User talk:Walls of Jericho/Archive 1

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Ashley Barnes
A tag has been placed on requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia, because it appears to be a repost of material that was previously deleted following a deletion discussion. If you can indicate how it is different from the previously posted material, place the template hangon underneath the other template on the article and put a note on the page's discussion page saying why this article should stay. Administrators will look at your reasoning before deciding what to do with the page. If you believe the original discussion was unjustified, please use deletion review instead of continuing to recreate the page. Thank you.

I would wait until he has played for Plymouth before requesting an undelete.

slυмgυм [ ←→ &#93; 13:27, 20 July 2008 (UTC)

P.S. It also uses Football player infobox, a template which has been renamed Infobox Football biography

List of Plymouth Argyle F.C. Players of the Year
Sadly, you can't just award a list Featured List status, it first has to be reviewed by other editors to ensure it meets the featured list criteria. To instigate this review process you would need to nominate it as a Featured list candidate. Cheers. --Jameboy (talk) 14:55, 17 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I had a feeling that might be the case. I'll see if it can be improved further before deciding to nominate it then. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 15:12, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Players of the year and home park
I haven't gotten around to doing Vicarage Road yet, although if a good stadium article to learn from is what you're after I would suggest looking no further than Qwest Field. Some of the information there is irrelevant for Plymouth, but it's got a good structure, and might give you some ideas if you intend to write a bit about the extended/new stadium.

As for the Players of the year, it looks pretty good so far. Couple of things I've noticed:


 * I've been criticised in the past for not doing enough to introduce the subject of my lists. I'd suggest starting with along the lines of "Plymouth Argyle Football Club are a professional association football club, based in Devon, south-west England. The Plymouth Argyle Player of the Year award is..."
 * On that note, bolding the article title is allowed, but not actually required anymore.
 * Do you have any third party sources that reference the award- the local paper perhaps?
 * You need a small symbol accompanying any colours that you use, to comply with WP:ACCESS. Something like † and ‡.
 * The way you've done Martin Barlo and Carlo Corazzin prevents the table from being sorted. My suggestion would be to give them completely separate rows, but add a footnote to explain that they shared the award.

Hope those help! WFCforLife (talk) 18:06, 24 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Hmm, might be worth nominating Home Park for a peer review. It's not that I'm not willing to help, but I don't really know what people look for when they assess stadium articles.


 * As for the Players of the Year, I think it's nearly ready for the Featured List process. A mention in the paper would have helped, but I don't think it's a big deal really. My only other suggestion is to see the picture in List of York City F.C. Clubmen of the Year for an example of good alt text. I wish you the best of luck at FLC, and will be happy to help out if there are any problems. WFCforLife (talk), Help wikipedia. Make the pledge. 21:54, 24 January 2010 (UTC)

Re: Kenny Cooper
As far as I can tell, the transfer is definately on. To summarize the source I cited, "Kooper wants to be on the American squad for the World Cup and couldn't be guaranteed sufficient opportunities to play at 1860 Munich. To that end, he requested a transfer and was loaned to Plymouth until the end of the season." Sir Sputnik (talk) 09:14, 29 January 2010 (UTC)

A barnstar

 * A belated thank you, its much appreciated. I'm happy to assist as much as I can for a worthy cause. Regards. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 05:26, 5 February 2010 (UTC)

Non Free Images in you User Space
Hey there Argyle 4 Life, thank you for your contributions! I am a bot alerting you that Non-free images are not allowed in the user or talk-space. I removed some images that I found on User:Argyle 4 Life/Sandbox. In the future, please refrain from adding fair-use images to your user-space drafts or your talk page. See a log of images removed today here, shutoff the bot here and report errors here. Thank you, -- DASHBot (talk) 00:42, 3 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Thank you for notifying me, Mr Bot.


 * I could go into great detail about how trying and tiresome the whole circus surrounding images on Wikipedia is, but since you are a bot I shall not bother.


 * Regards. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 00:51, 3 February 2010 (UTC)

When Saturday Comes
I've been keeping an eye on the FLC, but have deliberately kept a distance. I don't think I can be impartial about a format that I have used and might use again in future.

I think it's beyond question that When Saturday Comes is a reliable source. Whether their endorsement of the other sites is sufficient is generally down to the opinion of the individual reviewers. Without wanting to pre-empt anyone else, I think that's pretty high praise you've quoted there.

Don't be too disheartened about the lack of support, it's going better than most people's first FLCs, and I'm pretty sure it took me longer than this to get my first support. Good luck, and let me know if you have any further questions! WFCforLife (talk) 07:28, 6 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, it is a tried and tested format. :) I've been encouraged by the feedback really, none have been overly critical, they're just making sure the sources are reliable which is fair enough. I remembered Greens on Screen got a mention in WSC and thankfully I found a link, so hopefully that'll be enough.


 * I wouldn't use their material unless I was pretty sure its correct. I have alot of respect for the owner who runs it (with the help of a few contributors regarding photos), and I have learnt so much about our history through it, so I could think of no better source to use. The feedback has been positively joyous compared to a certain peer review I asked for. I'll give you a shout if I need anything else. Cheers. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 08:05, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

Jack Fowler (footballer born 1899)
Thanks for the note - maybe Puncheon will make his debut at Exeter today. I'm sure you won't object if Saints come away with all three points! Pardew is a great manager and has made some fantastic signings for a club at our (present) level. I think the play-offs are out of reach this season (after all we did start with a ten point penalty and only one win in the first ten games as the new signings blended together) but we'll be back soon.

I have now expanded the Fowler article and added my source for his date of death. As you can see, this came from a book about Wales international footballers. www.allfootballers.com gives the year of death, but is a subscription service. (Well worth it in my opinion, but I can see that not everyone wants to spend their hard earned cash on obtaining information for Wikipedia.)

The two Plymouth Argyle websites are fantastic resources, with so much information; it's a pity neither of them give any biographical details. (I wish Southampton had something similar, although Hagiology Publishing's books are equally comprehensive.) I will have to continue my expansion to cover his Swansea and Wales careers to make the article fully comprehensive - maybe tomorrow.

Are you able to shed any light on why Fowler went on the tour of South America after leaving the club? (That's almost definitely him in the photo as he looks identical to the picture in the Wales Who's Who.) Very strange! Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 07:52, 6 February 2010 (UTC)


 * No not at all, put them in their place. Some of them are actually entertaining the thought of playing us for once next season, no chance!


 * Indeed, if they had biographical details I would be all set, but I might have a further look into subscribing somewhere because I'd like to create pages for as many of our players as possible, and I'd like them all to have their date of death/definitely still living eventually. I'll purchase a few Argyle books soon which will help me there too. I'm very impressed with what you've done for Jack Fowler. Its a shame he didn't play more for us, but we did have some great players back then.


 * I have no idea why he went on the tour when he wasn't our player anymore. I see you found the page about it from Argyle on Tour, a great read. Boca's supporters haven't changed over the years, still loopy! Good old Moses though, he was a man who didn't take prisoners. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 08:28, 6 February 2010 (UTC)

I have listed this article for DYK with your name as co-author. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 11:46, 7 February 2010 (UTC) p.s. Sorry we couldn't hold on to the lead yesterday. That's three away matches in a row that we have conceded a late equalizer.


 * Awesome work there. Its amazing what can happen after you create an article! Would you fancy doing something similar for Moses Russell? He is deserving of a strong article but I couldn't do it justice myself because I don't have much information available to me. I could add a good table for appearances but not alot else.


 * Keep up the good work. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 12:22, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Moses Russell
I will see what I can do later in the week. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 15:39, 7 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I appreciate you doing this. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 14:55, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

I hope I've done him justice. A fascinating guy. I need now to find a picture to upload showing his bald head. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 07:54, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Great stuff. A guy like Moses deserved a worthy article. Good luck trying to find a free picture! Argyle 4 Life (talk) 14:22, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of List of Plymouth Argyle F.C. results by opponent


The article List of Plymouth Argyle F.C. results by opponent has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * WP:NOT a statistics database. A history of Plymouth Argyle F.C. is welcome, and the article with the main statistics is normal as well, but this is taking things one step too far. The resutls of Plymouth against e.g. Accrington Stanley are the kind of minutiae that belong in specialized statistical databases, not in Wikipedia.

