User talk:Valereee/Archive 51

Welcome to the 2023 WikiCup!
Happy New Year and Happy New WikiCup! The 2023 competition has just begun and all article creators, expanders, improvers and reviewers are welcome to take part. Even if you are a novice editor you should be able to advance to at least the second round, improving your editing skills as you go. If you have already signed up, your submissions page can be found here. If you have not yet signed up, you can add your name here and the judges will set up your submissions page ready for you to take part. Any questions on the scoring, rules or anything else should be directed to one of the judges, or posted to the WikiCup talk page. Signups will close at the end of January, and the first round will end on 26 February; the 64 highest scorers at that time will move on to round 2. The judges for the WikiCup this year are: and. Good luck! MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 14:17, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

DYK votes
Not only does it not look like we won't have an actual result with the vote, but we are also basing a huge change off of the thoughts of 25 people. How many people at DYK are aware of the discussion? What is wrong with a community-wide discussion or at least mass-bot notifications to all regular participants at DYK? The voting discussion said that it "should be resolved quickly and informally". That is not acceptable for such a huge change. SL93 (talk) 21:40, 1 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Nothing it wrong with it. We probably would need that. This wasn't an announced RfC. It was stated as such in the instructions, I think?
 * I'm a little at a loss to understand where you're coming from, @SL93. I know you've felt for a long time that prep builders are overworked, and this idea is something that could help with that, but it's clear you think it's going in the wrong direction. What is it you think would instead be a better possible solution to investigate? Valereee (talk) 21:43, 1 January 2023 (UTC)
 * It was in the instructions, but it hasn't been clarified if a close to it means that we will automatically start acting on that change. It's an OK idea, but this method doesn't feel right to me. SL93 (talk) 21:44, 1 January 2023 (UTC)

Blocked User
NoSnowFlakes1, a user you previously blocked, is still making vulgar personal attacks on their talk page. Doesn't that warrant a revocation of their talk page access? $chnauzer 15:44, 2 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Seems like a nice guy. Valereee (talk) 16:05, 2 January 2023 (UTC)

Help at DYK
I didn't realize there was an issue at DYK until the WiR discussion brought my attention to this discussion. I have no excuses and plenty of time, so I'd be more than happy to help if you wouldn't mind pointing me in the right direction. - Aoidh (talk) 15:22, 3 January 2023 (UTC)


 * @Aoidh, omg, I'm thrilled! Thank you for being willing to help out! Okay, so it looks like you have plenty of experience, 22 DYKs, almost all in the past six months.
 * You'll want to use WP:PSHAW, which makes building preps logistically easy.
 * After that it's just a matter of getting the balance right, which other people at DYK will be thrilled to help you with. You want to think about things like alternating bio/non bio within the set, not more than 2-3 US-subject articles, no more than one music/military/science/whatever. You want to choose the image carefully -- not every image gets selected, be picky about whether the image is interesting, illustrates the hook well, and whether or not there's an image simply because it's a subject that's easy to get an image of (dead white guys and buildings are easy to get pictures of, for instance, while an 1890s image of a Black woman? Not so much), and of course look for an interesting "quirky" hook for the final slot.
 * The best place to start is the lowermost prep set, which gives you plenty of time to figure out what you're doing and gives others plenty of time to help you with your first effort. Right now that's Prep 7, and it's empty. If you want to start, you can put an on it to let others know, and when you've got it filled to the best of your knowledge/ability, open a section at WT:DYK and ask for critiques. Be ready for plenty, and don't feel bad about any of it, prep building has a learning curve. :D Ping me with any questions, or come back here if you prefer. Valereee (talk) 15:59, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Awesome thanks, I will start on that right now. - Aoidh (talk) 16:03, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * A couple of quick questions if you don't mind (if you're on Discord I'd be happy to chat with you there) but with Template:Did you know nominations/Tomb of the Unknown Soldier (France) for example, I would need to wait for the reviewer to come back and approve the fixes before promoting right? Also I'm assuming that I should skip over hooks that I myself have reviewed (such as Template:Did you know nominations/Monaco GP (video game)). - Aoidh (talk) 16:19, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * I added three to Template:Did you know/Preparation area 7 (though I think I should switch spot 3 and 4 around so there's a bio in-between 2 non-bios done), but the problem I ran into is that I didn't see any more hooks that looked obviously ready to promote at the moment. (Sorry for blowing up your talk page with questions) - Aoidh (talk) 16:28, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Strike that last complaint about not finding enough hooks...I was looking at WP:DYKN rather than WP:DYKNA which explains why i found so few. - Aoidh (talk) 16:34, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Yes, you need to see a completed review and a checkmark. The checkmark is what lets the bot know to place it onto the approved page, which I see you've discovered! And no worries about blowing up my talk! That's completely normal for learning DYK prep builidng.
 * Yes, you can't promote anything you nominated or reviewed. One thing to keep in mind is that other prep builders also can't, so when you see something that has been nominated or reviewed by a frequent prep builder (theleekycauldron, bruxton, sl93, narutolovehinata5, a few others you'll become familiar with), it's a good idea to promote since they can't. Valereee (talk) 16:52, 3 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I've put together Prep 7 and have requested feedback at Wikipedia talk:Did you know. - Aoidh (talk) 17:00, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Requesting restoration of administrative privileges
Regarding [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Bureaucrats%27_noticeboard&diff=1131361752&oldid=1131335300 this edit]: I dunno; it seems to me that everyone (including me) has agreed that a former administrator who has not met the threshold for minimum activity shouldn't be encouraged to unconditionally request administrative privileges to be restored right away. The disagreements seem to be in the wording. I agreed that the original post from Tony didn't, in my opinion, sufficiently emphasize the need to re-engage in editing. I largely think we don't need to lay out pointers to former admins, but I appreciate that it's friendly to do so. isaacl (talk) 21:00, 3 January 2023 (UTC)

