User talk:Useddenim/Archive 2

Re: template:BSrow
Like this? Please calm down and capture how it looks like in your browser because the map looks fine in Firefox 12 after purging and ctrl+F5 for several times. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 03:54, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

NXEC route, as displayed on my computer in Safari 4.1.3 running OS X 10.4.11. It appears that the rows are center-justified, instead of being aligned correctly. Useddenim (talk) 10:36, 27 April 2012 (UTC)


 * . The problem is actually on BSrow-sc. I guess Firefox and IE's default value for align is "left" but "none" in Safari, leaving margin:auto in the BSrow-sc to align the whole collapsible section to center. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 12:42, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Template:Northern Line diagram
I've made an alteration to your tightening up - a | had crept in on one line, and this put Seaforth & Litherland and Kirkby on the wrong lines. I've got 'em right now - never edited one of those things before and don't intend to again if I can help it (reminds me of trying to set up a graphic screen in COBOL...). Took 15 minutes to work that out. 8-[  Peridon (talk) 10:38, 27 April 2012 (UTC)
 * Presume you mean as text of varying density? . -- Red rose64 (talk) 20:58, 27 April 2012 (UTC)

Re: Template:Slamannan Railway
No. The problem is that you applied div float:right in the text cell, just remove it because it's not functional and the floated object conflicts with the [expand/collapse] button thus causing the following text cells to align incorrectly. This is the very reason BS-sc templates does not provide note 2 cell (right-aligned). Anyway I still created BS6-replace for completion. OK, you used the time-dist. cell instead of main text cell!!! LOL!!! -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 04:24, 6 May 2012 (UTC)

BSrow-2sc
I have created BSrow-2sc, BS3-2sc, BSrow-2replace and BS3-2replace. The replace is still buggy that I have no idea why the icon columns of BS*-2replace float to left without any code ordering it to. But you can use the BS3-2sc now or create more BS*-2sc if needed. Note that in my sandbox2 page, you must apply the tw-left parameter to define the width of the left text cell in every BS*-2sc row and 1 single non-collapsible BS*-2 row to optimize the overall width of the map, otherwise the icons won't join cohesively between BS*-2sc and BS*-2 rows. Have fun. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 03:00, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

P.S. you should archive some of your older discussion topics. It takes me quite some time to load your take page... -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 03:00, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

Template:Clydesdale Junction Railway
Re your edit of Clydesdale Junction Railway. Can I suggest: Both probably misleading (not wrong) info I originally put in, and your edits show this. Keep up the good work the templates are looking good. --Stewart  ( talk |  edits ) 13:53, 25 May 2012 (UTC)
 * At Motherwell the Wishaw and Coltness Railway goes straight up and the Coalburn Branch points to the right.
 * At Rutherglen the GCR points to the left (rather than down)
 * Useddenim (talk) 04:39, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

Just noticed I put in another error with regards to the crossing of the GCR over the Clyde. Have a look at where you will see there is only one bridge. The template for Glasgow Central Railway is correct, whilst this template is incorrect. --Stewart  ( talk |  edits ) 16:34, 26 May 2012 (UTC)


 * again. Useddenim (talk) 20:06, 29 May 2012 (UTC)

Breaks in route maps
I've hesitated bringing this up in case it's "just me" - and I do appreciate the work you're doing to improve the route map templates - but on just about every one you've edited that I've looked at, I'm seeing 'breaks' in the line of route. This includes the two Shields Junction maps on this talk page. The problem seems to be related to the blue arrows for diverging routes sometimes appearing on a different line from the associated text. Any ideas? – Signal head  &lt; T &gt;  20:46, 26 May 2012 (UTC)


 * I am tempted to say "it's just you" as I've been doing these for some time, using Explorer, Foxfire, Safari and Chrome working in both Windows 7 and OS X (and it is a know problem that Explorer sometimes displays table incorrectly). The only time that I've seen your problem (aside from outright coding errors, such as leaving a blank line in the diagram whilst editing), is when a table/diagram is forced to an arbitrarily narrow width, so that could be starting point for your investigation. Hope this helps. Useddenim (talk) 21:32, 26 May 2012 (UTC)


 * I should clarify that the previous versions of the templates, prior to your edits, all display correctly for me.– Signal head  &lt; T &gt;  21:40, 26 May 2012 (UTC)


 * If only few rows break, the general cause is the text is too long and forced to soft-return. The only way to solve it is to move some text to the next row instead of cramming them in 1 single row. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 03:11, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Perhaps the Map template should be revised to contain  style? I really am at a loss to say what could be causing this for  (who seems to be the only person having a problem), as it's just icons being changed… Useddenim (talk) 03:45, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * No... The white-space:nowrap causes the table row behaves strangely with the [show/hide] collapsible button. Also, map editor is obligated to format the map text properly so the text cell does not stretch too long for reader with low screen resolution. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 04:15, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * OK, scratch that idea. Any other thoughts why this might be occurring? Also, when you say "low resolution", do you mean 640×480, cell phone size, or what? Useddenim (talk) 12:44, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm using a screen resolution of 1280x1024, the highest setting available.– Signal head  &lt; T &gt;  12:51, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * What browser are you using? Can you capture a screenshot of the map (and upload to Commons)? -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 12:56, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm using Internet Explorer 8 and this is what I'm seeing. Notice how where there's a break, there's a blue arrowhead by itself with the associated text on a different line. I'm guessing that for anyone who's seeing these maps correctly, the arrowhead and text are both on the same line?– Signal head  &lt; T &gt;  13:31, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * TBH, IE8 is pretty much deprecated. Sorry to say, but the problem is far too complicated for nowrap to solve because IE8 or older browsers force table (&#123;&#123;BSsplit2}}) to be shown on the next new row exclusively, while newer browsers conditionally allow it. If for whatever reason you can't install IE9, you should move on to other browsers like Firefox (my recommendation) or Safari. But well... BSsplit2 can be modified so the rmri is the integral part of the template... I suppose. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 14:18, 27 May 2012 (UTC)


