User talk:Unbroken Chain/Archive 3

Notability (music)
Hi Jake, could I ask your experience on this article that I prodded this morning Robin_Taylor-Firth this User_talk:83.33.55.176 IP is involved and has removed it and added some links that look a bit like they are related, to me it all looks like coi with the subject, I don't mind that much, I am only questioning notability, whats your opinion? Off2riorob (talk) 13:35, 6 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Well after a brief google search I did find her featured on a BBC site. I think that she is at least nominally notable as far as music goes. Nothing to write home to mom about but if covered by BBC that would be my first inclination. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 13:47, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks, i'll leave them with it for a while to see what they make of it, I see that link now..regards. Off2riorob (talk) 13:54, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Wikipedia This entry is from Wikipedia, the user-contributed encyclopedia. It may not have been reviewed by professional editors and is licensed under the GNU Free Documentation License. If you find the biography content factually incorrect, defamatory or highly offensive you can edit this article at Wikipedia. Find out more about our use of this data. This is there on the links? Looks like a bit of back feed, or at least wikipedia could be the source..Anyway i'll leave it and see how it grows, Off2riorob (talk) 13:58, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Yea, if you look at the entries on bbc at that link they are all from wikipedia? Reverse backfeed! Off2riorob (talk) 14:01, 6 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Oh jeez, with that info, I csd tagged it. Hopefully the admin will see and understand why it was tagged. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:09, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Reverse backfeed is something that seems to be quite common and I have done it b4, that bbc link could not be used to infer notability Anyway lets not be too drastic, there does seem to be little tiny spots of notability, only speedy tag it if you are sure as it is not harmful, ??? Off2riorob (talk) 14:20, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

And yet another editor chimes in... I ran across the Robin Taylor-Firth article checking  on articles needing wikification. I've contested the speedy deletion as the article sates that the person co-wrote a charting single which is a credible assertion of notability, and so it doesn't meet the conditions for a speedy deletion. I quick check shows this MTV article which would seem to partially support the assertion. Regards. -- Whpq (talk) 14:28, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * edit conflict, Its been removed, apparently he/she has co written a chart song and that is enough to assume notability..no wonder wiki is stuffed with pages no one ever reads, sorry to get you involved...lets see how it develops. Off2riorob (talk) 14:30, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * That is enough to establish that the article is not qualified for speedy deletion which has very narrow criteria. That is not a statement that the subject is notable, although in this case, that does seem likely. -- Whpq (talk) 14:46, 6 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Right, thanks for the explanation. Off2riorob (talk) 14:50, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Articles for deletion nomination of Extraordinary Assumptions and Hypothetical Conditions
This article was up literally a grand total of maybe ten seconds when you decided it needed deleted. As you can read on my talk page, I really don't see the point in trying to do this if I am going to get every little thing challenged in this manner instantaneously. Milowent left enough of a kind word for me in the last exchange to get me to try this one more time, but I don't need this.

The article needs some work on references, I admit. Those references are The Appraisal of Real Estate from the appraisal Institute, the Uniform Standards of Professional Appraisal Practice from the Appraisal Foundation, The Dictionary of Real Estate Appraisal from the Appraisal Institute, Scope of Work by Stephanie Coleman (an authority on the subject). I understand that there are similar definitions used in other professions involving the attest function, such as public accounting, auditing, medicine, etc. where there could be other references, and there are other references regarding the use of assumptions in reasoning in the philosphy field.

I assume that is what your problem is because I can't make heads or tails of your comment on the deletion page 'appears to be O.r. and it seems to be confirmed by talk opage comments'. I have no idea what 'O.i.' is or what I might have said on the talk page that reinforced that opinion.

I am new to this and I am interested in creating new content. I am not interested in even a minor flame war with the old hands with every edit. I would be interested in what you really meant, but this article and the two that preceeded it took probably an hour and a half to create. It needs another hour to look up the references and may require more to clean it up with a fresh rewrite after researching other professions. I am simply not going to bother if it is just going to be deleted. Ya all can go ahead and delete it or edit it or whatever. I've done all I'm going to until I get a better explaination of what I'm doing wrong here. --KTrimble (talk) 04:59, 8 October 2009 (UTC)


 * This is a response to your response that you put on my talk page. I don't really know how this was supposed to work, so I put it both places.  --KTrimble (talk) 05:38, 8 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I would have assumed that if you old hands had any interest in making an 'assumption of good faith' that you would have put your concerns on either the author's talk page or the article's talk page before instantly deleting.


 * I'ts after midnight and I have other things I need to do. If you are interested in screwing with this, go ahead.  I think a PDF of USPAP is on the Appraisal Foundation's website.  I have fifteen years of hard copies.  All of the Appraisal Institute books are available only in hard copy.  International Valuation Standards may also talk about this, but I haven't looked.  There are other texts by ASA, NAIFA, IAAO, the Farm Managers, and others that also talk about this subject.  There are also course materials out there about this concept.  I am pretty sure there are other professions that use the same or similar concepts and there are logic and philosphy articles around WP citing references on the subject as well.


 * WP's entries on Appraisal, Real Estate Appraisal, and related concepts are not quite right and some are pretty pathetic. Many look like 'stubs' that have been stubs for a couple of years.  I had originally planned probably a year and a half ago to try to author perhaps a hundred different interrelated articles on the subject that I could then refer people to when they had questions for me on the subject.  I started a list back then in my Sandbox.  I got discouraged back then and am just now getting back to it. But I got sidetracked on this deletion thing on the first article.  It really doesn't seem to be worth it.


 * BTW, I did not delete the articles that I created on Extraordinary Assumptions and on Hypothetical Conditions. I was planning to blank both of those and have them redirect to the combined article when I got time to figure out how.  If you want to delete something, blast away!

--KTrimble (talk) 05:38, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

Pay attention
Reality check #1: "criticism" =/= personal attack, and "opinion on User Talk page" =/= "disruption". If you can't tell the difference -- and especially if you don't understand the context -- don't be issuing threats.

Reality check #2: admins are not immune from criticism for their actions -- especially when the actions are obviously suspect. Criticism is not a blockable offence.

Reality check #3: Before you press the macro key to generate the "Assume Good Faith" text, note that it says to assume good faith in the absence of evidence to the contrary. I've got enough evidence to satisfy me to the contrary: maybe you ought to, I dunno, assume good faith that I know what I'm talking about?

Reality check #4: In the edit window for his User Talk page appears the following:


 * Just a heads-up to all: I don't mind you being blunt with me, if your emotions limit your ability to find more civil wording than would normally be expected, I'll not be offended. A word of caution however: My talk page is open to all, and I'll have 0-tolerance for any incivility directed toward any of my fellow wikipedians. Feel free to chastise me, but any incivility directed toward any other editor will be met with harsh reaction. Cheers: Ched

So you feel comfortable going explicitly against his wishes? --Calton | Talk 15:12, 9 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Well, in this case Yes. If you go to the Ani link I wasn't asking for a block just an uninvolved admin to come in and comment on the situation. I apoligze if the template was incorrect or if I misunderstood the situation. I do however believe that those types of commincations are to be allowed between users you should at least email those concerns rather then having it appear on the talk page as this sets a poor example for our newer editors who invariably always end up on an admin page for help or whatever. Those were my main concerns. Hope that clears things up. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:17, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Reverting talkpages
Reverting talkpages is for emergencies, I don't think that was one, I suggest replacing Durova's comment. Off2riorob (talk) 15:22, 9 October 2009 (UTC)


 * A little lost.....Can you point me to what I need to fix? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:24, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I think I got it wrong, I thought you struck a comment from Durova, but I am wrong, I think, sorry if I was mistaken. Off2riorob (talk) 15:26, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * If you find it let me know. I'll fix it as soon as I recieve the message. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:27, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * this edit? Off2riorob (talk) 15:32, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * That was a total error. I was striking my section P.a. and changing to incivility. I in no way even read Durovas comment. We did have an EC but then i tried to do it again. Was the comment reposted or should I readd it? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:59, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Its cool, Durova. has spotted your accidental edit and replaced her content. Off2riorob (talk)
 * Perhaps an explanation for her on her talkpage. Off2riorob (talk) 16:03, 9 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Done. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:15, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * All good, I was just watching out, take it easy on the ANI board, regards. Off2riorob (talk) 16:25, 9 October 2009 (UTC)
 * It's no problem, really. The system induces that kind of thing occasionally.  Seems to be a minor glitch that manifests occasionally during high traffic.  Not the editor's fault at all.  Durova 322 16:39, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Hello
Hi HaiB, I just wanted to thank you for your concern, and express my appreciation for your proactive approach in recent matters. At this time I am not actively seeking any escalation to what I consider to be a difficult editor. If blowing off a little steam on my talk page is what it takes to reduce overall drama on the site, and get back to building and protecting this project - I am more than willing to shoulder these types of things. While administrators are editors equal in stature to those who are not wielding the couple extra buttons, we are expected to conduct ourselves with a higher degree of integrity, and often come under fire for the actions that we must undertake. I realized that when I accepted my RFA nom., and am willing to suffer the occasional insults and attacks that our less congenial editors wish to throw. Thank you again for your concern, your kindness, and your integrity; it is much appreciated. ;) — Ched : ?  18:25, 9 October 2009 (UTC)


 * I find that your view in this matter is good intentioned and applaud you in the fact you can maintain it.Hell In A Bucket (talk) 21:54, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

Welcome template
Hey thanks! Go ahead and use it, I don't mind at all. will lay it down, or if you want you can copy and modify it however you please. :) JoeSmack Talk 04:03, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Don't apologize
You do mega good work here. A few false positives are not the end the world. Keep up your hard work, we really do appreciate it. -- Samir 04:22, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Boba Phat
Hi HIAB,

Not a shouter, but I WILL talk - and I'm a Dead fan too, so I like to keep the peace. However your reference to Boba Phat article meeting wp:snow is unsubstantiated. I know you mention you lean towards deletion, but understand that everybody started out somewhere small before making it big. Boba Phat is EXTREMELY well-recognized among the growing niche of cosplay & comic fans out there. Since 1997, he cannot walk into a convention, Star Wars related event or any other similar function without a slew of people running up for pictures & even requesting his autograph, including high-profile celebrities. I certainly see where this is open for debate among those unfamiliar with the genre, however to jump right into wp:snow as if there is NOTHING here to debate is simply uncalled-for. Please look at the facts before you make such an extreme judgment. There are many topics you know nothing about, and simply because this is one of them does not mean it should be snowballed into deletion. Obviously there is a clear case for debate otherwise there wouldn't be one.

