Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/IncidentArchive214

User:Bosniak's incivility & personal attacks
Some recent comments by merit some attention by administrators: Best regards, Ev 22:43, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * 03:20, 5 March 2007 (UTC): "Dr Mitov, you are just sad case of Srebrenica genocide denier. I honestly feel sorry for you ... due to dirty Christian world politics"
 * 21:03, 8 March 2007 (UTC): "mass scale massacres committed by Serbian Christian Orthodox terrorists and butchers who slaughtered ... Dr Mitov, like most Serbs - are brainwashed by"
 * 20:24, 9 March 2007 (UTC): "Of course, in serbian propaganda historiography, you will find all kinds of garbage - according to them, they survived 100 genocides."
 * 20:34, 9 March 2007 (UTC): "It's just a great feeling to watch Albanian Kosovo become independent. It's a wonderful, fullfilling, satisfying, feeling. It's like an orgasm, in political sense of the word."
 * 21:34, 12 March 2007 (UTC): "You might to more research before starting to defend those scums."
 * 21:48, 12 March 2007 (UTC): "Those Serb individuals who recognize genocide in Srebrenica are good people, and those who don't are scums ... holding fascists accountable"

Also, look what he said to me a short while ago: --Domitius 22:46, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * 22:05, 12 March 2007: "You are sad example of sorry little Serbian propaganda."


 * The user has been blocked for 48 hours. I would have made it a simple warning but the user's block log indicates that he has been blocked for week long periods in the past for WP:NPA violations.--Jersey Devil 02:49, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Edit war
Broun Baronets is under attack by User:Vintagekits and User:One Night In Hackney. Please block both 48 hours. - Kittybrewster 01:04, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You appear to be part of the edit war. Demanding the blocking of those who you war with isn't exactly kosher. IrishGuy talk 01:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Hmmmmm! thats an interest account of what is happening Kitty. Kitty feels aggrieved becuase he has to actually reference the material he wants in an article. If an article is not properly referenced or uses peacock terms then it is going to attract attention.--Vintagekits 01:09, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Hardly an edit war. The initial edit I made was to remove a clear peacock term. When I edited the article the second time I did fail to notice that is was a direct quote admittedly. The quote is of unclear attribution or neutrality so I added the peacock tag and posted a polite message on the talk page explaining my reasoning for it, then you subsequently removed the tag without explanation, and I have not edited the page since and have no intention of doing so.  One Night In Hackney 303 01:11, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Also this diff is quite revealing. It seems that the article was copying the source word for word rather than being re-written in a more neutral and encyclopedic tone, and the subsequent quotation marks have been added to allow the use of a clear peacock term. One Night In Hackney 303 01:19, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Perhaps even more revealing is that according to an online version the phrase "glorious history" doesn't even appear in the text, the quote being attributed to the book does not appear at all. One Night In Hackney 303 01:34, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Indeed. If the online version is accurate, the actual quote is completely different. IrishGuy talk 01:37, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I asked Kitty to attribute the quote but he evaded answering, I think that there could possibly deception here and I will check the hard copy of the book tommorrow, if this quote is not in the book I would take a very dim view of this.--Vintagekits 01:40, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I have answered every point both as you reverted and once I persuaded you onto the talk page. - Kittybrewster 01:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * You have now, after another editor found the book on line.--Vintagekits 01:51, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No, the ref was always there. He found a different edition is my guess. Whatever happened to WP:AGF? - Kittybrewster 01:57, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

(unindent)If the online edition of the book is devoid of the relevant criteria, personally, I'd leave it out. In the interests of confirming this, you could always take a photo of your edition of the book with the sections visible and newspaper or something to confirm the date and e-mail the image to me and I'll confirm either way. -- Nick  t  02:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I am grateful. It won't be tonight. - Kittybrewster 02:21, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Take your time. Obviously, the sooner the better to end this particular dispute, but there is no real rush. It isn't the end of the world :) IrishGuy talk 02:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Semiprotection needed at Brian Wilson and Talk:Brian Wilson
The same person that has been vandalising the above pages is back again. He moves around alot to different IP addresses. We need semiprotection at both of those pages for a reasonable amount of time to insure that he doesn't come back. This problem has been going on for a long time. --Jayron32| talk | contribs 02:45, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

This has been happening off and on for over two months, so any help would be greatly appreciated.--piper108 02:52, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Have you tried WP:RFPP? &mdash;ptk✰fgs 02:53, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * This vandalism really doesn't look that bad to me. --Chris Griswold (  ☎  ☓  ) 03:01, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

has already been semiprotected since 2007-02-24. —Quarl (talk) 2007-03-13 10:01Z 

disruptive editing/3RR violation by User:D323P
I'm requesting some kind of assistance in an edit war that has gone on for several weeks at Lies and the Lying Liars Who Tell Them.

User:D323P initially took the tone of trying to improve the article, with notes on the "talk" page indicating his/her perception of bias in the article. He/she subsequently added several paragraphs of "criticism" of the book to the page, each of which drew objections from multiple editors.

Other editors, including myself, have attempted to engage D323P in dispassionate discussion, in order to reach a resolution. He/she has, however, resisted numerous editors' efforts to improve the text and remove the effect of POV pushing. Rather than engage the arguments raised, he/she generally calls other editors' credibility and motivations into question, and raises the emotional tenor of the discussion.

Please note that D323P violated WP:3RR several weeks ago, after I had warned him/her of it, and I notified him/her via talk page afterwards. He/she has violated it again today, again after a warning.

Please consider blocking this user, or attempting to engage him/her in a discussion. I believe he/she is no longer responsive to the concerns of the editors currently involved in the situation.

