User talk:Waynejayes/Archive 4

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Naturism
I get that naturism is not explicitly about sexuality. however, the Portal:Nudity is now a redirect to Portal:Sexuality, as the two topics are somewhat related. if you or any other editors feel that naturist/nudist articles should not be linked to sexuality, go for it, but at least for now, while there is a nudity wikiproject, there is no portal. see this discussion: Wikipedia:Miscellany for deletion/Portal:Nudity. I will leave it to you to choose to add back the sexuality portal link, or add another portal llink (a society portal?), or simply not have a portal for this topic.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 16:21, 27 September 2014 (UTC)

September 2014
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 * After returning to England from Natal, Baynes was Vicar of St Mary's Church, Nottingham also an assistant bishop in the Diocese of Southwell and an honorary canon of [[Southwell

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Donald Nestor
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 * Hello, thanks for re-working some of the copyright problems with this article. Please note that there are still large chunks of text that will need work as well. You can see the matches HERE. If you would take a pass at those, I'll send you a pie! Crow  Caw  22:58, 8 October 2014 (UTC)

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October 2014
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 * especially the way in which he delivered them, often provoked considerable hostility in parliament. {sfn|Wilmot|1897|p= Vol 2:p 125} This all too frequently left him isolated and unable to do more

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Harold Johnson Nature Reserve
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Copyright checks when performing AfC reviews
Hello. This message is part of a mass mailing to people who appear active in reviewing articles for creation submissions. First of all, thank you for taking part in this important work! I'm sorry this message is a form letter – it really was the only way I could think of to covey the issue economically. Of course, this also means that I have not looked to see whether the matter is applicable to you in particular. The issue is in rather large numbers of copyright violations ("copyvios") making their way through AfC reviews without being detected (even when easy to check, and even when hallmarks of copyvios in the text that should have invited a check, were glaring). A second issue is the correct method of dealing with them when discovered. If you don't do so already, I'd like to ask for your to help with this problem by taking on the practice of performing a copyvio check as the first step in any AfC review. The most basic method is to simply copy a unique but small portion of text from the draft body and run it through a search engine in quotation marks. Trying this from two different paragraphs is recommended. (If you have any question about whether the text was copied from the draft, rather than the other way around (a "backwards copyvio"), the Wayback Machine is very useful for sussing that out.) If you do find a copyright violation, please do not decline the draft on that basis. Copyright violations need to be dealt with immediately as they may harm those whose content is being used and expose Wikipedia to potential legal liability. If the draft is substantially a copyvio, and there's no non-infringing version to revert to, please mark the page for speedy deletion right away using. If there is an assertion of permission, please replace the draft article's content with. Some of the more obvious indicia of a copyvio are use of the first person ("we/our/us..."), phrases like "this site", or apparent artifacts of content written for somewhere else ("top", "go to top", "next page", "click here", use of smartquotes, etc.); inappropriate tone of voice, such as an overly informal tone or a very slanted marketing voice with weasel words; including intellectual property symbols (™,®); and blocks of text being added all at once in a finished form with no misspellings or other errors. I hope this message finds you well and thanks again you for your efforts in this area. Best regards--Fuhghettaboutit (talk) 02:20, 18 November 2014 (UTC). Sent via--MediaWiki message delivery (talk) 02:20, 18 November 2014 (UTC)

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Articles for deletion/Jeugland Hoërskool
- and any other schools you  may  have listed for deletion. I'm sorry  to  disappoint  you  Wayne, but  we have a firm, age-old practice for handling  what  may  appear to  be non  notable schools. Please familiarise yourself with WP:OUTCOMES and the policies and guidelines that  it expands upon. Thanks. --Kudpung ??????? (talk) 10:03, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

New articles for schools
Hi, I noticed that you have created some articles for high schools (and possibly with bot) and thank you for your contribution. I kindly ask you to add a period at the end of the sentence please. Thank you. :)--Zhantongz (talk) 11:26, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Sorry, will thanks Wayne Jayes (talk) 11:28, 22 November 2014 (UTC)

