User talk:The Navigators

Your submission at Articles for creation: Safety sign (March 15)
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The One and Only  Boothsift  03:48, 15 March 2019 (UTC)

July 2019
Welcome to Wikipedia. I noticed that your username, "The Navigators", may not meet Wikipedia's username policy because it implies use by more than one person. If you believe that your username does not violate our policy, please leave a note here explaining why. As an alternative, you may ask for a change of username by completing the form at Special:GlobalRenameRequest, or you may simply create a new account for editing. Thank you. — Jeff G. ツ 12:27, 26 July 2019 (UTC)
 * Okay, well I'm one person and I've had this name for just shy of 10 years.--The Navigators (talk) 18:51, 26 July 2019 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Safety sign has been accepted
 Safety sign, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created. The article has been assessed as C-Class, which is recorded on the article's talk page. You may like to take a look at the grading scheme to see how you can improve the article. You are more than welcome to continue making quality contributions to Wikipedia. If your account is more than four days old and you have made at least 10 edits you can create articles yourself without posting a request. However, you may continue submitting work to Articles for Creation if you prefer. Thank you for helping improve Wikipedia! AngusWOOF ( bark  •  sniff ) 17:28, 30 July 2019 (UTC)
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Directive 92/58/EEC
Hello The Navigators, I am currently writing a draft on the European Directive 92/58/EEC. I'm not a native speaker and I don't trust my English that much. So I wanted to ask you if you could help me with this as you are one of the most active people in this project regarding (safety) signage.

Thank you, RandomDuck5000 (talk) 21:27, 23 August 2023 (UTC)


 * @RandomDuck5000 - Sure, happy to help. The Navigators (talk) 02:17, 24 August 2023 (UTC)
 * @The Navigators, I hope I don't annoy you, but I started to other drafts: Draft:Health and Safety (Safety Signs and Signals) Regulations and Draft:Directive 77/576/EEC. If you want, I would really appreciate your help and knowledge there! Thank you, RandomDuck5000 (talk) 15:18, 2 September 2023 (UTC)
 * @The Navigators - The article is published. Thank you for your great work! RandomDuck5000 (talk) 21:30, 17 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Glad to see that... *Looks at my draft, still waiting for review* Hey, what gives reviewers? (Joke)
 * (I got sorta side tracked the last two weeks when I finally decided to start a video game I've had for like six months. It just absorbed all my time. Had like 30 hours in about 7 days.) -- The Navigators (talk) 00:37, 18 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Let me know how I can help, when you are ready. (I think accidentally found your draft on the German project, since it was a draft that was in English about 92/58/EEC.) The Navigators (talk) 03:38, 25 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I started a draft, which can be found here: Draft:Directive 92/58/EEC. I'd be really glad if you could help me with the introductory text and the application of the directive. Thanks, RandomDuck5000 (talk) 13:34, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
 * @RandomDuck5000 So, I did some expanding to bring in more information from the annexes, and started locating the laws in member countries for adopting 92/58.
 * Would you add the German law or regulation for adopting 92/58 in Germany? I was having trouble finding the German law about it. (Feel free to add any others if you know them, I just went after ones I knew or could easily find.) If you have trouble with the citation, leave a link and I can sort it out. I wish there was just a list on EUR-Lex of all the member state laws for a Directive. The Navigators (talk) 05:52, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * @The Navigators Thanks alot! I found something like what you meant, its called national transposition in the EUR-lex database. I found something for Germany, indeed its a bit complicated there, because there is no specific law for safety signs, but one for workplaces in general, which is specified by non-binding rules, like for safety signs. These require since 2013 the ISO signs, not the EU signs. RandomDuck5000 (talk) 10:05, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * By the way, I really appreciate your work! RandomDuck5000 (talk) 15:28, 1 September 2023 (UTC)

