User talk:Zazaban/archive4

AfD nomination of Snootworld
An editor has nominated one or more articles which you have created or worked on, for deletion. The nominated article is Snootworld. We appreciate your contributions, but the nominator doesn't believe that the article satisfies Wikipedia's criteria for inclusion and has explained why in his/her nomination (see also Notability and "What Wikipedia is not").

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rock music
Now I feel bad for being pushy---thanks

We'll see how long it lasts

I appreciate it though. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fdog9 (talk • contribs) 19:55, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

Great job on the Soul Section —Preceding unsigned comment added by Fdog9 (talk • contribs) 20:00, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

For future reference
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Rock_music&oldid=313585334 Zazaban (talk) 15:45, 13 September 2009 (UTC)

Can you?
In the page History of anarchism you appear to have made a Revision as of 02:56, 5 September 2009. You added text and some references. One reference tag, appears to be causing a cite error. Could you please go back and fill out the full source to fix the cite error. Thanks. 75.69.0.58 (talk) 00:24, 14 September 2009 (UTC)

it seems they blocked nihilo forever from wikipedia in spanish. http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usuario:Nihilo anyway, i wasnt involved in it at all. as i told you before i decided to stay away from the nihilo wikipedia wars since i dodnt have the time for that silly shit. at somepoint i started to suspect he might be receiving a salary from a neoliberal thinktank since he was omnipresent and you couldnt edit anything without him reverting everything and having a lot of people blocked and thrown out of wikipedia. i figure this cyberactivism is one of the few ways neoliberals of the "anarco" capitalist variety can spread trheir ideas since in every anarchist meeting they will get thrown out inmediately. but as bob black says in an essay called Theses on Anarchism After Post-Modernism by Bob Black

" Let "Type 2" (anarchism) refer to anarcho-capitalism. (For present purposes let’s disregard the Type 2, free-market anarchists who seem to have no noticeable presence except in the United States, and even there they have little dialog with, and less influence over the rest of us.)"

anyway these people will keep their patthetic attempt to get inside a party that no one inside wants them in. personally i will come back soon here to write the english version of an article on colombian individualist anarchist Biófilo Panclasta as i just finished writing the spanish version on renzo novatore. see ya!--Eduen (talk) 11:01, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

I just created Biofilo Panclasta a character very similar to Renzo Novatore. I bet Wolfi Landstreicher doesnt know about him.--Eduen (talk) 03:03, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Free Love
Hey there Zazaban, if you are not watching Free Love you may wish to check out Free Love and Free Love as they intersect with edits of interest to you. Cheers! -- ToET 06:12, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Listed IAF article for deletion
Hello. I've listed the IAF article for deletion here I've noticed that you played a part in discussion at this page and would like your input. Peace and happy editing. 0nonanon0 (talk) 00:08, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

individualist anarchism
about post left anarchy in this article i think it could be included in a section that might be called "current influence". it might claryfy that although these thinkers dont explicitly call themselves "individualist anarchist" neverthelless they owe too much to the great max stirner and are explitcit about it. and it might note things like how wolfi ladstreister cites and claism as inspiration renzo novatore and how he also translated his and another italian individualist Bruno Fillipi (i might create an article on him soon, theres one in italian wikipedia and soon i might also make one in spanish wikipedia). Also the placxe max sitner in post left anarchy has is enpurmous, bob black is stirnerist and i can also see egoism in zerzan and hakim bey. but mainly it is present explicitly in bob black who calls himself "stirnerist". anyway the critique of ideology that post left anarchy has is just as it is situationist it is stirnerist and i really dont think its hard to find good citations and references on that. also max stirner is present in post anarchism in the work of the british Saul Newman who has many papers on stirner an his similirities. with french postestructuralism. in the end the main personality in individualist anarchism is stirnerand so much so that one supposed very important person within it such as benjamin tucker became stirnerist and all the main europeans are stirnerist (well han ryner criticizes sitirner as is mainly close to epicureism and stoicism). i also read once an interview on newman and he says " I would still want to insist on a kind of ideological distinction between individualist and social anarchism. The reason for this is that while, for social anarchists, the notion of individual freedom is just as important as the egalitarian and collective dimension, for individualist anarchists, the concept of a broader social or collective identity is completely absent. And this is why individualist anarchism has been adopted by libertarians and anarcho-capitalists (‘the individual is everything, society is nothing’). This is not to say, of course, that we cannot benefit from the insights of certain individualist anarchist and libertarian traditions - as you know, I see Stirner’s thinking as being of enormous benefit to Left anarchism. Moreover, while I would certainly put Stirner in the individualist anarchist category, he clearly has nothing in common with contemporary anarcho-capitalist perspectives. He saw money as a fetish that enslaved the individual, and property relations as impoverishing and marginalizing whole sectors of society. There was nothing liberating, for Stirner, about private property." http://community.livejournal.com/siyahi/2019.html

