User talk:Veronica at IAES

Welcome!
Hello, International Atlantic Economic Society, and welcome to Wikipedia!&#32;Thank you for your contributions.

I noticed that one of the first articles you edited was Draft:International Atlantic Economic Society, which appears to be dealing with a topic with which you may have a conflict of interest. In other words, you may find it difficult to write about that topic in a neutral and objective way, because you are, work for, or represent, the subject of that article.&#32;Your recent contributions may have already been undone for this very reason.

One rule we do have in connection with conflicts of interest is that accounts used by more than one person will unfortunately be blocked from editing. Wikipedia generally does not allow editors to have usernames which imply that the account belongs to a company or corporation. If you have a username like this, you should request a change of username or create a new account. (A name that identifies the user as an individual within a given organization may be OK.)

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Your username
Welcome to Wikipedia. I saw that you edited or created Draft:International Atlantic Economic Society, and I noticed that your username, "International Atlantic Economic Society", may not comply with our username policy. Please note that you may not use a username that represents the name of a company, group, organization, product, service, or website. Examples of usernames that are not allowed include "XYZ Company", "MyWidgetsUSA.com", and "Foobar Museum of Art". However, you are permitted to use a username that contains such a name if it identifies you individually, such as "Sara Smith at XYZ Company", "Mark at WidgetsUSA", or "FoobarFan87".

Please also note that Wikipedia does not allow accounts to be shared by multiple people and that you may not advocate for or promote any company, group, organization, product, service, or website, regardless of your username. Please also read our paid editing policy and our conflict of interest guideline. If you are a single individual and are willing to contribute to Wikipedia in an unbiased manner, please request a change of username by completing the form at Special:GlobalRenameRequest, choosing a username that complies with our username policy. If you believe that your username does not violate our policy, please leave a note here explaining why. Thank you. -- Deep fried okra ( talk ) 19:43, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello, thank you for the comment. I have successfully changed my username to comply with Wikipedia's policies. Thanks. Veronica at IAES (talk) 14:35, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

August 2021
Your edit to Draft:International Atlantic Economic Society has been removed in whole or in part, as it appears to have added copyrighted material to Wikipedia without evidence of permission from the copyright holder. If you are the copyright holder, please read Donating copyrighted materials for more information on uploading your material to Wikipedia. For legal reasons, Wikipedia cannot accept copyrighted material, including text or images from print publications or from other websites, without an appropriate and verifiable license. All such contributions will be deleted. You may use external websites or publications as a source of information, but not as a source of content, such as sentences or images&mdash;you must write using your own words. Wikipedia takes copyright very seriously, and persistent violators of our copyright policy will be blocked from editing. See Copying text from other sources for more information. Meters (talk) 19:46, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

This article was written using my own words. What kind of copyright permission do you need in order for me to not get blocked and have my article deleted from Wikipedia? Please let me know. Veronica at IAES (talk) 14:53, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

Speedy deletion of Draft:International Atlantic Economic Society


The page Draft:International Atlantic Economic Society has been speedily deleted from Wikipedia. This was done under section G11 of the criteria for speedy deletion, because the page seemed to be unambiguous advertising which only promoted a company, group, product, service, person, or point of view and would need to have been fundamentally rewritten in order to become encyclopedic. Please read the guidelines on spam and FAQ/Organizations for more information.

Please do not recreate the material without addressing these concerns, but do not hesitate to add information in line with Wikipedia's policies and guidelines. If you think this page should not have been deleted for this reason, or you wish to retrieve the deleted material for future reference or improvement, then please contact the. Bishonen &#124; tålk 19:46, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello, thank you for the comment. I used Wizard Article to help me create this article. I also had no intent for this article to be for advertising or marketing purposes. I was submitting this article to inform and spread knowledge about a non-profit organization. I was also using my own words as I took great time and care to make sure it was not copied from any source and not closely paraphrased. Please let me know what is the problem? How can I submit this article without it being seen as advertising, or copied content? Thanks. Veronica at IAES (talk) 14:39, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

August 2021
 Your account has been blocked indefinitely from editing because of the following problems: the account has been used for advertising or promotion, which is contrary to the purpose of Wikipedia, and your username indicates that the account represents a business, organisation, group, or web site, which is against the username policy.

You may request a change of name and unblock if you intend to make useful contributions other than promoting your business or organization. To do this, first search Special:CentralAuth for available usernames that comply with the username policy. Once you have found an acceptable username, post the text at the bottom of your talk page. Replace the text "Your proposed new username" with your new username and replace the text "Your reason here" with your reasons to be unblocked. In your reasons, you must:
 * Disclose any compensation you may receive for your contributions in accordance with the Paid-contribution disclosure requirement.
 * Convince us that you understand the reason for your block and that you will not repeat the kind of edits for which you were blocked.
 * Describe in general terms the contributions that you intend to make if you are unblocked.

