User talk:Tattoocowgirl

Neal Jones
Hi,

To avoid having your first and only article, Neal Jones, deleted, you might like to give some attention addressing notability criteria, citation / references and wikification. I will try to help where I can but the article needs serious work to conform to a number of guidelines. Start and the Community portal and try to build on your understanding of the mark-up language used to contribute to Wikipedia. It's very different to HTML which, based on your edits, you seem to know. Cheers, Stalwart111 (talk) 03:41, 14 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Hi,
 * I do not know anything at all about submitting for Wikipedia. I am not even sure if this is the proper place to respond to your messages. I saw both this one, and your other one. As for your concerns in regards to Neal's "notability", there is a very big difference between an "extra" and a "guest star" or "co star". Several of the roles mentioned in the profile, were extended roles, over the course of a season or the lifespan of a series, which results in a fan base. The fact that there is a fan base, especially for shows like Generation Kill and Rescue Me, is the reason for the entry - because they ask for it. Not to mention that Dirty Dancing in itself is one of the biggest movies of all time, and he had a supporting role in the film. None of the items on IMDB would qualify as an "extra". All of them are through the Screen Actors Guild or AFTRA, and all the theatre through Equity. If you are a fan of professional theatre, then the specific shows mentioned to you would make sense, as world premiers and Tony winning shows are a big deal, not to mention performing on Broadway in general as opposed to amateur or community theatre. Neal also coaches some of the biggest names in film and TV including, Chris Noth and Al Pacino. As a result of both his acting resume and his coaching clientele, people have asked for a wikipedia entry to be in place. Not one of the mentioned IMDB entries would qualify by any union or pay standard as "extra" work.


 * If you would like to advise on how the entry can be revised to be suitable for publication, I would greatly appreciate it. I am on the verge of having a baby anytime now, so I am not checking this as often as I would usually, but I will follow through with it if you can politely suggest how to fix it.


 * Thank you. tattoocowgirl


 * The proper place is on the article talk page. User:Are You The Cow Of Pain? has provided an excellent response: Talk:Neal Jones.


 * Stalwart111 (talk) 06:40, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

Under wikipedias guidelines and by any reasonable definition and understanding of the guidelines, Neal Jones is notable. He does adhere to the entertainer guidelines, it asks for multiple contributions, and does not specify a number of such. Under notability, IMDB is often the ONLY confirmation of work for dozens of actors, many of whom you have wiki entries for, with far less to show for themselves. The stage work alone, being on Broadway, in major companies (GLSF) both as a performer and director, far exceeds the entertainer guidelines, as well as his role in Dirty Dancing and definitely the two you mentioned, Generation Kill and Rescue Me. If Wiki has a specific number in mind, it should rephrase "multiple" to something more specific. Again, the notability definition is vague as well. Most entertainers use IMDB and personal websites that are managed by professionals as the go to referral sites for validity. By what standard are you defining"billing" because unless you are the regular lead in a show, Co Star or Guest Star are the respectable and notable places to be as the plot now centers around you - as is the case in most of the shows. See the Criminal Minds episodes "The Fox" and "Outfoxed" or Sex and The City.... the plot would not exist without the characters that Neal played in those episodes. It almost seems as if you are asking for proof via magazine articles, etc. Would you prefer that I scan in photos from a People magazine shoot 25 years ago about D. Dancing or a New York Times review from a Broadway show that ran in the 80's? The absence of tabloid attention does not negate the importance of the work or the fan base that has been generated as a result of the work. Let's be reasonable and if there are specific missing pieces, name them. If not, and the definition remains the same, then it looks like someone needs to go through and do a sweep of Wikipedia because there are a lot, A LOT of "entertainers" on here with far less to show - and I know them personally - so this is not petty. Talk about "prolific extras" - unless Wiki wants to start a category for just that, you may want to consider consistency in the standards in which the articles are edited and deletion considered. If the only thing Neal did was the supporting role on Dirty Dancing, it would still be "notable" because of the movies notoriety. That movie, and his character, do qualify as "cult following" as does "G. Kill" and you could even say his character on "Rescue me". He most definitely meets both the entertainer and notability guidelines if anyone at all that knows entertainment, is reviewing resume. Thanks.

Deleting content
The discussion at Talk:Neal Jones forms part of the history of the article, Neal Jones. Please do not blank content from the talk page. Thanks, Stalwart111 (talk) 02:37, 5 October 2010 (UTC).

Conflict of interest
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