 * Just noticed that the breaks have gone. Thanks to whoever sorted that.– Signal head  &lt; T &gt;  23:02, 30 May 2012 (UTC)

Cunning plan
I hope you noticed my cunning trick to get montmartre to work in Template:PA icon - yes it needed a redirect - but it had to be done on the Commons. &mdash; RHaworth (talk · contribs) 17:41, 23 June 2012 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the fix. And I'm glad to see that at least one person is checking my work. 8-) Useddenim (talk) 20:31, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

RDT West Corridor
About this: Well, too bad you didn’t like it, but at least it made me add new icons to the repertoire (will be useful somewhere else), brought my attention to some renaming inconsistencies that we all need to sort ( vs., vs. , and a few more), and taught me about the R.T.D. itself.

However I find it hardly consistent that you think «cluttering» when I homogenize a mix of and  style icons, not to mention you reverting my straightforward correction of kludgy  to … That’s assuming no-good faith, being trigger happy on the revert button, or what?

Tuvalkin (talk) 15:14, 13 June 2012 (UTC)


 * No, it was more a matter of only having a few minutes before breakfast and work. The reason for the combination of and  is to differentiate between regular (arterial) roads and expressways (or do we need a set of RP6 and RP8 icons?). WRT : this icon should probably be named, while  is more correctly  or . Oh, and I don't think  had been created yet when I did the diagram. Useddenim (talk) 15:53, 13 June 2012 (UTC)


 * Answering now, forgot about this. My replies:
 * Combination of and  is unexpected because the “naturalistic” generic set intends to represent roads when their toll class and other such “roadological” considerations are not relevant. In diagrams where they are relevant, I expect only things like, , , or  (messy names, yeah!). But of course each project (and even each edtor maybe) is free to use those icons as they see fit.
 * Meanwhile I needed and I created it. And now I see that it should be named  — bummer.
 * Finally might not have been created when you did the diagram, but it surely existed already when you decided to revert my edit that used it to replace the stacked kludge you kept there.
 * Tuvalkin (talk) 04:16, 27 June 2012 (UTC)


 * moved; replaced by ; and on North American maps, generally  represents a toll road,  is either an expressway or an arterial road,  (usually) minor country roads, and  "unclassiified". Useddenim (talk) 10:37, 27 June 2012 (UTC)

AMT logo
Why would you create a duplicate logo? That makes no sense. If it is PD then there should be replacement not two of the same logo, which will just cause confusion. Sw2nd (talk) 16:40, 7 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Take a closer look. The original is ©, whereas the Commons version is just simplified enough (an arc and a hollow ellipse) to be OK. Useddenim (talk) 20:57, 7 July 2012 (UTC)

July 2012
Welcome to Wikipedia. It might not have been your intention, but your recent edit removed content from Île-de-France tramway Line 1. When removing content, please specify a reason in the edit summary and discuss edits that are likely to be controversial on the article's talk page. If this was a mistake, don't worry; the content has been restored, as you can see from the [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=%C3%8Ele-de-France_tramway_Line_1&action=history page history]. Take a look at the welcome page to learn more about contributing to this encyclopedia, and if you would like to experiment, please use the sandbox. Thank you. Breawycker (talk to me!) 21:53, 8 July 2012 (UTC)
 * If this ham-fisted admin had bothered to actually read the edit summary and look at the page instead of just the character count, he would have noticed that all of the information that had previously been in a table had been moved into the RDT, and that then entire page was now less cluttered. Useddenim (talk) 22:25, 8 July 2012 (UTC)

Template:Rail-interchange
I've removed the file File:SNCF.svg from this template again. Per WP:NFCC #9, the use of non-free images on templates is strictly forbidden. There is no wiggle room on this, no debate point. It's an absolute prohibition. You can insult me if you like, as you did to User:Hullaballoo Wolfowitz but this has no effect on the wording nor the application of this policy. I recommend you find some alternative to using this image. If you persist in restoring this image in violation of WP:NFCC policy, it is likely you will be blocked. If you have questions, I am at your disposal. Thanks for your time, --Hammersoft (talk) 03:06, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * It's not the policy (which I understand and attempt to adhere to—see this vs. this) that I object to, but the actions of admins who rush in and make changes without checking to see if their actions were done correctly. Rail-interchange is used on some 4–6,00 pages, and thanks to and you, some of them now display   instead of an image. If you're not going to edit correctly, then I stand by my assertion that you're no better than a disruptive vandal. Useddenim (talk) 04:14, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Calm down please, Useddenim. But I'm on Hammersoft's side. Wikipedia has a very strict copyright policy. It's preferred to adhere to the copyright law than preserving the layout of our article as the consequence for copyright infringement can be more grave than tons of badly coded articles. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 04:18, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Sameboat, read what Useddenim wrote: What’s “overzealous” and indeed vandal-like is not abiding to a policy — but to deface a widely used template by leaving a gaping hole that looks like " ". Why not replace it with a blank spacer image or even just remove the file link altoghther? That’s either being unacceptably reckless or unacceptably incompetent. Adding veiled threats of banning makes it all disgusting. I’m shocked to witness this kind of admin-trolling in wp:en — I thought you guys were immune to this. Tuvalkin (talk) 04:56, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Tuvalkin, what admin-trolling are you referring to? And calling a breakage of template 'unacceptably reckless or unacceptably incompetent' is also not the way forward.  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 05:21, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Useddenim, if a template was broken by another editor, you assume good faith that the editor broke it without understanding, and you repair it - you do not revert the image back in to unbreak it, reinserting a WP:NFCC violation, and leave it at that for 17 hours. You even failed to ask Hullaboo Wolfowitz why he did not do it differently, no, instead you just walk away with a personal attack. I suggest you withdraw your personal attacks on Hammersoft for calling him a disruptive vandal, and Hullaboo Wolfowitz for calling him an overzealous editor, and take more care next time you re-insert an image in violation of WP:NFCC. You are out of line. --Dirk Beetstra T C 05:21, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I was not the one who added the SNCF logo, that was . And I wasn't assuming bad faith on the part of, just laziness. Someone who sports more than half-a-dozen barnstars and other awards on his user page should know better than to engage in "hit-and-run" editing. Useddenim (talk) 10:45, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I did not say you added that logo, I said you re-added the logo. Assuming laziness equals assuming good faith?  And what is blindly revering, twice, instead of actually solving a problem?  I still expect that you withdraw the personal attacks.  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 12:38, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Whatever happened to "You broke it, you fix it?" 128.205.48.117 (talk) 13:13, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Whatever happened to "you violated policy, I undid your edit"? Adding non-free images to templates breaks them. --Hammersoft (talk) 13:17, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Dear IP - but that was not what was done - Useddenim did not ask Hullaboo Wolfowitz to repair what they broke, that would indeed have been the better solution. Instead, it was blindly reverted with a personal attack.  I'm still waiting for Useddenim to 'fix' (withdraw) what he 'broke' (the personal attacks).  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 13:30, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