Administrators' newsletter – January 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (December 2022).

Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg ComplexRational · Extraordinary Writ
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Stephen
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Andrew Yong · Dbenbenn · DESiegel · GlassCobra · Joe Decker · Nancy · Pathoschild · StuffOfInterest · William Pietri · Wwwwolf · Xdamr

Interface administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Nihiltres



CheckUser changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg Moneytrees


 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Ivanvector · SilkTork

Oversighter changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-add.svg GeneralNotability · Moneytrees
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Guerillero · SilkTork

Guideline and policy news
 * Speedy deletion criterion A5 (transwikied articles) has been repealed following an unopposed proposal.

Arbitration
 * Following the 2022 Arbitration Committee elections, the following editors have been appointed to the Arbitration Committee:, , , , , , ,.
 * The 2021-22 Discretionary Sanctions Review has concluded with many changes to the discretionary sanctions procedure including a change of the name to "contentious topics". The changes are being implemented over the coming month.
 * The arbitration case Stephen has been closed.

Miscellaneous
 * Voting for the Sound Logo has closed and the winner is expected to be announced February to April 2023.
 * Tech tip: You can view information about IP addresses in a centralised location using bullseye which won the Newcomer award in the recent Coolest Tool Awards.

Discuss this newsletter

Subscribe

Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 01:09, 6 January 2023 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: December 2022
About This Month in GLAM · Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 12:17, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

Hooks
Just seeing if you have any opinions on my ALT hooks at Template:Did you know nominations/Iowa Colored Cowboys, after the reviewer didn't like the first one. SL93 (talk) 17:25, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * We agreed on one. Sorry for the intrusion. SL93 (talk) 17:42, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * @SL93 I actually liked the desegregation one better, myself, if you'd still like me to weigh in. Valereee (talk) 17:59, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * I would. SL93 (talk) 18:00, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Thanks for chiming in. The downtown library where I live has many old magazines dating back to around the 1950s, and I like to check them out for more article ideas. I found an article about the softball team in a 2001 Iowa history magazine. I was already interested due to black history, but the fact that they were based in my city sealed the deal for an article. SL93 (talk) 18:22, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * It's completely fascinating! I had never heard of them! Valereee (talk) 18:26, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * I found three sources with significant coverage about the team under their original name. Would it be bad form to expand the article after a DYK review and before it hits the main page? I'm not sure if that would require a re-review. SL93 (talk) 18:44, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Not at all! That's completely standard practice, absolutely encouraged rather than otherwise. I routinely continue to expand an article after having nom'd, especially common if I nom'd before I turned up new sources. It's one of the reasons promoters and movers-to-queue recheck the article. We're making sure there hasn't been anything introduced that is unsourced, a blp vio, copyvio, etc., or that an edit war hasn't developed. Valereee (talk) 18:50, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Ok. That's good. I will be expanding it within the next few days. SL93 (talk) 18:51, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * I did that already with a different article so now I feel relieved. SL93 (talk) 18:52, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