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing  will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion. Fram (talk) 13:39, 11 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I'll be challenging this, make no mistake. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 14:55, 11 February 2010 (UTC)

Please don't be reticent in defending your corner. You are entitled to express your opinion at Articles for deletion/Luton Town F.C. league record by opponent. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 18:31, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

Referencing BLPs
Hello. First, well done for adding references to so many unreferenced BLPs. But when you leave an article still needing more references, please could you use the template BLP sources (or BLPrefimprove, which redirects to that) rather than plain refimprove, to make sure the article gets properly categorised as a BLP needing improved ref'ing. thanks, Struway2 (talk) 12:28, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
 * No problem, I'll do that in the future. I did actually use one of them before it was suggested I should use a different one in a history page of an article which I added a reference to. Thank you for the message. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 13:42, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

Results by opponent
Actually, I've got a very similar one in my sandbox, albeit I only got as far as C before losing that book, and I haven't been able to get it back since.

I'm always reluctant to directly act on discussions where you're involved; we have very similar names as well as editing in similar areas. I'm worried that we could be accused of sockpuppetry, and that there's enough of a crossover that a checkuser test could come up as a false positive.

Provided it's a neutral notification, my suggestion would be to take it to the talk page of FLC. The Luton one has been nominated, so the discussion directly affects the FL process. I'd have thought that if a list has passed an FLC, reviewers there (as a general trend) think that it's an article worthy of inclusion. WFCforLife (talk) 15:23, 12 February 2010 (UTC)


 * That is what I thought too. I felt for quite some time that doing a list of results by opponent would be interesting, but I wouldn't have gone ahead and done so if there were no others on show. As it happens I saw one on Luton which passed an FLC which indicated it was a worthy article as you say, which gave me the nudge I needed to crack on with my own. I can understand why it is being questioned since there are only two such articles, but I believe the reason for that is because it does require alot of hard work.


 * I removed the Prod from the article and gave my reasons for doing so which prompted the Luton Town article being nominated and I've said I'll keep out of it because it directly affects me, and I believe the format is sound. We'll see what reviewers decide and take it from there. If its decided to delete them then I can't really do anything but I'm confident that won't happen. I would be happy for Cliftonian to defend the format but he isn't around any more which is unfortunate. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 16:07, 12 February 2010 (UTC)


 * P.S. I understand your concerns, some people will look for anything to back-up their argument, but I think its clear that we're not the same person. I might alter my name soon though, I expect it can be confusing for some people even though we support teams at different sides of the country. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 16:07, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I wish the Football League fixture computer would recognise that we're on opposite sides of the country, instead of routinely sending us to Home Park on Tuesday nights! WFCforLife (talk) 17:06, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
 * You won't have to worry about it next season, the way things are going at the moment! Argyle 4 Life (talk) 00:25, 13 February 2010 (UTC)

www.argylereview.co.uk
Hi - do you know what's happened to this website? It seems to have disappeared over the weekend. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 18:28, 14 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I did notice a few days that it hadn't been updated for a few weeks. I can't see anything right now on our main forum which the guy who runs it has posted on before. It would be a shame if its gone for good; maybe just taking a break and neglected to pay for bandwith. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 18:40, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

Rollo Jack
Have you got any books which include a bio for this player. I was wondering if he might be ths same person as Robert Jack who is listed as joint manager of Valur in 1937-8. Thanks. Eldumpo (talk) 21:31, 19 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I'm afraid I don't. He didn't play often for my club so I can't find much on him, but it might well be the same person since the two dates, retirement from playing and managing Valur, link fairly well. One of our current players began his career there, quirky. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 00:57, 20 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I added a link to his Swindon Town profile. I had hoped that this might indicate where he went next, but no such luck. Sorry I can't help further.  Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 12:08, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

FLC
I think it is already fantastic. I'll take a second look to be extra vigilant. The sourcing was the main thing so it should be a case of tracking down the info and adding the citations.Cptnono (talk) 01:25, 27 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Thats good to know. I've ordered a couple of the books that are listed in the references and they should be with me by Wednesday atleast, so I'll be able to add specific page citations. I would like to have more photographs, especially ones featuring the award, like this, but its a minefield. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 19:14, 1 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Good news, my books arrived this morning so I've been able to add inline citations for each player and one in the lead which is a reference to a table of the winners listed in the books. I've also expanded the lead to include some more information about the history of the club, we're rather old! I'm not sure what else I can add really, let me know what you think. I'll have a look over it a few more times and will probably nominate it again in a few days. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 16:04, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

BLP sticky PROD
Hi !. Every attempt to rescue a Wikipedia article is a noble gesture. However, there may be occasions when, with the best  will in the world, it  is just  not  possible to accord even a minimum of notability to an article or stub, or find a proper source for it. Most regrettably, even the most  dedicated inclusionists will have to concede that  the article may  have to  go if the creator or major contributors cannot  justify their work. For new and recent unsourced BLPs, some users are now working at  WT:BLP PROD TPL on  the development  of templates that are designed to  encourage contributors to source new BLPs, without  scaring away the newbies who  might  not  be aware of the rules. This template is certainly not  another  a licence to  kill for the deletionists, in  fact  the very idea of it  is to  ensure that  you  are not  fighting a losing  battle. It would be great if you  could look  in  at the prgogress and maybe leave a word of encouragement. The workshop page is essentially a template development taskforce, and is not a place to  engage in a hefty  debate on  incusion/deletion  policy. See you at WT:BLP PROD TPL?--Kudpung (talk) 12:54, 7 March 2010 (UTC)

GA review
Hi there, I have completed GA review on the article 1996 Football League Third Division play-off Final. While it is a fairly well written article overall, there are a few problems that need to be addressed before this can be promoted to GA. I will leave the review open for one week, but will pass it before then if the comments are dealt with. Thanks, -- Big  Dom  20:51, 9 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Great quick work doing those changes! I have now passed the article as GA. -- Big  Dom  17:37, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
 * Fantastic, my first GA. Thankyou for the review. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 19:28, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Rollback
Hi. I saw your note at WT:FOOTY and, after looking at your contribs have seen nothing problematic, so have gone ahead and enabled Rollback for your account. You should read WP:ROLLBACK before using the tool, and be sure to only use it for blatant vandalism. If in doubt, don't use it. Best, – Toon 16:07, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Thank you, much appreciated. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 21:17, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

William Fullarton (footballer)
Don't suppose you're able to fill in his PAFC stats (or anything else).........? -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 11:51, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * I've added his Southern League appearances in the infobox and his appearances in all competitions, along with an external link which has a picture. My book says he joined New Brompton in April 1907 but if you believe otherwise then feel free to change it. Books of player records from the Football League and Southern League are on my "to get list".


 * I hope that helps. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 02:48, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Wait, I thought the name was familiar. William "Bill" Fullerton managed Plymouth Argyle for one season, 1906–07, having played for Sunderland between 1903 and 1905. So they must be one and the same. It took a minute for me to realise given how late in the night it is. Isn't it mentioned at all in the resources you have? Lots of loose ends to tidy up here, but its not surprising I guess, since it happened more than a century ago. Argyle 4 Life (talk) 03:14, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Seasons list
Hello. As to Footballsite's reliability, it depends what you mean by "reliable". I've come across the very occasional typo but compared to something like Soccerbase it's a masterpiece of accuracy. However, it is someone's personal site, presumably to attract visitors who might then visit his programme-selling business, and there's no "about" page or list of sources or anything to convince the doubting reviewer of its reliability in Wikipedia terms, which sadly seems to equate to "run by a media company and therefore by definition subject to proper fact-checking". That may be the case in the States where all their sports are stats-heavy, but over here stats sites aren't commercially viable. (rant over :-) Footballsite is the only place I've found voting figures for re-election to the league, and I'd rather like to go on using it for that. What were you planning to use it for, that can't be sourced to FCHD or RSSSF?

Re the unlinked players, I've looked them up in Joyce's Player Records book and all three have played League football, so should be redlinked. Names are Herbert W. Swann, John Thomas Hakin known as Tommy, and John Arthur Boden, who appears in this list redlinked as John Boden (footballer). There's no hurry to create the articles, a few redlinks won't make any difference at FLC, but if you'd like whatever info Joyce has, I can copy it over here. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 08:26, 28 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Hello. I understand fully what you're saying regarding Footballsite because I've encountered the issue over reliability with another website when trying to get an article featured. Greens on Screen is refered to as the Oracle by many of our supporters because its full of information and the man who runs it (Steve, terrific guy) strives for accuracy, but its not run by a company. If it was more straight forward I would link many snippets of information to it because its fantastic resource. Without checking thoroughly, what makes FCHD and RSSSF undoubtedly verifiable? They're great websites but they also look like personal websites. Regarding Footballsite, I've included citations to it for a couple of league tables and voting figures regarding League expansion and election.