Regarding the same template, and WP:NFCC, you may also want to revisit what you did here, if I see it correctly, you have there inserted a non-free image in a template. --Dirk Beetstra T C 05:32, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Hmm, you may be correct, although how much simpler can File:Verkehrsverbund_Rhein-Ruhr_2010_logo.svg get to remain Non-free logo rather than PD-shape? Useddenim (talk) 10:45, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * You may be correct as well. I think the correct sequence now is to remove the file from the template, and if you think it is wrongly tagged, discuss the change of tagging, and if that discussion comes to a change of tag, reinsert the image again.  At the moment, it is still violating WP:NFCC.  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 12:38, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * And the correct place to discuss its copyright status is Media copyright questions. --Hammersoft (talk) 13:00, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

@Tuvalkin: WP:NFCC #9 is an absolute prohibition. People who willfully violate it are routinely blocked. I am not an administrator so it is impossible for me to block someone. Because of that, attributing a "veiled threat" to me is wholly inaccurate. You accuse me and Hullaballoo of being unacceptably reckless or unacceptably incompetent for not putting a spacer image in. I could just as well accuse people who add non-free content in violation of policy of the same thing. There were multiple opportunities for Useddenim to add a spacer image and he chose not to, instead preferring to violate policy. So, your claims of me and Hullabaloo being incompetent/reckless carry no weight. Now that you and Useddenim are both aware of this policy and how strict it is, I am quite confident that both of you will competently prevent such usage in the future. --Hammersoft (talk) 12:13, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I’m well aware of the restrictions on non-free images; indeed I was against the use of non-free images at all in my native wp (my side lost). But I’m also against the prevailing environment in Wikipedia(s) where an obvious troll is assumed to be in good faith while people obviously commited to the improvement of the project are treated like criminals and their work dully dafaced. You not an admin? Big deal. You mentioned he could be banned, worded in such a way that it was not a friendly advice, it was a threat — doens’t have to be carried out by yourself. You removed an image from a template and left a redlink in it. That was incredibily sloppy. Tuvalkin (talk) 22:54, 25 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I hope you will extend the same to Useddenim and Slasher-fun - they included the non-free images in a template, that is incredibly sloppy. --Dirk Beetstra T  C 06:14, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I see. So despite concerns being raised here about personal attacks, you continue by accusing me of being an "obvious troll". Tuvalkin, I encourage you to read No personal attacks. It isn't just a good idea, it's policy. So, I'll extend the same olive branch to you; you can cease with the personal attacks or if you continue to use personal attacks in violation of policy I'm confident there will be significant consequences to your editing ability. You can call that a threat if you like, but it isn't as I can't block you. Call it a prognostication. --Hammersoft (talk) 12:43, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
 * (Yawn.) I am very much interpreting your words as a threat. And I never called you or anyone here an «obvious troll» — you’re free to not read what I wrote and feel offended. I myself, I’m going to get some dinner. Toodles! Tuvalkin (talk) 20:23, 26 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I asked for that clarification, Tuvalkin, what admin-trolling were you talking about earlier? And calling someone incredibly incompetent is casual conversation I am sure.  I still hope that you extend that concern to Useddenim and Slasher-fun.  And sure, you call that a threat, I call it a fair warning.  --Dirk Beetstra T  C 03:54, 28 July 2012 (UTC)

@Useddenim: Now that you are aware of File:Verkehrsverbund Rhein-Ruhr 2010 logo.svg being used on that template in violation of policy, I'm confident you will address this issue? --Hammersoft (talk) 12:36, 25 July 2012 (UTC)


 * Regarding File:Verkehrsverbund_Rhein-Ruhr_2010_logo.svg, I suggest you also asking Media copyright questions if removing the hexagon rim make it copyright-ineligible because font is generally not protected by copyright law (e.g. File:English Pokémon logo.svg). -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 13:06, 25 July 2012 (UTC)

I've removed the image while it is being discussed - feel free to revert me when this issue is resolved. Thanks. --Dirk Beetstra T C 13:10, 25 July 2012 (UTC)


 * I plea, implore all of you, stop escalating the personal attack argument, not only it's not the proper place to "discuss" it, it just ruins the community harmony. I know it too well, recently there were another similar dramas hosted in Jimbo's talk page by 2 users with considerable contributions. The end result was so unpalatable until Jimbo actively closed those "discussions". Just let it go, please everyone. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 16:26, 26 July 2012 (UTC)