Thanks, Shannon —Preceding unsigned comment added by SheighZam (talk • contribs) 06:16, 14 October 2009 (UTC) SheighZam (talk) 12:21, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Go back at the time I reccomeneded the snow close.There was one keep vote and the rest delete. It would appear that there have been a few people that have backtracked that. YOu really should take a look it might help understand why I was sasking for the snow close when I did. I did give your article another once over and see you've added some refs. Keep in mind that you need to Assume Good faith which you did not do when I suggested a snow close or immediately questioned others motives because they posted something on my talk page. Look long and far I believe that was the first time Samir has interacted with me. I will be leaving a templated warning for these 2 infractions but it is more to help fimiliarize yourself with our policies. On a side note badgering people while they vote on afd doesn't help your case either, let it flow and as you make improvements your article will speak for itself. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:01, 14 October 2009 (UTC)


 * As to your comment if a subject claims notability there is no choice but to either prod it (which gets removed often) of Nom for AFD, snow closes are common practice. Sorry you seem to disagree here. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:13, 14 October 2009 (UTC)


 * My intention was not to badger or insult, but you can imagine my frustration at KNOWING first hand of Boba Phat's notoriety & yet having to defend this article. I did not know of the timeline when you decided on the snowball issue, and have become more familiar as I learn. Obviously Wikipedia is not like taking a simple English class. More like building a tort thesis in law school. Regardless, understand where I was coming from - i did not intend to insult, but when I clicked back to the page & saw strike outs through my comments, I was displeased. I saw the association you had with Samir and attributed accordingly - just as much of Wikipedia is built on assumption. So first off, my apologies on coming across as ignorant, and secondly as far as Assuming Good Faith, to me it appeared as you did not look over the references by Assuming Good Faith on your end, hence my hasty reaction. I don't believe I badgered anyone either. Also, please clarify what you mean by "I will be leaving a templated warning for these 2 infractions" Obviously as a newbie, I can't possible learn every single thing there is at one time. I learn as I go, & find that issuing infractions is not very welcoming. I simply am frustrated at having to prove the notoriety of someone who has been referenced on (and this is what I also shared with another editor):


 * Sign On San Diego, LA Weekly, LB Post, Seattle PI, Fox 5, Star Wars Blog, Crashing the Con documentary, The Daily Titan, Metromix, Vuze, Pixelgeek, Comic Book Movie, 562 City Life, The Craig Ferguson Show, CBS4, MTV, Gawker, etc.; these are all references with direct mentions &/or photos of to Boba Phat/Pimp Boba. While there are a whole slew of FLICKR, YouTube, Facebook, Twitter & MySpace sources which are questionable, a great number of them are attributed to celebrities and are are valid - for instance The Go-Go's Jane Wiedlin posting how excited SHE was to get a picture with the "famous Boba Phat" & even posting that statement as well as her photos of & with him on her Twitpic site; J. Scott Campbell (extremely famous Marvel artist) expressing on his Facebook site how Boba Phat is by far his favorite cosplayer (of which I can provide screen shot if need be); even Seth Green's literally LEAPING over his signing table (no joke) at last year's San Diego Comic Con for the chance to take a pic with Boba Phat as he passed by. Now the last incident is not documented in media (although I do have a photo from online that was taken of that incident) but its validity was witnessed by hundreds; as well as photos taken of Boba Phat with the 2 co-producers & #1 winners of the George Lucas Audience Choice Fan Film award "Saber!" from the 2009 San Diego Comic Con, who REQUESTED to be photographed with HIM. Additionally Anthony Michael Hall stopped mid-conversation to insist on taking a photo of Boba Phat at the Long Beach Convention on October 2nd, 2009, as Boba Phat passed by his booth (I have a photo of that as well, however Anthony Michael Hall is in possession of the one he personally took).


 * I will continue to upload any and all pertinent info as it is released, such as info on the upcoming films Boba has a part in (Lucasfilm fan film, Casy Pugh's "Star Wars: Uncut", etc.) and articles as they come out next month such as the Star Wars Insider one. Hopefully this will satisfy the argument at hand. In the meantime, thanks again for all your help, and I am happy you have the patience to educate me on proper Wikipedia etiquette, yet I firmly believe this is NOT a case for deletion. SheighZam (talk) 14:23, 14 October 2009 (UTC)


 * By way of encouragement, we do like new contributers and the policies are very intricate and confusing. The warnings I left are general notes and not escalated in anyway, basically just links to the policies and a reminder. I hope you stick around.Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:47, 14 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks, Killer! I plan on sticking around. looks like I have no choice right now... I'm relentless on the Boba Phat article, but I am also cooperative. Thanks for the welcome. And again, I didn't mean to sound harsh. Just takes time to learn. From one Dead fan to another: "Hurts my ears to listen, Shannon, burns my eyes to see... Cut down a man in cold blood, Shannon, might as well be me". Well, seeing as my real name is Shannon, if anyone's gonna keep up the defense of the Boba Phat article in preparation for whatever the future may hold with my participation on Wikipedia.... might as well be me.
 * Very Best, HIAB; and thanks for your kindness. I actually appreciate the warnings. Hell, I never started paying attention in school until the first time I actually got in trouble, so perhaps you're on the right path with me. -Shannon aka SheighZam (talk) 16:38, 14 October 2009 (UTC)



SheighZam has eaten your cookie! The cookie made her happy and she'd like to give you a great big hug for donating it. Spread the WikiLove by giving out more cookies, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Thanks again!

Spread the goodness of cookies by adding {{subst:cookie}} to someone's talk page with a friendly message, or eat a cookie with {{subst:munch}}!

Re: Speedy Deletion of Woodland Fairy Acres Article
Hi Hell in a Bucket,

Kingpin13 suggested that I contact you personally. With the user name you've chosen, I'd say he's sending me to the wolves... ;-)

Kingpin13 told me that it was your decision to delete the above referenced article about our company. I don't know if you've seen my whole discussion with Kingpin13, but he specifically suggested that I ask you the following: "Ask him what parts of the page specifically read like an advertisement, and offer to change them."

If there is any way that we can meet Wikipedia's guidelines in order to have the article published, I will continue to rewrite it until it meets with your approval. I just need to know what I'm doing wrong. I really tried to research your guidelines, in addition to following the path that other company articles had taken. If it's just a matter of our company not having enough awards, being around for more than a decade, being famous (i.e., in general, just having more clout), please be honest with me and I'll wait a few more years before we try to publish another article about our company. No hard feelings, I just need to know either what I'm doing wrong now or what we need to accomplish in the years to come.

Thanks so much!

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 16:31, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Okay Hell in a Bucket,

I guess I shouldn't tell you that I'm more of a Disco music fan... Just please don't tell me that you're too young to have ever heard of Disco music... ;-)

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 16:35, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

NO worries, [] mgo there, total disco. I'm going off my memory here but as I recall your article cited no 3rd party references and was written in a promotional manner. I would suggest reading wp:rs as far as what wualifies a reliable source but a good rule of thumb (not policy) is get three sources it helps prove notability, those sources can be local newspaper articles, regional, or even awards earned. We try to make sure they pass notability standards here. If you have a few sources you can find we can request that the page be restored and userfy it. Let me know what you think. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:40, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Woodland Fairy Acres - 3 reliable sources
Hi Hell in a Bucket,

Well, I did reference 3 reliable third party sources in our WFA article.

However, for one of the sources, I ended up linking to a webpage on our site that featured our portion of the magazine article. The reason for my doing this was that the download time associated with the url for the actual printed/archived article was around 5 minutes or so. I didn't want it to lock up someone's computer, so I ended up connecting to our own webpage which highlights the article there. That's when I got a copyright infringement alert. So, then I completely deleted that reference to our own webpage.

What can I do to reference that 1st article, so that we will have the 3 reliable sources that you require? The other 2 sources are reliable and link to the actual third party websites.

Thanks so much!

P.S. "Shakedown Street" - not bad...

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 16:55, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Make sure you cite it and paraphrase as much as possible. Downright compying brings up gopyright issues but if you phrase what is said in a different way with the correct source it should be fine. Can you provide me with links on the sources, I would like ot help look over them to make sure there isn't any problems and if there is I'd like to explain why or how to fix. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 21:59, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Thanks, Hell in a Bucket! I will work on re-writing it and will then send both the re-write and links to you. I had no idea that actually quoting the article, while still providing a link to it, was a copyright infringement. I thought that was an appropriate citing of a printed article.

I will send you everything as soon as I have it ready! Have a great evening!

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 22:24, 14 October 2009 (UTC)

Hi Hell in a Bucket,

I believe that I will need to refrain from working with you to have our article on Woodland Fairy Acres rewritten to meet Wikipedia guidelines. When I checked for messages to my account this morning, I found one written by Orange Mike that read, among other things: "If you continue to introduce inappropriate pages to Wikipedia, such as Woodland Fairy Acres, you will be blocked from editing." I don't know who he is, but apparently he has been reading all correspondence between myself and various Wikipedia editors. It is obvious from his message, that any rewriting of an article about WFA would be a conflict of interest, even if you and I work together to have it meet Wikipedia's guidelines.

Therefore, in order not to waste either your time or mine, I will not pursue your help in having our article published. I greatly appreciate your offer of help and the kind responses I have received from Kingpin and Chzz as well. I wish all of your editors could understand that not all contributors or would-be contributors to Wikipedia are trying to diminish its reputation and importance.

Again, I greatly appreciate your kindness and help, and your passing along a Grateful Dead disco song! I definitely learned something new out of this experience!

Thank you again.

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 16:21, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Thank you *blush*
Although technically it's not me that's writing these things - it's our federal government. All I'm doing is uploading them...