 * I didn't realise each player who played in the League needed to be redlinked atleast but like you said the other day, the criteria for inclusion now is alot more demanding. I saw a few players here who weren't redlinked so I assumed it was acceptable. If you could copy the information over to me then that would be great. I wouldn't feel right asking someone else to do it on my behalf. This is all I have on them at the moment; Swann, Hakin, Boden. So I felt that if I created the pages without knowing a bit more then it wouldn't look that good.


 * I did alot of work last night on the footnotes, so would you say I'm on the right path? Thanks for your help. Argyle 4 Life  talk  22:34, 28 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Reliable sources: it's a question of reputation, proven fact-checking, who writes for it, how is its content controlled... FCHD is a personal website, but it's also the definitive work on club histories, relied upon by many smaller clubs and leagues to save doing the work themselves: its reliability was confirmed here. RSSSF grew from a newsgroup to an international foundation with governing board, serious reputation, and status as official keeper of the Danish FA's records: its reliability was questioned and accepted at Reliable sources/Noticeboard/Archive 30.
 * Redlinks: see WP:REDLINK. It's normal practice to link notable persons, and anyone having played in the Football League passes WP:ATHLETE. The blacklinks on Gillingham seasons are presumably players who played Southern League for Gillingham/New Brompton but never played in the Football League for anybody. That's the case for the few in the very early days of Birmingham seasons whose lack of linking was questioned at its FLC. You may notice that your redlinks have gone blue, by the way. I was bored, and it was nearly as easy to format the stats stuff into a stublet as to copy it here.
 * Footnotes: I take pleasure in footnotes, they can often lead you off into finding out all sorts of interesting things, so tend to go overboard with them. You may have a similar turn of mind :-) Some people don't give them a second glance. It's up to you: so long as there's nothing in the actual seasons table that immediately prompts a question that isn't answered in the notes, you're OK. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 10:39, 29 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Very interesting. I guess if I'd like to include Greens on Screen as a reliable source in FA's then I'd need to go down that route, but I don't know where to start. I stick to the rules as much as I can but some technicalities go over my head. Its records have been gathered from original newspaper reports and they maintain a very strong dialoge with the club and BBC Devon - who even allow the site to include clips from Radio Devon after matches and other things, such as these. I'd love to include it in the future without certain people questioning its accuracy.


 * Thanks for doing the articles, layed out much better than if I had made a stab at it. I know where you're coming from because that is how I felt the other night when I planned on only doing 5/6 that evening, but ended up doing more than 25. Its alot of extra work but the reward is that it improves the article considerably. I think I've done as many as I can without including very trivial things, so I'm almost done I think. If there is anything else I can add then don't hesitate to tell me. Much appreciated. Argyle 4 Life  talk  01:29, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Just in case you find yourself needing alternative sources, for List of Lincoln City F.C. seasons I replaced the dead fchd with the most recent webarchive version, which includes up to end 2007/8, the corresponding Argyle page is here, and then used Statto, which covers most competitions and was accepted as reliable at this FLC. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 11:36, 24 May 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks fella, I'll have to use Satto alot more in the future. Any more news on FCHD? Last I heard it went down because of money issues but Richard Rundle was hopeful of getting it back again soon. Would be a shame if its gone for good. Argyle 4 Life  talk  22:20, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Gills
Cheers for the message. I'm sure it won't be the last time we find ourselves dropping into the bottom tier. I was actually in hospital rather than at the game yesterday afternoon, think I picked the better place to be :-P -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 07:29, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

Reviewer granted
Hello. Your account has been granted the "reviewer" userright, allowing you to to review other users' edits on certain flagged pages. Pending changes, also known as flagged protection, will be commencing a a two-month trial at approximately 23:00, 2010 June 15 (UTC).

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Thanks
I won't be quite as active as I used to be, but it's good to be back all the same. Hope you're keeping well.

At the moment my main projects are Watford-centric, but sooner or later I'll be looking to get certain Football League articles up to the standard of their P*****r League equivalents. I'll definitely drop you a message when I start that :) WFCforLife (talk) 09:39, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

Nathan Ellington
... has so many awards that he needs a box to condense them down. I'm having a bad day, what with being housebound for the world cup final, having an edit war with a 13 year old, and then getting a fresh reminder of why wikipedia will die unless it sacks all of its administrators, tears up all of its policies and starts from scratch. But that made me chuckle! WFC (talk) 23:53, 11 July 2010 (UTC)
 * I can understand your frustration, Wikipedia policy does that to me sometimes aswell. What did you get in an edit war with a 13 year old about? About Ellington, I thought I did include an awards box? Maybe I'm being forgetful because of the late hour. I saw the Team of the Year awards mentioned earlier and I've been meaning to do some for a while now. Brought back memories, 2001–02 was a brilliant season. The Team of the Year article itself is a bit of a mess, little referencing and the list of sections is very long. Argyle 4 Life  talk  00:01, 12 July 2010 (UTC)
 * It's just that as a Watford fan, it's (depressingly) funny to think that he has achieved so much, and to think what £3.25m and ~£10k a week could do for our club right now. Down the years, we've always had a reputation as shrewd operators in the transfer market (heck, even Roeder bought Kevin Phillips for peanuts). But West Brom really saw us coming with that one! WFC (talk) 00:06, 12 July 2010 (UTC)
 * I've been doing the same over the last couple of years regarding a few of our players (if Simon Walton plays against you this season then you'll have plenty to laugh about, and three points in the bag since they'll be effectively playing with ten men). I liked Ellington in his Bristol Rovers and Wigan Athletic days, we came up against him often and he was always a threat, but clearly he lost something after that - his record for you makes Jamie Mackie look like a clinical finisher. Argyle 4 Life  talk  00:22, 12 July 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, we're atrocious against ten men. Still, I'm surprisingly upbeat about our on-pitch prospects for 2010-11. No miracles, but 16th again seems realistic. Off it, we just have the small matter of either selling Scott Loach, Danny Graham and Adrian Mariappa to stay afloat, or finding an investor before the end of the season.

Curtis Nelson
hi just wanted to say thanks for creating his page and more so like myself for keeping the PAFC page up to date. Phenom V1.0 (talk) 12:17, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

File copyright problem with File:Sammy Black.jpg
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Sammy Black
I've looked up Sammy Black in Joyce's Football League Players' Records 1888 to 1939, but unfortunately it doesn't give any of the missing information that you were looking for, other than that he failed to score any goals for QPR. It doesn't give a date for him leaving QPR, and the date of death is just given as 1977. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful. &mdash; Gasheadsteve Talk to me 08:46, 17 August 2010 (UTC)

Non-free files in your user space
Hey there Argyle 4 Life, thank you for your contributions. I am a bot, alerting you that non-free files are not allowed in user or talk space. I removed some files I found on User:Argyle 4 Life/Sandbox 2. In the future, please refrain from adding fair-use files to your user-space drafts or your talk page.


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Thank you, -- DASHBot (talk) 05:06, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * I guess I should've removed them as soon as I pasted the work over to the article from the sandbox... Argyle 4 Life  talk  06:46, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

RE: AFD
Thanks man. I think I got it right with Branko de Tellería now. I've been relying on template copy-pasting for everything since my newbie days. Maybe its time for me to do a little technological upgrade and check out that bizarre WP:TWINKLE thing you say. Regards. Fache (talk) 23:42, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

Squad template deletion discussions
Hey, thanks for taking part earlier, now I found a few more that need to be voted on: thanks.--EchetusXe 18:35, 19 August 2010 (UTC)

Plymouth Argyle FLC
Unfortunately, I'm running behind in my reviewing at the moment; I haven't yet been able to get to a few FLCs older than yours that I'm interested in. Therefore, it may be a few days before I can drop by and offer a review. Be assured, however, that I do intend on getting to it before the FLC is in danger of being archived. It hasn't been 10 days yet anyway, so there should be some time left.  Giants2008  ( 27 and counting ) 02:09, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

William Fullarton (footballer) and Bill Fullerton
I have now merged these two articles - I hope I've got it right. I guess that, for the sake of completeness, there should be an article on his brother David. Cheers. Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 20:22, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
 * It looks good to me. Thankyou for doing it. Argyle 4 Life  talk  01:51, 2 September 2010 (UTC)