 * No, not the argument does that, but the utterly unnecessary personal attacks do that, but that is what is chosen by many people, something is wrong, but if you yell back, it is fine. --Dirk Beetstra T  C 17:40, 26 July 2012 (UTC)

Bloor-Danforth line Map
Would it be possible for you to make a "horizontal" map of the Bloor-Danforth line that will help to satisfy the article's FAC commenters? Tarret  ''talk 14:01, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * Sure. Did you want an .svg drawing, or an RDT created with BS icons? Useddenim (talk) 15:50, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't understand the need for a new map. The Route Template, you have worked on, looks very detailed (perhaps overdetailed) but it certainly does no leave out anything. Secondarywaltz (talk) 16:13, 1 August 2012 (UTC)
 * and why "horizontal"? Secondarywaltz (talk) 16:15, 1 August 2012 (UTC)

Pa Trolley?
If I'm right in what I think your asking. . . voting yes! MarketDiamond 10:20, 12 August 2012 (UTC)

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Speedy deletion nomination of Useddenim/Highway


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Captions
How can I help to add back captions to the pages needed? -- Magioladitis (talk) 07:15, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

Merge infobox bus to infobox automobile?
Merger proposed at today's TfD. -- Magioladitis (talk) 12:18, 22 August 2012 (UTC)

Look at Leyland Olympic, all the manufacturing and production detail at the top of the page was made invisible to the casual user thanks to this not too well considered desire to standardise infoboxes... glad to see the box has now been restored. I'll say more on the discussion pageStephen Allcroft (talk) 11:22, 24 August 2012 (UTC)Stephen Allcroft

Nomination for deletion of Template:BS-anleitungR
Template:BS-anleitungR has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 10:23, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:BS-ÜWjunctions
Template:BS-ÜWjunctions has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) (talk) 10:24, 12 September 2012 (UTC)

ZiS-154 and TDH-3610
What's the source of information about license production of american bus and usage of 6-cylinder DD 6-71 instead of 4-cylinder Soviet analogue? Ain92 (talk) 14:11, 30 September 2012 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Yamatoji Line RDT
Template:Yamatoji Line RDT has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Sfan00 IMG (talk) 17:12, 3 October 2012 (UTC)

Change in template for DST2l_legende
Your latest change in this template from DST2l to DSTl is incorrect: now this template is shown wrongly (file does not exist). Please fix this.
 * Template was fixed at the same time the icon was renamed. It mayhave taken some time for your browser to update hte image in cache.
 * I pressed Ctrl-F5 to reload all yesterday, there was no effect. But now it is OK, so nothing to care whatever the reason, thank you.

As for name change - I suppose it is incorrect now (but I do not insist since many names are incorrect). Look at INTl and INT2l. I named DST2l because it corresponds to size of INT2l. Intl is wider. MUR 07:56, 8 ноября 2012 (UTC)
 * Name was changed to match (existing) and . Useddenim 16:32, 9 November 2012 (UTC)
 * OK. Names of INT also may be changed to match existing. MUR (talk) 19:17, 9 November 2012 (UTC)

Hello. There is currently a discussion at Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. --Туча (talk) 23:40, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

Vandalism
Do not call other people's edits "Vandalism" unless it fits the strict criteria at WP:VANDAL. This edit summary was unnecessary and incivil. You will do better if you try to communicate through talk pages, not summaries. Dennis Brown - 2&cent;    &copy;   Join WER 00:06, 15 November 2012 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I should have called it edit warring. See here for context. Useddenim (talk) 02:05, 19 November 2012 (UTC)


 * Not a problem. She had brought it to ANI, it was a mistake so I had to acknowledge the mistake and just leave you a note.  We all make mistakes.  I also quickly closed the ANI discussion as I didn't see any need to do anything other than what I did above, just note to you that it was a mistake.  We see a lot of problems with mislabeled reverts that way, which is why it is always better to use the talk page, even if you use a summary, to explain.  If it goes to ANI or 3RR, that information is helpful as it demonstrates your willingness to engage and try to resolve the problem.  Dennis Brown -  2&cent;    &copy;   Join WER 02:12, 19 November 2012 (UTC)

Template:Border icons
Template:Border icons has a couple of missing icons. Since you have done some work on it can you check it out? Cheers. -- Alan Liefting (talk - contribs) 18:22, 4 December 2012 (UTC)

Talkback
ww2censor (talk) 13:56, 26 December 2012 (UTC)

HST legende
Just a request. Is it possible for you to fill in some of the missing HST legendes (forward and backward, for instance) as I have some uses for them? Thanks. Britmax (talk) 22:00, 28 December 2012 (UTC)

User:Tuvalkin
Any idea? User:Tuvalkin gone wild? -DePiep (talk) 23:25, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
 * No, I don't think so. has been working with me on BSicons for a couple of years now, and I've found him to be reasonable and thoughtful. It might help to give some context for your questions, though. Useddenim (talk) 23:58, 5 January 2013 (UTC)
 * I was kind of joking. Could have done better I admit. -DePiep (talk) 00:21, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Not funny. Useddenim (talk) 00:58, 6 January 2013 (UTC)

Signpost interview
It seems the signpost creator never contacted you for the interview about using RDT in the lead infobox. But I think you should participate and write down your thoughts about the present and future of the RDT project. Wikipedia Signpost/Newsroom/WikiProject desk/Interviews. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 01:23, 22 January 2013 (UTC)

