User talk:Thargor Orlando/ArchiveFebruary2015

Please comment on Talk:The Weeknd
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Please comment on Talk:Ag-gag
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Please comment on Talk:Michael Grimm (politician)
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Please comment on Talk:The Dark Side of the Moon
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Please comment on Talk:Human rights in Northern Cyprus
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Moving my hat
If you're going to move a hat to cover another comment please re-sign it yourself. I have no issue with Mark's comment and he mistakenly (and reasonably) thought that my comment was directed at him. — Strongjam (talk) 19:55, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Probably shouldn't have hatted it at all, but it looks resolved now. Thargor Orlando (talk) 20:10, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Here was me going to start a new section for this, but seeing as we already have a section... Thagor, if somebody else hats something (as Dreadstar did) they're probably fairly sure of what they wanted to hat. If you disagree, at least re-sign it yourself- it can seem unethical to expand the purview of a hat without claiming responsibility. PeterTheFourth (talk) 23:49, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
 * It seems like I was acting under what the hat was intended to do. I left a note at his page to tell him I did it, and said no problem if he disagreed.  How about, instead of coming here and preaching to me, going to the talk page of the person fanning the flames and getting them to stop disrupting what has otherwise been a civil talk page in his absence? Thargor Orlando (talk) 23:51, 13 February 2015 (UTC)
 * The issue is not what you were inflamed by, but that you were inflamed by it. In the future, take more time thinking about your comments and how they contribute to the encyclopedia before making them. Cheers! PeterTheFourth (talk) 00:14, 14 February 2015 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Army Ranger Wing
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Peterson Institute
Thanks. I've been waiting for page protection with the hopes that it will "educate" the IPs. But the backlog is considerable. I think PP is a better course of action (at present) than bringing their edits to the ANI or Edit War boards. – S. Rich (talk) 17:57, 14 February 2015 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Israel
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Please comment on File talk:World marriage-equality laws.svg
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1RR violation?
Hi, Thargor, sorry if you'd rather I not ask this here. Feel free to revert if so. Does this edit removing your coverage of PAX's response not put this user over 1RR, given that they also reverted here about 7 hours ago? It seems so to me, but I thought you'd know better. -Starke Hathaway (talk) 21:24, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
 * No need to remove, it's a good question. I looked, and removing my edit definitely doesn't revert it to a previous form in my mind, as he left the rest of the direct quote in place.  Definitely doesn't violate the letter, but certainly the spirit.  I won't be pursuing it, and he'll likely dig his own grave, but if you think you have a case, I could be wrong. Thargor Orlando (talk) 21:41, 20 February 2015 (UTC)

GamerGate sources
God Day Thargor.

I saw you were called for sources in the discussion of getting gamergate to a more objective standpoint, as such there's been a few people gathering information and sources of Gamergate movement(Or controversy). We've compiled quite a list of Gamergate based on the WP:RS, however Masem's quote in the lower reply to the post does make a valid point, if followed. This link has quite a few sources from various months back may be of use, I contacted Sordel as well about this, since I am unable to post anywhere on the talk on the Gamergate article. There's also a few links to Masem's talk of various ideas and such below that reply.

I wish you the best, it's still a mess, and this is just a question if it may help out with getting the article objective. If it's deemed unreliable sources, then please do no make use of them. I would not want you to get a sanction due to this. If it does get troublesome you can lay the blame on me. Don't take a chance on that, please. TheRealVordox (talk) 19:18, 21 February 2015 (UTC)
 * I've been around long enough to know how to navigate this. You have reminded me that looking more at The Escapist might be worthwhile, but games journalism in general is such a crapshoot.  Thanks, though. Thargor Orlando (talk) 19:40, 21 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Masem's quote about the sources is the worst part that hinders the other side's voice. The only shot we have about it being a harass campaign is that a very highly reliable source would look at the data from the 3 links in Masem's talk(Like in the reply I gave in the thread) in a proper article with due weight. However the chance of that being is slim and hopeful. I appreciate your effort though, but please don't take any risks. And thank you.


 * Ps: It's interesting that the specialist in the area of what GamerGate is (The gaming scene and their industry) is overshadowed by other bigger media that has little insight on the gaming scene at all, and how that is more weight than those who know the best. Such a weird way of going through this. Shouldn't the specialist of the gaming scene have more weight in due to their connection? TheRealVordox (talk) 20:30, 21 February 2015 (UTC)

Just for those of us who aren’t part of the secret society, what was "Masem’s Talk"? MarkBernstein (talk) 20:43, 21 February 2015 (UTC)
 * It's under the link I provided with my name as reply where there's 2 links towards Masem's talk. The First link is where Masem puts a good point that the overarching media should be seen as less biased and to be more used for creating the article, which I can agree with and have no issue with. However the question I thought at that time would be that the people that are in the industry should have more weight on their words since they are in the circles of what GamerGate is. The other point that was in Masem's talk was 2 people who had found statistics about the harassment claim however due to their origin they could be unreliable sources even if made by experts or amateurs. However Masem has not replied to it, due to unknown reason or simply because they are questionable origins for not being used as reliable sources. I cannot answer about those.