Appeals: If, after reviewing the guide to appealing blocks, you believe this block was made in error, you may appeal it by adding the text at the bottom of your talk page. Replace the text "Your reason here" with the reasons you believe the block was an error, and publish the page. Bishonen &#124; tålk 19:47, 24 August 2021 (UTC)

Hello,

Veronica at IAES (talk) 14:40, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

I understand that Wikipedia is an encyclopedia. I have absolutely no intent to publish articles that promote or market an organization. I believe I have summarized the content about the organization in a neutral way. How can I establish notability? What is needed in order to do so? How do I prove that the article is written in a neutral and non-biased way, and is based on what unconnected individuals say about the organization? Veronica at IAES (talk) 15:09, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
 * The draft just told of the existence of the organization, what it does, and its personnel- probably because it was copied from your website(according to the blocking admin). As I said, Wikipedia is not interested in any of that. We're interested in what independent reliable sources say about it in a significant manner- not just telling us what the organization does, but why it is significant and meets Wikipedia's special definition of a notable organization. In any event, you won't be permitted to edit about your organization in the short term, and if you wish to be unblocked you will need to tell us what you want to edit about. Once you build up a good edit history, showing that you understand relevant Wikipedia guidelines, you may later be permitted to indirectly contribute about your organization. I'm not the last word on it; you may make another unblock request for someone else to review. 331dot (talk) 15:35, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for the reply, however I am not sure if I understand why exactly the article was denied and I was blocked. There are many other pages with organizations that were posted in the same manner as the draft I submitted, describing what the organization does, its existence, personel, its journals and conferences. It was not copied from the website either, as I stated above, it was written using my own words. I am not a paid employee. I am not sure what exactly you are looking for. Are you looking for a references page to be added to the draft? I definitely can point out some other Wikipedia pages out there that got approved that could easily be marked as "promotional" especially given that they are for-profit. So this whole idea of you banning me from editing and posting a neutral article, where I did not praise the organization in any way, just posted facts, is strange to me.Veronica at IAES (talk) 16:08, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
 * I think I got my wires crossed regarding the copying, apologies. I believe you that you've probably seen other articles that were like yours. Please read other stuff exists.  As this is a volunteer project where people do what they can when they can, it is possible for inappropriate articles to get by us and go undetected by editors, even for years.  We can only address what we know about.  If you want to help us out, you can identify some of these other similar articles you have seen for possible action.(I'm guessing you're not interested in that, which is completely fine as everyone here does what they wish to do)
 * The draft had no sources whatsoever in it. Perhaps you had simply not gotten a chance to provide sources, but it is still difficult for us to know what you are summarizing without it being provided simultaneously with the edits.  I can say that we aren't interested in what the organization considers to be its "mission" as that is impossible to independently verify and is subject to change at any time.  The draft reads as an informative leaflet or pamphlet that simply tells us what the organization does. In terms of establishing notability, we aren't interested in what they do, but in why it is significant as described by independent sources wholly unconnected with the organization.  These would be things like news reports, academic journals, books, or anything as long as the organization itself had nothing to do with it. I would suggest that you review some articles classified as "good articles"(click to get to where you can find them) to get an idea of what is being looked for.  Again, you are welcome to make another unblock request that someone else will review- I am not the last or only word. 331dot (talk) 16:33, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for your reply. If I understand it correctly, it is impossible for me to submit this article about the International Atlantic Economic Society unless there is a reputable journalist that would speak or write about it? That is very odd and definitely seems like most pages on Wikipedia do not meet the requirements of this policy. I am happy to take the "Mission" portion out of the draft. If you have any other suggestions on how I could have it reviewed by someone from Wikipedia that would specifically tell me what to take out, or how to even start, I would appreciate it. I would like to submit a neutral and bias free article. But if this is only possible with journalists that independently write about organizations, then I am afraid this is the end of the road for me. Veronica at IAES (talk) 17:31, 26 August 2021 (UTC)
 * It's not a specific "reputable journalist" that needs to write about it, but independent reliable sources in general(most draft reviewers look for at least three). And they can't be asked to write about it by anyone associated with the organization, they need to decide to write about it on their own. It is true that the requirement for independent reliable sources means that some subject areas and specific topics are underserved on Wikipedia. However, summarizing such sources is Wikipedia's mission.
 * Again, there are almost certainly articles here that do not do as I have described; this does not mean more inappropriate articles can be added, compounding the problem. We are all volunteer participants, maybe tens of thousands around the world, with six million plus articles to manage. Things get by us.
 * Your draft, to be frank(apologies) is not salvageable in terms of establishing notability and would need to be restarted, only summarizing what independent reliable sources state. If no independent sources write about the organization, it would not merit an article at this time. It's impossible for you to submit a "bias free" article as everyone and everything has biases. This is another reason for requiring independent sources, so readers can examine them and judge their bias.
 * I might suggest that if you want to tell the world about your organization, you should use social media, your own website, or other alternative forum with less stringent requirements. I'm sorry to see you go and wish you the best. If you change your mind and want to be a more general contributor, (which might help you to understand things here better) you are welcome to make another unblock request. 331dot (talk) 20:43, 26 August 2021 (UTC)