in general, it's the promoter's responsibility to review any changes made to the article since the last article quality check it received. theleekycauldron (talk • contribs) (she/her) 19:22, 13 January 2023 (UTC)
 * I know that, but I still didn't know if it required a new reviewer on top of that. SL93 (talk) 19:24, 13 January 2023 (UTC)

The Signpost: 16 January 2023
 * Read this Signpost in full * Single-page * Unsubscribe * MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:15, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

Sweet and sour pork for you!
I've been to a Chinese restaurant a few weeks ago and taken this picture. Just wanted to show you. BorgQueen (talk) 01:00, 16 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Looks yummy! That makes me want to go make sweet and sour something. :D Valereee (talk) 14:36, 16 January 2023 (UTC)

Contentious topics procedure now in effect
You are receiving this message because you are subscribed to updates on the Arbitration Committee's contentious topics procedure revision process.

In December, the Arbitration Committee adopted the contentious topics procedure, which replaces the former discretionary sanctions system. The contentious topics procedure is now in effect following an initial implementation period. The drafting arbitrators warmly thank all those who have worked to implement the new procedure during this implementation period and beyond. KevinL ( aka L235 · t · c) 19:44, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
 * For a detailed summary of the changes from the discretionary sanctions system, see WP:DSVSCT.
 * A brief guide for administrators may be found at Contentious topics/Administrator instructions.
 * Updated templates may be found at Template:Contentious topics.
 * Suggestions and concerns may be directed to the arbitration clerk team at WT:AC/C.
 * Discuss this at: 

A bowl of Talabaw for you!

 * Thanks, Taung Tan! I enjoyed it. If you create other articles for Korean Burmese foods, just ping me, I'm always happy to work on articles about traditional foods/beverages! Valereee (talk) 22:47, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Burmese foods, you mean. Lol. BorgQueen (talk) 01:22, 18 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Gah. I did actually know that, working on too many different cuisines recently and everything blurred together. So sorry, Taung Tan. Valereee (talk) 02:00, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

Feedback request: Wikipedia policies and guidelines request for comment
Your feedback is requested &#32;at Talk:Monty Hall problem&#32; on a "Wikipedia policies and guidelines" request for comment. Thank you for helping out! You were randomly selected to receive this invitation from the list of Feedback Request Service subscribers. If you'd like not to receive these messages any more, you can opt out at any time by removing your name. Message delivered to you with love by Yapperbot :) &#124; Is this wrong? Contact my bot operator. &#124; Sent at 12:30, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Notice of neutral point of view noticeboard discussion
There is currently a discussion at Neutral point of view/Noticeboard regarding an issue with which you may have been involved. Thank you. Magnolia677 (talk) 22:56, 20 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Seriously we're going to a noticeboard instead of just talking? Okay. Valereee (talk) 01:00, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Nomination of Gabriele Bonci for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Gabriele Bonci is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or whether it should be deleted.

The article will be discussed at Articles for deletion/Gabriele Bonci until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. The nomination will explain the policies and guidelines which are of concern. The discussion focuses on high-quality evidence and our policies and guidelines.

Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article until the discussion has finished. Bearcat (talk) 17:24, 21 January 2023 (UTC)

Books & Bytes – Issue 54
The Wikipedia Library: Books & Bytes

Issue 54, November – December 2022 
 * New collections:
 * British Newspaper Archive
 * Findmypast
 * University of Michigan Press
 * ACLS
 * Duke University Press
 * 1Lib1Ref 2023
 * Spotlight: EDS Refine Results

Read the full newsletter Sent by MediaWiki message delivery on behalf of The Wikipedia Library team --14:15, 23 January 2023 (UTC)

You've got mail!
BangJan1999 21:46, 24 January 2023 (UTC)


 * @BangJan1999, I'm sorry, I've read the email but don't know what you're asking me to do. Valereee (talk) 21:56, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
 * In the following edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Category:Undefined_articles_needing_translation_from_Arabic_Wikipedia&oldid=1135469891 I said in the edit summary to take the article in question to redirects for discussion by mistake when the summary should've said to take the article to categories for discussion instead. I was wondering if it were possible to fix the erroneous edit summary. BangJan1999 22:03, 24 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Ah, I see...no, the only way to edit an edit summary is to delete it, which we only want to do if there's a very good reason, as we want to keep the history. Don't worry about misstating like that, everyone does it. You can just go back and make another edit to correct yourself. Valereee (talk) 22:32, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

profile
if you're a progressive, why are you supporting those who are "pushing back" against the liberal media?

do u mean it in the sense that the media is not liberal ENOUGH for a true progressive?

pivot to trump-bashing 2 lines later is muy confusing after having just said that you're against the liberal media. LIKE HIM!

cheers 2601:19C:527F:A660:4D61:BD28:BA7F:4ADB (talk) 06:57, 28 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Okay, I'm going to treat this as if it's not trolling from a dynamic IP. I'm not "against" the media. I just recognize that because so many individuals working in the media are themselves progressive, our most reliable sources can sometimes tend to approach stories, including story selection, from that perspective. So when I see someone making arguments that a particular source is not presenting something fairly or accurately, I try to look at it from their point of view. Valereee (talk) 12:16, 28 January 2023 (UTC)
 * how is that trolling? it's a seriously confusing paragraph.
 * had you written "...i'm progressive. DESPITE THAT, i tend to support those who push back (against leftie media)" that would make sense, but without such a reversal it sounds like "...i'm progressive.  THEREFORE, i support..." which of course does not.  2601:19C:527F:A660:2977:276F:9512:AB4E (talk) 21:11, 28 January 2023 (UTC)
 * It's purely a statement of facts. For anyone who is wondering why I'm occasionally siding with conservatives on a particular issue, I'm progressive. No matter what my own opinions are, I try to be fair. Despite vs therefore shouldn't have to be considered, as all of us should try to be fair and support arguments even on the side we're against, if those arguments are fair arguments. Valereee (talk) 23:36, 28 January 2023 (UTC)

January music
Thank you for wording the Concentricities hook which went to the Main page without problems, and for the images! - just my mother's birthday - she introduced me to music --Gerda Arendt (talk) 16:42, 9 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Ooh, those wouldn't happen to be Kartoffelklösse with that duck leg, would they? I just wrote that a few days ago, hadn't yet looked for an image. Valereee (talk) 16:53, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
 * They are, but not typical, but miniature (and not home-made, just heated). The more typical ones are pictured for 16 Nov, typical with goose (at a good restaurant) - the typical German Christmas treat. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:31, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
 * p.s. Kartoffelklöße would be correct German, - unfortunately the spelling with ss instead of ß results in a different pronunciation (short vowel, while it should be long). I'd probably begin with the ß version, and say "also" for the other. I heard for the first time that they have any similarity with Schupfnudeln, which is a kind of pasta. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 17:35, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Will do! Valereee (talk) 17:37, 9 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Today's topic Elisabeth Waterhouse. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:58, 21 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Today's topics are Elena Manistina, or: why Tchaikovsky's The Enchantress isn't on the Main page (which leaves me rather unhappy, and that's my last woman on DYK, two more compositions, then I'm out - life is too short), and under recent deaths, Clytus Gottwald for whom I made a DYK in 2012. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 23:17, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

