User talk:Xn4/Archive 6

DYK

 * Many thanks, Gatoclass. Xn4  17:30, 1 May 2008 (UTC)

Ikwel
Hi X. That Ikwel article you had been working on...Do you think it's mature enough to be translated into Turkish wikipedia? I saw that you had had discussions on its stub status. And I have my doubts about the rating of the title in Turkish, but I had been to the town, and liked it so much. If you intend to work on it in deeper detail, please let me know. (P.S. I see that you are interested in Italian artists also. So am I. Check my blog if you have a minute to spare and you always seek inspiration. The link is on my user page.) Cheerio! Cretanforever (talk) 06:08, 2 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Hello, Cretanforever. There isn't very much more I can do with Ickwell at the moment, and I do think it's worth translating as it is. But if your interest's mostly in Ickwell May Day, then perhaps we could do some more with that before anyone went to the trouble of translating it into Turkish. Let me know. Xn4  18:18, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

Blimey
Missed all the drama. I'll leave well alone. --Dweller (talk) 14:33, 16 May 2008 (UTC)
 * Masterly inactivity is surely better than any foolishness... but you might like to think it over! Xn4  14:38, 16 May 2008 (UTC)

France and the Hanoverian Succession
Thanks for your help but I would like to ask you however do you think the changing relations with France after 1688, (that is going from a Anglo-French alliance under James II into an anti-French Anglo-Dutch alliance under William III as you explained) contributed to George of hanover becoming King in 1714? Do you think I should be talking about the war of league of Augsburg AKA nine years war and the war of spanish succession (as this brought about the demise of France) in my assignment? I'm quite confused as you can tell! In case you are in need of clarification the wording of the question is 'To what extent were changing relations with France mainly responsible for the Hanoverian Succession?' Thank you I can assure you your help is much appreciated! Richie1001 (talk) 21:00, 21 May 2008 (UTC)
 * It's an awkward question, but yes, you need to refer to both wars. The main reason for the changing relations with France was the fall of King James II in what we now call the Glorious Revolution. The spark which kindled the Glorious Revolution was that James II had acquired a new son and heir who, with two Roman Catholic parents, was sure to be brought up in that faith, so the Anglicans and dissenters could no longer look forward to a Protestant succession. Although the 'Glorious Revolution' is so called, the name of Revolution was given to it post facto, the immediate reality of it being a successful Dutch invasion of England, led by William and his wife Mary (James II's eldest daughter and recently displaced heir). Why were the Dutch willing to spend a huge amount in equipping a force to invade England? In theory, to come to the assistance of English Protestants. But what was also in it for them was the prospect of gaining a strong new ally against France. The Jacobites, in rallying around James II in exile in France, who was allied to his cousin Louis XIV, necessarily became counter-revolutionaries. So long as war between Great Britain and France continued, the alignment of the Jacobites made the Hanoverian succession necessary to preserve the strategic status quo, and of course the careers of all the leading public men of the three British kingdoms, not to mention the Protestant ascendancy itself. High stakes, indeed. Xn4  21:25, 21 May 2008 (UTC)