Schools in Western Cape
I've noticed you've created a number of articles on schools in Western Cape with nothing more than the name of school & the fact that it's in Western Cape. Wouldn't it be better to start an article like Schools in Western Cape and include all of them instead of individual articles that don't cite special significance or detailed information on each one? --Abderrahman (talk) 11:32, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 * I am told that all secondary and high schools are notable and that there is a long-standing and inviolate concensus on this, and no one may propose a school for deletion. See WP:OUTCOMES.Wayne Jayes (talk) 12:05, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 * WP:OUTCOMES state that an independent source must be added for them to be kept. The reference you list is the government site for Western Cape (dead link), and it's a link to search for the school's name not a direct link.
 * I also see that the administrator Kudpung has the same reservations about your recent school articles.
 * EDIT: I misread the comment by Kudpung. And now have read some AfD discussions, it seems that what you're doing is within guidelines. I still maintain that it's a better idea for the reader and Wikipedia to have them all in one article instead of many single articles containing one sentence. --Abderrahman (talk) 13:53, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 * I absolutely agree with you, I am hoping that by following the guidelines the stupidty of this concensus rule will be revealedWayne Jayes (talk) 13:55, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Well, consensus can change. Have you tried to raise the issue through a RfC or even WP:PUMP? --Abderrahman (talk) 14:17, 22 November 2014 (UTC)


 * I have long been a supporter of the principle that all secondary schools should be considered as notable if they can be proven to exist. Presence on a government list without anything further is not proof that it actually has a real existence now or in the past, because the government could add schools it had approved founding, but did not yet operate-- we would not include those articles. Further there is a rule that a mere link to a database rather than a result is not adequate sourcing; And a link to an empty website doesn;t show anything at all, certainly not real existence--it is much easier to make a website than to found a school. What you are doing is by your own admission not good faith editing. The way to test a guideline or custom van be to challenge borderline articles, or to discuss the matter directly. That how consensus changes. It is  not to deliberately make articles that are so low in quality that nobody would really want to keep them.    One could   take a bunch of clearly notable people in a field I thought was over-covered, and deliberately make one sentence articles for them, with just enough sourcing to show they exist, in the hope that they would be deleted or that the discussions would show the futility of the rule. This would not be helping, but harming, the encyclopedia. We have in the past topic-banned people from creating new articles for mechanically creating stubs when they could easily do something more. If you continue in this vein, I shall consider doing it again. As a minimum, add the exact location and numbers of pupils and teachers and the date of founding.    DGG ( talk ) 22:29, 22 November 2014 (UTC)
 * User:DGG I understand you to be saying that User:waynejayes may not create any further one-line school articles, but other people can? (BTW I have provided each of the school's articles I created with a valid ref to show that it at least exists, either its official website or an online reference to a newspaper article). There is almost certainly no way of providing "the exact location and numbers of pupils and teachers and the date of founding" for many if not most of the Government schools in South Africa, the government doesn't even know this (or seems not to, they are unable to deliver text books to these schools).  You say the way to change consensus is to "challenge borderline articles"; I tried to challenge Jeugland Hoërskool, a one line article with a link to its official website as proof it exists.  The article is of the same quality as the ones I created, it is a pointless article, it tells me nothing, it doesn't summarize or condense (except to absurdity) the contents of the schools website.  I was told that the Gospel according to Consensus handed down from on high says that it doesn't matter how irrational it is to keep a pointless high school article it MUST be kept. I did wish to challenge the blind and irrational rule that high schools are always kept and primary schools are (almost) always deleted, but I've l;ost enthusiasm for that now. At this point I will no longer contribute to useless and pointless school articles, I will concentrate on improving the already good school articles, such as St. Andrew's College, Grahamstown

Wayne Jayes (talk) 07:26, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * OK, several things. First,  I  understand your reasoning that we might do better to make lists or combination articles, to be expanded later. I am not willing reluctant to abandon the principle that all high schools can have an article, as experience in the past has shown that if we depart from that  we will lose even the ones where there is something to say. But that does not mean all high schools should necessarily have an article, if it makes more sense to combine the material,  to be later expanded into articles. Wikipedia is very inconsistent in deciding anything that isn't a yes/no question, and the way merged material is handled tends to be erratic. But even so, this is still a direction worth pursuing & I will pursue it. I think it might be good to start by  making some of your articles into just such combination articles; perhaps you would be willing to do it, but if necessary, I can do so also.  My experience in most geographic areas is  that at least 3/4 of the time it is possible to say at least something besides the name of the school ,though not necessarily everything  I mentioned (often the date of founding) . But for at least one of your schools, I found  the website was totally blank, which has happened before.     One of the purposes of having school articles is for young Wikipedians to work on in projects of by themselves. We've found that it least for class projects it really helps to have a framework for an article, rather than having them start from scratch.
 * Second, I gave you the wrong impression. I am giving you advice,abut I see it came out worded as a threat of action. I myself personally will not take administrative action about this, because I'm involved in the discussion. If I thought you needed to be blocked, I would have to raise the question and see if someone else wanted to do it. I intended to warn you that in practice, the community has taken that sort of action for this sort of thing if done in excess, even for article which are unquestionably valid if done right, such as towns. The argument is that in working only from a list, errors are inevitable, and in fact many of the people who have done bulk editions have done it poorly and made errors, such as using obsolete nomenclature for biological species. It can be done, but it is necessary to be cautious. There is no formal method of getting an OK, but most large projects use a bot, which needs permission from the Bot approvals group.  The community has taken a particularly dim view of article editing, especially large article creations, done in order to prove a WP:POINT; they have often been considered disruptive.
 * third,When I say "the community" I mean the usual trend of things. I consider it my obligation in giving advice to advise people about what will probably happen, not There is no consensus handed down from "on high"; it develops from discussions. It usually doesn't change suddenly. Every good faith challenge is taken into account and things evolve. I work here with a very long time span--things I've started working for 6 years ago are just coming into effect now.  DGG ( talk ) 16:58, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * Thank you for you full and considered response, we all seem to get angry and passionate about things because we care, not because we don't care. Robust debate is good but I am happy to leave it for now. Wayne Jayes (talk) 08:28, 25 November 2014 (UTC)