Template:Northern Suburbs Light Rail
Thanks for the changes you made to the template. While it took me a while to figure out I have since realised what the hollow grey stationsn are - intermodal - Which brings me to my next question. The Northern Suburbs Railway is proposed to be a single track Line with passing loops (2 platforms) at New Town, Derwent Park, Glenorchy and Claremont. Is there a way to demonstrate this on the route map. Kind Regards Wiki ian 02:14, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * ✅. Useddenim (talk) 13:41, 11 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Thank you so much. I thought I scoured every part of the icons page trying to find those loop icons. Clearly I wasn’t looking in the right place. Since your knowledge of railway route maps is clearly superior to my own, I was wondering if you could fix the "line continues" at the bottom of each map? When creating the route map, I decided to create it as light blue - meaning its not in operation?. However I couldn't find a way to join a non-operational light rail line with an operational heavy rail line. Basically from my understanding, the heavy rail should be red, not pink as the South Line is still in use. And if this can be fixed is there icons for heavy rail spur lines (in use and not in use) coming of the light rail line?
 * That's because I just added them to the Catalog. (Also, the HST versions already existed, but I created the BHF and INTs for your diagram.) Useddenim (talk) 18:54, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * I found the Line continues icon on Commons, however if you know of an easy place to find them on Wikipedia, please let me know. Wiki ian 15:34, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Route diagram template/Catalog of pictograms/straight tracks. Useddenim (talk) 18:54, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

One final question... I want to add the parking icon to the route map (Granton in the first route map, claremont in the second, none in the third) as one of the stations is proposed to have a Park and ride facility. Should and how would I go about doing this without over cluttering the route map? Wiki ian 15:54, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Parking added to the Rail-interchange template. Useddenim (talk) 18:54, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * ✅. Useddenim (talk) 20:08, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

Thankyou once again. I found the icons I need to create the heavy rail spur lines. But in removing the BS3, its seems I can no longer do that (if you look at South Line Template and see the Fingal line spur, you'll understand what I'm trying to do). or am I mistaken again? And additionally, I left another message with Sameboat in regards to issues I'm having with 2 route maps. Could you also help there? I'm very greatful for your help. Wiki ian 20:28, 11 March 2013 (UTC)

Template:South Line (Tasmania)
I reverted your last edit on the template for the reason that the stations you changed were in fact passenger stations that are no longer in use (they never handled freight). While Hobart used to be a passenger (as well as a freight) station, it is now soley used as a freight station. I'm not sure if there is an icon that reflects this? Thankyou once again for helping to make these tamplates as good as they can possibly be. Kind regards, Wiki ian 00:12, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

IRC
Actually, I didn't add anything...I just reformatted and reworded a couple of sections to make them a bit clearer. Thank you anyway, though...I am a bit of a transportation buff (and old enough to vaguely remember the trolleys here in L.A.) so the photos will be interesting.WQUlrich (talk) 18:37, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

New Northern Suburbs Railway Template
If you look here, you will see a new template I've been working on for the article. I'm trying to demonstrate the importance of the 3 main traffic corridors in Hobart's northern suburbs, but am unsure if I should replace the existing, more detailed templates or just add a new one. I havent put it up yet because I'm somewhat unhappy with it. The body of water is the Derwent River, the road with all the house icons is the Main Road and the road passing thru the round-a-bouts is the Brooker Highway. I wanted to label each on the template, but wasn't sure how to without giving the Template a cluttered look. I also wanted to make the brooker hwy appear as such on the template but found there just aren't enough icons. Any suggestions/improvements you can make before I move it over to the article? Wiki ian 20:51, 16 March 2013 (UTC)

Also the rail bridge and road bridge at the bottom of the route map are actually on the same bridge, the Bridgewater Bridge.... Is there a way to demonstrate this on the route map? Cheers, Wiki ian 20:57, 16 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Overly complicated in my opinion; you should probably contact who has created many detailed diagrams on wp:pt. I would leave the existing, and add a link to a new, stand-alone template.
 * et al. work just fine for labeling.
 * Any text editor can be used to create new  icons – just experiment using cut and paste with the desired elements from existing icons. (But what specifically did you need?)
 * Although it was 20 years ago when we honeymooned in Oz, I don't remember seeing maps with North at the top…
 * This (➚) should give you a starting point. (I used two different 2- to 4-lane transitions, ‘cause I didn‘t know which was more accurate.)
 * Useddenim (talk) 22:01, 16 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply. I was hoping you'd agree with a second route map, as I feel they both serve different functions. I'm not sure how arrows would go, but I could experiment. I noticed the compass on the Sandfly Colliery Tramway template but wasn't sure if that was your personal preference or guidlines. Many icons were missing from the catalogue, particularly icons going across rather than up and down. Lane transitions are a perfect example. The top right of the route map I've made one road going parallel to the proposed light rail. This is actually meant to be two one way roads(Davey Street and Macquarie Street) splitting up from the top intersection with the Brooker Highway but I couldn’t find Lane transitions going across rather than up or down. I really like the idea of editing the icons, as many I could download, rotate and re-upload, but what to name them and where would get me stuck. Other Examples:
 * Bowen bridge - I never meant to demonstrate the bridge as being that long, there just aren't small road bridges that pass over water (same goes with the bottom road bridge on the route map)
 * Road bridges going over rail - once again straight up but not across - this has caused me to design the route map in a less than ideal way.
 * highway icons. I spent all night last night trying to express the Brooker Highway as a highway on the route map - but there just aren't enough icons.
 * Town over road icons - once again, straight up and down but not across.