i think here newman might have had access only to anglophone individualist anarchism and not to people like emile armand or han ryner. hes clearly focused on a kind of "anarchist republicanism" of sorts and so he distances himself from what he calls "nihilist individualism" and so prefers to deal with social democrats ernest laclau and chantal mouffe. now as individualist anarchism influence in insurrectionarism it will have to be researched and personally i have trouble understanding italian. anyway alfredo bonnano might cite sitrner or something. wolfi lansdtreister i already spoke on him before.--Eduen (talk) 01:54, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

also i can add Jason McQuinn, advocate of post-left anarchy used to use the pseudomym Lev Chernyi, in honor of the russian individualist anarchist. i also recommend you check out the article i made of spanish individualist anarchist magazine Iniciales and of spanish individualist anarchist Miguel Giménez Igualada.--Eduen (talk) 00:06, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Observable universe
Hi Zazaban. I reverted your edit to the page - if you have a source supporting the statement let me know and we can discuss it. Cheers, Olaf Davis (talk) 10:55, 21 October 2009 (UTC)

individualist anarchism
i guess the expansion of that article might go on the way of adding as i suggested you on a section called that might be called "influence" postleft anarchy, insurrectionary anarchism and anarcho-primitivism. i have two sources in spanish that show some of it as a precedent of green anarchism. Henry david thoreau on anarcho-primitivism and in the other anarcho-naturism. some spanish anarcho-primitivists adhere to naturism due to the legacy of it in individualist anarchism and also in france. for more on these check naturism in french anarchopedia. these might correct the view that the article gives that apparently the only legacy of individualist anarchism in contemporary currents is on american "anarcho" capitalism. you might want to check an addition i made on the article Renzo Novatore recently where i discuss the influence of novatore and the attention he has received by wolfi ladstreiter and insurrectionary anarchism. i also plan to expand post left anarchy and insurrectionary anarchism. for example it might be interesting in insurrectionalism to discuss the trials and persecution of insurrectionarists like alfredo bonnano and others and recent things such as its influence in Greece and chile. In chile there has been a cople of bombs put in police and military buildings claimed by groups who on their manifestos state that they have studied things like bonnano, lanstreitcher and others. and on the subject "anarchonaturism" i will have to review how did Nihilo erased it and see how i can create it again. or was it Visionthing. i dont remember. i mean they have kept a very questionable article like "heathian anarchism" with no good sources and anarcho-naturism which was well sourced and specific studies on it in articles and treatments in books--Eduen (talk) 17:39, 28 October 2009 (UTC)