Players list
Hello. If you're happy with stublets of the quality of Tommy Hakin, i.e just the article structure and very basic facts, like stats from Joyce's book, I can do that. I owe you a favour anyway for you doing that Blues kit template and then me never using it... One thing I noticed about your list, you won't get away with using fair-use images: argument being we can use a non-free image to "serve the encyclopedic purpose" of identifying a dead person on their own page, for want of a non-free alternative, (see WP:NFCC) but we can always find free alternatives to decorate a list article with. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 06:53, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * OK then, see how it goes. Stubs are ideal for me at the moment, because I've got time to do bits here and there, but not anything that needs solid work for any length of time. As I'm proving with something I've been trying to write for weeks which is growing by about half a sentence a day on average... cheers, Struway2 (talk) 07:25, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * First instalment: Jack Butler (footballer born 1885)‎, Jimmy McCormick (footballer born 1883), Arthur Dixon (footballer born 1887), none of which is what they're called in the list, presumably you didn't have dates of birth. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 13:41, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * I should tell you that after the Watford seasons list and particularly this FLC, I'm not sure I ever want to look at a list again. However. It looks very nice. Maybe the lead has a bit too much Argyle and too little players for my taste. In the position column, I'd prefer Forward to Striker: all strikers are forwards, but not all forwards are strikers. Correct as of 14 August 2010 is ambiguous: Argyle played on that date, so the reader can't tell whether the figures apply before or after that day's game. Incidentally, have your lot bought any decent light bulbs for their floodlights yet? cheers, Struway2 (talk) 14:20, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * According to GoS, Cyril Eastwood was really Cecil Eastwood. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 19:29, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Second instalment: Jimmy Logan (footballer), Bob Preston, who is Scottish not English, and Billy Forbes. Not a birthdate among em. Strange thing with Logan, and also Fred Cosgrove, is that Joyce's book has day and month of birth, but only questionmarks for the year, which is something I hadn't come across before. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 09:14, 19 August 2010 (UTC)
 * Third instalment: Jimmy Kirkpatrick: your list has him as a defender but Joyce has outside-right, and GoS team sheets list him at no.7; Tommy Gallogley; Jimmy Dickinson (footballer born 1899): seeing as there was a birthdate for Mr Dickinson I put it in the title instead of (English footballer) as in your list. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 15:10, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
 * They're all c&p. What takes longest is checking I have actually changed the link to GoS and the page number in Joyce and the total appearances. Be surprised if there's any more before the middle of next week, what with football and real life and such. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 15:31, 20 August 2010 (UTC)
 * The remaining stubs are coming along (honest)... By the end of the week. If they aren't, then feel free to send a note three times a day until they do get done. As to free pictures, I'm no expert. Have a look at File copyright tags/Comprehensive, don't know if or  might be any use? cheers, Struway2 (talk) 18:26, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

Finished. You may have noticed that another editor with quite an interest in matters Cornish has added some bits to Harry Cann: the Tintagelweb page has a team photo showing him as winner of the Cornwall Junior Cup, and if he was only 5 ft 11, his teammates must have been real shortarses. Harry Bland is English and not Welsh as your list has him. As the existing Harry Roberts (footballer) is an England international, I've called Roberts Harry Roberts (footballer born 1906), assuming he was, rather than (English footballer). There's more to Corcoran's early Scottish career than Joyce speaks of, but I haven't got any reliable Scottish sources; only used Celticwiki because Celtic F.C.'s website confirm his 3 games for them, so it's likely the other info is OK.

If you want an external link, this clip from the British Pathé archive shows close-ups of several listed players, incl Roberts, Cann, Kirkwood, and it has sound, which a lot of these old clips don't. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 19:58, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Re: Deletion Archive
Your're not missing anything. That was my mistake. There were quite a few that were archived incorrectly (at least by closing date), and I accedently cut and pasted more discussions than I had intended without realising it. Thanks for pointing that out. Sir Sputnik (talk) 01:21, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Amsterdam Tournament
I'm late to the party and the FLC has been closed as successful so I won't comment there. At the candidacy you mention that it wasn't held this year due to busy fixture schedule and you got the information from the dutch page. Any chance you can add that info (end of the lead or blank row in table, I guess) with the ref to the list. I think it's quite important to make it clear this FL isn't out of date and why it hasn't happened in 2010. Thanks, Rambo's Revenge (talk)  17:24, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

NFCC images
There seems to be a growing assumption that just because a person is deceased doesn't make the subject automatically allowed a fair-use image. WP:NFCC #1 says "no free equivalent is available". Do you know that. There will be hundreds of pictures of the subject available. Have you attempted to obtain a free image of this subject? Rambo's Revenge (talk)  15:14, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
 * I did have a look before I uploaded the current image and couldn't find anything remotely free. I'm not an expert on where to look so there might be something that I missed. If a free image does turn up then thats good, I just felt compelled to get something of him up since he is revered where I'm from. Argyle 4 Life  talk  15:29, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately sentiment does not equal fair use. I've tagged this as CSD becuase the resolution is way too high. Otherwise I would have taken it to FfD. P.S. You can reply here I'm watching. Rambo's Revenge (talk)  15:31, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
 * Ah ok. I've learnt quite a bit about use of image since I started editing seriously but still have a way to go. I thought that a non-free image of an individual where no free ones exists was acceptable from what I've seen and read. The most notable example being Bobby Moore, although that image is much smaller and lower in quality. An idiots guide to image use would be supported by me! I have now found this image of him on Flickr (I searched in "The Commons" only earlier, not thinking that there might be one of him copyrighted) but the license isn't correct. I assume the owner can change it if asked nicely. Argyle 4 Life  talk  15:58, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
 * They can indeed. Some like the idea of their image being used on Wikipedia (a big website) some don't. By the way, I hope I wasn't to stern in my original message. Unfortunately I've seen a lot of rationales assuming dead = fair use. It isn't your fault. You have probably witnessed similar, assumed it was acceptable and were acting in good faith. The problem is they take quite a bit of process to delete in many cases (a FfD) because they usually have some weak attempt to meet WP:NFCC making fair use "disputed" and thus not really eligible for CSD. There has been much debate over WP:NFCC but fair use images really need very strong specific rationales for use (FAC brings this up often). However, unfortunately a lot of non-free images have boilerplate rationales because they are quicker and many kind of get away with it. I commend your attitude over this matter and wish all users would show the willingness to learning about image use that you have. Sincerely, Rambo's Revenge (talk)  17:02, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Featured List?
Have you thought about nominating Seattle Sounders FC results by opponent to be a featured list. I suspect that it is very close the the required quality. The FL review would take approximately 2-3 weeks and you'd need to respond to reviewer comments regularly, so it is a bit of a time commitment. I encourage you to consider nominating it. You've obviously put a lot of work into it and it looks great. --SkotyWAT<sub style="margin-left:-1.0ex;">C 21:31, 8 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the kind words. You're welcome to add to it if you think anything is missing. I haven't updated it for a while and some of the text might need to be changed, but I agree I don't think it's far off being ready. I've been really burned out over the last few months due to things happening in my life and the fact that my football club is being stripped bare due to the incompetence of the owners, so my motivation has been lacking. It'll come back though I'm sure. Argyle 4 Life  talk  02:27, 10 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't give up just because of that conversation. I've replied.  It's easy for folks like Chris and GiantSnowman to take a crap all over people's hard work in the name of some marginally aplicable policy.  They're certainly entitled to their interpretation of the policy, but I think that they're wrong and I think that there is sufficient evidence to support that fact.  I encourage you to proceed with the FL nomination.  I, for one, will be more than happy to help respond to feedback given in the review and will definitely voice my support of the nomination after a thorough review of the sources and prose (I've only skimmed it to this point).  Don't give up on this, and don't let these two jokers get you down. --SkotyWAT<sub style="margin-left:-1.0ex;">C 04:38, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Have to agree with Skoty. Besides, it's hard to argue that a succinct summary of an MLS or Football League club's head-to-head records is of less encyclopaedic value than Pascal Di Tommaso. The likes of GiantSnowman may do so anyway, but if it happens you can take comfort from the fact that they're being pedantic for pedantry's sake. —WFC— 10:43, 24 January 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks guys. I'll crack on with it soon and see what can be improved. I could understand their position if it was an indiscriminate list of statistics, but it isn't. If this sort of list isn't acceptable then I don't really understand how lists of players, managers, award winners, etc are either. This list would've been ready months ago if my club wasn't in such a mess, but I'm doing my best to snap out of it and be positive. Argyle 4 Life  talk  11:51, 25 January 2011 (UTC)

Nuno Mendes (footballer)
Hi there ARGYLE, VASCO from Portugal here,

i am sorry for my summary (a bit misunderstood by you judging from the subsequent summary) and my edits at this footballer's page. I have seen the discussion at WP:FOOTY and dropped a line therein.

Also, and given the fact my summary was just a misunderstanding, as i explained in the discussion, i do not think i deserved the attitude towards me in Mendes' page ("revert me again and i'll..." - threats!) and WP:FOOTY ("...common sense is lost on some people"), but you would know.