Boccaccio's Concerning Famous Women
On your reference that I believe you have on hand of G. A. Guarino's Boccaccio's, Concerning Famous Women (New Brunswick, N.J., 1963) what page is it on where it gives reference of Boccaccio using Valerius Maximus, Factorum at dictorum memorabilium libri VI.1, ext. 1? On Virginia Brown's book it is page 247. I want to expand Hippo, a Greek woman and am now gathering additional information and references. I'll check back here for a possible answer later. Also what pages are Hippo on? Thanks. --Doug talk 20:13, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
 * In that 1963 edition of Guarino's translation, Hippo is on page 116 and is called Chapter LI.
 * Boccaccio, of course, doesn't state all his sources. Guarino gives an appendix on pages 253 to 257 headed ' SOURCES OF CONCERNING FAMOUS WOMEN ', explaining Boccaccio's sources for many of these chapters are listed in Attilio Hortis, Studi sulle Opere Latine del Boccaccio (Trieste, 1879), and in Laura Torretta, "Il Liber De Claris Mulieribus di Giovanni Boccaccio", Giornale Storico della Letteratura Italiana, XXXIX (1902). A number of inaccuracies in these works have been eliminated.
 * In this appendix, "Val. Max." is defined as "Valerius Maximus, De Factis Dictisque Memorabilibus" and it's stated as a source (in most cases the only identified source) for chapters XXIX, LI (Val. Max. vi. I. ext. I), LII, LV, LX, LXIII, LXV, LXVI, LXVII, LXX-LXXIV, LXXVI, LXXIX-LXXXIII, and LXXXVII. The note on Valerius as the source for LI [Hippo] is on page 255. Xn4  23:09, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Most useful information, appreciate it. This fits right in with what I am now working on. When I do the update (about a week) I'll let you know. Thanks again. --Doug talk 23:29, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
 * No trouble at all. Xn4  23:33, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

P.S. Is Factorum at dictorum memorabilium the same as De Factis Dictisque Memorabilibus? Being then the English translation by John Henry Walker Memorable Deeds and Sayings, ISBN 0872206742? --Doug talk 23:50, 29 May 2008 (UTC)


 * Factorum ac dictorum memorabilium is the usual title ('ac', not 'at'), while De Factis Dictisque Memorabilibus is an alternative referring to the same work. Xn4  00:11, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

I have just now dropped in a five fold expansion to Hippo, a Greek woman. If you have time, feel free to tweak. The way I count characters in a word count is by Word. Before the expansion the character count as I see it was 1265. After my expansion it is now 8620 = 6.8 times expansion. Am I doing this correctly? I am submitting to DYK since it is at least a 5 fold expansion. I am trying to catch up to you on DYKs.

Another editor just took out most of what I put in. I believe it to be relevent since it shows where Boccaccio got the information on chastity and the moral aspects of it - which pertains directly to Hippo and her story. What do you think? Thanks for your help.--Doug talk 18:46, 30 May 2008 (UTC)


 * To be frank, Doug, I'm inclined to agree with EALacey that most of that doesn't really belong in an article on Hippo. But - if I may make so bold - why don't you start an article on Factorum ac dictorum memorabilium? There, these outlines from it would be at home. Xn4  23:33, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the advice. Great idea! I believe I'll do just that. That would make everyone happy. Thanks again. --Doug talk 23:45, 30 May 2008 (UTC)

Thanks for the 25 DYK Medal! As I'm sure you have seen, EALacey has made some excellent improvements to Hippo. If you feel a citation to p. 253 of Guarino where he refers to Attilio Hortis and Laura Torretta is still appropriate, please add it. I believe you have a better feel for this than I do. Thanks for all your help. --Doug talk 11:55, 31 May 2008 (UTC)

Factorum ac dictorum memorabilium
I just put up a new article on Factorum ac dictorum memorabilium. If you have time, please take a look at it and do any tweaking you feel is necessary. Let me know if you have any suggestions. Thanks. --Doug talk 20:45, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

The article was selected today as a DYK. It turned out to be a rather large article. Found a lot of info on it. Thanks for all your help on the variuos articles you have helped me on. --Doug talk 17:02, 6 June 2008 (UTC)



Doug Coldwell has smiled at you! Smiles promote WikiLove and hopefully this one has made your day better. Spread the WikiLove by smiling at someone else, whether it be someone you have had disagreements with in the past or a good friend. Happy editing! Smile at others by adding {{subst:Smile}} to their talk page with a friendly message.


 * My word! You were onto that like a dog onto a rabbit. Xn4  22:38, 6 June 2008 (UTC)

Oh, its a fifteen hundred character minimum for DYK! I just wrote another article on ancient Rome on the Conscript Fathers. Its a little shorter. --Doug talk 20:41, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Derby School
Absent for some time. I can no longer edit the Old Derbeians page, I'm afraid. Perhaps a post to the admin of the site?

