User talk:Visviva/Archive10

How we will see unregistered users
Hi!

You get this message because you are an admin on a Wikimedia wiki.

When someone edits a Wikimedia wiki without being logged in today, we show their IP address. As you may already know, we will not be able to do this in the future. This is a decision by the Wikimedia Foundation Legal department, because norms and regulations for privacy online have changed.

Instead of the IP we will show a masked identity. You as an admin will still be able to access the IP. There will also be a new user right for those who need to see the full IPs of unregistered users to fight vandalism, harassment and spam without being admins. Patrollers will also see part of the IP even without this user right. We are also working on better tools to help.

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We have two suggested ways this identity could work. We would appreciate your feedback on which way you think would work best for you and your wiki, now and in the future. You can let us know on the talk page. You can write in your language. The suggestions were posted in October and we will decide after 17 January.

Thank you. /Johan (WMF)

18:13, 4 January 2022 (UTC)

Nomination of Index of Korea-related articles for deletion
A discussion is taking place as to whether the article Index of Korea-related articles, to which you have significantly contributed, is suitable for inclusion in Wikipedia according to Wikipedia's policies and guidelines or if it should be deleted.

The discussion will take place at Articles for deletion/Index of Korea-related articles until a consensus is reached, and anyone, including you, is welcome to contribute to the discussion. Users may edit the article during the discussion, including to improve the article to address concerns raised in the discussion. However, do not remove the article-for-deletion notice from the top of the article.

To customise your preferences for automated AfD notifications for articles to which you've significantly contributed (or to opt-out entirely), please visit the configuration page. Delivered by SDZeroBot (talk) 01:01, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Koralt
Template:Koralt has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the entry on the Templates for discussion page. Izno (talk) 04:12, 23 February 2022 (UTC)

Gyeongju Featured article review
I have nominated Gyeongju for a featured article review here. Please join the discussion on whether this article meets featured article criteria. Articles are typically reviewed for two weeks. If substantial concerns are not addressed during the review period, the article will be moved to the Featured Article Removal Candidates list for a further period, where editors may declare "Keep" or "Delist" the article's featured status. The instructions for the review process are here. Sandy Georgia (Talk)  17:49, 1 March 2022 (UTC)

New administrator activity requirement
22:53, 15 April 2022 (UTC)

Pending suspension of administrative permissions due to inactivity
Established policy provides for removal of the administrative permissions of users who have not made any edits or logged actions in the preceding twelve months. Because you have been inactive, your administrative permissions will be removed&#32;if you do not return to activity within the next month.

Inactive administrators are encouraged to rejoin the project in earnest rather than to make token edits to avoid loss of administrative permissions. Resources and support for reengaging with the project are available at WikiProject Editor Retention/administrators. If you do not intend to rejoin the project in the foreseeable future, please consider voluntarily resigning your administrative permissions by making a request at the bureaucrats' noticeboard.

Thank you for your past contributions to the project. —&thinsp;JJMC89 bot 00:07, 1 May 2022 (UTC)

Nomination for deletion of Template:Alsoknown
Template:Alsoknown has been nominated for deletion. You are invited to comment on the discussion at the entry on the Templates for discussion page. Izno (talk) 05:17, 7 May 2022 (UTC)

Thanks
Thanks for creating and maintaining List of African-American newspapers in Nebraska. It's been very useful in finding important newspapers. I created two articles from there - Afro-American Sentinel and Western Post - that I otherwise wouldn't have known about. Urve (talk) 19:24, 7 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Awesome! Thank you for creating those articles. -- Visviva (talk) 19:34, 7 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Symbol flower.svg Coming back to this to say I have created more, from many states, entirely because of the lists that you've created. West Virginia Enterprise, Arkansas Freeman, Freeman's Press, Mirror of the Times, Lighthouse and Informer, and a few more from Nebraska. Thank you so much. It's very important that we document this history, and you've helped me find a way to play my part. Urve (talk) 08:20, 27 September 2022 (UTC)

You're invited! Wiki Loves Pride in Indianapolis
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Help with disruptive and biased editors
Hi Visviva. I was hoping to get some help with an issue before I went to the Administrators Noticeboard. I have had repeated issues with clearly biased editors who have found any reason to revert edits I have made on articles including Aboriginal cultures.