Still, regarding your (fine) intentions of turning Mendes' article into a good one, i guess my five (anon) edits following your stub creation state my desire to contribute and not be a nuisance. Attentively - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 16:34, 8 February 2011 (UTC)


 * I have "inserted some words" in the pertinent discussion, as you have, but thanks for the "individual" message, no worries mate, i won't accept your apologies because you don't need to apologize ;) If that nameless "user" you mean is who i think - or this one - boy oh boy... Cheers! - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 17:36, 8 February 2011 (UTC)

Bill Strauss
Hey, you changed the nationality of Strauss in the List of PA players and put the current SAF flag next to it, but shouldn't it be more appropriate to put the old flag instead? I'd do it myself, but I have no idea where to find the right image code. Thanks. Utinsh (talk) 21:56, 18 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Hello, that is a very good point. The same issue came up before the list became featured with Sam Kirkwood. I've changed it to the South African flag used between 1912 and 1928 as shown here. Argyle 4 Life  talk  22:23, 18 February 2011 (UTC)

Thanks
and best of luck to your lot on the financial front (and on the field: we had Sheff Wed in the last round of the FA Cup and they didn't look very good, but they may have been "concentrating on the League"). Talking of finance, I'm rather hoping this headline isn't too accurate a reflection of the facts... cheers, Struway2 (talk) 10:58, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Much appreciated and I hope nothing bad happens there to spoil your adventure next year. Two goals I have are to see Argyle in the top flight and European competition before I kick the bucket! Today has been a dark day because I never thought we would join the list of clubs to have taken administration, but it has also been one of hope. The people who have run us into the ground for too long have been removed from power and the supporters are doing all we can to ensure our future is prosperous, along with raising more money for loyal staff. I guess I should update our season article now and check what editors have been up to on our main page. Such joy. Argyle 4 Life  talk  21:42, 4 March 2011 (UTC)

Your GA nomination of Nuno Mendes (footballer)
The article Nuno Mendes (footballer) you nominated as a good article has been placed on hold. The article is close to meeting the good article criteria, but there are some minor changes or clarifications needed to be addressed. If these are fixed within seven days, the article will pass, otherwise it will fail. See Talk:Nuno Mendes (footballer) for things which need to be addressed. Jezhotwells (talk) 23:14, 20 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the review. I will try my best to show that the source you're unsure about is reliable. It appears to involve a number of people who collaborate to form an exhaustive database about Portuguese football, but I didn't check to see where they get the information from and it isn't easy to determine. When I first found the website it reminded me of Soccerbase without the respected publisher behind it. I think I can replace a number of them, mostly the league tables, with references to Rec.Sport.Soccer Statistics Foundation, but now that the player has dropped down to the third division it gets trickier because there isn't anywhere obvious to me that tracks the matches and lists them.


 * If I can't prove it's reliable - for what it's worth I've seen hundreds of Wiki articles about Portuguese players using it for the statistical breakdown - then do I have to replace every one of them or can I get away with including the overall page for 2008 and 2010 onwards? I guess this is what I signed up for by trying to get an article about an obscure Portuguese journeyman footballer to GA status! Thanks for your time. Argyle 4 Life  talk  01:49, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

FPF website
Hello and thank you for your message. I made a few attempts at finding the archived information at the FPF website, but it wasn't obvious at all. I suspect they do archive prior seasons entries, so I'll try again later today. Best regards. Jogurney (talk) 13:13, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry to say I've tried almost everything I could think of - changing the "futebol" parameter from 11 to 10 (especially for players who were with Gondomar in the 2009-10 season), searching the website for an archive, using Google searches of the website for an archive - and have come up short. It's strange that FPF doesn't store the season data somewhere, but I'm not able to find it. Jogurney (talk) 16:22, 21 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Thank you so much for the barnstar. I'm glad you were able to bring that article to good status. It's also great news that another editor views foradejogo.net as a WP:RS, because I've used it hundreds of times and it would be a shame to have to remove it. Keep up the great work! Jogurney (talk) 11:22, 23 March 2011 (UTC)

SFL1
There are some semi-pro teams in SFL1, but it is mostly fully pro. From memory Airdrie were fully pro when they were in SFL1 and he played in many games against other fully pro SFL1 teams and a few cup ties against SPL teams. It's more questionable whether a certain SFL1 player meets the GNG, I had a quick search for "Darren Smith"+Airdrie and could only find the two local paper articles going into any depth about him. Jmorrison230582 (talk) 18:17, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

todd lumsden
I have removed your deletion notice for Todd Lumsden as it is nonsense. You obviously (as you're foreign, so why would you?) have not much knowledge of our football system, and under Wikipedia rules on Notability (fully professional league) the admins have told me that any player who has played for his club in any senior competition when his club are in the First Division or the SPL is notable.

Lumsden played 14 league and 1 Scottish Cup tie for Hamilton Accies in 2004/05, when they finished 7th in the First Division.

Salty1984 (talk) 20:45, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

I can see your point, the term fully professional is unclear as it's very possible Raith (part-time) could win the first division this season and be promoted to the SPL...

It does say "Players who have appeared, and managers who have managed, in a fully-professional league (as detailed here), will generally be regarded as notable"

Which given the nature of Scottish football is only reasonable to be taken as the top two divisions as there is only one fully professional team outwith them, and that is Livingston.

We don't want SPL2, all we want is a 16 team top flight which the Old Firm won't vote for, and they have the financial clout to win any battle!

Salty1984 (talk) 21:28, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Cheers, I'll fix up Mark Ramsay's page when I get time. I doubt anyone else will do it; people in Cowdenbeath can't afford computers, and tend to have too many fingers to use them effectively... Salty1984 (talk) 22:40, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Proposed deletions
Hello. Wonder if you could either list the articles you prodded at WP:FOOTY manually, or else add the WikiProject Football banner to those talk pages that haven't got it yet so that ArticleAlertBot will pick them up. To give people a chance to check them out before they disappear without trace. thanks, Struway2 (talk) 08:49, 27 March 2011 (UTC)

Player notability
No problems - any time - and don't get discouraged when IPs challenge PRODS on their favourite players. It happens. Don't forget that WP:NFOOTBALL and WP:FPL both prove that players in the Irish system aren't notable (though they may still pass WP:GNG), and that you have the support of a good number of editors. Regards and happy editing, GiantSnowman 23:44, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

the Truros
Alright, I'll check it out. Actually, and further coincidentally, when I noticed your nomination I was on the page too to nominate a soccer player bio (actually 6 or 7) for deletion. If you have a moment, I hope you'll contribute to those discussions. Yeah, I don't know why we'd be named Truro here where there was no Cornish immigration (or at least not a wave of) - many of the settlers of Truro here (Nova Scotia) came from Ulster, Ireland, others from Yorkshire and Scotland. They may have just named it after Truro, Mass. - a lot of New Englanders came here and vice-versa around the time before and when the States separated from England. (Also too, a main downtown street where I live now, Halifax, Nova Scotia, is named Argyle Street.)  Good talking, Mayumashu (talk) 01:53, 30 March 2011 (UTC) Oh, I see you already have - cheers. Mayumashu (talk) 01:59, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

FK Novi Pazar players
Hi. Sorry, I only came now online. I´ll quickly take a look and I´ll post here all non-notable ones that play in the club, weather are done by that user, or not. OK, the ones that should be deleted are: Vladan Đogatović, Ibrahim Arifović, Elhan Bejtović, Elvedin Škrijelj, Admir Kecap, Salih Hamidović, Edin Selimović, Amar Plojović and Elvis Holić. The following one, Adnan Bektašević, is already nominated, and these two seems to have a bit longer careers,Miloš Đalac and Dino Caković, so let me confirm them and complete them first. FkpCascais (talk) 02:48, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Đalac is Montenegrin and I just wanted to see if he had any other spells maybe somewhere else because this is his first spell in Serbia, and Dino Caković played for Javor which has played in SuperLiga but seems that hasn´t used him. I didn´t get to them yet, I was fixing some other User:Ludanoc players from Novi Pazar in the meantime. FkpCascais (talk) 03:47, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * OK, Miloš Đalac played for FK Kom (15/0) in the 2003–04 First League of Serbia and Montenegro, (Srbijafudbal) thus being notable (Transfermarkt only have the last 3 seasons in their database). And Dino Caković (Srbijafudbal) has been with Javor in the SuperLiga, but failed to make an appereance, thus failing notability. FkpCascais (talk) 03:53, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Many thanks for this David. I should have done it myself, but honestly, all the AfD´s I donne (not many, around 5) were never done fully properly. I´ll see now how you did them and try to do it right next time. Regarding the numbers of AfD, the number now seems smaller, because the club made an effort this winter to bring experienced players to try to archive promotion this year for their first time, so after all, it wasn´t exactly just a "few" notables as I said, but anyway, 9 less is a great "cleaning" already. I checked them all at Srbijafudbal site, one by one, it ended up being by far the easiest way, although they have stats only begining in 2001, but for this case seems that it was more than enough. FkpCascais (talk) 04:12, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The website is very easy to navigate and if you go to the top you´ll see that it has the squads and basic club info of all clubs from the top 3 tiers in Serbia. I contacted the administrator and he told me he copies the stats from the Serbian FF reports, so I ended up adding the site in the Footy links under Serbia section. For someone needing some info from Serbia, well, if I am not around :) Srbijafudbal seems the most complete and reliable website from there. Also the fact that doesn´t contain any space shuttle tech makes it very navegable. If you make a trick like this, exemple Vojvodina normal page into this you´ll have the profiles of most players from the last 3 to 5 seasons. The players from the last seasons have their careers and stats complete, and the ones from more time ago begin lacking info. I founded a couple of mistakes in a universe of houndreds, so it is not bad at all. Poke me if you need anything. :) FkpCascais (talk) 04:39, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