I have in mind to create a street map of the St. Helen's House area as it was in the 1960s (before Derby School left the building and before the creation of the inner ring road and subsequent destruction of major landmarks. What do you think?

OldDerbeian (talk) 11:19, 3 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Hi, Terry. Do you mean there's a technical problem and the page won't accept edits from you? If so, I suggest the best admin to advise you is Victuallers, who's taken a keen interest in the Derby School article(s). In the mean time, as you can still post messages here, please feel free to leave me a note about any edits you'd like me to make.
 * The street map you have in mind would be good to have. For geographical accuracy, the largest scale of the old Ordnance Survey (I think there's an edition for Derby in three or four sheets of about 1946) would give you a good foundation.
 * Greetings, Xn4  23:02, 3 June 2008 (UTC)

I've obtained a copy of the 1847 25" OS map of that area of Derby. I just haven't got around to messing around with it to produce the area map I had in mind. I'll stick the image of the Cigarette card through inkscape to see if I can get something acceptable. One problem I have with that is the latin text, which isn't what I remember from the 1960s (perhaps there's an article about changes in the Coat of Arms in itself). I do have an image of the blazer badge (which was black and white in the 60s and 70s). Somewhere I've got a 6th form tie (or is uniform too trivial?) and I should have some copies of the school magazine - the Derbeian. Oh, and I've been in touch with the Old Derbeians society - the initial response is positive, so look forward to a link from that Web site to the Wikipedia article. Finally, today, I found this which reference the wikipedia article and provides another image for possible inclusion.

As for the Arms, what I'd really like to do it to get hold of a copy of the Arms registered at the College of Arms. I eMailed them in the past, but got nothing back.

OldDerbeian (talk) 19:47, 4 June 2008 (UTC)


 * Thanks for all that. On the motto, it seems it had some variations, but I guess a permanent form was fixed in the 1952 grant of arms. On the College of Arms, I'll be surprised if you get any joy from them. The heralds have limited resources and are running a business (that is, people pay them fees for the work they do). If they went out of their way to help people with heraldic questions free and for nothing, I imagine they would soon be inundated! However, the grant of arms itself should survive somewhere - perhaps in the Derbyshire Record Office? Failing that, I believe there's an illustrated article on it in the Derbeian of the time. As you know, Alan Bird (1960-67) is working on a school history, you may like to check with him (via the ODS), as he probably has a copy of it. Xn4  20:22, 4 June 2008 (UTC)

Timothy Woods
While I feel that being a Rhodes Scholar is enough to prove notability, there are other Wikipedia editors who would disagree and who may recommend that the Timothy Woods article be deleted. It would be helpful if you could supply further evidence of his notability, such as newspaper or magazine articles about him. --Eastmain (talk) 23:38, 3 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the note, Eastmain, I've made a start on that. Xn4  10:40, 5 June 2008 (UTC)

List of Old Alleynians
Hi, sorry for not getting back to you beforehand, have been rather busy, but am now doing more genealogy! I see your point about the Contadi, after having read the "Notability" guidelines, though would you suggest it be worth making a page about the peerage? Thanks Savoia (talk) 10:16, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Thomas Halsey (cricketer)
Thomas Halsey (cricketer) = Sir Thomas Edgar Halsey, 3rd Baronet... agree? Talk:Thomas Halsey (cricketer). Cheers. Bazj (talk) 21:41, 7 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Indeed, one doesn't suppose there were very many Thomas Edgar Halseys born on 28 November 1898! I've redirected one to the other, after reading Talk:Thomas Halsey (cricketer)‎. Xn4  12:41, 8 June 2008 (UTC)

Another cricketer?
Hi Xn4, I have been working on Joseph Wright pictures for a few weeks and I came across Harry Peckham who is not only still in print but was involved in one of the early agreements about the rule of cricket. However I can't find the basic bio stuff of born, died, married, chuildren etc. I think you have access to additional sources ... could you assist? If no time then fine and thx anyway. Victuallers (talk) 08:27, 9 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Unluckily, he isn't in the DNB, and of course he's far too early for Who's Who. I'll see what I can do. Xn4  10:15, 9 June 2008 (UTC)