Seriously, though - thanks very much. Glad to see I'm not plugging away in vain. :-) -- Ser Amantio di Nicolao Che dicono a Signa?Lo dicono a Signa. 03:00, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

Please tell me everything that must be included in the very first line of my entry for the online communtiy shaggybevo.com so that you do not delete it or accuse me of something else that I didnt do. I am a legit member of the community, we are already referred to by another entry in wikipedia, and I am trying to link to that, then expand on our mission statement, goals, etc.. before I can get a line or two entered you have deleted the entry and then you accused me of sockpuppetry. I had to read about what that means as i never heard of it. I am happy to read about your personal requirements but please give me a few minutes to get it all in before you delete the entry. Go browse the site yourself if you doubt the size of our community, the references to our actions in popular media or other activities. This is not a joke, please respond with your requirements and I will comply.

Reinstatement of Extraordinary Assumptions and Hypothetical Conditions
I worked on this article hopefully to get it to survive deletion. The original draft is at User:KTrimble/Extraordinary assumptions and hypothetical conditions. Discussion of the deletion of the original draft is at Articles for deletion/Extraordinary Assumptions and Hypothetical Conditions.

The edit/creation page says to contact the 'deleting administrator' for guidance. Please check out the revised draft at User:KTrimble/Sandbox/Extraordinary Assumptions and Hypothetical Conditions. I am also contacting other admins apparently involved. Please let me know what to do next, if it is acceptable enough to not be deleted. Thank you. KTrimble (talk) 04:00, 17 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Firstly I'd like to point out I'm not an admin. But let me take a look and see what we have. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 04:48, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Going GREEN definition
Please do not restore speedy tags have they have been removed by another editor. The page was not patent nonsense, but rather was a dictionary definition/neologism, and I had proposed it for deletion as such. Thank you. TN X Man 11:55, 23 October 2009 (UTC)


 * I didn't replace with the same tag. take a look again. It was a bullshit page. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 12:19, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

CSD for Grand Hotel van Cleef
Hell, I had a look at the history of that article, after weighing in at the AfD and spending some time improving it. Sure, there were problems with it, but the AfD was unwarranted, esp. since you yourself had found hits in Google News--but this speedy deletion template really was unwarranted: there is no way you can legitimately state the article at that moment was promotional. Thanks, Drmies (talk) 04:19, 28 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I saw your comment at the AfD discussion. Thanks for that. Take care, Drmies (talk) 04:24, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

RE: Recall
Hey. Thanks for the comment. However, if you're not in support of recall, I'd have to move you to the talk page comments section; the recall page itself is for those who are supportive of recall, where I organize them into one of the two categories. Master of Puppets 05:02, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Voip business description article
Dear Hell, may you explain why you try to move current article to trash?
 * Mainly because it's a spam article. It's promoting the business and doesn't show how it's notable. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 18:23, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
 * In my mention, your opinion just connect with my history of articles. It's a just my first day here, so i apologize that i try to avoid any rules. It's a just my way to check everything before read rules :). In my mind, WIKI have fun to explain comunity how it business working inside. There may be compiled my expiriense and newbies in this business can read  to avoid mistakes.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vinogradovisoleksii (talk • contribs) 18:31, 29 October 2009 (UTC)


 * No one is saying desecrate your user page but this isn't a how to site. This is a Encyclopedia.Hell In A Bucket (talk) 18:37, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
 * I can't agree with you in this case. Article Business is showing how it works. Probably my article have to be part of this big article, but it looks like simmular. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vinogradovisoleksii (talk • contribs) 18:45, 29 October 2009 (UTC)


 * There are clear differences. Your article breaks down cost structures and profits. The business article only defines what types there are. Not once does it give you cost basis or profits or the like. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 18:48, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

how is companies going to be articles in WIKI
Dear Hell, may you explain how it's process going in? For example i seen there cisco manufacturer, but don't seen quintum. Also i seen here MERA_Networks, but can't add same for other company. It's just to undertsand. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Vinogradovisoleksii (talk • contribs)
 * It can be extremely confusing and daunting when first trying to understand Wikipedias notability guidelines. I would guess the reason you don't see a smaller company is they didn't meet our inclusion rrequirements. I would suggest reading through the links in the welcome template that was sent to you on your talkpage. It should help clear things up. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 23:22, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

AFD closure
I hope you are ok with and understand my IAR closure. Abecedare (talk) 19:02, 29 October 2009 (UTC)
 * Your cool breeze. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 19:31, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Steven "Lenky" Marsden
Hello. You tagged Steven "Lenky" Marsden created by User:Hughmcarter for deletion. I think it does assert notability, and sources were easy to find anyway. --Apoc2400 (talk) 19:39, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

Removal of Woodland Fairy Acres page
Hi Hell in a Bucket,

I was wondering if you could eliminate the page on Woodland Fairy Acres, which shows all the violations in my attempt to publish a legitimate article for wikipedia.

I had stopped working with you, because Orange Mike seemed to insinuate that he would not allow the article to be published even if it met wikipedia criteria after my working with you. A google search for Woodland Fairy Acres brings up this wikipedia page with all the violations (and gives a negative impression of our company). Since my attempts to publish an acceptable article were legitimate, but an article won't be allowed by your editors, I would greatly appreciate wikipedia eliminating all references to Woodland Fairy Acres.

For your reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Woodland_Fairy_Acres

Thank you so much for your help!

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 15:16, 2 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I hope you don't mind my butting in, Hell, but since I have the ability to see deleted pages, I was able to review this article. User:Flwr petal fairy part of the problem was a promotional tone, and I appreciate that you were willing to rework the article to make it less like an ad.  However, there were two other problems.  One of them was the problem of whether this company meets Wikipedia's notability criteria.  I can see that you had several sources, but they didn't really seem to me to show that this company is so important that a major international encyclopedia would need an article about it.  They were more the kinds of local coverage and shopping guides I'd expect any retail store- notable and non-notable- to have some of.  And the third problem is that you appear to have a conflict of interest- at Wikipedia, we all agree to avoid writing about ourselves or our own businesses.  If your company really is notable, you can be sure that someone outside the company will write about it based on what they read in the sources. It's always possible that I'm wrong, but I don't think this subject would be one that the encyclopedia would need an article about. -FisherQueen (talk · contribs) 17:06, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

That's fine, FisherQueen. I'm just requesting that the violation page be removed in reference to Woodland Fairy Acres. If an article on the company will not be allowed for publication at this time, then I think it would only be fair that all references to Woodland Fairy Acres be removed. Would you be able to remove the violation page indicated above, Hell in a Bucket?

Thank you so much!

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 01:19, 3 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately the link will come up on google searches but if they click it it should take them to a page showing it was deleted. Is it not doing that? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 03:50, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

Hi Hell,

Yes, it states that the page has been deleted, but also references the violations. It certainly doesn't paint a "neutral" image. Under the circumstances, I think it would be more appropriate to eliminate all references to Woodland Fairy Acres, since we don't yet warrant an article.

It's not that difficult to remove the page, is it? I would greatly appreciate your help with this, as my trying to publish the article in the first place was in no way an unscrupulous act. I certainly was never trying to hide anything and was definitely trying to work with you and the other editors.

Thank you so much.

Flwr petal fairy (talk) 04:27, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

No I'm sorry it's the record that there was and the classification it was deleted under. It isn't derogatory only that why they deleted it. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 04:31, 3 November 2009 (UTC)

Cripple Creek & Viictor vs. Mollie Kathleen
Thanks for adding the article, but you are confusing the Cripple Creek & Victor mine, which is a currently opeating open-pit gold mine near Victor, with the Mollie Kathleen, the former underground mine near Cripple. I have toured both, and they are very different mines, on opposite ends of the mining district. If you will look closely at your own refs, you will see the mistake. Plazak (talk) 14:41, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Actually, I do understand the Molly Gold mine is ran by Victor Company. I am remarking about the effect of Victor Coloradothe close proximity of the towns make them sister cities. And if you look the mines in the area including this one had significant effects on both cities economies. Perhaps I should word it differently so as to not make the tours themselves but the mines in the area? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:45, 14 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I have reworded, please review and let me know what you think. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:49, 14 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the improved wording. I think that the article still needs tweaks to both the references and some imprecise wording, which I will take a whack at later.  In particular, the free part of references #1, #4, and #8 do not mention the Mollie Kathleen at all.  The last sentence implies that the Mollie Kathleen has had a recent effect in increasing tourism to CC and Victor, when in fact the Mollie Kathleen has been giving tours at least since the early 1980s, when I first toured it.  Regards,  Plazak (talk) 16:38, 14 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your work on Colorado-related articles. I hope that you don't mind some of my nit-picky edits.  Plazak (talk) 19:16, 14 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Yup Colorado articles are my favorite. I think I've authored almost 50. As far as nit picking knock yourself out. I made sure they are here. I leave it to others to polish them. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 19:22, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Rollback
I have granted rollback rights to your account; the reason for this is that after a review of some of your contributions, I believe you can be trusted to use rollback correctly, and for its intended usage of reverting vandalism, and that you will not abuse it by reverting good-faith edits or to revert-war. For information on rollback, see New admin school/Rollback and Rollback feature. If you do not want rollback, just let me know, and I'll remove it. Good luck and thanks. Jamie  S93  15:34, 14 November 2009 (UTC)