OK, I see now that a person that doesn´t understand the language may have some doubts, so this may help:
 * SuperLiga
 * Prva Liga, meaning First League, 2nd tier.
 * Now, the 3th league (Srpska Liga) is divided into 4 geographical goups:
 * Srpska Liga Beograd, WP article Serbian League Belgrade
 * Srpska Liga Vojvodina, WP article Serbian League Vojvodina
 * Srpska Liga Zapad, WP article Serbian League West
 * Unfortunately, the Srpska Liga Istok (East) is missing. FkpCascais (talk) 05:04, 30 March 2011 (UTC)

Deletion review/Log/2011 April 6
FYI. postdlf (talk) 14:01, 8 April 2011 (UTC)

Category:Football biography using deprecated parameters
Here's a possible plan of action: Sound good? GiantSnowman 13:10, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
 * 1) Whenever we come across a new article, check what infobox is being used, and if the "wrong" one is being used, inform the creator about the correct infobox.
 * 2) Enquire at Bot owners' noticeboard to see whether it's feasible to use a bot to convert the infoboxes.
 * 3) In the mean time, start going through the articles, checking notability along the way.
 * I'll put in a request tomorrow when I have some time. Cheers, GiantSnowman 15:43, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Hey, request has been lodged at Bot owners' noticeboard. Cheers, GiantSnowman 16:54, 17 April 2011 (UTC)
 * And the same one at a slightly different place, Bot requests/Archive 41/Archives/ 24. GiantSnowman 18:32, 17 April 2011 (UTC)

League of Ireland players
Why are you proposing to delete all LOI players? Have you nothing better to do than delete thousands of hours of work? They play at the highest level in Ireland and frankly it is none of your business. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.191.233.130 (talk) 14:06, 15 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I think you will find that I never said all. I don't make up my own notability criteria, I follow those that have been agreed upon by consensus. Unless a player has competed internationally, at a fully professional level or in a major continental competition (not qualifying rounds) then he/she is not notable. It doesn't matter if they're English, Irish, or Moldovan, if it doesn't meet the criteria then it has no place here. Adhering to policies and maintaining the reputation of the encyclopaedia is my business. Argyle 4 Life  talk  16:03, 15 April 2011 (UTC)

You dont run wikipedia mercifully so it is not your business. As has been pointed out repeatedly the notability criteria needs to be changed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.191.233.130 (talk) 13:49, 16 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I take part in deletion discussions with an open mind, so that proves you don't know me at all. If notability can be established in an article after I have already given my opinion to delete then I have no problem changing that opinion to keep. Consensus says that playing in the League of Ireland doesn't automatically grant notability, just like the Veikkausliiga, the Premier League of Bosnia and Herzegovina and many others. There is no agenda on my part. Happy editing. Argyle 4 Life  talk  20:22, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

history
ahhh...you're working on this, right?-- Club Oranje T 11:56, 16 April 2011 (UTC)

Bradford City
Yep, for my sins I'm a Bantam...and basically we're screwed. We can't afford the rent at our stadium, but we have a lease which we can't break without going into administration...but if we do that we'll be docked points and therefore relegated, in which case we'll probably go bust completely. It's a shocker. The players have no passion or drive whatsoever, and I won't tell you what I think about our caretaker manager due to BLP policies here ;) Not much better up your end, is it? GiantSnowman 22:38, 24 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks to our bumbling managers this season, we somehow have four first-team goalkeepers - and Saxton's #4, so I almost guarantee he'll be shown the door come the summer, which is a shame, as I'd've like to have seen him. You've entered Administration, right - so how come you haven't been docked points yet? Being in the same league as Crawley is an absolute disgrace, for multiple reasons (us sinking so low, them buying success) - but such is modern football, right? GiantSnowman 00:38, 25 April 2011 (UTC)

Relegation
Commiserations - however, at least you've made the Bradford City home page - every cloud, eh? GiantSnowman 19:16, 2 May 2011 (UTC)
 * And from me. Thought you might make it, but it must have been incredibly difficult for all concerned. Hope it gets sorted out soon. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 07:50, 3 May 2011 (UTC)

report...
I have filed a report on another user at Administrators'_noticeboard/Edit_warring. Just advising as a courtesy as you were the first step (well, second, you were the "R") on the WP:BRD cycle and I may have mentioned you by name.-- Club Oranje T 12:53, 11 May 2011 (UTC)

ps. Commiserations also on the relegation. -- Club Oranje T 12:53, 11 May 2011 (UTC)

Grim Reaper (
I did not introduce them in the first place, but not only does it show that a team has "died" but also makes it more enjoyable for viewers. I see no harm in including it. I mean, if most of the users are against them I don't mind if they are removed. But some have been up for two years now and no-one's said anything about them. Qampunen (talk) 20:14, 13 May 2011 (UTC)

Richard Morris (footballer)
Thanks for the note: The Who's Who of Welsh International Soccer Players gives his career details plus a twelve line biography, although it has nothing not already in the article you linked me to. He is mentioned in three of my books, all of which (Who's Who, The Complete Wales FC and Joyce's Football League Players' Records) give his date of birth as "1883". He is also mentioned on the Liverpool FC website which suggests 1879 as the year of birth. If you plan to create an article, can I suggest that you do so as Dickie Morris which seems to be his accepted name (although Who's Who gives it as "Dicky"!) Sorry I can't help more. Best of luck for next season - I hope Argyle can find their equivalent of Markus Liebherr and bring you back up the leagues. -- Daemonic Kangaroo (talk) 04:55, 16 May 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Walter Anderson (footballer)
Materialscientist (talk) 09:05, 19 May 2011 (UTC)

Thanks
For referencing "trap", "tackle" and "technical area" in the football glossary. All the Ts are my responsibility but I had trouble finding those. <span style='font-family: Georgia, serif; color:#639;'> Timbouctou (<span style='font-family: Georgia, serif; color:#639;'> talk ) 13:33, 23 May 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Dickie Morris
Materialscientist (talk) 08:03, 26 May 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Glossary of association football terms
The DYK project (nominate) 08:05, 29 May 2011 (UTC)

Quite a character!
Hi there ARGYLE, VASCO from Portugal here,

Has this user ever responded to you (please see here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Alexanderalgrim)? Not to me he has not, getting quite annoyed by his behaviour. Have tried in English and what seems to be his mother tongue (Portuguese as me, as he edits mainly in Portuguese soccer, and has a distinct user name), he says "talk to the hand".

Interesting enough, he has been granted autopatrol rights at WP. Checking his talkpage history, it's clear he did not even bother to contact the editor that bestowed that honour upon him...Cheers, keep up the good work - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 22:36, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

DYK for Bill Yates (footballer)
Materialscientist (talk) 00:03, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

Scott Evans (footballer)
I have removed the prod tag from Scott Evans (footballer), which you proposed for deletion. I'm leaving this message here to notify you about it. If you still think the article should be deleted, please don't add the prod template back to the article. Instead, feel free to list it at Articles for deletion. Thanks! TerriersFan (talk) 01:24, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Gerald Cork
Hello Argyle 4 Life. I have a source which says that Gerald Cork (father of cricketer Dominic) played some professional matches for Port Vale, but I can't seem to find any further info online. Would it be possible if you could help shed some light on whether he did or not? Thanks. AssociateAffiliate (talk) 17:00, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Gregoire Akcelrod
Hi, Gregoire Akcelrod's page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregoire_Akcelrod is a copy of Greg Akcelrod already deleted 3 times ! : http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Greg_Akcelrod&action=edit&redlink=1. I think you could make a speedy deletion. Thanks Soccerincanada (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 19:06, 12 June 2011 (UTC).