-Pete 03:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I second this. There are four editors taking issues with D323P and his edits, and he won't relent or work to build consensus. --DavidShankBone 03:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I have fully protected the page for 48 hours. The user Peteforsyth has a clean record of no blocks and no incivil/personal attack activity that I can see. Furthermore, the consensus was clearly against the reported user's edits, so I won't issue out any 3rr blocks regarding this matter. However, for future purposes please send the matter here or request protection at WP:RFP, because if I see it happen again I will be forced to block. Looking at the talk page I also see several personal attacks made by the User:D323P. I will warn him/her against using such attacks but I won't block him/her at the moment either to try and see if something can be done to resolve this without such measures.--Jersey Devil 04:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I received your note. Thank you. Pete wrote, "Other editors, including myself, have attempted to engage D323P in dispassionate discussion." I'm sorry, but I do not agree with that at all. Discussions happened only after my material was deleted without discussion (violation of WP policy). They were also not "dispassionate." I rightfully objected to the way my material was misrepresented (as seen on the discussion page) and how I felt I was being unfairly treated. D323P 04:58, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Need some help at Talk:Attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder
A shouting match has erupted here. It's not really a discussion anymore, as creating a new section with an incivil heading seems to be the preferred way of making a point for many of the participants. I was involved (back when it was a discussion), so I hesitate to try to rein it in myself. Help appreciated. --Ginkgo100talk 03:24, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * If this wasn't such a serious post I'd feel a WP:BJAODN coming on. 03:27, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Ironic indeed. &mdash; Michael Linnear   03:29, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * hehe HighInBC(Need help? Ask me) 05:03, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Terry Shannon
After the travesty of a first AfD, I've renominated this for deletion. I've been told that there will be a story on it in The Register. Just watch out for that. -Amarkov moo! 05:14, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Legal threats by User:Paul Hartal
User:Paul Hartal has repeatedly accused me and other editors of libelling him, his alma mater (Columbia Pacific University) and other alumni (see Rochelle Holt, among others).  He has been asked several times to stop referring to editors' actions as libel. In response to an AFD discussion on Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Rochelle_Holt he has begun crossposting a rant accusing myself and others of libel to his talk page, as well as Biographies of living persons/Noticeboard. I would very much appreciate it if an admin could look into this situation - Mr. Hartal does not seem to understand that accusing editors of libel constitutes a legal threat, despite numerous admonishments. Cheers, Skinwalker 16:54, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The only two admins involved, myself and Will Beback have are also too involved (that is, have also received legal threats) to make a block. If someone who is uninvolved would look at this, it would be appreciated. JoshuaZ 17:51, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * This is a job for either an RfC or a community ban fro all articles related to CWU. The overt legal threats were a while back, and these days he is only foaming at the mouth, not actually threatening people, I think. It is very hard to assume good faith of someone whose major activity on Wikipedia is whitewashing a diploma mill and attacking those who resist him in doing so, but let's play it by the book. Guy (Help!) 22:22, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Guy, the threat on the BLP noticeboard was yesterday. JoshuaZ 00:03, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The legal threats were made as recently as yesterday on the BLP noticeboard. I have blocked the user indefinitely for legal threats. Any other admins feel free to post you agreements or disagreements with the block below.--Jersey Devil 03:04, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I endorse the block. This user has dealt with other editors by making threats and attacks while using Wikipedia as a soapbox. He's been warned several times but does not seem to listen to other editors. -Will Beback · † · 10:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Kscottbailey
I do not appreciate his comments on the talk page of my now-closed RFA, nor his repeated reversions of users who are kindly removing the thread. Please do something about it. Cheers. – Chacor 05:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I just removed it again. I'd appreciate it if someone who opposed the RfA would step in here if it continues to be an issue... I don't really believe in kicking people like this when they are down. This has little to do with my support of the RfA, and I'd rather not appear to be too biased. Grand  master  ka  05:53, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * He has restored it with a third revert and is defending his reverts by saying that those who're removing the thread are ganging up to avoid 3RR. – Chacor 05:56, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

The page has since been protected due to the edit war, but Kscottbailey has been continuing to assume bad faith when dealing with editors who were involved in either the war itself or stopping it. He posted this rather incivil comment on my user talk page after I reverted his last edit and was considering protecting the page. He left a similar bad faith comment on Viridae's talk page here (Viridae ultimately protected the page). --Core desat  06:29, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * And now he's wikilawyering over the definition of WP:NOT and WP:NOT. --Core desat  06:56, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * While I'm sure Viridae acted with the best of intentions, reverting then protecting a favoured version was always going to result in protests. Anyway, reasoning with Kscottbailey seems to have calmed the situation down, but I wouldn't count on a support from him in any future RfA, Chacor. Rockpock  e  t  08:32, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Nikodemos and Ruadh are the same people reverting back each other's changes
Nikodemos and Ruadh are the same people, and Nikodemos has been reverting back to Ruad's versions in articles. Compare their dates of their edit histories. Both are absent and present on the same days. Ruadh:  Nikodemos:   Proof:

Nikodemos was gone from December 30 through January 12. There were no edits from Ruadh during that time.

Nikodemos and Ruadh take an extended leave, not making any edits from January 19 through February 19. Both arrive back on the same day, which is February 20. Both names make edits on February 20 and February 21.

Nikodemos and Ruadh don't make any edits from February 22 through Februrary 25. They both arrive back on February 26 and start making edits.

Nikodemos takes a break, not making any edits after March 5. Ruadh also stops making edits after March 5 as well and has not made any since. Nikodemos arrives back on March 12 to revert back to Ruadh's version of the article Economics of fascism here:. I revert it back with the commont "you really think I'm that stupid Ruadh?" In aother article Anti-capitalism he uses the Nikodemos name to revert back to a Ruadh version there as well  pretending that he's a third party coming in to stop some kind fighting. Nikodemos/Ruadh realizes he's been found out and leaves a message on user talk page accusing ME of being a double user of someone else.