Vision Thing of course wants the indivAnarchism article to stay dear to neoliberalism (which means nice for capitalism and economiscistic). i kept your edition on lysander spooner but to tell you the truth this "natural law" thing is mostly an anglo-USA affair coming out of Locke. it doesnt matter at all in european individualist anarchism. i think in the USA section we should deal a little with free love talking about things like Lucifer the lightbearer, Moses Harman, Voltairine de Cleyre and M. E. Lazarus. a good source is this article and Vision Thing shouldnt have an excuse on refusing to include this since the neoliberal feminist wendy McElroy writes it. also i created Henri Zisly, an important individualist anarcho-naturist that perhaps John Zerzan and his followers should give a check. and finally Bruno Filippi a friend of Renzo Novatore.--Eduen (talk) 05:21, 29 October 2009 (UTC)

i propose we transform Category:Egoists (individualist anarchists) to Category:Egoist anarchists. You can check the recent additions i made to that category and in order to distinguish anarchist egoists from archist egoists such as Dora Marsden or Ayn Rand. as you can see people like bob black and feral faun are egoist anarchists as much as benjamin tucker or emile armand. but of course lysander spooner of proudhon are not egoists while they are individualist anarchists.--Eduen (talk) 00:53, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

as you can see in the article Max Stirner i created a section which discusses stirner´s influence in anarchism and i added that information to your egoist anarchism. there i talk about stirners influence in post left anarchy, the right to be greedy and posanarchism. i think from there we can proceed to add this influence by stirner in the article individualist anarchism. this is very well justified as max stirner is a major original initiator of it an his thought has kept influencing anarchists even if they have reservations of using the "individualist" label. i read somewhere something that suggested that american post-left anarchists prefer not to call themselves individualist since seems in the USA that individualist anarchism is associated with "anarcho"-capitalism. the writers of The right to be greedy For Ourselves call themselves "egoists" and for me thats a good qualification to include them in the individualist anarchism and bob black and wolfi lanstreicher are very stirnerist.--Eduen (talk) 23:18, 31 October 2009 (UTC)

egoist anarchism
i think it will be better to erase the section on benjamin tucker as it does not explain the influence of stirner on him whi is the main point of the article. the abandonment (is that a word in english) of american individualist anarchists of the liberal theory of "natural rights" for egoism is already discussed in the section dedicated to american individualist anarchism. what is written now just looks out of place.--Eduen (talk) 08:31, 2 November 2009 (UTC)

have you checked Anarchism and Friedrich Nietzsche. someone wants to erase it. if you want to keep it you can help.--Eduen (talk) 20:14, 7 November 2009 (UTC)

anarchism and sex/love
i plan to start this article Anarchism and sex/love which will be part of the articles "issues on anarchism". if you wanna help it will be nice.--Eduen (talk) 01:00, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

i created Anarchism and sex/love. Through the investigation for it i came to know more about german individualist anarchism. Through John Henry Mackay Adolf Brand embraced egoism and thus created queer egoism! I will proceed to add these things in the individualist anarchist articles. somehow stirner had to have some nice followers in his "home" country.--Eduen (talk) 12:26, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

well also in this investigation i came up with this article "Interview with an anarchist dominatrix". In it you will find the following from her "During a domination session both parties are consenting adults who choose to perform their particular role – whether it be the role of the master, the all-powerful oppressor, or that of the weak, oppressed slave – and choose their own limits...Domination is a game, the adult’s version of what children call ‘playing’." This was published in the Anarchist Federation (Britain and Ireland) magazine Organize. If you want to include this in the article i guess you could briefly explain this situation as to provide an anarchist view on the subject in the section "Later 20th century and contemporary times". In the interview theres also a reflection on the issue of prostitution. I also plan to include anarchist views on pornography such as these http://www.theanarchistlibrary.org/anarchist-defense-pornography and a hakim bey treatment on it and also jealousy where i will include an essay by emma goldman and one by the great Emile Armand. oh also prostitution.--Eduen (talk) 20:52, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

Template:Infobox composer
I have redirected Template:Infobox composer to Template:Infobox musical artist as it did before today. Your code in Template:Infobox composer was the type of code placed in an article which uses an infobox. The code of the infobox itself should be completely different and is much more complicated. You can click "View source" at Template:Infobox musical artist to get an idea of the difference. See Help:Infobox if you want to attempt to make a real infobox, but also see WikiProject Composers. You can experiment in a user subpage like User:Zazaban/Infobox. It can be confusing to other editors if the template namespace contains non-working infoboxes. Your code in the page history of Template:Infobox composer ignored all parameters from an article and just wrote "Template loop detected: Template:Infobox composer" regardless of what a user tried to do in an article. PrimeHunter (talk) 21:02, 20 November 2009 (UTC)