Club notability
I agree that club notability and WP:FOOTYN needs to be addressed, ideally we could have something like WP:FPL but for clubs...do you want to instigate the discussion? Going to be pretty busy over the next few days being all 'political', so won't be able to contribute much I'm afraid. GiantSnowman 22:10, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Ha, sorry to disappoint you! I'll try and contribute as much as I can while I can i.e. tonight, tomorrow. GiantSnowman 22:20, 28 June 2011 (UTC)

FC Chalon
Good work! I got confused with 1/32èmes which is the round of 64! However, the club reached just that level in each of the two seasons and didn't get further in 2001-02 - see []. TerriersFan (talk) 19:17, 9 July 2011 (UTC)
 * No worries. I appear to have been confused too. The round name in the second RSSSF link I provided threw me off. Argyle 4 Life  talk  21:01, 9 July 2011 (UTC)

Juan Luis Mora Parada for AfD??
You know the criteria better than I. Mora plays for the second division team Rangers de Talca in Chile. The editor of the article is creating other second division player articles

Home Park
Hello. Thanks for that: interesting reading. I'd wondered when I was doing the season article who or what Home Park were, and if they had any relation to Argyle. Wish my lot had a historian who published their work. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 19:45, 17 July 2011 (UTC)
 * No real interest in Lincoln City at all... I'd done Darlington F.C. seasons, but didn't have the sources for seasons' top scorers which I'd need to take it to FL, so decided to do Lincoln City F.C. seasons purely and simply because it could be easily sourced from their excellent archive site, which I'd come across when writing Bert Linnecor and others. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 21:13, 17 July 2011 (UTC)

Help!!
Hi there ARGYLE, VASCO here, hope all's fine by you,

Please have a look at the message i sent good 'ole User:Thumperward (he seems absent at the moment) and kindly advise me (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:Thumperward#Jos.C3.A9_Carlos_Fern.C3.A1ndez_V.C3.A1zquez_-_Help.21.21.21).

When/if i lose my temper, then i get the scolding, only for wanting to improve the articles :( Cheers! - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 14:23, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

Attendance
In case you haven't found a source yet for that Estonia attendance, the Estonia FA website has it. cheers, Struway2 (talk) 08:14, 22 July 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for ur help
Thanks a lot for your help about the logo!!--NovaSkola (talk) 08:55, 23 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Dear, Argyle 4 Life, I also need one more time same help as could u please upload logo of Ravan Baku from here http://www.apasport.az/photo/REVANLOGO1311493844-2.jpg

It is just new clubs each time changing logos--NovaSkola (talk) 10:12, 24 July 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks a lot once again. Let me know, if you need my help.--NovaSkola (talk) 21:02, 24 July 2011 (UTC)

Greetings
Thanks for your notice buddy....i will be more careful next time....

Good morning....

Civility and stuff
Regarding my last WP:FOOTY input, i have already replied you there. Here, i'll only add, other than a second apology to you, WP, WP:FOOTY and (some of) those concerned with some of the contents of my input: i can cope with being called "stupid" (what's intelligence anyway), but VILE? Please think about what you wrote as well my friend.

Attentively - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 13:35, 27 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The events of the last week have been very disturbing and I was offended by what you said, so I can only imagine how someone who lost a loved one would've reacted to your comment. As I said before, think about what you write before you click that save button. Comparing a cheating footballer to a mass murder is wrong. Argyle 4 Life  talk  22:10, 27 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I'll try to "defend" myself once again, as i feel i did not manage it the last time around: i only chose that comparison to illustrate the level of vandalism occurring in the footballer's page (i did not compare anyone, i merely "reasoned" - or did not! - if this occurs in a mere footballer page, what can be done with a real scumbag like that mass murderer and the ones like him), i only chose a very unfortunate example to guide me by. I guess you are very upset at me, and there's nothing i can say at this moment to "turn back the tide", so i'll just be quiet for now...

No friends in real life, still have time to make enemies in the virtual world, even though i intend just the opposite - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 02:13, 28 July 2011 (UTC)
 * You don't have to apologise to me, I'm not going to hold it against you. It was an off the cuff remark and we all make them. If you look at the editing history of Sam Deering you will see an expansion I made after answering a request to do so. I found something unsavoury that he said during his time at Oxford United and in my edit summary I made a comment about his intellect, which I shouldn't have. You do a lot of great work around here and I have no beef with you, so don't worry about it. Argyle 4 Life  talk  02:22, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

DYK nomination of Template talk:Did you know/List of Faroe Islands national football team results
Hello! Your submission of Template talk:Did you know/List of Faroe Islands national football team results at the Did You Know nominations page has been reviewed, and there still are some issues that may need to be clarified. Please review the comment(s) underneath your nomination's entry and respond there as soon as possible. Thank you for contributing to Did You Know! Jim Sweeney (talk) 11:39, 28 July 2011 (UTC)

Marian Fuchs
Thanks for the heads up, I never knew adding a simple reference to a page could be so controversial! Cheers, GiantSnowman 12:18, 30 July 2011 (UTC)

Hiroyuki Takahashi
Hi. I read a message about Hiroyuki Takahashi from you. This player name is Hiroyuki Takahashi (japanese 高橋宏幸 j-league official site ; #24) not Hiroto Takahashi (japanese 高橋裕人? Albirex Niigata official site ; I don't know details). Obviously Hiroyuki Takahashi and Hiroto Takahashi are another person. Hiroyuki Takahashi is appeared in a fully-professional league (J. League Division 1) in 2002 season (j-league official site ; Tokyo Verdy 1969 #30 (57 minutes)). So, I remove Proposed deletion tag. Thanks. --Nameless User (talk) 08:38, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

DYK for List of Faroe Islands national football team results
PanydThe muffin is not subtle 08:49, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

AfD
Hey, thanks for removing my comment from that AfD article, I wasn't sure what the policy was but I had a feeling that I wasn't supposed to add my choice. TonyStarks (talk) 12:10, 3 August 2011 (UTC)
 * No problem. I was fairly sure that by nominating the article you were making your opinion known, but I wanted to make sure by checking on the relevant page and it was there. Argyle 4 Life  talk  12:32, 3 August 2011 (UTC)

User:Alexanderalgrim
Hi there ARGYLE, VASCO here,

from what i see, nothing have you managed in terms of reaching this chap. What do you think can be done, if anything?

Attentively, happy week - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 21:21, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

1997–98 Premier League Team of the Year
Thanks for letting me know. I've had a look in the book and McManaman's not listed so I've removed him. Cheers, Mattythewhite (talk) 22:58, 8 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Aye, thought I'd bring the PFA books I bought on the cheap from Amazon to good use. I'm not sure Jcarls1 is to blame here, I think he's taken the seemingly fake content that was on the PFA Team of the Year with good faith when created the templates. Most probably IPs over the years adding what they've liked on a page that is scarcely patrolled are to blame. Cheers, Mattythewhite (talk) 00:23, 11 August 2011 (UTC)

ANI
 Chzz  ► 21:53, 9 August 2011 (UTC)

Searching for a player
I'm looking for a player who has been with your favorite club a while back and was hoping you might be able to shed some light on his career. Neale Marmon, who spend most of his career in Germany seems to have started his footballing days with Plymouth Argyle or at least have spend some time at the club. I'm unable to find anything on him for the period before 1979 and from 1980 to 1982. Are you able to find out when and how long he was with Argyle? Thanks for any help you can provide, Calistemon (talk) 06:19, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks, that made it a little clearer. I will leave him as Plymouth Argyle in the youth section of the infobox a all sources I could find state that Argyle was his original club. Calistemon (talk) 00:06, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