This IP 66.6.107.236 has also been making edits to the Anti-capitalism article, which I think is Nikodemos/Ruadh as well. . Billy Ego 16:28, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I am curious to know exactly which policy I am accused of having violated. Although I have indeed reverted back to two versions written by User:Ruadh, that was 7 days after that user had stopped editing the two articles in question. I have reverted to Ruadh's edits, but he has never reverted back to mine, thus there can be no question of two accounts working in tandem. I also never pretended to come in to mediate anything, since User:Ruadh is obviously absent. I claim to have no one's support other than my own. I have repeatedly attempted constructive discussion with Billy Ego on my own, which he has refused. – Nikodemos 18:20, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Using sockpuppets to revert back to versions of your other sockpuppets is showing that you support that changes of your sockpuppets. It's creating the illusion of agreement with you. The only reason your Ruadh sockpuppet has not made an edit since you got back from your 7 day break is because I caught you. Billy Ego 18:25, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Sock puppetry says "In addition to double-voting, sock puppets should not be used for the purpose of deception, distraction, or to create the illusion of broader support for a position than actually exists." You're obviously violating that policy because you have been creating an illusion of broader support than exists by reverting back to the versions of your sockpuppets. Billy Ego 18:35, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Please do not presume to know what I would or would not have done. I have explicitly stated that I do not claim to have any support other than my own; how exactly was I trying to create an illusion that goes against my own words? Sporadic editing by two users a week apart is hardly an attempt to show broad support for a position. – Nikodemos 18:41, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Enough of your games. You don't have to say explicitly in words that you support another user's version. Simply by reverting to that version you are showing support for the version. You are creating an illusion that someone else supports that version of the article besides you. It was an ongoing act of deception by you. 18:42, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Ongoing? Unless I am very much mistaken, I reverted to User:Ruadh's version, but he never reverted back to me. – Nikodemos 18:48, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * What does it matter which sockpuppet reverts to which? You were reverting to your Ruadh sockpuppet's version, which was creating the illusion that more than one person supported that version. You were also using your "69.6.107.236" sockuppet making versions the same day as your Ruadh sockpuppet on February 20. Billy Ego 18:50, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Following a prompt by User:TexasAndroid, I realize that the above argument was unnecessary and disruptive. I wish to apologize for getting lost in the heat of the moment. I will now cease editing this page until a third party comes in to comment. – Nikodemos 19:07, 12 March 2007 (UTC)

Even if this is two accounts used by the same person, the timing on the edits is far enough apart that there's no violation of WP:SOCK policy here. There's clearly no WP:3RR and I don't see any sign of attempting to claim an overwhelming consensus of alledged sock accounts or anything.

Merely using two accounts is not a violation; you have to do something with them that would be prohibited if it was one account. Even if this is a sock, they are't doing any such.

Billy, your behavior here appears to be a case of WP:OWN. Please cease and desist. Georgewilliamherbert 19:27, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

sockpuppets and apathy
I find it upsetting that absolutely nobody responds to messages I leave here on the board. I'm trying to draw attention to a certain situation. I believe I have been acting correctly and with restraint in the face of clear misconduct, but if I can't rely on the support of other administrators, I end up feeling like an idiot. Why even bother. Here's the situation, one last time, as clearly as possible. After this, if no one chooses to respond, I throw in the towel: I honestly don't care if the Kinnernet article stays or goes, the notability is borderline, but that's no skin off my nose. I care that Wikipedia processes are being corrupted, but only to a point - I can just shut off my computer and it goes away. I care more than that when I feel I'm being ganged-up on with little or no support. That's all folks, thank you and goodbye.--woggly 07:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Tracking the edits of a user I suspected to be the sockpuppet of a banned user, I read two newly created articles regarding subjects I found to be just barely notable, and heavily laced with advertisement-like hype.
 * Rather than deleting the articles under CSD-A5, I nominated them on AfD, for the benefit of the doubt. (I really and truly don't feel that either of them are notable topics for the English-language Wikipedia, and find it significant that neither of them have articles on the Hebrew-language Wikipedia. But that's just my opinion.)
 * The banned user I had originally suspected of starting the article published a long anti-wiki rant off-wiki, publicly ridiculing me personally and Wikipedia in general[www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1797584/posts].
 * Both AfDs were visited by several brand new users, who with as few as three edits to wikipedia all "discovered" the AfD and came to vote "keep" (namely user:Israelgeeks, user:Kinnernetgal, user:Jerusalemgold, user:Dervish8, and the suspected puppet I was originally tracking, user:Mhltv).
 * I added a note asking above-mentioned banned user to please stop using sockpuppets, and was accused of being "toxic" . The reponse did not surprise me and the style was familiar, I blocked this user as a sockpuppet.
 * The new user votes and chorus of criticism continue, unchecked. Voters protest my labelling of new users, claiming these are "ad hominem" attacks: ; and in one case, simultaneously denying that new users are sockpuppets, and demanding the unblocking of the suspected sockpuppeteer:
 * Just for the record, the banned user I suspect of being a sockpuppeteer was blocked indefinitely after making legal threats, and veiled threats of what he "could" do to my children if he weren't such a nice person. He has never retracted any of these threats, and indeed to this day repeats the legal threat off-wiki. Every deletion vote that has somehow been connected with him has attracted "brand new users" (See Long term abuse/Israelbeach).