I have left a msg with, hopefully he'll have something for me to go on. Once again thankyou so much for your help. Wiki ian 09:12, 17 March 2013 (UTC)

Icons
See Template talk:Waterways legend. AlgaeGraphix (talk) 14:25, 17 April 2013 (UTC)

Template:512 St. Clair
Why are you (In fact, other than fixing a DAB link in List of bus routes in Kolkata, I don't see any interest in public transportation in your "contributions" history…) Useddenim (talk) 20:08, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) removing the "Terminus" flag from the legend of this template? and
 * 2) insisting on changing the route number (from a sample to an incorrect number)?
 * I try to solve a link to a disambiguation page. The link 00 leads you straight to a disambiguation page without any clear target. By changing it to nr. 05 I did get a valid link.
 * I can't be bothered with the fact that you look for excuses to disqualify me. I specialize in hunting down links to disambiguation pages in templates. I don't how many route diagrams of roads, canals, trains, metros, buses and others I have done but I did a few of your templates too.
 * So, please stop this joke and read Civility. The Banner talk 20:26, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
 * First off, there's nothing in the  coding of Rail-interchange that links the route number, only the icon. So I have no idea how you even thought there was a link to 00. And 05 also leads to a disambiguation page, so I don't see how that was any improvement. Besides, it was  who moved List of bus routes in Toronto to List of Toronto Transit Commission bus routes, introducing the redirect. (I'm not going to expend any more effort researching who changed the link from Toronto Transit Commission buses and when.) And finally, your edit completely fails on the first point of Civility: "Explain yourself". Useddenim (talk) 01:21, 19 April 2013 (UTC)


 * Funny how he deleted the entire thread with the comment "removed nonsense" when I rebutted him point by point. Useddenim (talk) 14:25, 19 April 2013 (UTC)

New problem
There is a problem in many articles with the RDT and I don't know the origin, but they can usually be fixed by using infobox rdt. Except in this case for 512 the route diagram is overly large. Secondarywaltz (talk) 14:08, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
 * "Overly large": too many icons? too long? too wide? too many links? too many template calls? Based on this thread, I think the problem is with the general RDT template, not this particular diagram. Useddenim (talk) 14:18, 9 May 2013 (UTC)
 * No! A problem happened recently in many infoboxes using a diagram but not infobox rdt. Look at the 512 article infobox now! This is just one. 14:25, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

Re: BS-KRZ
Sorry. There seems to be some template and wiki markup limitation. I tried to fix, but it only works if you substitute the template instead of transclude it in the map like this:

I'm sure the problem comes from the vertical bar. Substitute it with ! doesn't work at all. I've tried, but no good either. -- Sameboat - 同舟 (talk) 14:43, 14 May 2013 (UTC)

Waterways legend
Hi, I noticed that the Waterways legend has moved, and been replaced by another page. On that page there is a link to a table of icons, but it links to the railway table of icons. I have tried to understand how it all links together, but have failed. Any clues as to where I alter it so it links to the waterways table of icons? Bob1960evens (talk) 12:20, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Um, which page are we talking about? The old page was renamed Route diagram template/Catalog of pictograms/watercourses, becoming part of the BSicon catalog, and is linked to from BSicon. Its replacement (created because of whining by ) matches the other legend pages, and assumed the old name of Template:Waterways legend. The latter should be linked from the "Legend" link in the upper-right corned of any properly-constructed canal RDT (i.e. one that uses the BS-table-canal header, or specifies  (or   or  ) in BS-map or BS-table or BS-table3. (I thought I checked to make sure it was linked correctly.) A bit of a convoluted reply, but I hope it answers your question. Useddenim (talk) 12:50, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I should have been more specific. If I am on a page which includes a map template, Legend is displayed. If I click it I get to Template:Waterways legend. Towards the bottom of that page there is a link to [Catalogue of pictograms], but if I click it, it takes me to Route diagram template/Catalog of pictograms, rather than Route diagram template/Catalog of pictograms/watercourses. But the link is somehow hidden in a transcluded documentation page which I cannot find the location of, in order to edit it. Is that any clearer? Regards. Bob1960evens (talk) 13:29, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
 * The transcluded link is on BS-template, which is used on all the legend pages. However, once on Catalog of pictograms, there is a link at the bottom of the page (from BSicon) to Route diagram template/Catalog of pictograms/watercourses. Does this help? Useddenim (talk) 16:53, 19 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I have now found it. The route to the catalog is now sufficiently convoluted that I think I shall revert to using a link on my user page to get to it when I need it. Bob1960evens (talk) 16:23, 20 May 2013 (UTC)
 * …or just use BSicon. (talk) 16:41, 20 May 2013 (UTC)

List of night buses in London
Hi,

A few things, Yes history does have a place with wikipedia, as long as it's related to the subject. Did you have to copy word for word the information from the website you copied from? Ever heard of copyright! Route N89 was reintroduced in 2003, it's not a reintroduction since the current it not the same as the previous N89. And some of your link need to go somewhere, like for e.g. N81 there is no page for N81 so where is it going? CourtneyBonnick (talk) 14:49, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
 * It's not a copyvio if it's your own work. And yes, the distinction could be made more clearly between the original and current routes. And the additions were done in somewhat of a hurry, so pardon me if I missed the fact that there is no current N81 and I didn't add a subsection for the original. Alan Gryfe (Useddenim (talk) 15:00, 27 May 2013 (UTC).

I apologise I did not know and I apologise for being harsh. CourtneyBonnick (talk) 15:12, 27 May 2013 (UTC)
 * No problem. I was just trying to add some more “meat” to the article so that it wouldn’t be an AƒD candidate. Useddenim (talk) 15:24, 27 May 2013 (UTC)

Harrogate Line
Both Royal Gardens and Horsforth Woodside are listed in the article on the Harrogate Line so I don't see why they shouldn't both be in the associated RDT - Harrogate Line. If the RDT is only supposed to show the modern line then all the closed stations, lines to Leeds Central etc should come out and all that should be shown are the current or planned stations between Leeds and Poppleton. NtheP (talk) 10:01, 6 June 2013 (UTC)