One such user is Skyring. I have repeatedly attempted to work with them, discuss through their concerns, and compromise my work to avoid conflict. However, they have started a lengthy discussion on the Australian Wikipedian's Noticeboard accusing me of being a political actor and blanked my edits.

Until now I have attempted to work with these editors, as their argument has been that this is a policy disagreement that has to be worked out. However, from Skyring's repeated comments it is clear that they hold a particular disdain towards Aboriginal cultures and are biased against having that information on Wikipedia.

As such, I'm asking for help as to how to proceed with them. I don't think they should be editing content that includes information on Aboriginal Australia. I'm fairly new though, so I don't know what else to do."

The discussion is here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Australian_Wikipedians%27_notice_board#Problematic_editing:_NPOV_vio_and_UNDUE

PS. I have become aware that my editing may be seen as a single-issue account, so I'm trying to branch out into other areas. I hope that my history of compromise and sourcing diligence shows however that I am not attempting to vandalise, I just have a particular interest area at the moment. Poketama (talk) 05:36, 16 June 2022 (UTC)


 * I definitely sympathize with your situation, but I'm afraid my dispute resolution skills have never been much good, and are now verrry rusty. I don't quite have the wherewithal to get up to speed on everything at the moment. AN may be your best bet. Good luck! -- Visviva (talk) 05:52, 16 June 2022 (UTC)
 * You are quite correct, Visviva. Poketama, if you wish to make baseless personal attacks on other editors, may I suggest that you do not conduct a campaign on talk pages but instead use established Wikiprocess. When I noticed your WP:SPA activities I raised a public discussion - which you have kindly referenced above - and I have every faith in my fellow editors working together to resolve any problems. We've come this far without any centralised authority and we work things out together. Transparency is the way the project operates.


 * As for your comments above, I heartily reject them. Aboriginal culture is a significant part of who we are as Australians and Wikipedia is an excellent place to state this. My concerns are about sourcing and WP:UNDUE prominence and your insertion of falsehoods into articles, as documented in my opening remarks in the discussion you find so challenging. --Pete (talk) 06:40, 16 June 2022 (UTC)


 * I am a bit rusty, so I had to go check WP:NPA, where I read that "Accusing someone of making personal attacks without providing a justification for your accusation is also considered a form of personal attack." I don't see anything above that I would (personally) consider a personal attack on either of you. But at any rate, the content issues here have plainly become personal for you both (or else you wouldn't be coming here to argue on some rando's talk page). FWIW, I would strongly recommend that you both dial it back considerably. -- Visviva (talk) 13:37, 16 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks Visviva, sorry to get you involved. I'm doing my best to work within the processes. Coming to your talk page was an attempt to follow the advice of Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents which says "Want to skip the drama? Check the Recently Active Admins list for admins who may be able to help directly." I'm not sure how to resolve this issue, but I don't have much of a wish to get into a protracted dispute about it. Cheers. Poketama (talk) 16:45, 16 June 2022 (UTC)
 * Oh! I guess I would be on there now. I'm afraid my admin skills, such as they are, are pretty much limited to the janitorial side of things. I hope you're all able to find a good positive-sum solution here. -- Visviva (talk) 17:08, 16 June 2022 (UTC)

ANI thread related to discussion in which you participated
Hi, just notifying you of this ANI thread connected to a discussion on the MoS talkpage. Boynamedsue (talk) 17:13, 23 June 2022 (UTC)