Conscript Fathers
I recently wrote a new article on Conscript Fathers. They are considering it as a possible DYK - however the original hook I gave them is a little too boring for the Main Page. I have submitted a couple of alternate hooks. If you happen to think of a hook, please feel free to submit. If not, thanks anyway. Sorry for the short notice. It is under Articles created/expanded on June 7.--Doug talk 22:44, 12 June 2008 (UTC)

They did select just now Conscript Fathers for DYK based on an alternate hook I submitted: "DYK...that the Conscript Fathers were senators drafted for the ancient Roman Senate much like conscription is a military draft?" --Doug talk 11:17, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

Template:Schools in Derbyshire
Greetings Xn4.

Your recent edit to Template:Schools in Derbyshire is somewhat surprising as we discussed this some time ago and agreed to leave them in. A Google search is certain to throw up numerous historic newspaper references for all these schools and likely books too. This more than satisfies Wikipedia's notability requirements. Have reverted your deletions. -Arb. (talk) 12:09, 16 June 2008 (UTC)
 * I'd forgotten that discussion last year. No need to repeat my remarks there, but I didn't agree to leave the redlinks in and I see very few of the schools navigation templates still include any now. Perhaps a more agreed approach would be for someone to create stubs for each of the redlinked former schools? Xn4  17:53, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

wb
I was about to wonder where the grasshopper went, but happily found him again. ---Sluzzelin talk  15:26, 17 June 2008 (UTC)


 * What a whopper! Isn't he more of a locust? Xn4  16:15, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Bah, same difference in German ---Sluzzelin talk  22:14, 17 June 2008 (UTC)
 * Of course, they are us. The Muses brought song into the world, some men and women were so thrilled with it that they forgot to eat and drink, and after they starved to death their souls became... Xn4  11:31, 18 June 2008 (UTC)

Hi from a Hammick
We're a rare breed. :) I was named for my uncle, who in turn was named for his uncle, the Oxford chemist D. L. Hammick. I recently heard from a chap at Oxford who is putting together a history of chemistry at that school during the 20th Century. I told him what little I could about the family. Anyway, thank for writing him up at Wiki.

-- Lawrence Dalziel Hammick

P.S. Everybody calls me Larry, except troublemakers such as banks and governments.


 * Hi, Larry, good to hear from you. Dalziel Hammick‎ is still only a 'start', I hope we can do some more with it! Regards, Xn4  12:55, 21 June 2008 (UTC)

DYK 6/24
and again ...


 * Many thanks for letting me know, Daniel! Xn4  13:46, 24 June 2008 (UTC)

DYK

 * Hi, Gatoclass, many thanks. I merely suggested a new hook, so I've copied this to User talk:Marine 69-71. Xn4  11:18, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Stephen Eyre
A proposed deletion template has been added to the article Stephen Eyre, suggesting that it be deleted according to the proposed deletion process. All contributions are appreciated, but this article may not satisfy Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion, and the deletion notice should explain why (see also "What Wikipedia is not" and Wikipedia's deletion policy). You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why you disagree with the proposed deletion in your edit summary or on its talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised because even though removing the deletion notice will prevent deletion through the proposed deletion process, the article may still be deleted if it matches any of the speedy deletion criteria or it can be sent to Articles for Deletion, where it may be deleted if consensus to delete is reached. Do you want to opt out of receiving this notice? Terraxos (talk) 23:57, 27 June 2008 (UTC)


 * This is of no interest to me, and Stephen Eyre does indeed seem to fail WP:N. Xn4  00:03, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

hi again
I'll see what I can do today. As a living individual we will need some solid refs for the hook as the best bits are litigous. The other idea is to do a pre-raphaelite gag... yep its coming! Victuallers (talk) 09:41, 28 June 2008 (UTC)