2011–12 Southern Football League
Hi there, yes, go for it :o) You mean adding results grids and suchlike? By all means add stuff like that, anything that works for the Conference article would work on the SFL article. I must say though, I do prefer the current way of listing the new clubs in each division - splitting them up like they are in the Conference article doesn't read as well, I think. I basically threw in the one map and the stadia list - there may be errors in them. Same with the Western League - I mainly worry about updating the tables, and providing the tables aren't squeezed or filled with rubbish, I'm happy. Mr Heaney - I find him to be a bit of a strange man, and he keeps his cards very close to his chest. He may be rolling in money he's not telling us about, or he may be days from bankruptcy - who knows?! I'm sure he has fingers in some dodgy pies, and it may be that it all comes crashing down at some point. Hopefully he keeps the club separate to an extent, so that someone else could come in if he comes unstuck. But as you well know, things don't always work out for the best, and some people seem intent on ruining clubs. Rushden are gone, and who knows who'll be next. Chester, Halifax and a few others had to start from scratch. I do hope for the best for Argyle, but if they struggle on the pitch, then it might get worse before it gets better. Fingers crossed. Arlesey? Lol no idea - damn corporate interference again! Bretonbanquet (talk) 21:31, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Sounds great :) Yeah, that sounds like a plan... I can only assume there's some kind of ulterior motive there, maybe it's me being cynical. Separating the club from the ground works as long as the ground owner doesn't decide to put the rent up. It depends a lot on who buys it. Barry Hearn did the same thing at Leyton Orient, now the club pays him rent because he owns the ground. But when he sells the ground - and who knows who will buy it - the owner could push the rent up, and force the club out so that they can build flats on the ground. Hearn has already built a block of flats in each corner, and he collects the rent! God alone knows where Heaney's getting his six million - but it seems that people with assets and clout can raise that kind of money quite easily. And here I am, I can't even raise a tenner half the time! Like you, I don't trust Ridsdale at all - people like him always seem to come out richer, and that can only mean the club is poorer. And yeah, it seems so strange to see a Cornish side so high up the leagues - and they went all the way to Chelmsford on Saturday and came back with three points! Bretonbanquet (talk) 22:49, 15 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I missed your reply after someone decided to post a foot-long moan on my page. Yeah, Bradford are a great example of this - there's no way a club like that should be stuck in League Two year after year. Got to feel for their fans. You can bet that someone will try to do something at Home Park which isn't to the fans' taste, and of course money will talk. A cinema??? Wow. It sounds a bit like Barry Hearn's idea to rotate Orient's pitch 90 degrees and build a hotel... It does seem like Heaney has some pretty strange ideas, maybe your lads should follow him around and eavesdrop! Truro won again tonight, but Plymouth had nothing to cheer about - down there with poor old Bradford :( Can only get better, right? Bretonbanquet (talk) 23:19, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I agree, the changes he was making were awful, but he doesn't like to be told! I totally understand how last night's result made you feel angry and fed up. My "first" club Orient provided me with the same feeling. At this rate my non-league "second" club will be passing Orient on their way up! Ugh.. Apparently Heaney has said he won't be selling Truro and will basically give Plymouth Argyle FC to Ridsdale, because you're not allowed to own two clubs. Heaney will then keep the ground etc... sounds like a recipe for potential disaster. Maybe I'm being pessimistic, but I just don't trust either of those guys. And yeah, it translates on to the field - I'm sure the players are worried, a lot of them are new, right? Tough times. But, wow - what a photo!! That's about the best pic of a footy ground I've ever seen. Let's hope Heaney doesn't spoil the view. Bretonbanquet (talk) 22:15, 17 August 2011 (UTC)
 * I hope you're right, we do have a decent squad but people are worried that we can only play one way and other teams have sussed us out. Tiny Cox is our best player. Yeah, you're right, Heaney owning the ground doesn't make much sense, unless he thinks he can undo the covenants. He must have some kind of plan, surely? As for your squad, it sounds like our squad last season. For the first few games they were still introducing themselves to each other and made a lot of mistakes, but once they gelled they put in an amazing unbeaten run. You've got a young team though! Let's see what happens on Saturday. Good work in your sandbox, looks good. I'm not great at maps either, I did a few last season by trial and error, but I found it took me ages. Might be worth copying last season's maps and removing / adding the relevant relegated / promoted teams. User:Delusion23 has a great handle on the Northern end of the non-league pyramid - he might have some good pointers about maps :) Bretonbanquet (talk) 22:03, 18 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I had the same problem with that map last year. In the end I used one which only showed part of the country, but it still looked rubbish. Way too many clubs in the Slough/Burnham/Beaconsfield/Ashford area, which is a pretty small area really. I think that my trauma over that map was why I never got round to creating one for the South and West Division... haha.. I saw your troubles on Saturday, whilst using an abacus to keep up with the number of goals Orient were shipping. Not having much luck so far this season, are we? Even Truro lost this evening. I'm with you on the off-the-field stuff, I guess we shouldn't worry about these things until they actually happen. Easier said than done though. Bretonbanquet (talk) 01:18, 24 August 2011 (UTC)

Bizarre - Again?
Hi there ARGYLE, VASCO here,

how come did my last WP:FOOTY discussion did not get almost any inputs? A bad choice of headline perhaps? Could you please drop a line?

Attentively, regards - --Vasco Amaral (talk) 12:18, 16 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Not really sure what I can add at present. You did the right thing by opening a dialogue with the user. Sorry, I'm not having a good day. Argyle 4 Life  talk  13:33, 16 August 2011 (UTC)


 * Anything i can do to ease your wiki-load, don't hesitate to ask ;) --Vasco Amaral (talk) 15:02, 16 August 2011 (UTC)

Archive
Hello, once again. How do you archive your comments in here? I just don't understand how you can save all this info in that box.--NovaSkola (talk) 06:07, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Never mind, I found it myself.--NovaSkola (talk) 06:17, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, a simple copy and paste job. Argyle 4 Life  talk  09:37, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

FLRC
I would ask you to assume good faith but I seriously doubt I will get that. Regardless of what you think the objective is, it doesn't change the fact that every one of those lists (and note! That is only a very small portion) doesn't meet the basics of the basics of current standards. Strawberry on Vanilla (talk) 19:03, 21 August 2011 (UTC)
 * There is no good faith in tagging dozens of articles (that have been through an exhaustive reviewing process to become featured) after people reviewed your own work and pointed out things that need rectifying. Argyle 4 Life  talk  19:25, 21 August 2011 (UTC)

Thanks for the kind words...
I've been called many things but rarely (if ever) "tremendous"... thanks! :) —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 14:47, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Let me put it this way: after you lose a few games you suddenly no longer consider non-League the glorified joke you did (be honest) before... yet you feel depressed every time you hear the fixtures read out ("And Luton travel to Braintree in today's programme"?! Stone the bloody crows) and you never, ever, ever get used to the media calling you "non-League Luton". Gah! —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 15:12, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * I sympathise, I remember the exact feelings you're having now, in fact I remember using the same words precisely as you just did there... Our situation is slightly different (–30 anybody) which really rubbed the salt in the wound, though... and it still hasn't really healed. The fact is that the gap between League Two and the Conference is now practically non-existent but it's still a huge psychological barrier and, well, I hope you don't have to go through it too. I was actually surprised and frankly offended by how a lot of other teams' fans reacted to the –30 debacle; towards the end of that season we played Wycombe at home and with ten minutes to go their fans unravelled a big white sheet on which they had written "GOODBYE LUTON!"... I mean, it was just the ultimate case of being kicked when we were down again and again and again. On the positive side for you the bottom few teams of League Two really are apocalyptically dreadful and only two go down, so if you don't get points deducted it would take quite something to send you out of the League. I'll be cheering for you guys anyway, hope you can turn it around; it's only four games in and it's a marathon, not a sprint. —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 15:46, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Incidentally, can I interest you in some exemplary Hebrew? —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 16:02, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, good luck Plymouth hey... thanks for your comment and kind words on the Israeli list too! Hope to work with you again soon; happy to collaborate on something if you like, just give me a shout when you have an idea! Keep well... :) —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 18:07, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * May be hard to get sources for but for a while I have really liked the idea of getting John Sitton an FA star... just a heads up, working on something else right now... but when the time comes, perhaps we could pair up if we like, and we could pick someone else to help us and we could bring our dinner, because when we'd finished we'd need it? —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 20:07, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Let me know if and when you want to work on Sitton's article. As *cough* the leading Wikipedian light on all matters Leyton Orient *cough* I could be of assistance. I had to put that quote in his article, O's fans quote that on a regular basis ;) Bretonbanquet (talk) 21:41, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * (P.S. You may have noticed a theme on the subjects I choose for featured articles... hahaha...) —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 20:08, 25 August 2011 (UTC)
 * Look on my Sandbox and you'll see I've already started us off at the bottom of the page. —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 21:27, 25 August 2011 (UTC)

A more serious suggestion
How about Matthew Le Tissier? I just got his autobiography at Luton airport and read it on the way out to Israel, I reckon it could potentially be an FA and an entertaining one too... if you're up for that? What do you reckon? —<i style="text-shadow:#bbbbbb 0.1em 0.1em 0.2em;"><b style="color:#ff3300">Cliftonian</b><b style="color:#ff3300">the orangey bit</b></i> 18:23, 26 August 2011 (UTC)