 * There's something wrong about Royal Gardens—actully there's something wrong about the entire article: the route description reads as if it was written by a 16th century map illustrator (‘here lies…’), and the individual station pages don’t contain enough data to fix the contradictions and omissions. I based my deletion on the fact that the neighbourhood of Royal Gardens is some 2 miles southeast of Holbeck; and unfortunately, I don't have reference material (other than Google maps) available to me to sort this out. Can you offer any help? Useddenim (talk) 12:18, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
 * Lol, yes I was looking for a "here be dragons" entry myself. I don't know how well you know this part of Leeds but according to  Horsforth Woodside existed between at least 1850 and 1864.  There's some uncertainty about where it was but the best guess is that it was on Butcher Hill.  The other option is that it was at Woodside Quarry which would make sense from serving the quarry but would have been very inaccessible as this was mostly woodland at the time.  Have a look at http://www.old-maps.co.uk and the 1851 map of the area.  Royal Gardens was only in Bradshaw for a few months in 1857 but was near to the site of the current Burley Park and served the Leeds Zoological and Botanical Gardens then known in their second incarnation as Leeds Royal Gardens (http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=hIdc1pziHmoC&pg=PA168#v=onepage&q&f=false - mentions the station in 1853). It might even have been on the same site. NtheP (talk) 16:41, 6 June 2013 (UTC)
 * I stand—well, sit in front of my computer—corrected. In fact, I think there might even be enough information in your reply for a stub article about Royal Gardens. Are you up to it? Useddenim (talk) 18:05, 6 June 2013 (UTC) P.S. I only visited Leeds once, for a weekend when I was ten years old, and I actually think we spent more time in Sunderland, where my Dad had an acquaintance.
 * Hey, all done in good faith. I have a slight advantage in that I lived in the area for about 6 years so I know the geography fairly well - the bear pit was about two minutes from where I lived for a year.  An article on the Gardens is a good idea but I'm going away tomorrow for a week or so, so something to look at when I get back - if you haven't beaten me to it :-) NtheP (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2013 (UTC)

Duckmanton Junction Template
Dear Alan. I've replied at length to your first redraft of Duckmanton J, it is in my talk box, (I think, I'm very confused by what is where in correspondence) Here's what I've written, as belt and braces. Kind regards, Confused Dave

Hello Alan. Significant progress, impressive. I have two maps (and memory) in front of me and I'm confident Duckmanton (Ducky, locally) East Junction was three-way as I drafted it in my original. If it wasn't literally a three-way point it was as near as dammit. It was, if anything slightly north of the flyover viaduct, but no-one in their right mind could quibble with it being represented on the same horizontal on a route diagram. Your nice smooth curve between Ducky E and Ducky N Jcts is much better than mine. The S to E line (ie the one which set off WEST and curved over) from the flyover curved quite sharply right to hit DEJ running East-West as per the above, I don't have the skill to represent it as such on my diagram, so I cheated by exaggerating the curve to the West of the flyover. Your flyover angle is much better than mine, but you need a curve to its right. (I wish I could send you a map!!) My Duck S Jct is more accurate, it is best represented by a three-way junction, I have two wonderful photos in front of me confirming my strong memory. (I wish I could share these, too.) My crude representation implies the layout immediately north of DSJ was symmetrical, which it wasn't. The S to E line had to swing quite a way West to gain height and angle to cross over, yours show this well. The E to S line curved down quite snugly close to the flyover and ran its last few hundred yards parallel to the Up Main Line. Visually it looked like a third southbound track. My diagram shows it accurately, but with a greatly exaggerated distance bewteen the through N-S main line and the E to S line. Moving on to the overall picture. I agree that Ark T Junction was north of lines through Ark T Station and the bridge where the GC main line crossed the LD main line, but, whilst the kink you've cleverly put in addresses this and gives you somewhere to put the name of the station, it doesn't look right or square with memory. I think the solution, if it is possible, would be to start the northeastwards drift of the line at or even to the left (West) of the GCoverLD bridge. That is what happened on the ground and visually everyone looking at the LD sees it as simply EtoW, both on the ground and from a satellite. If that is impossible I suggest sticking with flat EtoW is slightly better, but I won't go to war over it. Much the same applies to the kink in the GC main to the north of DNJ. You are accurate in that the line did curve gently NNE and Staveley Central station was slightly East of a line through ATJct, but, as with the Arkwright kink, I find the curve in the main line confusing. The mal-effects are threefold: 1. it exaggerates the longitudinal angle of the tracks through Staveley Central, which had gently drifted back to nearly 0 degrees longitude in the area of Staveley Shed, 2. it makes the junction with the Chesterfield loop look quite wrong, the main line was visually and in fact straight, with the loop line off Westwards at a pretty sharp angle and 3. it makes the MR line under the bridge N of Staveley Central look very wrong, it ran E-W, curving very sharply S immediately after it ran under the GC (it still does, by the way.) I missed off the curve as irrelevant to the story, I add it for your benefit only. If you want to represent the fact that the line north of DNJ wasn't simply N-S then I suggest you lengthen the diagram between DNJ and the junction off to Chesterfield Central and make it a gentle S, with the Staveley Central area represented by my original. I leave to you whether to shorten the right hand line on the Midland, or leave it or curve it southwards. I really like the idea of pale grey for lifted lines. In my original I used dark pink for in use by passenger services and pale pink for in use (or in situ) but not by passenger services. Hope this makes sense. Kind regards, Dave DavidAHull (talk) 08:46, 2 June 2013 (UTC)
 * The end result is superb, thank you. DaveDavidAHull (talk) 06:06, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

A note at Commons
Hi, I've left a note at commons:User talk:Useddenim. -- Red rose64 (talk) 08:31, 7 June 2013 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Mid-Jordan Line
Template:Mid-Jordan Line has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the template's entry on the Templates for discussion page. Thatotherperson (talk/contribs) 07:28, 9 June 2013 (UTC)

LD&ECR Route Diagram
Hello Useddenim, thank you for turning my amateur efforts into something pro-looking. There is a downside, however. I want to add three things about which I intend to write articles, but I have to ask you to do it because I'm not up to your wizzo programming. The three are: Langwith Junction and Tuxford sheds and Tuxford Works. I've had a look around Wiki at engine sheds and "Engine Shed" seems to be the term generally used, though Tuxford, Langwith and Immingham railwaymen always called them "The Loco." as in "I've got to sign on at t' Loco. at half past ****ing three tomorrow morning."