 * From my initial survey of what you've described, I agree that is likely to be a puppet of banned user Israelbeach.  It is a shame that the results come back as inconclusive from RFCU.  In the meantime, as a non-admin, I've removed a handful of instances where israelnewsagency.com was being used as a source.  It seems I was going back over JZG's own work in that area (which was reverted by an anon IP).  I have dealt with another banned user once who was persistent and incorrigible.    Don't let it get you down.  While WP:DENY is a good idea, sometimes it burns you out faster than it eventually gets to them.  Those times, I step back and realize that sometimes junk can exist in a Wikipedia article for weeks before it's noticed.  If they get away with a day or two of vandalism/PoV before you come back and clean it up, it won't be the end of Wikipedia (and it may even garner more attention by others since you weren't there to wipe up the mess immediately).  Good luck.  ju66l3r 11:25, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Thank you. Sincerely. I think I'll take a wikibreak, but it would be nice if someone kept an eye open after, who is testing the limits of what he can get away with. --woggly 13:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Anonymous IP Ban Evasion
I believe this user: User talk:72.88.165.163 is clearly the same person as this user: User talk:72.88.162.57 who simply started using a slightly different IP address in order to evade a block appropriately placed by Crum375. In fact this Anon-IP user should probably be permanently blocked from Wikipedia as the edits are very biased, without discussing why-- and lots of edit warring. If you are not sure that it is the same person, the contribution histories [] vs. [] should serve as very strong circumstantial evidence. --ProtectWomen 08:10, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: The user is back as now a different IP  and has made a personal attack against myself for exposing him.  How do I move forward with a request to have the 72.88.xxx.xxx IP range blocked for a longer time period or perhaps banned? --ProtectWomen 19:11, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Bignole, User:Arcayne, User:Mardavich et. al.

 * The following discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page.  No further edits should be made to this page.

[I consolidated these two separate sections, as they seem to be the same issue and should probably be dealt with and archived together. See also this related report] - David Oberst 18:04, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Harrassment report by User:Bignole
Myself, and User:Erikster, User:ThuranX, User:Arcayne have been experiencing some harrassment from a fellow user:User:Mardavich. He cites Wikipedia rules in an effort to force us out of the 300 page. Initially he left "warnings" on users Erikster, ThuranX and Arcayne's page about violating the 3RR, which they didn't. In truth, these editors were cleaning up the article, and were removing original research that had no citation, or rewording for NPOV. Offended by their changes, he "warned" them. Later, as Arcayne was cleaning up the page, Mardavich reported him for 3RR violation. He cites the diffs and claims that Arcayne has been acting as if he "owns" the article. Arcayne was initially blocked, but when I asked the Admin responsible to go back and look at the diffs more carefully, and compare with the previous versions (which Mardavich did not supply) he did and then unblocked Arcayne, as it was clear that it wasn't real 3RR violation. Since my defence of Arcayne, Mardavich decided to basically wait for me to actually edit 300 (since I had regulated myself to the talk page the entire time), and he picked out the only 4 edits I had that actually removed information and reported me to 3RR committee. I have yet to see the outcome of this, but I responded on there to look carefully at the diffs, because Mardavich again did not supply an "original version" for comparison. All the diffs are completely different, 1 is removing 2 images that have nothing to do with the film itself, they were pics of real life statues that couldn't be used for comparison; another was removing duplicate information; another was removing more duplicate information. My point is that Mardavich is harrassing myself and the others to the point that he's trying to have use blocked so we can't "oppose" his views on the 300 page. I forgot to mention that the 300 page has become highly controversial because of all the reviews about it's possible "racism", and Mardavich is one of the many editors pushing to include every bit of information that calls the film and it's makers racists, withouth any NPOV. Can anything be done about this, or do I and my fellow editors have to worry about never cleaning up any article wikipedia for fear that Mardavich is going to pick out 4 edits and report us for 3RR, or something else?  BIGNOLE    (Question?)  (What I do)  12:22, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Unrelated, but your signature is awfully long. And doesn't look like it'll wrap correctly at the end of a line. --  Nick  t  12:28, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * As I said before, politely reminding users who are in danger of violating WP:3RR is not harassment, it's an essential part of the process. Rules and safeguards like WP:3RR are there for a reason, to prevent edit-waring and ownership of articles by a few editors, which is what's been happening at the article in question. --Mardavich 12:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Update: Please note that User:Bignole has been spamming the talk pages of his friends, inviting them to come here and support him. The individuals in question have been WP:owning the 300 article, in an organized fashion, and they've made no secret of their goal to WP:OWN the article in question by tag-teaming as evidenced by the following statements: "We should be watching each other's backs, like making other editors aware when we need to tag out and let someone else jump in". or "if you are running out of reverts or move into target territory, it might be helpful for us to watch each other's backs. Either way" --Mardavich 13:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes, I agree. But, throwing around these "warnings" to make editors leave an article so that you can push your POV is not part of the policy. You have been deliberately manipulating the rules of Wikipedia to try and get your way, as was seen when you tried to have Arcayne blocked, but failed.  BIGNOLE    (Question?)  (What I do)  12:57, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Take it to WP:DR and change that signature please. -- Nick  t  12:59, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I would like to suggest that you reconsider your decision in this matter. I am one of the users Bignole referred to as being essentially wiki-stalked by this POV-pushing user. Dissent in Wikipedia is normal, but Mardavich is not one of those users who relents after losing an argument. He has disrupted the 3RR noticeboard on two  separate occasions with baseless, empty accusations. Simultaneously, he has worked to tie up admin resources in filing this baseless claim. Even a cursory edit of Mardavich's own user and Discussion Page indicate his strong identification with any causes surrounding Persia and specifically Iran. I would be kind and suggest that his bahvior is a simply hyper-sensitivity to issues that concern Persians, but his actual demeanor is in practice very proactive in removing those editors he sees as interfering with his view of Wikipedia. That three editors (two of them highly respected memebers of this community - I am not including myself as I am still learning the ropes) have had to essentially spend their time away from contributing positively to Wikipedia to fend off these empty yet time-consuming complaints is just wrong.
 * After a heated conversation on admin User:Bakharev's Talk Page, seen here, wherein you can note from the history     [] how Mardavich repeatedly modified his argument to reposition and escalate his charges against myself and the other users named above, we contemplated whether or not to file an AN/I complaint. At the time, we decided against it, as we were more concerned with fixing the issues of the 300 (film) article. As well, admin Bakharov asked us to stop focusing on each other and instead focus on the article. Clearly, Mardavich was unsatisfied with admin Bakharov's attempt to de-escalate the issue, and then went on a Wiki-bender, filing 3RR reports and AN/I reports to beat the band.
 * User Mardavich is a pariah on the Wiki community. His edits are POV-motivated, he refuses to work with anyone or tolerate edits of any viewpoint that differs from his own, and attempts to remove those editors who - following good Wikipedia policy - choose to oppose POV and unsourced edits. Lastly, and most importantly, I am personally troubled by his wiki-stalking tendencies. This is not healthy editor behavior.Arcayne 13:15, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * As for Mardavich's "update", one man's spam is another man's email. As we the accused in the complaint, I find it extremely appropriate that Bignole brought this complaint to our attention. Mardavich perhaps thought he might be able to sneak this complaint by, as he didn't bother to notify the other people listed in the complaint - again, an example of Bad Faith and wiki-working the system. The fact that he is even able to offer an "update" clearly shows he is watching everyone's traffic instead of, y'know, contributing to articles. This person needs to leave Wikipedia for a nice long time. Arcayne 14:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Reply: Please note all the personal attacks in the above postings by User:Arcayne, calling me a "pariah" etc, the user has also called me "a creep", "unethical", "devious", "POV pusher" on several occasions, all in total disregard of WP:Civil and WP:NPA. --Mardavich 13:43, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * My personal opinions of User:Mardavich have not been discussed in an open article Discussion page and only in other user talk pages as well as in official forums (although not in Mardavich's talk page). I think the guy is a pariah and an unethical, devious creep. His behavior utterly contradict Good Faith, Civility and No Personal Attacks. He is a wiki-stalker who only seems aware of these descriptors because he is following user edits and making comments where they appear. Kind of the definition of a wiki-stalker.Arcayne 13:56, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought it is worth noting that while Mardavich has been trying up the time of the editors who have been wroking on the 300 article, he has since helpted contribute to the article ending up like this overnight. He's using this noticeboard and the 3RR noticeboard to distract folk. My opinion of Mardavich has not changed.Arcayne 14:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Personal attack report by User:Mardavich
"Life is too short to be wasting it dealing with lowdown dirty dogs such as yourself"