Please share your views on Similar Article List of Bengali songs recorded by Runa Laila
You've previously voted in the discussion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/List_of_Bengali_songs_recorded_by_Shreya_Ghoshal. Similar article List of Bengali songs recorded by Runa Laila is considered for deletion. Would you please share your views here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/List_of_Bengali_songs_recorded_by_Runa_Laila. Abbasulu (talk) 03:40, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

July 28: You're invited! Food Deserts & Food Policy in Indianapolis editathon
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Thanks and I mentioned you...
Hi, thanks for the insight on list criteria for brand new lists. I've decided to seek a template tweak and in my initial effort to recruit such changes, I mentioned you. FYI that thread is here.... Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Templates.... thanks again for putting "new lists with single author" in the mix! NewsAndEventsGuy (talk) 14:07, 20 July 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for your courageous (but probably exhausting) dissent
I've already thanked you for each of your 4 edits asking for space for Opposition to the NPP begging letter, but I thought I'd add it again here.

I thought about adding my support for you there but decided that it probably wasn't worth the stress and other downsides, especially given that you had already understandably given up, that I had already been recently reprimanded for allegedly unacceptable speech (some details in the Precious Anniversary section here), that I disagreed with parts of what you said (for instance, I think a moat and alligators may well be necessary, though giving more funding to the current bunch of alligators is not necessarily a good idea), and that I would actually like to see their software fixed so that editors creating articles in good faith don't feel slandered as supposedly dishonestly engaged in "unambiguous advertising or promotion", etc (see here, though I have never actually bothered to try to recreate the article in dispute), but I don't know whether that apparent slander problem has already been fixed or not (and if it hasn't, I have no reason to expect that giving more money to the same people will result in any of that money being spent on fixing it).

"The New Page Review team will be asking the WMF for attention to the PageTriage software. Please review the request and if you support it, consider signing it. [dismiss]": This appears on my Watchlist, and presumably also on the Watchlist of huge numbers of other editors. To me, this looks like an outrageous violation of at least the spirit (and perhaps also the letter) of WP:CANVAS, especially given that it has no semblance of neutrality, as it asks for support, but not for comments or dissent, and Wikilawyering (wrong forum, etc) is later used to discourage dissent. Of course perhaps worse still is the very fact that it is produced by software on my Watchlist rather than by a signed post on my Talk Page, as this in itself powerfully discourages dissent (as, whether intentionally or otherwise, it inevitably implicitly says 'We are powerful Wikipedians, don't annoy us if you know what's good for you as a Wikipedian').

And, at least in my case, the discouragement would seem to have worked, so I'm probably just posting this here to let off steam, and perhaps also in the hope that you or some other reader will get some useful ideas from some parts of what I've said.

But once again thanks anyway. Tlhslobus (talk) 17:49, 23 August 2022 (UTC)


 * You raise some valid and interesting points. Thanks for stopping by!
 * In my head I am working on a detailed, data-driven analysis of where Wikipedia stands, why it's a problem, and the particular policies and practices that have led us to this situation, and how the literature on policy change can inform how we think about solutions... in practice, I'm not quite sure when I'm going to get the time and energy to get all that done, so I may just be fated to periodically shake my fist at random clouds. -- Visviva (talk) 20:27, 23 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks, and good look to you. The trouble is that I wouldn't know what data to trust. I suspect (and/or "common sense" tells me) that the original amateur editor such as me is almost a dying breed, and that great chunks of Wikipedia, including many of the "best" articles, are now produced by professionals competently concealing their professionalism behind things like multiple identities, and paid by vested interests to do various kinds of competently concealed promotions, etc, and that quite likely this also includes where possible killing off articles that the vested interests don't want for various reasons. But of course that's a "conspiracy theory" without supporting "evidence" ("common sense" is not "evidence" ). So I suspect all an amateur like me can now do is produce the occasional seemingly useful edit when one appears to be needed. Tlhslobus (talk) 22:36, 23 August 2022 (UTC)