Individualism
Hello. I plan to improve the article Individualism. As it stands now it mainly provides an bourgoise anglo-liberal vision of individualism and the individual. I became particularly interested on this concept after reading humanist Tzvetan Todorov book Imperfect garden : the legacy of humanism. In it todorov provides a vision of individualism as one of the possibilities of modern socio political thought along conservatism, scientism, and humanism. He recognizes humanist thought as also individualistic and as individualist thinkers François de La Rochefoucauld (writer), and Sade but also the great humanist Michel de Montaigne. La Rochefoucauld is the main writer of what we could perhaps term "aristocratic individualism" and as such it is going to be opposed to bourgoise liberal individualism and protestant ethics pro work values and puritanism. It is more humanistic and more occupied on what Foucault terms "care of the self". Dandies exemplify this well. In this way La Rochefoucauld and Montaigne influenced Nietzsche and so some have talked about Nietzsche´s frnacophilia which goes as far as using french words such as ressentiment. Todorov in a chapter dedicated on individualism on that same book also deals with the great dandy Charles Baudelaire.

I dont know if you are aware of a certain tendency in some anarchists of talkin in good terms of aristocracism. It is present in Emma Goldman, Renzo Novatore and other similar anarchist thinkersv mainly through a rejection of mass society and what Nietzche calls "herd behavior". If you wanna help in this in the individualism article it will be nice. AS i tried to include european individualist anarchists in the individualism template someone responded these people were too obscure and so he refuses to accept Armand, Novatore, Georges Palante, Ryner calling them obscure but defends keeping obscure USA writers such as Lysander Spooner and satanist Anton LaVey. AS far as Lavey some things ive read about him sound nice but he seems to have embraced his country´s neoliberalism (Ayn Rand) while not being aware of nietzschetian individualist aristocracism. Also individualism should be maybe an Issue of anarchism. Seems to me though anglo people are going to overemphazise private property as being the main issue in invidualism within anarchism while in europe and latin america maybe what Bookchin called lifestyle anarchism was a more importan issue. anyway Viva los dandies!--Eduen (talk) 08:36, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

I recently expanded the article on Michel Onfray. He´s a best seller in france because of his atheist manifesto and already with some fans in latin america but seems he hasnt been translated into English. an open and dedicated hedonist philosopher apparently now he has embraced postanarchism. "Le post anarchisme expliqué à ma grand-mère" is a conference he gave in june of this year and french wikipedia in its article on him is noting this event already. Onfray is influenced by deleuze, foucault, bataille and has praised Negri and Hardt as well as is a furious nietzschetian who decided to republish the works of Georges Palante or as he calls him "nietzschetien de gauche". Now if we count him in the postanarchist camp i will have to say some of his works might be a nice insertion of a french sensibility towards anarchism and anarchism history inside post anarchism. Saul newman for example dissmisses individualist anarchism as too entangled with "anarcho" capitalism. michel onfray, as ive read in his recent book La puissance d'exister knows Han Ryner (also an epicuereanist like him) and of course Georges Palante (most likely Newman doesnt know these individualists) and all the time talks of an antiliberal libertarian left politics.

I think for the Michel Onfray as well as for the Postanarchism article i will proceed to include him in postanarchism with the references already available. Anyway Onfray calls may 68 a nietzschetian revolt for a good reason after all. And for the Individualism article this might also be important.