User:Arcayne has been making personal attacks against me for days now, even after he was warned to stop by an admin, calling me all sorts of names like a "pariah and an unethical, devious creep" and now a "lowdown dirty dog". Am I suppose to just take this verbal abuse? What happened to WP:NPA and WP:Civil? --Mardavich 15:45, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * This looks pretty severe to me; I think a preventative block could be justified here. This kind of disruption isn't OK. I would like to see the warning he was given; could you provide a diff? Heimstern Läufer 15:55, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * He was warned to be polite here --Mardavich 16:01, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * If you don't mind, hang on for a second Heim. This is more complex than Mardavich is making it seem.  I ran across this from looking at Alex's talk page last night and read through a lot of things, and it appeared to me that Mardavich has been harassing several editors on one particular article because he wants a particular viewpoint in the article.  I read through one 3RR report that Mardavich filed that was laughable in how far from 3RR it actually was.  He has been putting "warnings" and saying "I will have you banned" on several users talk pages.  Arcayne asked Mardavich to stop leaving messages on his talk page; Mardavich refused.  That doesn't excuse Arcayne's incivility, but it isn't as cut and dry as it appears.  I'm still trying to sort everything out here.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  16:04, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Not a problem; part of why I asked for a diff was so I could get some context. But since you seem to know more on the subject than I, I'll let you follow up on this one. Heimstern Läufer 16:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately, I'm at work so I don't have the time to fully go into this. If you or someone else does have the time and can fully get the context, then go right ahead and do whatever is warranted.  I just wanted to make sure that no one made a hasty move and did fully look into it before blocking.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  16:12, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * User:Bbatsell, harassment is a serious accusation you're making. Since when politely reminding users to respect and follow WP:3RR is considered harassment? I only posted on Arcayne's talk page because he made a sweeping blind revert  removing hours of my work on the article, he can't tell me not to contact him when he's clearly disrupting my work. --Mardavich 16:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I don't think circumstance should justify personal attacks, however it should be taken into account when deciding the remedy. HighInBC(Need help? Ask me) 16:43, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I just discovered this new allegation by Mardavich (not putting the name of the person being accused appears to be a repetitive tactic of his, evidenced here in an attack on User:ThuranX). I will admit to not being civil to Mardavich (although only in my and other user talk pages or in response to his endless tirade of complaints and accusations - never in an article or a Discussion Page, and not even on his own Talk page); the user tried to get me blocked for good faith edits and has tried to do the same with at least three other editors, filing spurious 3RR and AN/I complaints (again, this one and this one, He has also filed at least two 3RR reports, here and here. This complaint's success probably rewarded him enough to think of it as a valid method of removing editors from the 300 (film) article, as CovenantD has since left the article in disgust. The uncivility referred to occurred between users on their own talk pages, all of whom had reason to not particularly like or appreciate Mardavich's special brand of working the system to block editors who disagreed with his edits in 300. I consider this user to be a wiki-stalker - how else would he happen to know the content of any of my conversations on other users' pages? Add to that the fact that I asked him no less than three times to never contact me, and I feel that my opinion of him is dead on, although it might not have been politic to come out and say it. Lastly, the mass revert he is referring to was to correct the massive vandalism and POV-pushing that had occurred overnight, as evidenced by this version. The actual revert was done by User:GamblinMonkey here, and mine took place moments later. After that, i went back through all of the intervening edits and re-added every edit that was not outright vandalism or POV-pushing (citing in the edit summaries the origination contributor), including some edits by Mardavich himself. The current article reflects those changes by myself and many others who contribute positively to the article. Arcayne 16:52, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page, such as the current discussion page. No further edits should be made to this page.