Your comments on my Talk page
It's difficult for me to assume good faith after your first comment on my Talk page. I really don't have any interest in interacting with you any further; nor you with me, I suspect. But as I just stated at the AfD, the article creator's removal of my edits make me disinclined to help with the GTC article. So why don't we just go our separate ways? I still don't agree with the way you went about things in the AfD, or your obscenities on my Talk page. But I can see that I've insulted you by not respected your 'cojones' and for that I apologize. You are WP:BOLDer editer than me, no doubt. You win. And you may well carry the day at the AfD. Now can you please leave me alone? thanks, Shawn in Montreal (talk) 15:11, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
 * A couple of things. You did provoke me a little bit. That being said you caught me on an extremely bad week so you caught a bit of crossfire. First you should have asked why I nominated the article even though the tag was there. I probably could've been more descriptive as to why I did what I did. My spanish comment have cojones mi hombre (Have balls my friend/brother)was meant as a halfway funny, not meant to be tough guy at all. As far as the obsceneties sorry if you were offended but I don't believe any were directed at you. If you'd like to go our seperate ways that's fine, just try and remember Ask before you assume bad faith. I would have been much less agitated had I not had the need to defend myself from the gate. Thanks for trying to help the article though, some good ones do get deleted and your work saving them is nec. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:29, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks. And I'm sorry that I added to your stress level. goodbye and good luck, Shawn in Montreal (talk) 15:38, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Hutchison, Wood & Miller
Hi again. I've been doing a bit of work on prominent architects in Quebec and I'd like to keep the red link to Hutchison, Wood & Miller, as Google suggests they are known for works beyond the big milk bottle, it seems. The other link, to the defunct company itself, is probably unnecessary, I agree. thanks, Shawn in Montreal (talk) 04:12, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * The only issue I was seeing with that was they were notable for only creating the one landmark. If I'm wrong add it back. I did do the Heritage Montreal site. It was right up my preffered alley for article creation []. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 04:18, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes I just saw that you created Heritage Montreal after posting this! Nevermind the architects. That's great. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 04:20, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

City Park Carousel
What source says anything about ownership? http://nca-usa.org/cgi-bin/census/census.pl?NCANo=28, which you copied despite the copyright notice, says nothing about ownership, and I can't find anything at http://www.carouselnews.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=475&Itemid=1&ed=45 about the City Park currently owning the structure. If I missed something, or if you find another source, please add the citation; but please don't revert what you believe to be improvements. Nyttend (talk) 22:45, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * That's why I said "currently". Are Pueblo City Park and Pueblo Public Park District No. 2 the same thing?  The names aren't the same, so you'll need a source to say that.  Moreover, stop deleting valid information, including the infobox.  Nyttend (talk) 22:55, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Yes they are the same thing. I am actually writing the city park article now. It was a long process. Please stop deleting my info as well. READ THE SOURCES. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 22:57, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * What's your source for the website-is-public-domain statement? The webpage claims to be copyrighted; perhaps you're thinking of federal government works?  Nyttend (talk) 22:58, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If you don't provide a source to the effect that the organizations are the same, I'm going to tag it for sources; and I'll not stop removing copyright violations. Nyttend (talk) 22:59, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * That page says nothing about the carousel; it's quite possible for someone to own something but be permitted to have it located on someone else's property. Nyttend (talk) 23:04, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * That is helping explain the districts to you since apparently you need a connect the dots lesson here. DO i have to break down what a park is next? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 23:07, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

You have to read the sources to say it's not there......In carousel news it plainly says this albeit way down. " In 1940, the City Commissioner of Parks and Highways arranged for Pueblo Public Park District No. 2 to purchase C.W. Parker #72. The ride was installed south and east of Goodnight Avenue How much more clear can that be?
 * How are we to know that the Pueblo Park District No. 2 and the Pueblo City Park are identical? How am I to know that it has never since been sold?  I don't appreciate the condescension.  Nyttend (talk) 23:15, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * That's unfortunate. I don't like having to point you to a seperate article to help show our parks were in divisions but you can't can't connect the dots? Don't complain just because you can't follow a simple thread of logic. You said you had doubts about the districts, I pointed you to a city park article that clearly states that theere were several districts at that time. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 23:18, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * By "out of date", I meant that the newest statement regarding ownership was something from 1940. I meant nothing about the date of the source itself; it's just that statements about a situation in 1940 are not well-qualified to be sources about the present state of anything.  Nyttend (talk) 01:13, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Pardon, I don't know what you mean by "NHR". Nyttend (talk) 01:21, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

I was in error in that (NHR) part anyways I was double checking and it didn't make sense.. I intend on putting the other two sources back in tomorrow. I am not going to continue tonight. I would also urge you to stop because technically you and I have both violated 3rr. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 01:24, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Chill pil
Hell, please rephrase fuckin dolt and freaking leash to more neutral terms, asap. Off2riorob (talk) 23:49, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Dude, make an apology at ANI and get the f out of there. Off2riorob (talk) 00:16, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I'll have a look at it to see what is going on, phew....it must be full moon tonight. Off2riorob (talk) 00:37, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * No one has riled me like that since I first got here. I don't know if the sources were too long or what but damn. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:46, 22 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Hell, you were lucky to get out of there alive, sometimes a simple apology is so easy and the best, I'm sorry I lost the plot...

These contact details are there, after a quick look I would say these guys own it, Pueblo Parks and Recreation Department, are they like the local council? but it could also be some kind of trust, you could either call these guys or email them to find out for certain.

Pueblo City Park, 3455 Nuckolls Ave, Pueblo, CO 81005. Website at: www.pueblo.us, or call the Pueblo Parks and Recreation Department at (719) 553-2790 or email them at parks@pueblo.usThis e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Off2riorob (talk) 00:51, 22 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Hi ... I'll have a look. Was more worried about you getting yourself blocked at ANI. Black Kite 00:52, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * OK ... looks like it's sourced now. Phew :) Black Kite 00:56, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Pueblo City Parks and Recreation Replaced the Public Parks a long time ago. It was renamed but the same organization. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:53, 22 November 2009 (UTC)


 * It was sourced to begin with, that's why I was getting so pissed. hewnce my initial ocmment, I have a source that says Pueblo City owns it...Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:57, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * I see now what happened, you were there creating an article and...we know the rest, it is perhaps better to keep an article in user space until it is developed a little more, that way you'll have it more prepared. Off2riorob (talk) 00:59, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Good Faith
I couldn't find an appropriate place to post this. Perhaps you could create a thread on your page just for this. Justafax was just updating me on edit requirements which is ok. We were not engaged in an edit war. As a matter of fact he agreed with me for the need to edit, although he did tell me not to sign my edits in the article. I am mindful of the Wiki community and will do my best to contribute in a positive way. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kadathdreamques (talk • contribs) 21:33, 21 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes I followed that exchange. I agree one hundred percent in his assessment that you were acting in good faith, just not going about it the way the regulars do. It's not your fault, but ignorance of the policy is almost alwayas never an excuse...either way you saw what was going on and you actually fufilled the template by reaching a consensus. Next time just take it to the talk page. You're cool though everyone gets a template now and then, you were only trying to help. BTW anytime you wish to make a section on your talkpage or any talkpage there is a tab above that says new section. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 21:39, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Thank you Hell. As I get used to the community I will become better at editing properly. I do feel a little like a corpse with buzzards circling around though. I mean, how the hell did you guys find me so fast?!? In faith for Wiki, yours. Keep the faith. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Kadathdreamques (talk • contribs) 21:53, 21 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Watchlists my friend. Unfortunately the Little Bighorn article does get a fair number of views and garners more vandalism I had watched a few times back and forth before I jumped in. There is also a category of users who ID themselves as Recent Changes Patrollers. Above on the top of my talk page I can view new page creations and recent changes. By refreshing I can see the next round. Don't worry as long as you explain yourself well you''ll be akllright. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 22:04, 21 November 2009 (UTC)

Query. What do you mean by "everyone gets a template now and then"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.27.184.50 (talk) 06:10, 22 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Warning for violating a policy. There a lot of them and sometimes tempers get flared. Example below. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:46, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

WT???
Why, may I ask, did you delete my comments on another user's talk page? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.54.76.54 (talk) 16:14, 22 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Mr Schumin is currently having some problems with a pesky IP who regularly vandalises his page. Your post was a borderline attack. If you feel it wasn't restore it. Ben Schumin can re-revert it if he doesn't agree. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:17, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * If it sounded a bit snippy, it was - he's reverted several edits of mine on an article claiming lack of sourcing. When I asked him about it, he blanked my question, rather than answer it.  I've been away from Wikipedia for a while, but it used to be blanking a comment on a talk page rather than responding to it was a party foul.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.54.76.54 (talk) 16:22, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Actually rereading your comment it is rather mellow. My apologies, it appears you aren't the other IP. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 17:13, 22 November 2009 (UTC)
 * No worries, mon. 71.54.76.54 (talk) 17:51, 22 November 2009 (UTC)

Why are you removeing text I posted?
Why are you removeing text I posted? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.249.235.218 (talk) 04:41, 24 November 2009 (UTC)


 * It is a attack. You are questioning her motives and not assuming good faith. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 04:43, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Why if I am not asking you why are you getting in to my bussines? It is not an attack, that is what you think.

From what I was reading to me it sound like she is blocking people for no good reasion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.249.235.218 (talk) 04:46, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Can you answer one of my questions?
Please help me? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.249.235.218 (talk) 05:11, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Article rescue

 * Wow thanks. As a deletionist I never expected to get one of these! Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:20, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

Removal of PROD from Nathaniel Samuels
Hello Hell in a Bucket, this is an automated message from SDPatrolBot to inform you the PROD template you added to Nathaniel Samuels has been removed. It was removed by DGG with the following edit summary ' Managing partner of Kuhn, Loeb is notable. Needs sourcing. '. Please consider discussing your concerns with DGG before pursuing deletion further yourself. If you still think the article should be deleted after communicating with the 'dePRODer,' you may want to send the article to AfD for community discussion. Thank you, SDPatrolBot (talk) 19:51, 27 November 2009 (UTC) (Learn how to opt out of these messages) 19:51, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

I Need Your Help
First of all, thank you for helping. I am being harassed by this person. He is the one trying to get the article titled "Banjee" deleted. He has been banned three times and he has created numerous current sock puppets. I believe he is creating sock puppets just to delete the article. Please help me. Thanks.