 * There's something in what you say, although I guess I wouldn't put it quite as strongly. Whenever I contemplate the rising barriers to entry (and even more so, to various forms of "status" such as autopatrol or adminship) I find myself wondering what could possibly motivate someone to overcome those barriers today. What sort of upside could justify the obvious downsides of working so hard to become part of a community that is so resolutely closed off? The parsimonious answer isn't very pleasant to contemplate (and surely can't be entirely true), but it is parsimonious. -- Visviva (talk) 00:04, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
 * The parsimonious doesn't have to be pleasant to be broadly true, and it doesn't have to be "entirely" true to be useful (probably few explanations in a complex world can ever be "entirely" true). Anyway, thanks for the interesting chat, but I'd probably better stop now before it all gets too depressing .Tlhslobus (talk) 07:31, 25 August 2022 (UTC)

Gwageo
I stumbled across this article and noticed it has some referencing problems (more specifically the lack of details on the sources cited). I tried to find the sources myself but I had no luck. I went on the edit history so I could find where it began, and to my surprise it was there since the article started, in 2006. So I went to your profile and to my bigger surprise you are still active! I wonder if you can trace back the sources you used, even if it was 16 years ago. 168.228.231.75 (talk) 08:06, 27 August 2022 (UTC)


 * Oh dear. I should still have all these on my bookshelf, so I will take a look. Byeon 1999 is definitely User:Visviva/Byeon1999, and I have an ugly suspicion that Byeon 1996 is just a typo for Byeon 1999, but I will check on that. Visviva (talk) 14:17, 27 August 2022 (UTC)
 * Update: I think the referencing issues are fixed now. The article could do with a complete rewrite, but I probably won't be getting to that right away. -- Visviva (talk) 16:16, 27 August 2022 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election nominations opening soon
Nominations for the upcoming project coordinator election are opening in a few hours (00:01 UTC on 1 September). A team of up to ten coordinators will be elected for the next coordination year. The project coordinators are the designated points of contact for issues concerning the project, and are responsible for maintaining our internal structure and processes. They do not, however, have any authority over article content or editor conduct, or any other special powers. More information on being a coordinator is available here. If you are interested in running, please sign up here by 23:59 UTC on 14 September! Voting doesn't commence until 15 September. If you have any questions, you can contact any member of the current coord team. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:52, 31 August 2022 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election voting opening soon!
Voting for the upcoming project coordinator election opens in a few hours (00:01 UTC on 15 September) and will last through 23:59 on 28 September. A team of up to ten coordinators will be elected for the next coordination year. The project coordinators are the designated points of contact for issues concerning the project, and are responsible for maintaining our internal structure and processes. They do not, however, have any authority over article content or editor conduct, or any other special powers. More information on being a coordinator is available here. Voting is conducted using simple approval voting and questions for the candidates are welcome. If you have any questions, you can contact any member of the current coord team. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 22:27, 14 September 2022 (UTC)

Correction to previous election announcement
Just a quick correction to the prior message about the 2022 MILHIST coordinator election! I didn't proofread the message well enough and left out a link to the election page itself in this message. The voting will occur here; sorry about the need for a second message and the inadvertent omission from the prior one. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 17:42, 15 September 2022 (UTC)

Wikiproject Military history coordinator election voting closing soon
Voting for the upcoming project coordinator election closes soon, at 23:59 on 28 September. A team of up to ten coordinators will be elected for the next coordination year. The project coordinators are the designated points of contact for issues concerning the project, and are responsible for maintaining our internal structure and processes. They do not, however, have any authority over article content or editor conduct, or any other special powers. More information on being a coordinator is available here. Voting is conducted using simple approval voting and questions for the candidates are welcome. The voting itself is occurring here If you have any questions, you can contact any member of the current coord team. MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 20:14, 26 September 2022 (UTC)

You're invited! Environmental Justice editathons in Indianapolis & Bloomington
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You're invited! In-person WikiConference North America Meetup in Indianapolis!
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