Richard and Mrs. Tweek


The MetsBot has improperly fixed a double redirect. This |this page has an incorrect title that I am not able to change. Also, I'm not sure if there was more info on the page that was removed, but it was the more commonly used page. Please refer to the page's discussion area for extended info. Thank you. Tweeks Coffee 12:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * How can it improperly fix a double redirect? The page was moved to another title and then moved again, so this page was a redirect to a redirect. i.e. a double redirect. As the page was created as a redirect from the original move it had nothing on it other than the original redirect. See the history here --pgk 18:51, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * It did it improperly because it kept a factually incorrect title, deleting the correct one. Richard and Mrs. Tweek would be the most appropriate title. Tweeks Coffee 19:32, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Article moved as requested; nothing was preventing non-admins from doing the move. Redirects fixed. There's no problem with MetsBot; it did exactly what it was supposed to. —Quarl (talk) 2007-03-14 10:27Z 

Lysdexia / 69.238.129.55
Continuing from here (archive). - Banned User:Lysdexia is active again from. Even if there are some useful edits, we don't have to put up with this: ("illiterate freak"), denies/removes warnings  ("accurate, not vandalism"). Is there any 'thruthe hating ignorant admin scum' around here familiar enough with the case to decide about a long-term block of the IP? Femto 12:44, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Blocked 2 months, and undid a few of the more egregious edits. Fut.Perf. ☼ 13:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Assistance needs on AI6 articles
Could we get as many people as possible watchlist the American Idol 6 pages? Specifically, Antonella Barba and Sanjaya Malakar. All of the finalists articles are being hit but especially those 2. I'd rather not protect the articles if possible. --WoohookittyWoohoo! 13:52, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Problems on National Council of La Raza
I am concerned by what is going on here.

I have been checking the sources offered by the anonymous contributors, and it does seem to paint a pretty grim picture of what the NCLR actually is. Instead of honestly debating this, however, multiple administrators have both reverted and locked the page, user:Evrik stated that trying to get it locked was a "legitimate" method of trying to force someone to register (I was under the impression that registration on Wikipedia is not compulsory in any fashion), and the other side offers no citations of their own but attacks the messenger and sources without anything to back up their own attacks. This is not the way wikipedia is supposed to operate. I am going to paste this concern to WP:ANI in a moment.

My primary concern is that administrators are locking the page, one administrator reverted the page before locking (which is a no-no and borderline abusive), and yet none who do this seem to be offering any response to the anonymous sources other than dismissive attacks upon the person of the anonymous contributors.

My secondary concern is user:Evrik's statement, "Excuse me, but asking for semi-protection is a way to make whoever is forcing these changes to register so it can be discussed."(emphasis mine)

I was unaware that it is ever required that we "force someone to register" in order to have a discussion, that seems very counterintuitive as talk pages are available to every contributor, registered or not.

I would appreciate some guidance on this matter; it seems Wikipedia is not a place for apologetic propaganda, and the existing article on NCLR (after spending some time investigating them and reading the sources provided, as well as hunting down my own sources) indicates that NCLR may be a duplicitous organization with a real position somewhere between what the current page is and what the anonymous contributors were offering. One Elephant went out to play... 14:37, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

NEED HELP After my leaving a friendly note to Bastique on his talk page informing him of my revert, he reverted back, AND instituted full protection on the page.

Additionally, he left me a threat on my talk page.

This is behavior beyond what anyone could consider reasonable, I request intervention, please. I was not trying to cause problems, but Bastique definitely has an attitude issue. One Elephant went out to play... 15:04, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I am not involved in the content dispute. I reverted to the previous protected version and then protected it.  Please take your issues to the article talk page.  Please do not use Wikipedia forward your agenda.  Bastiq ▼ e demandez 15:05, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Bastique, I have no agenda, as you can clearly see from my history on the topic.

What I have a problem with is that you have now TWICE abused your powers to "win" at that page, locking it down to your preferred version in violation of the Protection_policy. You then left me a threatening note telling me "Do not revert me again". You are passing the bounds of civility and I definitely have a problem with that: you appear to have an attitude problem and I do not feel safe editing at Wikipedia with you now obviously targeting me. I have filed a request for help as I cannot seem to figure out how to make the Request for Comment that you mentioned, but that too seems like a nasty abuse on your part, since I would have to get someone else to sign off on it and you appear to be working very hard to keep anyone else from being involved, especially since you completely locked down that page now.

I will note that, beyond twice reverting because I saw a problem with how people were doing things on that page, I have made no insertions with respect to content, and I have specifically stated each time that I am not doing that to endorse which version of the page I prefer. My issue is with how Wikipedia's processes are being abused, and certain editors are behaving in a less-than-fair manner. One Elephant went out to play... 15:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I suggest you quit trying to game the system. You've been reverted by none other than Danny Wool, an employee of the Foundation, once already. I reverted the page to the version protected by Kat Walsh, a board member.  You can scream abuse and bloody murder all you want, but when all is said and done, you're doing nothing more than gaming the system into push some personal agenda on the page in question.  Bastiq ▼ e demandez 15:23, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I am not trying to "game" anything, and I resent your continued threats and incivility. I don't know who "Danny Wool" is, nor do I know who "Kat Walsh" is, and I don't really care: edits should stand on their own merits, not based on who made them.

YOU, meanwhile, have twice reverted and then used your own tools to lock to your preferred version. That's a problem and a violation of the Protection Policy, and based on your continued incivil and rude comments, I am tempted to go straight to filing formal arbitration over this. I have done nothing to deserve your rude and incivil treatment, I was offering some friendly criticism because I thought that it would help, and I have not done anything or even been involved in any conflicts to this day. I have no "personal agenda" on the page, whatsoever, beyond wanting to see Wikipedia made into a better encyclopedia: you appear to be on the opposite side.