 * Are you able to search through the link I provided? TheRealVordox (talk) 21:26, 21 February 2015 (UTC)
 * There's a secret society? How do I sign up?  Do I have to leave a note in a wall or something? Thargor Orlando (talk) 13:44, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Sarcasm could be good for talk pages, but even if it's a good chuckle ;) have some class, the links is there in the link. TheRealVordox (talk) 18:44, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
 * It's under the link I provided with my name as reply where there's 2 links towards Masem's talk.
 * The only link I see is to KiA and it doesn't appear from your contributions that you've posted on User talk:Masem. I'm really interested in seeing what Masem has to say on this subject, TheRealVordox, so could you share these links again. Thanks. Liz  Read! Talk! 23:55, 22 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Ah,Liz it was not my contributions but I was refering to my reply in the thread of KiA, with this same name I have here. The 2 links in that reply was asked and given by Camarouge, Bramble window and Ihadurca Il Imella in reply to said link.TheRealVordox (talk) 09:52, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks, TheRealVordox. Much appreciated. Liz  Read! Talk! 15:54, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Doubtful, RS as considered by wikipedia are unlikely to suddenly decide to do extra research into a years old hashtag. Take for example the Mass Effect 3 game release. When suddenly after release I large amount of articles concerning "Mass homophobia" came out.

Most of us "in the know" were perplexed by these articles, we spent days talking with the writer in comments sections, trying to explain that the RS was not what was actually happening, but likely a "controversy" for marketing, and to deflect major differences in the game from what were told by the lead producer, and what we actually received. (choices throughout 3 games will matter, will not have three simple endings)

In short, the RS will not go back or make changes on their reporting, while the "not reliable" sources are more likely to. Therefore, the popular opinion and the majority consensus will be that GamerGate are Misogynist Terrorist group.

Wiki-Dripping (talk) 13:55, 26 February 2015 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Columbia Township, Lorain County, Ohio
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Gamergate Article
Thargor, I just wanted to let you know that I am going to drop out of the Gamergate controversy debate, and to record a few observations.

The issue of sources is an interesting one because, of course, there are no good sources on the controversy. Top tier media doesn't follow video games, so the only thing that it has been interested in is Gamergate as an offshoot of the general meltdown in behaviour on social media, which is presumed to be of interest to general readers with Twitter or Facebook accounts. We're at least three years off (more like five) on Ph.D.s on the subject of Gamergate and when they are written it will almost certainly by Gender Studies students. The only available sources are thus from people who are on one side of the debate or the other: articulate, media-savvy gender theorists piled up on one side and, let's face it, a largely non-academic audience on the other side who are mainly represented in tweets or on message boards. When moderate commentators tend to be Youtubers (not the most illustrious reference perhaps, despite their value) it seems impossible to move the article from its current ideological entrenchment. When you consider that many people who comment on Gamergate actually depend on Wikipedia for their "research" this page reveals a more general flaw in Wikipedia as it now stands.

Anyone with an academic background will know that the ground that the article is based on wouldn't even pass for a secondary source for research purposes, let alone a primary authority.

The perception that Gamergate is anti-Feminist is a dangerous one because, of course, Gamergate is just a hashtag that anyone can append to a tweet: moreover, they are likely to, in order to get their comments picked up somewhere else. Attempting to characterise a large number of discrete tweets without a proper statistical analysis is painting with the broadest possible brush, and when people reach for the "misogynist" or "anti-feminist" paint, that's pretty much a clear indication of a non-neutral standpoint. (How many even of the nastiest comments in this furore were genuinely symptomatic of hating women or believing that they don't deserve an equal position in society? It's all too much "give a dog a bad name and hang him" for my taste.)

Still, I don't have a dog in the fight and I've already been implicitly accused of Gamergate sympathies for daring to suggest replacing misogynist attacks with a less loaded description. For the foreseeable future I believe that the page is best characterised by the old dictum that "history is written by the victors". Best wishes, Sordel (talk) 10:16, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * I'll never fault anyone for wanting to disengage from this one. Best of luck to you. Thargor Orlando (talk) 13:57, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Though we often find ourselves on opposing sides of an argument, Thargor, I think this article suffers a bit from WP:RECENTISM and in a year or two, it will be in much better shape. A little hindsight is needed to put the whole sequence of events into perspective which we don't have right now. Liz  Read! Talk! 16:00, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Agree with what User:Liz said. I also wrote a piece to you User:Sordel in your own talk about what you wrote to me.(Why do I have trouble with user links, bah!) TheRealVordox (talk) 16:36, 23 February 2015 (UTC)
 * I hope so, but considering how negatively it's actually impacting the culture at large, I'm not sure it can wait. Hopefully I'm wrong, or hopefully it gets solved. Thargor Orlando (talk) 18:35, 23 February 2015 (UTC)

AE enforcement or discretionary sanctions requested Feb 2015
A statement you made was brought up in discussion here. --DHeyward (talk) 08:13, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Rosamund Pike
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RE: Wisconsin Senate recall elections, 2011 article
Sorry about that. My watchlist was triggered but I should have checked the talk page as well. Yours, Quis separabit?  22:30, 25 February 2015 (UTC)
 * Not a problem! Thanks for the note. Thargor Orlando (talk) 22:36, 25 February 2015 (UTC)

Please comment on Talk:Somalis in the United Kingdom
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