And also as far as anarchists with a sensibility for avant garde art movements check this englishman Simon Critchley. Maybe this guy is also doing postanarchism (hes close to ernesto laclau´s postmarxism) but besides his The New School teaching position hes inside a crazy group called International Necronautical Society with a postsituationist approach to politics and life.--Eduen (talk) 07:42, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

in the end all these are revolts againts mass industrial capitalist consumer society. dandys are aesthetic individualists who prefer their small affinity groups and bohemian spaces instead of the strange puritanism of bourgoise entreprenourship. hippies and punks are bohemians who prefer their small affinity groups rather than being at work or staying home watching tv. as it stands now the individualism article presents an anglo liberal vision of things while maybe a great individualist of the last century was Theodor Adorno (he mentions all the time the loss of individuality in mass consumer society).

for example the italian article mentions stirner, nietzsche, thoreau, and establishes a difference between egoistical and non egoistical individualism. the french mentions descartes, galilei, emile armand, georges palante; and later proceeds to make a difference between liberal individualism and anarchist individualism. the portuguese article mentions Sartre (existentialism in sartre and camus might be also individualism as far as it concentrates in the individual´s existence or as L. Susan Brown calls "existential individualism"). this article seems to me is another bad case of Systemic bias (i mean, it even has a section called "Individualism and US history"). anyway it is already tagged for bad referencing and non-neutrality.--Eduen (talk) 08:16, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

i already started this. you can chek it now. theres of course the issue of economic individualism which might take a little longer (philosophical and political individualism i think i have it covered). i think of course neoliberals are individualists (archist individualism) but also mutualism who opposses the existence of classes or the fact of having to work for someone else. this might need some research although theres some texts of Emile Armand who talk of reasonable individualist anarchist options. One is things like craftmanship just like some hippies or the urban people who adhered to mutualism in Proudhons time or he says also "illegalism" and "millieux livres". Anyway i left the banner that was there already. One thing that that article needed was to deal with other individualist philosophies besides liberalism such as anarchism, existentialism and humanism. I think on economic individualism i can proceed from there. Ultimately the controversy of whether mass industrial capitalism promotes or destroys individuality has to be established.--Eduen (talk) 07:00, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

well i guess i provided 80 percent of what i wanted to give to the article. now checking the discussion on the talk page it is interesting to note people complaining this article was too biased towards US neoliberalism.--Eduen (talk) 11:25, 22 December 2009 (UTC)

Latin american individualist anarchism
I added a section on the individualist anarchism article on latin american individualist anarchists. I found about the brazilian Maria Lacerda de Moura reading about spanish individualist anarchists. If you know spanish you might want to check this fascinating article [http://elanticristodistro.blogspot.com/2009/12/la-insumision-voluntaria-el-anarquismo.html La Insumisión Voluntaria. El Anarquismo Individualista Español Durante La Dictadura y La Segunda República (1923-1938) x Xavier Díez]. these people were sort of like hippies of their time. i want to see if someone could translate this awesome article into english and maybe i might write the nice people of Anarchy: A Journal of Desire Armed or Fifth Estate (periodical) to see if they might want to deal with this subject on their publications. Seems to me spanish individualist anarchism is very little known to anglo speaking anarchists and so many like Saul Newman tend to overassociate individualist anarchism with US neoliberalism.

About Biofilo Panclasta i read a biography on him. A nice colombian stirnerist vagabond. Theres a colombian or argentinan im not sure crust punk/powerviolence band named after him.--Eduen (talk) 06:38, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

decadence
i just created category: dandy and category: dandies.

on decadence i think there should be a section on the rock and roll lifestyle of sex, drugs and rock and roll and Wine, women and song with all the talk on punk rock and all that. You could mention the nice trilogy of punk documentaries by Penelope Spheeris The Decline of Western Civilization. The best one is the third in which she presents the lives of LA homeless "gutter punks". the glam metal band Mötley Crüe has a compilation called Decade of Decadence.

now theres also a related or almost the same thing which is "decline" and so the book The Decline of the West. oh, also you should talk about so called roman decadence with all the talk on Caligula and the big roman orgies and all that which some have tried to blame for the decline of the Roman empire. On that you can go to Roman decadence.