Precious anniversary
--Gerda Arendt (talk) 09:17, 10 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Thanks, Gerda! I'm making Kartoffelklöße! Baking the potatoes right now as many recipes seem to recommend baking/ricing rather than boiling/mashing. The main concern seems to be textural. Valereee (talk) 18:19, 10 January 2023 (UTC)
 * Wow! My grandmother made them (the halb-und-halb variety, half ground raw potatoes, half mashed potatoes) on high holidays, but I never made them from scratch. - I'm on vacation, - click on songs! I tell my own stories now, instead of relying on DYK. That was a real hook in 2012. Today, I'd possibly have to say that he learned Greek ;) - One OTD item on today's Main page is Tosca, - I really wonder how we arrived at the notion that opera is not interesting. --Gerda Arendt (talk) 22:12, 14 January 2023 (UTC)
 * It's not that opera isn't interesting. It's that the details about opera you think are interesting aren't interesting to folks who aren't interested in opera. I am interested in food. I find the idea there are halb-und-halb dumplings fascinating. I recognize, however, that the average reader is not going to find interesting "Did you know ... that some kartoffelklöße (pictured) are made with half mashed and half raw potatoes?" The fact I find that fascinating does not mean the average reader will.
 * To someone interested in and knowledgeable about food, it's an interesting factoid. To someone who just likes to eat food, which is literally the entire world, not so much. So instead of that, I would probably go with something along the lines of ... that potato dumplings are considered traditional in multiple European cuisines despite the potato not arriving in Europe until the Columbian Exchange?
 * That might actually interest people, as there are probably a lot of folks who don't realize potatoes weren't much used in Europe until the late 1700s. So while to me it's kinda basic info, to readers it might be enough to get them to check out kartoffelklöße. Which is the entire point of DYK. Valereee (talk) 00:30, 30 January 2023 (UTC)

Women in Red in February 2023
--Lajmmoore (talk) 07:30, 30 January 2023 (UTC) via MassMessaging

Administrators' newsletter – February 2023
News and updates for administrators from the past month (January 2023).

Administrator changes
 * Gnome-colors-view-refresh.svg Gimmetrow
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg Bjelleklang · Bob the Wikipedian · Leithp · WhisperToMe · 100 inactive admins



CheckUser changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg BDD · Bradv · Donald Albury · Maxim · MusikAnimal

Oversighter changes
 * Gnome-colors-list-remove.svg BDD · Bradv · Donald Albury · Maxim

Guideline and policy news
 * Following an RfC, the administrator policy now requires that prior written consent be gained from the Arbitration Committee to mark a block as only appealable to the committee.
 * Following a community discussion, consensus has been found to impose the extended-confirmed restriction over the topic areas of Armenia and Azerbaijan and Kurds and Kurdistan.

Technical news
 * The Vector 2022 skin has become the default for desktop users of the English Wikipedia.

Arbitration Miscellaneous
 * The arbitration case Armenia-Azerbaijan 3 has been opened and the proposed decision is expected 24 February 2023.
 * In December, the contentious topics procedure was adopted which replaces the former discretionary sanctions system. The contentious topics procedure is now in effect following an initial implementation period. There is a detailed summary of the changes and administrator instructions for the new procedure. The arbitration clerk team are taking suggestions, concerns, and unresolved questions about this new system at their noticeboard.
 * Voting in the 2023 Steward elections will begin on 05 February 2023, 21:00 (UTC) and end on 26 February 2023, 21:00 (UTC). The confirmation process of current stewards is being held in parallel. You can automatically check your eligibility to vote.
 * Voting in the 2023 Community Wishlist Survey will begin on 10 February 2023 and end on 24 February 2023. You can submit, discuss and revise proposals until 6 February 2023.
 * Tech tip: Syntax highlighting is available in both the 2011 and 2017 Wikitext editors. It can help make editing paragraphs with many references or complicated templates easier.

Discuss this newsletter

Subscribe

Archive Sent by MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 01:38, 2 February 2023 (UTC)

The Signpost: 4 February 2023
 * Read this Signpost in full * Single-page * Unsubscribe * MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 21:46, 4 February 2023 (UTC)

New Pages Patrol newsletter January 2023
Hello , The October drive reduced the backlog from 9,700 to an amazing 0! Congratulations to who led with 2084 points. See this page for further details. The queue is steadily rising again and is approaching 2,000. It would be great if <2,000 were the “new normal”. Please continue to help out even if it's only for a few or even one patrol a day. won the 2022 cup for 28,302 article reviews last year - that's an average of nearly 80/day. There was one Gold Award (5000+ reviews), 11 Silver (2000+), 28 Iron (360+) and 39 more for the 100+ barnstar. led again for the 4th year by clearing 49,294 redirects. For the full details see the Awards page and the Hall of Fame. Congratulations everyone!
 * Backlog
 * 2022 Awards

Minimum deletion time: The previous WP:NPP guideline was to wait 15 minutes before tagging for deletion (including draftification and WP:BLAR). Due to complaints, a consensus decided to raise the time to 1 hour. To illustrate this, very new pages in the feed are now highlighted in red. (As always, this is not applicable to attack pages, copyvios, vandalism, etc.)