You have been rude, incivil, have misused your administrator powers. You have, in short, acted the jerk. I am asking you politely right now to stop doing it, or I will have no choice but to file a formal complaint with the one body that might do something about it. I refuse to operate under conditions where someone like you is just looking for an excuse to abuse people. One Elephant went out to play... 15:28, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Good luck with that arbitration. – Steel 15:29, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Steel359 removed my request to re-check for page unprotection from the Page Protection request page. That is highly inappropriate behavior. One Elephant went out to play... 16:11, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I just took a glance at the edit history of the page. It's blazingly obvious to me that there's something out of kilter and that there is a need for protection of the page (reverting Danny??? not a good idea) until the differences can be sorted out by talking through them on the talk page. I see absoultely no sign of Bastique being involved in the content of the page, and to suggest otherwise may cause others to doubt your veracity. Also, I'm not sure there's a lot of merit in generally casting aspersions on Bastique the way you have been doing, One Elephant went out to play..., and I'd strongly advise you to reconsider your approach. What I see here is somewhat disruptive. AN/I threads are supposed to be succinct. Support page protection, support cautioning OEwotp on behaviour. ++Lar: t/c 16:55, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

First of all, again, who is this "Danny" and why does what he does matter more than anything another editor does? I do not see the point to this. Edits should stand on their own merits, not on who made them.

Second of all, the protection policy and policies on administrators specifically state that administrator powers should not be used to "win" a content dispute. If Bastique was going to revert, that's fine, but he should not also have protected it when there was no vandalism of the page, he should have let some other truly non-aligned administrator do the protecting. That is why I reverted it and why I left him a friendly note explaining why.

Where I start to see a real problem is that not only did Bastique threaten me twice - here and on my user page - he was very rude, and turned around and reverted it again, following by locking down the page completely so that nobody can edit it. This is not the action of a reasonable administrator, this is the action of someone who is using his own administrator powers to win a content dispute in violation of wikipedia policies. I am trying to remain calm and civil but it is very hard when I am faced with an administrator who refuses to be civil and thinks he has some right to insult, threaten, and berate users. One Elephant went out to play... 17:07, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Bastiq ▼ e demandez 17:12, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No, I have not been very rude. I told you to get over yourself when you accused me of threatening.  That's not "very rude."  That was a reasonable response to your accusation of my threatening you.
 * 1) I have not threatened you.  I haven't threatened you once and I haven't threatened you twice.  You are lying.

Reverting Danny is a bad idea because Danny works for the WMF and often tries to discreetly deal with issues that have been brought directly to the foundation's attention. Sometimes by large, angry lawyers. He's usually right about stuff, so when I see him reverted, it's a sign that the other person is usually wrong. Not always, but that's the way to bet. Reverting Mindspillage is also a bad idea, because she's on the board of the WMF (second highest vote getter from the community in the recent board election) and often tries to discreetly deal with issues brought to the foundations attention. Sometimes by large, angry lawyers. That they both got involved in this article, to restore it to a particular place, is a sign that you're almost certainly seriously confused about something. I don't know what, no time to dig in, but it's the way to bet. Also, I've never seen Bastique lock content he was involved in a dispute in. Ever. I reviewed the edits and he's not, in my view, involved. I've not ever seen him berate users. He certainly didn't in this case, he gently warned you and then when you persisted in being unpleasant, warned you again. The charge that he's abusing powers is baseless. My advice to you: make your case for your changes on the talk page and drop this thread before you get yourself in deeper, because there's nothing that you really have anything to complain about. ++Lar: t/c 17:27, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Bastique's alleged attacks and violation of WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA
Bastique continues to attack me, violating WP:CIVIL and NPA.

He threatens me: I consider "Do not revert me again", from an administrator, to be a threat that should I revert him, he will do things with his administrator powers. This is incivil on his part. He insults me: I consider "get over yourself" to be an insult, and I'm sure most would agree that the phrase is insulting. He calls me a liar.] This despite the fact that he clearly threatened me before, as well as in his unfounded accusation that I was trying to "game the system" as well as continually insisting I am "pushing an agenda", which is not the case.

I consider this as well as what he posted above to be one more threat on his part. This is beyond any bounds of reason for an administrator.

I formally request help to deal with Bastique, an administrator who seems to have reacted badly to what was intended as friendly advice on keeping his behavior within the bounds of wikipedia policy. So far, he has violated the Protection Policy with his admin tools, and violated WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA in his continued attacks against me. One Elephant went out to play... 17:22, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You have not once been friendly, so don't tell people you have. Bastiq ▼ e demandez 17:25, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I started out attempting to be very friendly. I was certain to leave in my note a request that you regard my note as helpful criticism. I did not start out attacking you, nor do I wish to be viewed as attacking you now, but you NEED to calm down and you need to stop doing what you are doing. One Elephant went out to play... 17:41, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

This needs to be summarily rejected as spurious ++Lar: t/c 17:27, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I am getting sick to God of this user pointing the finger at me. Getting this kind of accusation from somebody who apparently doesn't know me is infuriating to say the least.  I'm going to assume good faith and say that he's seriously misguided about my intentions, but it's clear that there's no dialogue to be engaged with him.  Someone suggested to him to open a REQUEST FOR COMMENT, but he still doesn't seem to get it.  Bastiq ▼ e demandez 17:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Bastique, from the moment I left you a helpful criticism, instead of following up on it, you have violated WP:CIVIL, you violated WP:NPA by calling me a liar (the Text Example of a Personal Attack from the policy page!) and you have continually left threatening comments to me only to claim that you are not threatening me later. This is duplicitous and not conduct becoming an administrator. Lar, I have tried to contact you to discuss it, but you have not responded, if you are on AIM or YIM, I will speak with you directly. I get the feeling you have not even bothered to read the case. I am not being spurious, I have been trying to get some help, because BAstique's threats and personal attacks are completely out of hand. His editing of my comments a bit ago was even more out of line. One Elephant went out to play... 17:41, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You started the Personal Attacks by accusing me of threatening you. I have not once threatened you.  You are lying by saying I have. (-Bastique)