Schools Template
Hi. You may want to add your Cape High School articles to Template:CapeTownSchools Gbawden (talk) 06:52, 24 November 2014 (UTC)
 * No thanks Wayne Jayes (talk) 07:29, 24 November 2014 (UTC)

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Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot
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SuggestBot picks articles in a number of ways based on other articles you've edited, including straight text similarity, following wikilinks, and matching your editing patterns against those of other Wikipedians. It tries to recommend only articles that other Wikipedians have marked as needing work. We appreciate that you have signed up to receive suggestions regularly; your contributions make Wikipedia better — thanks for helping!

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Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot
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SuggestBot picks articles in a number of ways based on other articles you've edited, including straight text similarity, following wikilinks, and matching your editing patterns against those of other Wikipedians. It tries to recommend only articles that other Wikipedians have marked as needing work. We appreciate that you have signed up to receive suggestions regularly; your contributions make Wikipedia better — thanks for helping!

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Vanessa Huppenkothen
Hello Waynejayes, last June you entered the notability box into the article. I'm quite sure that in the meantime the article shows the notability. would you be so kind and have a look at it. If you conclude the same, please remove the box. Yours --Baumfreund-FFM (talk) 05:26, 27 January 2015 (UTC)
 * Thanks for your rapid reaction.
 * Sorry that I didn't determined it until now.
 * Yours --Baumfreund-FFM (talk) 20:06, 18 February 2015 (UTC)

Chris Mann (poet)
Hi Waynejayes, apologies for my poor Wiki etiquette in replacing the bio text on this page without enough explanation or discussion. Chris Mann asked me to make the changes as he felt it needed a little expansion, and also corrections to some small inaccuracies, for example, in the first line he is described as an academic - in fact he is not an academic and regards 'poet, playwright, singer-songwriter and socio-cultural activist' to be a more accurate description of what he does. He also claims that, strictly speaking, the Valley Trust is a CBO not an NGO. Lizzygo2 (talk) 15:36, 27 January 2015 (UTC)

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Cut & paste move
Hi, and thank you for your contributions to Wikipedia. It appears that you tried to give St. Andrew's College, Ireland a different title by copying its content and pasting either the same content, or an edited version of it, into St. Andrew's College, Dublin. This is known as a "cut-and-paste move", and it is undesirable because it splits the page history, which is legally required for attribution. Instead, the software used by Wikipedia has a feature that allows pages to be moved to a new title together with their edit history.

In most cases, once your account is four days old and has ten edits, you should be able to move an article yourself using the "Move" tab at the top of the page (the tab may be hidden in a dropdown menu for you). This both preserves the page history intact and automatically creates a redirect from the old title to the new. If you cannot perform a particular page move yourself this way (e.g. because a page already exists at the target title), please follow the instructions at requested moves to have it moved by someone else. Also, if there are any other pages that you moved by copying and pasting, even if it was a long time ago, please list them at Cut-and-paste-move repair holding pen. You made the move in July of last year, so you may not remember it, but it has only now been discovered and corrected. The editor who uses the pseudonym "JamesBWatson" (talk) 02:49, 8 February 2015 (UTC)
 * JamesBWatson thank you for your advice, I don't think I did any other moves like this, except for John Armstrong (bishop of Grahamstown) which I corrected on the same day (I hope in the right way) Wayne Jayes (talk) 09:36, 8 February 2015 (UTC)

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Articles you might like to edit, from SuggestBot
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