New draftify script: In response to feedback from AFC, the The Move to Draft script now provides a choice of set messages that also link the creator to a new, friendly explanation page. The script also warns reviewers if the creator is probably still developing the article. The former script is no longer maintained. Please edit your edit your common.js or vector.js file from  to  '''

Redirects: Some of our redirect reviewers have reduced their activity and the backlog is up to 9,000+ (two months deep). If you are interested in this distinctly different task and need any help, see this guide, this checklist, and spend some time at WP:RFD.

Discussions with the WMF The PageTriage open letter signed by 444 users is bearing fruit. The Growth Team has assigned some software engineers to work on PageTriage, the software that powers the NewPagesFeed and the Page Curation toolbar. WMF has submitted dozens of patches in the last few weeks to modernize PageTriage's code, which will make it easier to write patches in the future. This work is helpful but is not very visible to the end user. For patches visible to the end user, volunteers such as and  have been writing patches for bug reports and feature requests. The Growth Team also had a video conference with the NPP coordinators to discuss revamping the landing pages that new users see.


 * Reminders
 * Newsletter feedback - please take this short poll about the newsletter.
 * There is live chat with patrollers on the New Page Patrol Discord.
 * Please add the project discussion page to your watchlist.
 * If you no longer wish to be a reviewer, please ask any admin to remove you from the group. If you want the tools back again, just ask at PERM.
 * To opt out of future mailings, please remove yourself here.

Thanks for your efforts
I appreciate your efforts on working on the multiple requests for comments regarding creating and deleting articles in large numbers. I know it has been a daunting task with much uncertainty regarding the existence of any consensus on the matter. Best wishes for your continued contributions! isaacl (talk) 18:19, 7 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Thank you, isaacl. Valereee (talk) 20:40, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

A cup of coffee for you!

 * Thanks, lol...the stupid thing is, I really value AB. I think in general they're a good editor. But they seem to have this blind spot w/re their own local area. I'd be willing to AGF except for the fact they're completely unwilling to answer the question: bring me the three. Literally they will not answer that question. Just won't even acknowledge it was asked. That's where I start to question the good faith. Valereee (talk) 01:00, 7 February 2023 (UTC)
 * You jumped to AfD mere minutes after demanding I answer your questions across multiple article talk pages. Give me a break... --- Another Believer ( Talk ) 14:59, 7 February 2023 (UTC)
 * AB, I jumped to AfD because you told me to. I didn't even nom them all, just the one. Valereee (talk) 20:45, 7 February 2023 (UTC)

This Month in GLAM: January 2023
About This Month in GLAM · Subscribe/Unsubscribe · Global message delivery · Romaine 20:31, 9 February 2023 (UTC)

Clarification on Policy for New User
Hey, I'm new (like brand new, don't even have an account yet) and I'd like to get some more info before making a huge fuss about another user's conduct. Could you check out the convo here [] and let me know if any of the conduct you're seeing is rising to the level of needing to be addressed more directly or in other channels, including my own? I'm being accused of a few things and I'm second guessing myself. 2600:4040:7A15:9F00:9443:EEC9:18ED:218C (talk) 21:43, 9 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Just create an account. Seriously, this argument that I'm not sure I want to contribute further in the environment shown on this talk page is silly. Meanwhile we have to deal with multiple IPs...so both are from Philly, am I talking to the same person? I think I am, but can I assume so? Maybe it's two people? Maybe it's one on their home and work? It kind of feels like you've decided you're going to make life more difficult for us because you don't think we deserve to have you make it easier. :) Valereee (talk) 01:42, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Fair point, I just did. Thanks for the perspective. I was more referring to the other things, not the IP vs account thing. OuroCat (talk) 01:47, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Could you clarify why that was canvassing? I was not asking you to contribute to the RM discussion, but whether any of the behavior there was out-of-line. OuroCat (talk) 01:53, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Hey, @OuroCat, thank you for creating an account. It really does help both you and the rest of us.
 * I mentioned canvassing because I wanted to make sure those at that discussion knew that it had been brought to my attention by someone who had an opinion on the subject. It's a really tricky issue. When you call my attention to a discussion, there's always the question of why. Valereee (talk) 02:02, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
 * Isn't canvassing itself improper behavior? Could you have not responded to the discussion, to maintain neutrality and not say that I was doing something improper? OuroCat (talk) 02:11, 10 February 2023 (UTC)
 * I've revised. Valereee (talk) 02:17, 10 February 2023 (UTC)