now maybe the nietzschetian theme of Last man might also be related as it influenced Theodor Adorno dialectic of Enlightenment.--Eduen (talk) 10:24, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

Anarchist Communism
Ok, how to we come to a compromise so we're not hitting undo back and forth? Right now the article is lacking:

1) "from each according to ability, to each according to need" as the fundamental economic principle that differentiates anarchist communism from other economic anarchist principles according to Cafiero, Kropotkin, Makhno, Puente, Fabbri and Magon and countless others.

and

2) the dominant understanding that anarchist communist free association includes the a communities ability to deassociate from those not fulfilling the self-determined obligations of that community. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Thomas.giovanni (talk • contribs) 03:22, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

2010s in music, other 2010 pages?
I am repeating my post here. I agree with you. I am not sure why there are any 2010 article pages. The decade just started! Where is the discussion on deletion? If an article is up for deletion, there is generally a discussion and consensus. I don't see much of a discussion except by three people on this particular page. Where do we go from here?--CreativeSoul7981 (talk) 21:50, 8 January 2010 (UTC)
 * No, I meant, I was in agreement with not jumping ahead and making predictions about the decade. There are a lot of unverifiable sources for these article pages. What is the consensus for how to go about editing these pages? I'm neither for or against deletion unless the articles become bombarded with blogs and random websites as sources. What do you think? Shall we just continue on monitoring the page like we do the others?--CreativeSoul7981 (talk) 00:18, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Available?
Yo Z, just wondering if you had any free time to tackle the [[Anarchism GA review]]? I think it's a good opportunity to get the article into some sort of stable, baseline-quality shape, if there are enough of us willing to do the work required. Thoughts? Skomorokh  23:29, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Sure, but It's looking utterly fantastic right now. Tightened like you were using a spanner. I'm not sure what's left that I can do. Zazaban (talk) 23:35, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * Well Peter has a lot of suggestions at the review. He comments on the free love content that we disagreed over, for instance. Another one is moving the schools of thought stuff into its devoted article, which I am very behind but that could be controversial. There are a lot of referencing issues in the "social movement" section (which I suspect was probably written as original research initially) that could use some attention/research. Also, I dumped some content into your contemporary anarchism article you could take a look at; it might not belong, and Jadabocho has removed some of it I think. I'll ask Cast and Malik as well if they are around. It would be amazing to get this most troublesome article to GA I think :)  Skomorokh   23:44, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * I wouldn't move the whole section, but I'd certainly cut down the social anarchism section so that it isn't in subsections. Zazaban (talk) 23:54, 11 January 2010 (UTC)
 * There we are, how's that? Zazaban (talk) 00:43, 12 January 2010 (UTC)
 * A rather fucking awesome start I'd say :D  Skomorokh   00:55, 12 January 2010 (UTC)

Proposed deletion of Feminist archaeology


The article Feminist archaeology has been proposed for deletion&#32; because of the following concern:
 * almost all of the text is unusable POV

While all contributions to Wikipedia are appreciated, content or articles may be deleted for any of several reasons.

You may prevent the proposed deletion by removing the  notice, but please explain why in your edit summary or on the article's talk page.

Please consider improving the article to address the issues raised. Removing  will stop the proposed deletion process, but other deletion processes exist. The speedy deletion process can result in deletion without discussion, and articles for deletion allows discussion to reach consensus for deletion.

help a noob?
hi, i just started making pages and i suck at it. My first was a page about Judith Chomsky and it's awful! I couldn't find a page about http://moveyourmoney.info/ on wikipedia and i was going to start one but i don't want to fowl it up like i did my last one. Your'e obvisously a pro at editing and i thought these articals might be up your ally, so could you gimme a hand? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ultan42 (talk • contribs) 14:00, 17 January 2010 (UTC)

Anarchism GAN
Hi, I've visited the article again and it remains on hold. I've now reviewed all the main text and have produced a much smaller list of things to fix this time. I've still got to go through the references in detail, but have decided to take a rest. I will probably fix anything I find myself unless I decide a source is woefully inadequate.

