart 111  00:13, 27 February 2013 (UTC)

ABOUT DESCENDANT CLAIMS
I feel it imperative that readers understand desposyni claims made at the time I entered Kashmir.It was a time when Taliban and fundamentalists were making a strong presence in Afghanistan, Pakistan, and Kashmir. Many valuable sites were being destroyed, including Bamyan Buddha and Kabul Museum, many Hindu and Buddhist temples and many Christian sites. All now gone. The former caretaker of Roza Bal tomb, Bashrat Shaheen, was trying to regain control of Roza Bal tomb. He and his family had been threatened. It was hoped by me stepping in as I did, I could draw attention away from him, bolster his claims from a western perspective, and hopefully draw world attention to the tomb in efforts to save it. Author Laurence Gardner, a friend, was aware of the goals and the need for this approach, and was extremely helpful to me at the time. He created the 'genealogy chart' that I showed to Kashmir Directors and authorities. I never truly believed that Magdalene and Jesus were married, nor was I a supporter of all his theories. However so many popular books claimed otherwise that it seemed more advantage to go along with that theory if it helped the situation at Roza Bal tomb. Indeed it did, for the tomb was sealed shut against the outside world, including Taliban fundamentalists. However, it did not happen soon enough to save the life of Bashrat Shaheen. who died at this time under strange circumstances ruled a "suicide" by authorities. I have lost two wonderful helpful people involved in this research at Roza Bal, Laurence Gardner and Bashrat Shaheen. Only they were privvy to this info at the time. This is the first time I have made this info public. As soon as I was out of Kashmir and free to publish my own research, I refuted these claims about desposyni through Magdalene and I have continued efforts for DNA studies to this day. I feel the Shaheen family certainly has the best claims for descendant from Yuz Asaf. I hope one day the DNA will prove their claims. Asd for me, I dont care either weay..I feel retrieving the DNA is the most important goal for history and for our future. I hope the facts I have presented here can be included in this article some day. I will not touch it for fear of being accused of COI. But as worded it is incomplete. I am deeply grateful to those strangers who have created this page. You have done an overall excellent job. Thank You. SuzanneOlsson (talk) 18:53, 5 May 2013 (UTC)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk) 18:53, 5 May 2013 (UTC)

WP:TPG
Per WP:TPG comments from other users should not be deleted, as you did here and here as well. History2007 (talk) 19:34, 5 May 2013 (UTC)


 * The originators of comments retain the right to make corrections, or edit for more accurate info as and when they realize them. You can always compare them. I may change my post 3-4 times to correct myself and clarify my thoughts.. SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)


 * No. You still need to read WP:TPG. You shloud not modify or delete comments from other users at all - unless fixing minor page formatting. Never delete other user comments. Never. History2007 (talk) 23:10, 5 May 2013 (UTC)
 * I did NOT delete other users messages! What are you looking at????    SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)


 * We must have different optometrists. I see here and here that you deleted two messages, one from me, another from Dr Ali. Or shall I go back to the optometrist tomorrow? History2007 (talk) 23:54, 5 May 2013 (UTC)


 * No. I did not make those edits. I cannot explain what happened or why you think I did, but I did not...no reason why I should have. Those posts were made by Dr. Ali.I have compared the two posts in each comments and dont even see any difference!SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)


 * Did you leave your computer on and walk away? A child around? Anyway, the deletions were made. No question there. But I will see my optometrist tomorrow anyway... History2007 (talk) 01:07, 6 May 2013 (UTC)

WP:ANI discussion
Please be aware of this discussion on WP:ANI given that it refers to your activities. History2007 (talk) 19:40, 6 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Up to your old stuff again History?  My. My.  You must be grinning from ear to ear after you submitted that rant. Do I really bother you THAT much? Isn't this a bit over the top and obsessive-compulsive for you? And why did you write at all, and with a slant to leave out information and mislead other Wiki editors?  SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)


 * Oh. I see. This is your "revenge" for some deletion you blamed on me..You went straight from that accusation to the suggestion to ban me (again) .why did you even bother coming back here- just long enough to start trouble again I see. No one else is/was having these problems except you. and I still have no idea what you are talking about. There is no reason why I would change or delete Dr. Ali or you. Ina all my years here, and all the accusations you have lodged against me, deletions and changes has never been among them. I believe we had these issues between us on previous occasions. Boy, you really dont like me!SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)


 * I will repeat this post here for benefit of anyone following these discussions: When I was in Kashmir seeking the DNA, it took many months of planning and meeting with many officials and University professors who would lead the scientific recovery of the DNA. The final permission had to come from Chief Minister Farooq Abdullah, who, at the time I believe, still controlled Roza bal through his WAQF (Trust). . It was nothing we approached lightly or carelessly. This was shortly after 9-11 in America and very very troubled times for the entire region. Great thought and careful planning went into every phase. It was only due to the indiscretion of one local chowkidar who thought he was left out of backsheesh that the negative versions started being fed to the newspapers by him and him alone. He can also be seen in various documentary films bashing me, bashing Ahmadaddis..and generally ranting for fundamentalism to prevail. That was the time the letter was written to try and regain the tomb from his influence...however he had a lot of local relatives, young males who would then back him up and threaten anyone who approached the tomb. This is the same man who was selling off tomb artifacts to Pakistani agents. Holger Kersten bought a piece of carved wood relic from this same man..who began regarding Roza Bal as his own personal ATM machine. .had there been no intervention, the entire tomb would be destroyed by now. There's a big difference in the way these events are portrayed  by History2007,  through ignorance, and what really happened.SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)

I might add that at this time, CM Farooq Abdullah lost control of Roza Bal tomb to another group- it is now run by a Board of Directors, who control a WAQF so large that it exceeds the annual income for all of Kashmir. Even this group has invited me back to continue the DNA Project. For health reasons and for financial reasons, I am unable to return at this time. SuzanneOlsson (talk)Suzanne OlssonSuzanneOlsson (talk)