There are independent sources that write about the organization, but they lack correct information, or incomplete information, which is why I am very confused why you would want me to submit incomplete information, instead of a summary of the organization, written in a neutral way? There is not a section where my draft praises the organization in any way. And as I said before, I am happy to take the "Mission" section out of the draft, if that will help. Not sure why you say the draft is not salvageable, when I took great care to write it exactly the way other articles have been written here on Wikipedia for other organizations? (Except for the mission part). And these articles have been up on Wikipedia for years. How is this fair and justifiable? So just because I kindly asked for my article to be reviewed, to make sure I do not violate any policies, I got blocked and my article was immediately removed without a second thought? Seems hostile and like I would have been better off just submitting without asking anyone for anything, if this is the sort of response I get for it, while others comfortably get away with it. Veronica at IAES (talk) 13:26, 27 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Were the articles you used as a model classified as good articles? If you had just placed the draft in the encyclopedia yourself, you might have gotten lucky that no one would notice it right away, but it eventually would get noticed, even if not for years.  Unfortunately until Wikipedia has a paid staff of hundreds of thousands of people to monitor the six million plus and counting articles 24/7, that's just the way it is.   I've explained the reasons for why the draft is problematic- perhaps I am simply not being clear.  I will again say if you feel that I have been completely unfair, you are welcome to request unblock from a heretofore uninvolved administrator; I'm not the last word, and I make mistakes. Whatever you decide to do, I do wish you the best. I'm happy to respond to further specific questions from you, but otherwise I won't bother you further. Good day to you. 331dot (talk) 20:54, 27 August 2021 (UTC)

I do have specific questions. Can you please explain to me how would this article need to be re-written in order for it to satisfy Wikipedia's policy? I already agreed I would remove the Mission from the draft, but what else is problematic? I am happy to work with you or anybody who can point me in the right direction to publish this article without having any problems. I am not here to violate any rules or spam Wikipedia. I would appreciate the feedback, thanks. Veronica at IAES (talk) 12:50, 31 August 2021 (UTC)
 * I'm willing to discuss this with you, but I think it would be beneficial for you to hear from someone else first. 331dot (talk) 22:52, 31 August 2021 (UTC)


 * Here is just one sentence from the draft you posted: "This is a great opportunity for both experienced economists and PhD students to present their research in front of internationally known economists and finance experts." If you can post material like that and honestly think it wasn't promotional, then I have doubts as to whether you will ever be able to contribute in a neutral way, because if you can't see the promotional nature of your own writing then you won't be able to avoid doing the same again. If it were just a matter of a few sentences like that, it would be easy for someone to remove them, but the whole tenor of your draft, from start to finish, was promotional, so that it would need totally rewriting from scratch. The page looked totally as though it was written by a marketing or PR professional. I have no doubt that you are sincere in your statement that you are willing to learn, and to rewrite it in a way which would be acceptable with help from someone, but unfortunately it is unlikely that anyone will be willing to devote the amiunt of time it would require to take you through the process, which would mean taking themselves away from other,  more directly productive, work. My experience over the years is that the substantial majority of people who come to Wikipedia and try to write new articles from the start have a difficult and frustrating time, because  knowing what is considered suitable is something one learns through extended experience of editing  Wikipedia,  not something which one can learn by being told in a few sentences. My advice to new editors is that it is best to start by making small improvements to existing articles, rather than creating new articles. That way any mistakes you make will be small ones, and you won't have the discouraging experience of repeatedly seeing hours of work deleted. Gradually, you will get to learn how Wikipedia works, and after a while you will know enough about what is acceptable to be able to write whole new articles without fear that they will be deleted. Over the years I have found that editors who start by making small changes to existing articles and work up from there have a far better chance of having a successful time here than those who jump right into creating new articles from the start.  Of course that advice probably won't appeal to you if you have no interest in editing Wikipedia except in order to publicise the work of your organisation, but in that case Wikipedia probably isn't the right place for you anyway. JBW (talk) 21:42, 25 September 2021 (UTC)

Thank you for taking the time to explain this to me. I now understand what you mean by promotional material. I will not try to submit this draft again, instead, I will attempt to re-work it and have someone look at it for review way before I even consider posting. Would you give me a second chance and help me with my new draft? If so, who would I need to speak with? Thank you for your consideration and for your time. I appreciate it. Veronica at IAES (talk) 16:30, 29 September 2021 (UTC)