Ronald Backardy (talk) 02:54, 28 November 2009 (UTC)Ronald Backardy

Robber's Cave
Hell in the Bucket Please check the History of the page before writing to talk page.I didnt removed the speedy deletion i put a hangon.And also please wait for sometime to add me more information to page.This way wikipedia will grow.Alokprasad (talk) 15:13, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Also i am not aware of how to edit it offline.so saving on each change .Alokprasad (talk) 15:14, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

No prbs Man..:-)..Thanks Alokprasad (talk) 15:15, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Vandalism
what vandalism?--Kevinharte (talk) 17:16, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Air Evac Lifeteam
Maybe you should ask yourself how an air ambulance service which operates over 100 helicopters covering 23 can be considered non-notable, especially as much smaller local services are included. It should be kept for the same reasons that Air Methods is. IE being the largest and operating the most aircraft.--Degen Earthfast (talk) 18:02, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

Your apology
Thanks, and don't worry, no hard feelings. It was obvious that you were getting caught up in the heat of the moment, and I was sure that you wouldn't normally talk that way. Nyttend (talk) 18:46, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * This issue came up recently regarding plaques in Massachusetts. You can find better advice than I can give in the "copyright issue for photos of plaques" section of this talk page archive.  By the way, I've expanded the district article a bit.  Nyttend (talk) 19:11, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I like it. There is quite a bit more to add to this section. I think that it can be fleshed out to be a featured article, It regularly hosts large city events, Octoberfest and is also the site of our biggest natural diseaster yet. If you don't mind I will be asking you to help reword as you did above, I think we can get this one on the Main page. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 19:18, 2 December 2009 (UTC)
 * If the information can't be found in print, I'm not very sure that we should consider these plaques reliable sources. Have you researched this area in-depth in your local public library or in the CSU-Pueblo library?  You could find lots more information if you were to get a copy of the district's NRHP nomination form, which is available for free from the National Park Service.  If you're interested in doing this, email a request to nr_reference@nps.gov, saying that you want this district's nomination form (perhaps including its reference number, 82001021, to make it easier for the NPS staffer) and giving them your name and address.  Nyttend (talk) 13:59, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Was the Obama visit directly relevant to the district's history in the grand scheme of things; are you sure this isn't recentism? Individual visits by prominent individuals generally don't belong in articles unless they're really turning points — of course we mention Lincoln's visit in November 1863 at Battle of Gettysburg, but that was because of the significance of the Gettysburg Address — and I don't see how Obama's presence in Pueblo was transformative for anyone or anything.  Nyttend (talk) 14:37, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Well, thank you very much :-) Nyttend (talk) 15:29, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Sorry to say, but the article is far from FA quality: among other things, it's definitely not comprehensive. But thank you for the compliment on my writing :-)  Nyttend (talk) 16:47, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Barnstar
Hello Amigo, thanks, that is only my second barnster, the other one was for editing in the bipartisan hell that is the political fields here, I am certain you would do the same for me, respect to you, best regards. Off2riorob (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * If you use for the first ref, you can use to place the same reference at another place in the article. Regards  So  Why  15:30, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

If I need to use the phrase "contributing properties" but want to link it to Contributing Properties in the Historic Union Ave Commercial District. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:30, 4 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Format the link like this: contributing properties which gives contributing properties.   Fl ee tf la me   ·  whack! whack!  · 16:47, 4 December 2009 (UTC)

Lincoln Heights Jail
Thank you for noticing that Lincoln Heights Jail was unreferenced. I had added a reference in this edit, but another editor removed it. I have restored the reference. -- Eastmain (talk) 04:19, 5 December 2009 (UTC)

Welcome back.
Hey dude, did you get the cleaning done. Good to see you back. Off2riorob (talk) 23:00, 8 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Yup my cleaning is done, as well as a almost bare watchlist. Thanks for being a great friend Rob. It's appreciated. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 23:02, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Its a pleasure to be your friend, keep cool dude. Off2riorob (talk) 23:03, 8 December 2009 (UTC)

Ophélie Bretnacher
Nice work there and in only 11 minutes..It looks almost worth keeping now,? Off2riorob (talk) 08:54, 9 December 2009 (UTC)


 * If there is more coverage maybe....This isn't a Natalee Halloway, Amanda Knox or Jon Benet Ramsey, so far she is just a murder victim sad as that is...Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:18, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I left him a note, he IMO isn't helping his case.Off2riorob (talk) 18:17, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Not really. I had left a warning for commenting on his ownership of the article. I'm trying to help epxlain the speculation is not helping and the non connectors are a bit off putting too. It's a tad confusing at times. Kinda like Americas Most Wanted. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 18:20, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

In addition I would like to come back on your sentence: “One day your article might get there, that time is not now” and make additional comments: Without wiki, the only information which are provided today are via journalists without double-checking who can often report bias or wrong information : WIKI is the only universal place where the information can be challenged, crossed-checked, summarized, stabilised and updated on a reliable manner. In Hungary the main source of information on the case are tabloids like Blikk and Bors. They are totally unreliable, only interested in selling paper rather than to report facts and truth, keeping Hungarian people totally away from the truth (Hungarian newspapers launched crazy accusations on Italian students pretending to be in close relation with the Hungarian police. These crazy accusations were translated by google and spread also in France). And this is just an example of the fact that once such a bi-national case is only reported by journalists, some stabilisation (certification) has to be done somewhere reachable from everybody : WIKIPEDIA is this only place, and the current exchange between us is the proof of that. And this “authentic information safeguarding” has to be done now, not in five years. This is not a Franco-French case, but a French-Hungarian case and de facto an European case. Given the constraint of Hungarian language, the article in English language (the only single vector of communication within Europe, where French is maybe better than Hungarian but totally surpassed by English) is essential to keep quality of information at the same level in Hungary and France and reachable to the community of ERASMUS, for whom it is a notable case. It was asked to the members of European parliament to make a minute of silence when the death of Ophélie was announced. European promoters are uncomfortable with this case because it is a symbol of collateral damages of European construction : ERASMUS has been implemented to facilitate the student mobility within Europe but when a problem appears (such as Ophélie case), the former way of doing “business” in Europe is going on : no justice cooperation between countries, administrative nightmare for the victims, predominance of diplomatic agenda over the human rights and for the European new entrants of the EU, going on with communist way of doing justice and human rights. That is why this case is notable at European level, because it is collateral damage of European construction. My last point will be regarding the free encyclopaedia principle of WIKI. As seen in “1984” of Georges Ornwel or in the movie “Brazil”, you know how information control is important for countries in deficit of democracy. You know that even our own countries (USA and France) are able to use information as a tool to do borderline things in term of democracy. You know that former communist countries are still in a process of learning democracy, even those which are already part of the EU. Former communist countries are marketing themselves as safe and modern places to get the money from rich Western countries through tourism, investment and any other business. The case Ophélie is part of that, it is also notable for that reason. It is not one of the numerous disappearance case, but it is a similar case to the one in Croatia with the Australian girl Britt Lapthorne whose story was very similar and close to a diplomatic incident between Australia and Croatia (For Ophélie it was also close to the diplomatic incident and the family had to visit the Hungarian embassy in Paris on January 11, 2009 at the end of its March for Ophélie” in order to show that the actions were was not against Hungary but simply for Ophélie). Here Wikipedia is providing what democracy has been waiting for decades, a way to guaranty that information is not manipulated but simply made reachable and reliable for anybody. Regarding the figures when you compare to other cases in Anglo-Saxon countries, don’t forget that France and Hungary lag behind these countries in term of internet usage, and the case Ophélie was forecast in prime time on all the national TV in Hungary and in France during the winter 08-09. You are probably right, maybe the article need to be re-worked to emphasised better the reason why it is notable. And anyway, the exchange we had are the proof that the quality of the information will be permanently challenged on Wikipedia Raymondnivet (talk) 20:56, 15 December 2009 (UTC)

Fear and loathing....
I am scaring myself enough at the moment. I love movies though and have a large collection...that sad story about disapearing in eastern europe reminded me of that awful scary movie ,,Hostel, one and two...terrifying..I will have a look at that link you gave me, is it streaming for free? Off2riorob (talk) 19:15, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Yeah it's actually a documentary. It's a bit on the conspiricist side, hence why I say if even a tenth is true it's scary. It has to do with the Georgia Guidestones, the American stonehenge....Hell In A Bucket (talk) 19:18, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I was looking here, it does look scary, do you need to download it or is there a link to watch online? I was getting a 404 error message, it it only streamed over there where you are? Off2riorob (talk) 00:56, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Check it out here. [] Hell In A Bucket (talk) 17:02, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Yea, thats loading up, I'll have a look in a bit, thanks. Off2riorob (talk) 18:18, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

Star Trek
Hi, Hellinabucket. Why do you keep reverting my change of "orbital skydive" back to "space skydive"? Star Trek is known for a basic degree of technical accuracy when it comes to known science fact.

I launch satellites for a living, so let me try to give you a quick primer. To be in orbit, one has to travel fast enough to have the curvature of the planet fall out from under you before you fall far enough to hit the atmosphere- about 17000 mph here on Earth. If you're in a vehicle traveling this fast and step out, you wouldn't fall- YOU would be in orbit. This is commonly done- it's called "spacewalking".

In the movie, the drill, obviously, had to maintain one position over the planets surface at a relatively low altitude (but still high enough to be in space). In such a situation, you'd have to use some kind of propulsion system to hover in place, since the horizon is no longer dropping out from under you due to your horizontal speed. If you were in such a spacecraft, and stepped out, you'd fall just as though you'd stepped off an extremely tall cliff, which is exactly what happened. This is actually a point of surprisingly good technical accuracy in the movie- it's something most people wouldn't know that they did right. I'll copy & paste in the bad astronomy review below...

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2009/05/08/ba-review-star-trek/

Kirk, Sulu, and Officer Red Shirt (srsly! His suit is red!) jump from a shuttle to attack the mining drill when it’s lowered from the Romulan ship over Vulcan. Wearing space suits, they fall from orbit, land on the drill, fight the Romulans, and stop the drill.

The Science:

Well, there’s lots of bad and good science here. Strap in.

First off, something they got right once I thought about it some. The shuttle left Enterprise to go to the Romulan ship. At first I thought both ships were in orbit, but that’s not true! The Romulan ship had lowered the mining drill from above the atmosphere, but it had to be hovering above the ground to do that, not orbiting the planet, or else they wouldn’t be stationary over one spot (true, there is a geosynchronous orbit that keeps you over one spot, but it’s tens of thousands of kilometers over the surface, and the ships were clearly just above Vulcan’s atmosphere).

So when the trio jump from the shuttle, my first thought was that they’d still be in orbit; to deorbit means they’d need to change their velocity by several km/sec, which is clearly not possible. But they weren’t in orbit, so they just fell. OK, +1 internets for the movie.