New message from TheresNoTime
Just in case the worst has happened and you've been locked out of your account, I wanted to make sure you saw my reply there — tl;dr, you'll probably need to email ca@wikimedia.org — TheresNoTime (talk • they/them) 00:54, 11 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Yes, thank you so much, I did see it, and I had forgotten all about those scratch codes, which IIRC I was paranoid enough about that I'd emailed to my husband's phone, copied into a word doc on my machine, texted to my phone, and printed out to stick into a desk drawer. :D Belt and suspenders, that's me. But then, once having taken care of it, I forgot all about it. Valereee (talk) 14:02, 11 February 2023 (UTC)

Maize
I'm going to pick on you a little since you're technically "involved" with your comment at the requested move now, so it wouldn't come across as admin shopping, etc., just asking for advice from you here. You saw a bit of what us regulars at the article talk page have been getting burnt out from with the sniping/poisoning the well attitude you commented on in the above section on OuroCat. It seemed like too under the radar for ANI at the time, but now it's just a mess, and I personally wouldn't be going there now just because it'd look like I'm trying to "win" a content dispute. We were mostly trying to ignore the behavior to avoid the appearance of biting a newcomer, but despite warnings when we could only contact them on the article talk as a dynamic IP, they kept ignoring WP:TPNO about not attacking editors and focusing on content.

With the move, they continued demonizing regulars in the RM itself with things like I want to be part of a community that calls out and corrects individuals that use their credentials and status as a cudgel against others., and that seemed to encourage a good bunch of supports to start attacking those who had been trying to deal with OuroCat like here or especially No Such User going after me for posting main detailed comment and commenting on two support !votes and threatening to get me banned for that.. I'm stuck responding to No Such User on the article talk on their repeated piles of bullshit comment trying to at least somewhat counteract the poisoning the well stuff again. Then you have OuroCat effectively trolling that thread with comments like this in response to that when we couldn't really do much without them having a usertalk earlier as an IP. Quite a bit of badgering too considering I said I wasn't commenting more in that diff and where they weren't involved. That or a sort of sealioning by OuroCat where they aren't entirely familiar with WP:ENGVAR, and they accuse me instead of personal attack for saying I was worried they were confusing British English as something that only applied narrowly the UK despite previous conversations. Just petty stuff.

The RM battleground/potshots really comes across as ganging up on one of the few people who was actively working in-depth on content in the article and trying to run them off. That especially comes in with comments by OuroCat wanting to make my !vote less prominent so opposes showed more or earlier criticism about me being an ag. scientist, etc. as an odd chilling effect. I never thought I'd see this much battleground mentality in a crop article, but I'm worried about just how much editors are fine disrupting the talk page on the behavior side while ignoring sources or content we already have addressing it on the content side. Maybe this is just a word slurry at this point, but I'm basically out of bandwith with the hounding going on from mostly OuroCat and No Such User, so any advice while I'm away awhile on how to protect the article from this kind of battleground stuff is appreciated. KoA (talk) 23:57, 10 February 2023 (UTC)


 * Yeah, I wish I'd not !voted in the discussion. I hadn't read it closely enough to see the problematic behavior (and had completely overlooked the fact there was a previous RM only a few months ago) when I !voted. But as you say, now I'm involved and can't admin there. Ditto on the level of battleground w/re a crop. Valereee (talk) 14:31, 11 February 2023 (UTC)