Antoine Le Maistre DYK

 * Many thanks for updating me, Circeus! Xn4  13:23, 30 June 2008 (UTC)

Columbus Fourth voyage
I've looked into this further especially since, as you pointed out Morison was a respected scholar, and have found further information on this - in spite of the fact others also found references on Zacuto. I now believe the article is correct as written and it was Regiomontanus' Ephemerides, not Zacuto's. In Samuel Eliot Morison's book Admiral of the Ocean Sea - A Life of Christopher Columbus on page 653-654 it says,

''At this juncture Columbus bethought himself of a strategem. Among the few books aboard ship was a Regiomontanus "Ephemerides," printed at Nuremberg before the end of the century, but containing predictions of eclipses for thirty years ahead. In three day's time, on the night of February 29, 1504, Regiomontanus predicted a total eclipse of the moon.'' It then goes into detail explaining that Columbus predicted to the Indian chiefs the moon eclipse. They were skeptical, however when it happened the indians were scared and brought Columbus all the provisions he needed - praying the Admiral to intercede by all means with God on their behalf, that he might not visit his wrath upon them, promising for the future diligently to furnish all that stood in need for.

Christopher Columbus, Mariner is a "condensed" version of Morison's 1942 book Admiral of the Ocean Sea: A Life of Christopher Columbus. Thanks for your excellent advice on this. --Doug talk 20:49, 30 June 2008 (UTC)


 * From what you say, Doug, it seems Morison doesn't give any notes on where he gets the details of this story of Columbus from? Without a reliable primary source, the naming of Regiomontanus and/or Zacuto may just be someone's speculation long after the event. The main sources for Columbus are his own journals (but there's no trace of one for the fourth voyage), letters, reports, provisioning decrees, etc. Columbus's son Ferdinand was with him on the fourth voyage and left an eyewitness account of it, and a complete roster and payroll also survive. Xn4  15:29, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Good point! The "Mariner" book has no notes, but the two volume "Admiral of the Ocean Sea" contains notes at the end of each chapter. On pages 400-401 of "Admiral of the Ocean Sea" it states:

''At this juncture Columbus bethought himself of a strategem. Among the few books aboard ship was a Regiomontanus "Ephemerides," printed at Nuremberg before the end of the century, but containing predictions of eclipses for thirty years ahead.''

The note for this statement can be found on page 406:

It is not known which of several editions of this almanac printed before 1501 Columbus possessed. The relevant page (f. 16 verso) from a copy of the c. 1474 edition is reproduced in Thacher [John Boyd] "Columbus" II 630 and the Caddeo ed. of Ferdinand (II 276). That edition was reproduced in facsimile by Harrassowitz at Leipzig 1937, with an introduction by Ernst Zinner (cf. review by A. Pogo in "Isis" XXX 611).

The first volume of the Morison "Admiral of the Ocean Sea" however does discuss Abraham Zacuto. --Doug talk 15:44, 1 July 2008 (UTC)


 * From that, all you can really conclude is that Morison didn't get to the bottom of it! Xn4  15:47, 1 July 2008 (UTC)

Excellent point. I didn't put the information in originally about Columbus' fourth voyage, however just stumpled across the information on Zacuto. Others have found additional information that seems to support Zacuto tables, however I am now leaning towards Regiomontanus' tables, even though originally from the references I found I was leaning towards Zacuto's tables. Perhaps the article should be edited as ...Columbus, in a desperate effort to induce the natives to continue provisioning him and his hungry men, successfully intimidated the natives by correctly predicting a lunar eclipse for February 29, 1504. - with a period after 1504. I'm not sure if footnote # 27 would still be appropriate then. Whichever way you think it should be edited, I am sure I will agree with, since there seems to be arguments for both ways (Zacuto's tables -vs- Regiomontanus' tables). What do you feel we should do now? --Doug talk 17:48, 1 July 2008 (UTC)