They would fall fast. And they did! Their speed was a little less than a kilometer per second, which sounds about right. At their altitude there wouldn’t be much if any air to slow them, so they’d free fall; as they plunged deeper air resistance would slow them down. At first I thought they’d actually burn like meteors, but in reality (ha! Reality!) they weren’t going that fast.

Of course, I have to wonder why Officer Red Shirt waited so long to pull his chute. But then, he was a red shirt.

I love the fact that Sulu had to save Kirk here. Nice touch. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Carves (talk • contribs) 06:18, 10 December 2009 (UTC)


 * WP:TLDR Hell In A Bucket (talk) 06:27, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

Book content
Hi, HiaB, are you any good at finding books to read online, this book is being used to support some content about Stedman Pearson and I want too check it, any ideas where I could access it? ..this book...cite book|title=Rock movers & shakers|last=Rees|first=Dafydd|first2=Luke|last2=Crampton|publisher=University of Michigan|date=1991|ISBN=9780874366617 or maybe its easier there in the us, closer to mitchigan? It is for sale on amazon for four dollars, the link is blacklisted. Off2riorob (talk) 16:29, 11 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I couldn't find a copy online of thebook. What is the actual info that is being cited. I can look for that...Hell In A Bucket (talk) 18:55, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * This is the title..Rock movers & shakers. Off2riorob (talk) 22:16, 11 December 2009 (UTC)
 * This is the ibsn book search..Off2riorob (talk) 01:19, 12 December 2009 (UTC)

Woops
See the AFD. These two are (I believe) native French, speaking English as a second language- perhaps stay away from metaphor in this situation in the future- especially one relating to an oft-cited cultural stereotype (the French and hygiene, in this case). I've attempted some damage control, but an apology from you may prevent Raymond (the man who's wife you've inadvertently called smelly) from losing his shit all over you. -- King Öomie 21:58, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Tools
Have you got betacommands user comparison tool? Off2riorob (talk) 22:17, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

This one... Off2riorob (talk) 22:21, 11 December 2009 (UTC)


 * nope just use twinkle. Pretty easy...Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:54, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Its a good tool, I wanted a second opinion about some socking...? Off2riorob (talk) 01:16, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Sure who do you have? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 05:11, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Go to Betacommand talkpage and ask him to please have the User compare activated, he will ask you to email him and sent you by mail a key to allow you to use it. Off2riorob (talk) 17:19, 12 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Hell, are you cool? Feel free to email me...? Off2riorob (talk) 01:47, 17 December 2009 (UTC)

Merry Xmas
Good luck for 2010. Off2riorob (talk) 20:40, 23 December 2009 (UTC)

Centijimbos
Hi!

I noticed restored the "centijimbos" userbox to Jimbo's userpage. I think it's a valid change, and it's certainly not vandalism. What was your motivation for reverting my edit? 74.207.139.170 (talk) 04:22, 25 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Simply reverting doesn't mean it was vandalism. If I had used rollback that might have been a valid arguement...As I did not it isn't. There is nothing wwrong with the section. Just because you don't think it's professional enough doesn't matter. unlesss it is against policy what is the beef? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 04:23, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

I'm sorry, I'm new to Wikipedia, and I still find some of the terminology unwieldly - I don't know what "rollback" is. Could you please clarify why you restored centijimbos? 74.207.139.170 (talk) 04:27, 25 December 2009 (UTC)


 * No problem. Undoing a change or restoring a page version is a manner of restoring a controversial edit. Rollback is a seperatetool that will rollback several edits to the last known version. This tool is only to be used in clear and blatant cases of vandalism. In this case everyone can edit Jimbo's page...Provided it is within policy. But blanking a section like that that isn't against policy purely because you consider it unprofessional isn't col. Try taking it to the talk page and remember if Jimbo sees it and dislikes it he can remove. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 04:32, 25 December 2009 (UTC)

WP:AIV
Hell in a Bucket, may I know the reason for which you removed my comment at WP:AIV? I commented there as an admin reviewing the report, and you or anybody else cannot remove it just because you don't agree with it. Being a regular editor here, I assume you are familiar with the policy on removing others' comments, so I sure would like to know what the heck you were thinking. ≈ Chamal  talk ☃ 12:58, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Completely unintended, I apoligize. I believe it was allready at Ani....Hell In A Bucket (talk) 13:00, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh, OK. My apologies for the outburst :) ≈ Chamal  talk ☃ 13:04, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * No worries I would have wanted to know the same thing. As i recall I think we edit conflicted. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 13:06, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Glad your back
Hey HIAB, you have to pay the tallyman see Tallyman, UK usage. Off2riorob (talk) 13:58, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Thanks, i was only gone a week but it felt like forever. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:14, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Ha ha, are we addicted? Off2riorob (talk) 14:18, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Just a bit. I was discussing a issue on Jimbo Wales page and I made a truthful statement. I never thought I'd get pleasure from volunteering until I started here. This is a worthy cause! Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:19, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * That crack is some dangerous stuff, we have it here but not excessive and that meth is almost unknown in England, wiki is better for the health. Off2riorob (talk) 14:35, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Aside from the mental part of it? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 14:36, 26 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Oh yea, sometimes it keeps me awake... once recently an editor said he was going to report me and I said go on then and went to bed, I couldn't sleep and after a few hours got up and turned my computer on to check, he he he!, and I once had a wiki dream where I was editing in my sleep... I should get some therapy, perhaps there is money to be made as a wikipedia deprogrammer . Off2riorob (talk) 14:41, 26 December 2009 (UTC)

Ref your comments at Jimbo's talkpage
is aware of Jimbo's status. She has also been blocked by Jimbo in what might be considered a "cooling down" sanction - and proof of the pudding re policy is that it has irritated her to such an extent that she often reminds Jimbo of it. Now that you are aware of the history behind the comment, I would suggest that you self revert your response on the basis that circumstances have been explained to you. I know you acted in good faith (and you might have requested my help in your latest troubles - my impression is that your block log no longer reflects the good you do round here) but it might be wise to remove yourself from between the ongoing Jimbo/Bish situation. Cheers, LessHeard vanU (talk) 01:52, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Cool. Thanks. LessHeard vanU (talk) 01:56, 27 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Well me and my damn temper. I called arbcom Morons, assholes and Nazis. I was attacking the actions and not specific people so thought I was safe. The policy says if you are describing behaviors you're cool but I corssed the line. The odd thing is the block time said one thing and the screen the other. I requested adjustment to either one that was incorect and Bluboy decided I hadn't thought about the situation and so he reset the log. Thanks for the support, I was really surprised with how he overlooked everything and threw it back on me. Oh well, last time he Indef blocked me for apoligizing for being a asshole. Why should things be different? BTW REVERTED. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 01:59, 27 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Like I said, I think you are here for the benefit of the project - and I fully understand that that doesn't mean everything should be nice and fluffy. If you have a problem, drop me a line - if I think you are in the wrong then I will explain why, but if you have been treated disproportionately then I will try to fix things. Also, if you find people holding your block log against you just refer them to me - again, I will try and mediate. Last thing, I also regret often what I say in anger, but it is who I am and like you I am here for the benefit of the project. If something makes you angry, there is a good chance it is not you who is at fault (but try posting when you are a little calmer, huh?) LessHeard vanU (talk) 02:08, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

Which guidelines?
Re:

What 'guidelines for inclusion' are you talking about? I don't understand what you mean.

I don't particularly care one way or the other if you're interested in dialling things back &mdash; but if you're interested in helping Brews (rather than just loudly and unpleasantly venting) it would certainly help him if you took a calmer approach. Follow his example. An AE request was filed; Brews made a calm, cool response; then you decided to (incorrectly) assume that JohnBlackburne was an administrator, and (incorrectly) imply that there was some sort of Wikipedia-wide vendetta against Brews with your little 'english is physics' diatribe.

Brews made a much more credible case in his own defense than you did. For better or worse, editors will be judged (at least partially) on the basis of their company. (That isn't a Wikipedia-specific thing; it's human nature.) You make it more difficult for Brews' relationship with the community to improve if you go off shouting angrily any time someone else criticizes or questions him. For one thing, the loud, angry man jumping up and down makes it difficult for us to 'hear' Brews; for another thing, he's a grown man and he's perfectly capable of choosing his own fights.

Dial it back, for his good. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 02:12, 27 December 2009 (UTC)


 * that is a reasonable arguement. So was the answer to this one []. Exact same thing as today. I admit that a few of the comments are a bit over the top. But consider how many more times will brews be brought to enforcements over these fringe issues until someone says that's a little too much physics here. From my perception there hasn't been a lot of help for Brew, and his arguements as you point out are good. Not to be snide no one has yet ever come up with a substantial reason for these sanctions in the first place or a reason why they are still nec. A important part of our process here is preventing harm. In great interactions like this, where Brews proves he is here to help Wikipedia, why would sanctions be needed at all? At that point things become punitive. Remember we are all volunteers, why run off a highly qualified contributor? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 02:39, 27 December 2009 (UTC)