I'm notifying everyone who seems to have done some work wince my first review. I have done a few edits myself, the biggest to the lib ed section which probably should be looked at by one of the team.

Ps In view of the stability requirement on the article I suggest reverting certain edits as vandalism rather than POV.--Peter cohen (talk) 16:58, 21 January 2010 (UTC)

Miles Davis's "Quiet Nights"
Zazaban, I see that you've made a slight clarification regarding Davis's Quiet Nights album. Would you happen to be able to provide a citation to support the statement later in that same sentence (presumably made by someone else, not you) that the album was "released against the wishes of both artists"? I've added a "citation needed" at the end (as I work on cleaning up the article), but I thought since you were in the neighborhood I'd check to see if you might know. RedActor61 (talk) 03:27, 23 January 2010 (UTC)
 * ✅ See my edit summary for a note on formatting; this kind of templating works better for shorter articles, though. Drmies (talk) 04:26, 23 January 2010 (UTC)

Map of the Meuse
Is it possible to have a discussion with you about the map of the Basin area of Meuse which I find very relevant? Sincerely! José Fontaine (talk) 17:01, 24 January 2010 (UTC) José Fontaine (talk) 17:04, 24 January 2010 (UTC) (and Oreo Priest)

Individualist anarchist legacy
I think now it is time to add some lines on the individualist anarchism article on the influence it had in post world war II anarchism. Theres of course Herbert Read and albert camus who were influenced by Stirner as shown in egoist anarchism and also theres post left anarchy, insurrectionary anarchism and postanarchism. Renzo novatore and Bruno Filippi on Wolfi Landstreicher. All of this is well referenced in those specific articles. Also i already added a section on the individualist anarchism and the Individualist anarchism in the United States articles on American Egoism. Should Nietzsche´s influence be mentioned? maybe. I think Michel Onfray could also be mentioned, i read a book of him (La puissance d'exister)in which he mentions Han Ryner, i could get the reference if needed. In La sculpture de soi : la morale esthétique he dedicates a section on Stirner and later one on vanguardist art currents such as situationists and Body art. He says both are ways of approaching self creation and in both Stirner and the sitiationists he finds an existential insurrectionary approach to daily life. I could also get the citation. that book also mentions Flâneurs and dandies.

I have read about Oscar Wilde in some articles on individualist anarchism online. Renzo Novatore also mentions him in Towards the creative nothing. Maybe we should mention him on that article also.--Eduen (talk) 19:32, 8 February 2010 (UTC)

i added sections on contemporary individualist anarchism in both european individualist anarchism and individualist anarchism in the United States. I hope "anarcho" capitalists dont get angry at this since this additions might not go well with the pretention in some of them to monopolize the label "individualist anarchism". I even found out about Michele Fabiani, an italian insurrectionist who wrote an essay called "individualist anarchist critique of modernity" (im going to try to have it translated into spanish). Hes imprisioned just as Alfredo Bonanno is. Post left anarchy as a mostly american creation is also mentioned and it couldnt be otherwise since it is a strongly stirnerist current. Also mutualists i mentioned. If you know about more current mutualists you could mention them. Wolfi Landstreicher is such a strong individualist and so hes also mentioned.

Italian individualist antiorganizationalism is a long tradition and Bonanno and Fabiani are the succesors of Renzo Novatore and Bruno Filippi. I also created Dante Carnesecchi and will create Auro d'Arcola. Both are individualist anarchists left wing futurists who were comrades of Novatore.--Eduen (talk) 07:59, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Cunt = male anus?
Never in researching this article have I encountered this usage, so I've reverted, and I think it needs a source. Cheers. Rodhull andemu  23:13, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

history of anarchism
i guess a good guide could be the anarchism article itself. anyway when i get the time ill try to go over it. lately ive been too busy and partying.--Eduen (talk) 04:58, 18 March 2010 (UTC)

anarcho-queer
Someone created Anarcho-queer. If you want to you could help us improve it. i made some suggestions on the talk page after goin over it.--Eduen (talk) 17:38, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

"scare" quotes considered not scarey
I can't say that I understand why so many people have a phobia of quotation marks.