I don't know if you know the LDECR, so I'll play safe and describe where they go, sorry if I'm telling you something you know very well. I'll describe them as if you are looking at the screen:

Langwith Junction shed was inside the curve leading from Shirebrook North to Shirebrook South, ie below and to the left of the Shirebrook North blob and above and to the right of the Shirebrook South blob.

Tuxford shed was inside the triangle formed by the LD, GN and West to North curve, next to the LD line.

Tuxford Works was outside the triangle, on the same (right hand, to a viewer) side of the tracks, ie below and to the right of the Tuxford Central blob.

I'd like to air some finesses:
 * 1) The summit of the line was at Scarcliffe station.
 * 2) Strictly, Doe Lea Viaduct didn't go over the river, which went under a culvert under the viaduct's western approach embankment, the viaduct did, however, go over the MR Doe Lea Branch.
 * 3) Boythorpe Viaduct went over two railway lines - the MR Brampton Branch and an industrial line.
 * 4) Horns Bridge famously went over two railways and the River Rother.

I couldn't figure out how to mark the summit and gave up, whether doing so adds info or clutter I leave to you.

If I had to choose between river and railway under Doe Lea Viaduct I'd choose railway.

I concluded that putting four railways and a river under Chesterfield's two viaducts would have confused more than helped, you may think differently.

Hope this makes sense. Kind regards, Dave DavidAHull (talk) 17:41, 29 May 2013 (UTC)


 * Chesterfield–Scarcliffe section done. Still musing the geometry required for Shirebrook and Tuxford. What destination(s) should be beside the  above Sheffield Midland? Useddenim (talk) 13:32, 30 May 2013 (UTC)
 * Does this → look right? —Alan Useddenim (talk) 18:32, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Hello Alan, impressive stuff. I fear the lines under Boythorpe V and Horns Bridge do look fussy, but that was the complicated reality, not a reflection on what you've done, would an exSTR between the two make it more digestible? Doe Lea V looks great, the summit at Scarcliffe adds rather than confuses. I had expected you to take a wholly different approach to the shed and works at Tuxford, ie add a black building and a black factory pictogram, one for each in the style of Scarcliffe's summit triangle, I'm sure I've seen such things but couldn't make them work. However, you're several light years ahead of me on all this, so I'll cheerfully bow to your experience. The Langwith J shed is on the wrong side of of the curve to Shirebrook South, I have added a diagram and shown its position in blue, the shed would be a blob on the end of my blue branch. It definitely was dead-end and did not connect onto the Shirebrook South line. Your work on Tuxford is seriously fab. I had assumed (for no good reason) that the works branched off the main line, but you are right, it did branch off the curve a very short distance from Tuxford West Junction. I know that the shed, like Langwith J, was dead end, and any locomotive coming off shed would have to start off westwards (up the screen). I don't have track plans of Tux to the same resolution as LJ, or the same personal knowledge. I have spent some time looking at 1955 OS map on screen and can't be sure whether there were connections to the shed off the curve, off the main line from the west only or from both west and east. I can't see any connection from shed to curve, I am confident that there was a connection from main line westwards (most duties set off in that direction and locos returned from that direction) I THINK any connection eastwards would have been via the sidings, so on balance I think it is safe to represent it as a simple dead end with just a westbound connection. Unless you know different... It might be easier and just as informative to represent them as buildings. I've stripped a line out of the Tux diagram, if it is fair the shed should be a terminal blob, as per LJ shed. Hope this makes sense. Kind regards, Dave DavidAHull (talk) 20:24, 30 May 2013 (UTC)

Finally, destinations beyond Sheff Mid: I represented Sheff Mid as a through station because it was and is, but as far as LDECR was concerned it was their final destination. I'm not sure what precedent is for such conundrums. Geographically the continuation would MML to St Pancras.
 * OK, I think it's done now. I have no actual knowledge of the LD&ECR or its envrions; I just did what I thought you were describing. Obviously you did well enough. I did tighten up the Tuxford/Dukeries area a bit, though. Feel free to point me towards any others that you think need a little ‘fixing up’. —Alan (Useddenim (talk) 03:59, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Great stuff, thank you. It commits me to doing articles on the works and sheds! Having cut my teeth on the LD I did the junctions at Arkwright, ie "Template:Duckmanton Junction". I reckon it represents both the configuration and the timeline. I had two problems I couldn't resolve, both tweaks, so I put it to bed. 1) I don't know how to do the "pointers" to the reference features Arkwright Colliery, Arkwright Town Station and Arkwright Town Junction, the blue lines and direction arrows solution I adopted are clear, but I longed for fine lines with dinky little arrowheads or some such. 2) the two road bridges where the A632 crossed the lines are also reference points over time. Ideally I would have liked to have them on all four snapshots, but I couldn't figure out how to show bridges over nothing, on the left in 1972 and on the right on 1987. Hope this makes sense. I have others, but my brain cell can only do one thing at a time. Pleasure working with you. Kind regards, Dave 86.146.16.160 (talk) 08:21, 31 May 2013 (UTC)

Dear Alan, I've just looked at the LD Route Diagram whilst starting to work on Spinkhill station and find that something has gone awry, have a look and you'll see what I mean - the Clipstone Junctions have gone skew-whiff and Tuxford Works have become detached. I've had a look from other stations and it looks ok. This smacks of version control, but I can't see how to fix it. Most mysterious. Dave DavidAHull (talk) 22:46, 12 June 2013 (UTC)
 * This is a temporary problem with Wikipedia that will right itself sometime soon. (The technical details are that some icons have been renamed, and there is a delay with the servers catching up.) Useddenim (talk) 13:02, 13 June 2013 (UTC) Phew! Thanks, Dave DavidAHull (talk) 06:36, 21 June 2013 (UTC)