 * It's trivially easy to point to the circumstances of the last discussion, and move on. There are thousands of editors on Wikipedia, most of whom spend very, very, very little time at WP:AE.  I'm pretty sure I've never heard of JohnBlackburne before today, and I imagine that he doesn't know me or you from Adam either.  It's just not possible to guarantee (and it's unreasonable to even expect) that every editor will be fully familiar with the history of every other editor.  In good faith, JohnBlackburne raised a legitimate concern that Brews was acting contrary to his extant topic ban.  That report will probably be closed shortly, and no lasting harm will result.  (I'll note that in the case you linked above, Tznkai didn't immediately ban Brews; he brought his concern to the community and sought input first.  Brews wasn't blocked for even a short period of time in that situation &mdash; as in this one.)
 * While it's unfortunate that these enforcement requests will occur from time to time, at least some of the responsibility here does have to rest at Brews' own feet. While his conduct for the last month or so has been quite good (as far as I gather), his conduct (at speed of light and in more recent policy discussions) was decidedly less than stellar.  The Wikipedia community is pleased to have a subject matter expert contributing and would like to make every reasonable effort to allow those contributions to continue.  However, we can't also avoid acknowledging that his past approaches to Wikipedia have at times been somewhat less than collegial and productive.  (Once a situation is sufficiently serious to warrant the time, effort, and heartache of an Arbitration, the community tends to expect a binding, final solution.)  Until we are reassured that those problems are fully resolved, Brews' actions will tend to receive more official and unofficial scrutiny.  Worth noting is that barring further disruptive editing, his restrictions (general probation and the topic ban) will expire in less than a year.  That said, I expect that these sorts of AE requests will be relatively few in number, and I would strongly endorse sanctions against any editor who appeared to be encouraging or engaging in the use of these provisions for harrassment.  (Mind you, I will also confess some sympathy for Tznkai and Blackburne's view &mdash; the correct breadth with which the topic ban should be interpreted is not at all obvious, and it's certainly a reasonable reading for both multigrid method and bivector to be considered as falling within the fringes of it.  To an extent, it is Brews' generally positive recent work and willingness to reform his conduct that has inclined me – and probably other admins – to read these mathematical and computational physics articles as falling outside his restrictions.)
 * Perhaps regrettably, the 'friends' of Brews have probably (again) hurt him more than helped him. Count Iblis' repeated calls to lift the topic ban (coupled with a selective blindness regarding Brews' previous conduct) have been very effective in cementing the perception that there is a problem here, and that the topic ban should remain in place for the full duration imposed by ArbCom. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 03:15, 27 December 2009 (UTC)


 * For Brews' sake, I would also urge you to be very restrained, factual, and polite in commenting on any proposed sanction of him (or, for that matter, of anyone else you ever want to help, including yourself). Screaming about the accuser, or administrators as a group, or ArbCom is worse than ineffective: it is counterproductive. There is a second reason for not doing so in Brews' case: There is a risk that he will be inspired to take a similarly aggressive stance, as he has done in the past, which only gets him in more trouble: in addition to his physics topic ban, he is under a more general, one-year probation against disruption and incivility. Brews can be his own worst enemy.—Finell 10:45, 27 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Also urging restraint. Perhaps a step back? The view out of my window..the sun is breaking through the clouds, all is well. Off2riorob (talk) 10:49, 27 December 2009 (UTC)

Socratic Barnstar?
You're suggesting I should drink poison? Crafty (talk) 03:16, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * That barnstar is for people with eloquent arguements. I gave it to you because of your userpage. You put it all on the table. As far as the Hemlock thing, I would only agree if you were guilty of corrupting the youth of Athens....Hell In A Bucket (talk) 03:41, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I thank you sir, your barnstar does my arguments great honour. I have recently had the opportunity to visit Athens. Having lately seen the youth of that metropolis I can assure you they will not come to corruption by my thighs. :) Crafty (talk) 04:08, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Michael W. Ryan (murderer)
Hello Hell in a Bucket. From where is this article copypasted, please? Could you add the url? I can't find it. Thank you. --Vejvančický (talk) 16:47, 28 December 2009 (UTC)


 * From what I read it is a copyright vio of us. I didn't see the darn duplicate page tag and selected the copyvio. I gotta shower for work so anymore questions aned I will answer in like 20 minutes. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:49, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Nevermind, It actually looks legit now. The Author explained what happened. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:52, 28 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Yes, I see. It was a bad redirect. I'm sorry for bothering you. Have a good day. --Vejvančický (talk) 17:01, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

Given that the general response was ...
... this, then it appears you are chosing to be oblivious. Proofreader77 (interact) 06:46, 29 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Merely a suggestion. I was and am aware, however I don't think you should police his page either. He has a right to post it and if Jimbo likes he can remove or block. Clearly his choice. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 06:48, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

A general principle...
Do you recall the advice I gave you about the AE request on Brews ohare? I would urge you to consider its broader application anywhere where you're hoping to make a persuasive and convincing argument. When you want to be seen as The Voice Of Reason, you need to present yourself as coolly as a cucumber. This style of comment just doesn't help you. Even if you're dealing with someone whom you believe is being totally impolite and unreasonable, you can't win by being more impolite and unreasonable. Resist the urge to get the last word. Pissing matches just end with everyone covered in urine. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 16:06, 29 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I agree, in this case I did revert. However Ten if you look I did try several nice notes on the ownership issues and he just keep persisting. I realize I am a bit hotheaded but here is a great example of someone's reach exceeding their grasp. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:08, 29 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I saw your self-revert, and I think it was a good call.
 * The point is, once you've made your arguments (calmly, coolly, clearly, and concisely), you don't gain anything by repeating them more angrily if someone simply refuses to take on what you've said. Certainly, you can clarify any misunderstandings of what you've written, and by all means engage with editors who appear to be interested in having a reasonable discussion &mdash; but you're shooting yourself in the foot if you start yelling at someone who is just ignoring what you're saying.  To an outsider it goes from being "There's one guy who won't listen to reason" to "There's a couple of crazy guys making fools of themselves and frothing at the mouth".
 * The "Yes you are!"/"No I'm not!" back and forth (and all its variants) is one of the most common illustrations of diminishing returns on Wikipedia. With each cycle, the parties get angrier, less coherent, less credible, and less likely to back off from their ever-more-deeply entrenched positions.  If someone makes an apparently silly or disruptive suggestion, it's usually best to offer a single, clear, concise rebuttal or two, and then move on.  Other editors can evaluate the relative merits of the two sides, and if it really was a bad idea, it will disappear relatively quickly into the archives...unless people keep posting to the thread.  Even if a post was in genuinely bad faith (rather than simply out of naivete or lack of understanding of Wikipedia) you're doing no one any good by feeding a troll who's looking for an argument.
 * Further, when two editors are involved in a rapid-fire punch-up, other editors become disinclined to wade in. (We don't want to get any of your piss on our trousers, thanks.)  It's painfully obvious in any discussion when just one party (often the lone – or nearly lone – proponent/opponent of the proposal) is going through and responding to every single comment.  The community is pretty clueful about such situations.  It's more distracting if two opponents are going at each other, drowning out any other conversation.  They tend to cancel each other out, and render themselves both irrelevant.
 * Incidentally, your last manual talk page archive didn't make it into your Archives. Just a heads-up. TenOfAllTrades(talk) 16:36, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I can actually agree with your sentiments. I do not intend on going away, however I am going to try different tacts. In this case though I'm done discussing it with Proof. That's all I was doing feeding a page troll at that point. I do appreciate when those of differing opinion come to my talkpage in a effort to talk not attack. If you would like ot continue to do so you are omre then welcome. I will listen to what you say, won't a;ways agree but I will at listen. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 16:44, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

I very very very strongly suggest listening to TenOfAllTrades here, that is some excellent advise. Prodego talk  19:19, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

Thank you
Could have used a better edit summary, but still, thanks. Prodego talk  19:17, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I was gonna say...I saw it coming..how are you dude? Off2riorob (talk) 23:50, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
 * I'm good. Just brewing some coffee. Really trying to change up my approach on this things but damn sometimes it's hard to change habits. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 23:54, 29 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Habits, yes..sometimes it requires a slap, as in pushing through the developed patterns that are impregnated in early life, as a comment let me say that time does all of that for you, enjoy and accept who you are now as time will bring its own change too. Just pay attention and you won't miss anything. Off2riorob (talk) 00:04, 30 December 2009 (UTC)

Sister Vincenza
Hi Jake, regarding your article Sister Vincenza, it has been brought up at the BLPN here , I was going to prod it for..Not notable person, any little notability is connected to this one conspiracy theory event but I saw its yours so I thought I can just ask you about it? Off2riorob (talk) 13:23, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Articles for deletion nomination of Sister Vincenza
I have nominated Sister Vincenza, an article that you created, for deletion. I do not think that this article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and have explained why at Articles for deletion/Sister Vincenza. Your opinions on the matter are welcome at that same discussion page; also, you are welcome to edit the article to address these concerns. Thank you for your time.Please contact me if you're unsure why you received this message. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 17:50, 31 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Hi HiaB, that is a move, nominating your own article, I will comment in a while, you have improved it a bit, lets see who comments. Off2riorob (talk) 19:05, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Hi Jake, in the future I don't think it is a good idea to self nominate an article, let someone else do it if they really want to, the situation seems to be confusing for people. Off2riorob (talk) 15:23, 2 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I guess so. I hate useless work. I'll just have to go throuihg that route next time. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:27, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Happy New Year :-)
A salute for your gracious and honorable response to complex situation. Here's to many delightful learning moments (for us both LoL) in 2010. Cheers! Proofreader77 (interact) 00:24, 1 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Yo, me too, happy new year amigos. Off2riorob (talk) 00:26, 1 January 2010 (UTC)


 * PS Some New Year's ring-in music for exciting times :-) Proofreader77 (interact) 00:28, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

Re: Delivered New Year's music ... How wonderful! ... My heart is singing-in the New Year! ... Bless your whisky-pickled heart, Hell In A Bucket! LoL Cheers! Proofreader77 (interact) 01:06, 1 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Greatful Dead: "Hell In A Bucket" - From now on I will consider that your theme song ... and know, every moment (whatever's goin' on) ... that you're "enjoying the ride!" Amen. Hallelujah. Happy New Year! LoL Proofreader77 (interact) 01:18, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

PS Missing link?
re: User_talk:Proofreader77

You wrote: "This one was the best sorry [["

But there was nothing after the two open brackets. Did you mean to put a link there? (If not, disregard, but if you did, I'd surely like to hear what it was. :-) Proofreader77 (interact) 18:05, 1 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Many thanks ... Playing Grateful Dead this morning ... and now I can even spell it. LoL Proofreader77 (interact) 18:39, 1 January 2010 (UTC)

Semi-protected
I noticed some misuse of your userpage so I semi-protected it for a duration of time. Chillum (Need help? Ask me) 00:02, 2 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Thank you, much appreciated. seems the troll has been forced to move on. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 02:05, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Ophélie Bretnacher & Eva Rhodes
Your tenacity and want-to is amazing Raymond. I appreciate the fact that you were so willing to go up to bat for Ophelie. It is truely a sad situation. I just want to show you the difference between Jon Benet Ramsey 1, or Natalee Hollaway, 2 now compare Ophelie she had a spike of coverage when she died that has steadily petered away. It is the notabilityy aspect we were talking about. I did have a question is there any articles that highlite this death as a treaty sticking point? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:02, 16 December 2009 (UTC)

Hello and Happy new Year Hell in a Bucket,

I have it :

Les familles d'Eva Rhodes et d'Ophélie Bretnacher, autre étrangère disparue en Hongrie, envisagent d'adresser ensemble une plainte auprès de l’Union européenne

http://www.jfb.hu/node/837

D'après le correspondant de l'AFP en Hongrie, ces deux affaires ont été pour lui l'aspect le plus difficile de son métier de journaliste parce que « À cause de l’AFP, on est obligé de poser des questions douloureuses que, personnellement, on préférerait se garder de poser » http://www.jfb.hu/node/1026

Eva Rhodes & Ophélie Bretnacher have been kept  after 17 days of discussion I am very happy with the way the French Wikipedians have improved the page

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oph%C3%A9lie_Bretnacher

http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eva_Rhodes

Best Regards --Raymondnivet (talk) 13:15, 4 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Congratulations Raymond, the article looks real good. Off2riorob (talk) 14:30, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Hello hell In A Bucket,

Thank you for The resilient Barnstar, I'm very happy.