Health and Safety (Safety Signs and Signals) Regulations
Hey @The Navigators, I need your help again: Could you please have a look at Draft:Health and Safety (Safety Signs and Signals) Regulations? I am not shure if I forgot something, and I don't think the grammar is the best. Thank you very much, RandomDuck5000 (talk) 18:14, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * , Yeah, I read the comment the reviewer left. The English project really wants 'secondary sources', instead of 'primary sources'. (Here's the German Wikipedia's article on the concept: Primärliteratur and Sekundärliteratur, that might make more sense than the English articles I linked. The German Wikipedia policy is similar, so you can also read that if it's easier to understand: Wikipedia:Keine_Theoriefindung)
 * I really get annoyed with that comment/policy on topics like this, because I swear some people forget that not every topic has a billion secondary sources, some topics just don't have that many. It's a law regulating safety signs in the United Kingdom since 1996. I don't really know what commentary people think is out there.
 * In theory more secondary sources should fix the issue, however I going to guess those have not really shown up. I guess we'll have to see if those couple books you found are enough secondary sources to satisfy them. (You also might get lucky and draw another reviewer, who interprets that rule more reasonably and approves it.)--The Navigators (talk) 19:49, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it's complicated for topics like this. The german project seems a bit more relaxed about that, but sometimes it is just difficult to find good sources in english, since I am not in an english speaking country... Well, I hope this amount of sources is considered reasonable for review, but let's see... RandomDuck5000 (talk) 19:58, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Also, because of that issue, I deleted the draft of Directive 77/576/EEC, because there aren't that much accessible sources out there, even if I am pretty sure this Directive deserves coverage too... RandomDuck5000 (talk) 20:00, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Yeah, these topics are really tough to cover sometimes, likely part of the reason why we went about 12 years without a proper safety sign article on English Wikipedia.
 * Some good news, I located a webpage on the EU's website that lists all the national laws adopting Council Directive 92/58/EEC. I started working through that to fill in blanks. Anyway, have a good rest of the weekend. The Navigators (talk) 22:46, 29 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks, you too! RandomDuck5000 (talk) 10:56, 1 November 2023 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Specifications for Accident Prevention Signs has been accepted
 Specifications for Accident Prevention Signs, which you submitted to Articles for creation, has been created.

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CS1 error on KarTrak
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Hello, The Navigators. Thank you for your work on ANSI Z35. SunDawn, while examining this page as a part of our page curation process, had the following comments:

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&maltese; SunDawn &maltese;   (contact)   06:08, 9 January 2024 (UTC)

January 2024
Welcome to Wikipedia. I noticed that your username, "The Navigators", may not meet Wikipedia's username policy because it is plural, appearing to be used by more than one person. If you believe that your username does not violate our policy, please leave a note here explaining why. As an alternative, you may ask for a change of username by completing the form at Special:GlobalRenameRequest, or you may simply create a new account for editing. Thank you. — Jeff G. ツ 12:19, 29 January 2024 (UTC)
 * Okay, well I'm one person and I've had this name for little over 14 years now.--The Navigators (talk) 12:58, 29 January 2024 (UTC)

Mr. Ouch pictogram report
Hi there! Was just reading through Mr. Ouch and, as a pictogram nerd, found the section you added about its design process to be really interesting. Dug around a bit on search and the NEMA site trying to find a copy of the main source for it—"Final Evaluation of Four Revised Safety Pictograms for Pad-Mount Cabinets"—but came up empty-handed. Any chance you happen to recall where you found it? No worries if not. Thanks so much :) 2600:1700:87D3:3460:40E4:FC60:2EDE:9BDA (talk) 05:48, 21 March 2024 (UTC)


 * Hello, sorry about the short delay. I was provided with the document by a individual via email, and to my knowledge it isn't floating around online. I reached out to the person who provided it to me, and they said it would be fine to send a copy your way. Easiest way would be for you to create an account on Wikipedia.
 * If you have a user account, there will be an option to send an email to me. I can then send you the report in reply. The Navigators (talk) 01:57, 24 March 2024 (UTC)

Hazard symbol
Your addition to hazard symbol is definitely worth doing but only if it is done right. It makes no sense to give the 1967 and 1975 EU laws (which have been repealed), but not the current status (2008!) - see page 325 of https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/PDF/?uri=CELEX:32008R1272. I can see that maybe there is a place somewhere for historic symbols but not in the main table.

A revert may have seemed heavy handed but I felt that showing invalid information would not be an improvement (and I suspect that it is fairly easy for you to correct and resubmit, since most of the pictograms have not changed since the 1975 law). 𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 21:15, 8 June 2024 (UTC)
 * FYI: The document is in mono but §1.2.1.1. says Hazard pictograms as laid down in Annex V shall have a black symbol on a white background with a red frame sufficiently wide to be clearly visible. Hope that helps. --𝕁𝕄𝔽 (talk) 21:20, 8 June 2024 (UTC)
 * Those would be the GHS symbols in column one, they're the same symbols. The EU adopted GHS symbols with CLP regulations in 2008, and phased them in through 2017.
 * I reverted it back to my version, but added some more text to the sections below to point out the phase-outs of the old EU and Canadian symbols.--The Navigators (talk) 23:27, 8 June 2024 (UTC)