Using quote marks around a common piece of slang like "hippie" is an acknowledgement that it's a piece of slang, a fuzzy concept, a word with connotations that some people might object to, but you're using it anyway because it's difficult to think of an equally concise synonym that would work for what you're trying to say. Getting across all of that with just a couple of punctuation marks is a really impressive feat of language, and abandoning this idiom does not seem like a good idea. -- Doom (talk) 01:52, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

Egoist Anarchism as a form of anarchist communism?
How can anarchist communism not be communitarian? What is a non-communitarian communism?

How can egoist anarchism be a form of anarchist communism when the most important theorist that its proponents point to- Max Stirner- criticizes communism throughout The Ego and Its Own? Here's just one of MANY examples of Stirner rejecting communism:

"On the contrary, communism by the abolition of personal property only presses me back still more into dependence on another, namely, on the generality or collectivity; and, loudly as it always attaks the 'state', what it intends is itself again a state, a status, a condition of hindering my free movement, a soveriegn power over me. Communism rightly revolts against the pressure that I experience from individual proprietors; but still more horrible is the might that it puts in the hands of collectivity.  Egoism takes another way to root out the non-possessing rabble..." Stirner, Max. The Ego and It's Own.Cambridge University Press. P. 228

While I disagree that egoism is a form of anarchism- Stirner never identified as an anarchist and has very little in common with the views of insurrectionary anarchists such as Galleani who did identify with communism, I think that if you want to include egoist anarchism in the anarchist communism page it should be in the critiques section. If you feel like you want to include insurrectionary anarchist communists alongside mass anarchists such as Kropotkin, Malatesta, Makhno, Flores Magon, etc., etc. within the page- such as Galleani- that's a lot more legitimate. But I have a hard time seeing how to reconcile Stirner's Egoist critique of communism with Galleani's anarchist communism.

--Thomas.giovanni (talk) 16:12, 8 May 2010 (UTC)

That may be so that there is an individualist interpretation to syndicalism (a temporary union of egoists?) but do you have a link to that from the AFAQ? Regarding anarchist communism though, how can communism not be communitarian? If you want to make the argument that anarchism includes egoist strains fine. I disagree with it; but there's plenty of reliable and valid sources out there that disagree with me; so I'd definitely have to accept such a contention. However, I don't see how egoist anarchism can be a form of communism and have never seen any sources to back that up. Again, I think that anything on the anarchist communism page about egoist anarchism should be on the criticisms section. I'm all ears if you can show me some reliable sources that talk about how communism can be egoist and anti-communitarian, I think that's completely contraditory, but I'm open to reading some sources that you provide. The AFAQ references that I've found seem to align more with what I'm saying (that egoist anarchism is critical of anarchist communism not a form of it). Here's a quote from AFAQ showing that individualist anarchists disagree with communism:

''Thus the Individualist anarchist argues that social ownership places the individual's freedom in danger as any form of communism subjects the individual to society or the commune. They fear that as well as dictating individual morality, socialisation would effectively eliminate workers' control as "society" would tell workers what to produce and take the product of their labour. In effect, they argue that communism (or social ownership in general) would be similar to capitalism, with the exploitation and authority of the boss replaced with that of "society."''

Needless to say, social anarchists disagree

Again, I'm all ears if you can show me something different...

--Thomas.giovanni (talk) 04:17, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

So I still disagree and think egoist anarchism should be in the critique section; but I feel that you have enough of a reference (though I still think the link between your reference and your statement is weak) to allow for different interpretations. So, on the principle of allowing wikipedia to show different perspectives when there's controversy based in enough reliably substantiated references), I'll leave it like it is.--Thomas.giovanni (talk) 23:22, 27 May 2010 (UTC)