Now, that I have a new english text, what should I do? --Raymondnivet (talk) 22:30, 4 January 2010 (UTC)


 * Well now that the article has survived a deletion review on the French Wikipedia I don't think there should be aq problem adding it here. I can't speak french or I would offer my services. You might try rewriting the article in English and asking a editor to make sure that the spelling and context should be in English but I think it has a doubled chance of surviving here.Hell In A Bucket (talk) 00:47, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

It's done. It is on my User page User:Raymondnivet/Ophélie Bretnacher disappearance And I have asked some help. Thank you Hell In A Bucket.--Raymondnivet (talk) 09:00, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

Hello hell In A Bucket, Thank you for your help repeatedly, in fact everything I tried to January 5 th was deleted. I didn't want to disturb you so I tried on my own. Thank you for this. --Raymondnivet (talk) 10:02, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

help

 * It isn't official, but there is an essay on notability criteria for stadiums written at WikiProject Event Venues/Sports task force/Notability. Please let me know if there are any more questions.  Thanks!  --Mysdaao talk 17:51, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

AfD
Please see: Articles for deletion/Sister Vincenza Taffarel (2nd nomination).Borock (talk) 19:59, 7 January 2010 (UTC)

NRHP citation
What do you mean: have you requested and received nomination forms by snail mail, or something else? If you mean they've mailed you some forms, see WP:NRHPMOS, and for specifics of how I follow those guidelines, see the citation style I used at Zimmerman Kame. If you mean something else, accept my apology and please explain what you mean. Nyttend (talk) 06:01, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

I have finally recieved the documents on Union Ave. SO yes for the first question.Hell In A Bucket (talk) 06:05, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Re: Admin
Re, your message, sadly, I am not. However, as to nominations, I believe it was too soon. If I can go 6 months without losing my temper, then maybe, just maybe, I might be ready to accept a nomination. It is also too soon as I just got off a block.—  Dæ dαlus Contribs 01:31, 11 January 2010 (UTC)


 * When you choose to run...I will support. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 01:33, 11 January 2010 (UTC)

ANI Rape of Nanking image discussion
I would suggest that you leave the conversation alone, as you stated you were going to do. The discussion is getting quite heated, and ANI is not the place to discuss it. Don't unarchive or unhide that thread again please. - Tbsdy lives (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) talk 07:27, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * P.S. While not currently an admin, not only am I aware of how the noticeboards work, I actually founded WP:AN, and endorsed the split of WP:AN/I when it occured shortly thereafter. - Tbsdy lives (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) talk 07:29, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * No shit? Nice. Seriously, I think that this is an issue and yes it was getting heated. Getting accused of being a prude really irks me, I do like the touch of trying to insinuate I was making legal threats. I do not intend on dropping this completely but for tonight it might be best. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 07:32, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Watch your language. Children might be reading. :) ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 07:35, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * No shit indeed. I would suggest discussing the matter on a forum other than WP:AN/I, as this is not the appropriate place to change existing policy. - Tbsdy lives (formerly Ta bu shi da yu) talk 07:34, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Ah well, thanks for your efforts. Sorry I didn't stick around to participate in the discussion, but I had to get to bed. It's nice to know I'm not the only one who thinks that image doesn't belong in an general knowledge encyclopedia. And no, thinking so doesn't make us prudes :). 67.48.115.204 (talk) 12:09, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Hey there Hell in a Bucket, I noticed the thread on Jimbo's and earlier yesterday found myself at the Rape of Nanjing article. It is a horrible photo, and I spent an hour or so thinking about it before I went to bed.  I was old enough during Vietnam to be watching the footage of the girl (who was my age) running towards the camera, nude, on fire; a moment in time I will never forget.  So my thoughts were:  a) This dead, mutilated torso has nothing left but to remind us of the atrocities that an average human can commit (and perhaps make us think about that in the way that less severe photos may not), and b) perhaps it would be possible to have these "rated R" photos blanked so that you had to reveal them in the article, and didn't just open an article and find yourself confronted by that image first thing.  Just an attempt to find an alternative.  :-) Oberonfitch (talk) 17:15, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I would support the click and link. There is a lot of content on WP which might benefit from the ability to make a choice.  Having recently inadvertently exposed my eyes to Goatse...lol  Oberonfitch (talk) 17:39, 13 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Turns out we have a page for that Options to not see an image, which has options for not seeing images we'd prefer not to see. Heironymous Rowe (talk) 20:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Keeping front page of Jehovah's Witness page locked
HIAB (I'm calling you HIAB for Hell in a Bucket, that's my name for you, good? Question, the front JW page used to have a lock on it. It is a controversial page, and I've seen people come and go leave all sorts of things on it anonymously. JW's are currently under somewhat of a seige in Russia, and this in the past has led to persecution and martyrdom, so it's an important topic and the way it is presented is important. Is there anyway we can get the page locked, so that only posted editors can make changes? Thanks. --Natural (talk) 22:20, 13 January 2010 (UTC)

Jake, Thanks for the feedback. My name is Scott. I teach in Newark, NJ. Are you into art? I wanted to give you a good link for a book. I'm into art and poetry, but am in the process of certification in science. What do you do for work? Thanks for all the help. Nice picture, I'm going to try to upload a pleasant picture also. It's presonable, thanks again.--Natural (talk) 21:21, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Fellow Colorado Citizen :-)
Much better weather, huh? That cold snap was, well, unusually cold. LOL. Oberonfitch (talk) 23:23, 13 January 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm up by Fort Collins, proud sponsor of alternative transportation methods. See my User page.  :-) Oberonfitch (talk) 02:18, 14 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Ah, so you had a cold snap? I was in the Denver area over New Years and loved the warm weather so much that I forgot my coat and accidentally left it there when I returned to Ohio.  I'm so thankful for a backup...Nyttend (talk) 07:08, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
 * It wasn't actually as cold as it could have been. For comparison, about ten years ago, all the rooster's combs froze off.  So, you know, happily that didn't happen.  But I still have drifts of snow around the house (unheard of!) which is a lot more like living in Illinois where what snows, stays.  Ohio, well, same problems as Illinois as far as weather, but then you can grow stuff there.  And you have actual rivers, not streams pretending to be...  :-) Oberonfitch (talk) 13:51, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Oh, and hi there, Hell :-) Oberonfitch (talk) 13:51, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Kinda funny but look at Pueblo Colo weather. We've had lovely nice and warm weather. No snow at all. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 19:23, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, huge difference in climates. Did you see what is happening over at four corners?  Everything closed.  Oberonfitch (talk) 19:59, 22 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Up here, we seldom get snow until February. This year, thus far, 9 substantial snowstorms.  We're getting the snow intended for the ski areas.  Very weird. Oberonfitch (talk) 20:01, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Question?
Who went to ANI? Proofreader77 (interact) 06:12, 14 January 2010 (UTC)

Talkback
 ttonyb (talk) 08:08, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Ophélie Bretnacher III
Hello Hell in a Bucket, O. B. is out the speedy deletion. Ophélie Bretnacher disappearance Bests regards --Raymondnivet (talk) 09:34, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/S33k4ndd3str0y
Did you mean to leave your evidence section blank? Rhomb (talk) 22:33, 15 January 2010 (UTC)


 * NO i didn't Let me go and add. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 22:35, 15 January 2010 (UTC)

WP:ANI
I think it's backlogged again, as I am getting personal attacks left, right and centre from an IP editor for the past few hours, and yet nothing has been done about it. Rapido (talk) 20:58, 22 January 2010 (UTC) (PS. If a response, can you respond here? Thanks)


 * Unfortunately if the ANI board is backlogged the only thing we can do is try to keep the disruption from hemmorhaging. It's a bummer but these things take time. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 22:48, 22 January 2010 (UTC)

Ophélie Bretnacher (last)
Yes finally. Thank you, Hell In A Bucket, for all your help. I have starded "Disparitions" for French WP http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disparition and Alicia Ross is inside. What are for you the 5 most important in USA ? Best regards --Raymondnivet (talk) 14:51, 23 January 2010 (UTC) The highest publicized disappearances or deaths (I think that's what you asked for) IN my opinion Natolee Halloway, Jon Benet Ramsey, Laci Peterson those are the only ones I can think of offhand. Sorry. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:32, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Barnstar to HARRIS.news?
You may want to reconsider a barnstar you gave to User talk:HARRIS.news for plagiarim (a copy of List of Italian architects). Just sayin' -- Alexf(talk) 15:09, 5 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Yeah I just saw that. Would you mind looking at the history of my talkpage and throw an extended block to my anon Ip friend? Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:10, 5 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Thanks that's actually a sockpuppet of a blocked user the second ip it's used tonight Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:15, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
 * Done. Remember AIV is the place but after proper warnings given. In this case, they have no business doing this and it is a school. They should know better. -- Alexf(talk) 15:16, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
 * This was actually a continuation from [] and the 3rr board that's why I reported without going through all the warnings again. Hell In A Bucket (talk) 15:19, 5 November 2013 (UTC)
 * I see now. thanks. -- Alexf(talk) 15:21, 5 November 2013 (UTC)