 * I provided the links above. Either apologize, or don't, but you WERE threatening me. One Elephant went out to play... 18:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Just saying, "I consider this a threat," doesn't make it so. (-Bastique)


 * You need to read WP:NPA again then. One Elephant went out to play... 18:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * And frankly, I don't believe you do consider it a threat. (-Bastique)


 * Too bad. I do. One Elephant went out to play... 18:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Therefore you are violating WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA. I suggest you stop.  Bastiq ▼ e demandez 17:46, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I suggest you stop threatening me, stop violating WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA constantly at me, and stop your abusive behavior. you trying to twist things around like this, openly calling me a liar and violating WP:NPA and then turning right around and claiming that I violated these, is completely ridiculous. You seem to be enjoying attacking me, and that's why I've filed this as well as sending an email to the mailing list about your abusive behavior.One Elephant went out to play... 18:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * My talk page is open, as is my email. I've seen enough to think that you're not completely clear on things. I've changed the heading of this section to make it clear that these are allegations. ++Lar: t/c 17:47, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't see anything wrong here. "Don't revert me" isn't a threat. Nor do I see any implication that Bastique would user admin powers in "retaliation", which is ludicrous. In fact the only incivility I see here is coming from One Elephant went out to play..., by accusing Bastique of "duplicitous" behavior, threats and other such things. &rArr;   SWAT Jester    On Belay!  18:07, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * In addition, judging from One elephant's comments above the arbitrary section break, i.e. not knowing who Danny is, implies that One elephant is unfamiliar with wikipedia's policies, at least on some level. Therefore, it seems a bit ridiculous for someone who doesn't fully understand wikipedia policy to accuse a well respected administrator of violating these policies. &rArr;   SWAT Jester    On Belay!  18:10, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Swat, yeah, I'm new here. I got a rude introduction to the policies when some idiot decided my name violated the username policy (though how a name referencing song lyrics violates policy, I have no idea) and I had to get THAT fixed. Thankfully, more of the admins here are like Mike Rosoft than are like this Bastique character, at least it seemed so back then. So I studied the policies. Nowhere in the policies did it say "AND IF YOU SEE DANNY DO SOMETHING, STAY AWAY" or "NOBODY CAN EVER CONTRADICT AN ADMIN." Trying to say that now is ridiculous, that's not how the policies say this is supposed to work.One Elephant went out to play... 18:34, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Er, actually it does, see WP:OFFICE. "Danny Wool is a steward, elected administrator on the English Wikipedia, and a longtime Wikipedian. He is in charge of the Wikimedia Foundation Grants Committee and is one of three paid Foundation employees. Danny deals with some of the communication from dissatisfied organisations and people, and does his best to protect the interests of the Foundation in conjunction with Brad Patrick, legal counsel to the Foundation" "Please note that this is official policy, and reverting a WP:OFFICE may be grounds for blocking. I do not recommend that admins block for this, I'm just saying... don't revert a WP:OFFICE edit unless and until you've asked and know what you are doing. There may at times be legal reasons for this." As for your second part, nobody ever said you can't disagree with an administrator. But what you're doing goes beyond disagreeing and is borderline INCIVIL. &rArr;    SWAT Jester    On Belay!  18:58, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Swat, that is fine: I had not seen the WP:OFFICE page before, I might have missed it, there are so MANY pages. Regardless, it was not noted as a WP:OFFICE action, so how would I have known? Also, what I have done is reported when an administrator threatened me, and did something I thought and still do think violates the Page Protection Policy because administrators are not supposed to use their powers to "win" content disputes. It is not a violation of WP:CIVIL to report something like this, but Bastique has repeatedly violated WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA at me since, and yet the admins here are not doing anything about it, so I can only assume that I was right to fear when threatened by Bastique, because you won't enforce your own policies against his attacks. One Elephant went out to play... 19:10, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Calling someone who administered a username block "some idiot" is not helpful. We need collegialism here, not invective. As to why the name was blocked, review WP:USERNAME I've also reindented some of your remarks (especially those interspersed with those of other folk) to make it clearer who said what and in what order. ++Lar: t/c 19:04, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Lar, when the block was reviewed, there was NOTHING in the WP:USERNAME policy to show why it had been blocked. The reviewing administrator agreed with me that the username block was unjustifiable. One Elephant went out to play... 19:10, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Elephant, I don't know the details of this dispute, but Bastique is a highly respected editor and admin, so it's worth making an extra effort to get along with him. Your edits to the article in question did seem extreme, and you were being reverted by very experienced Wikipedians. My advice to you is to let this go, because it's a misunderstanding that's spiralling out of control at this point. SlimVirgin (talk) 18:15, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * This edit would be regarded as vandalism on most articles. This isn't a place you go to to try and enforce your view into articles. I am closing this discussion as it has already needlessly taken up to much space on AN/I and there are more pressing matters that need to be taken care of. If the reporting user returns to continue wikilawyering you will be blocked for disruption. Case resolved.--Jersey Devil 19:05, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Ok, now I have been threatened once more. I am not "wikilawyering", it isn't even my original edit, I undid it because I saw what appeared to be a violation of policy.

But whatever, you have shown you admins don't care about policy or following the rules, I have been abused and false statements made about me, and you're just attacking me even more. Fine. Whatever. If this is how wikipedia is, I don't want to contribute any more. One Elephant went out to play... 19:12, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I'm wondering whether Elephant is the banned user . Elephant was reverting at National Council of La Raza to restore edits made by, which resolves to the University of Houston, Texas. An earlier IP used by Enviroknot was , in the same range. Their interests seem similar (anti-Islam is a big interest) and the voice pretty well identical.


 * Other Enviroknot accounts were, , , and some others here, in case anyone wants to compare them to Elephant. I'm minded to block indefinitely. SlimVirgin (talk) 19:12, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

That is IT. Now people are making lies and accusations like this at me, after being asked politely not to?

You win. I AM LEAVING. WIKIPEDIA IS NOT WORTH CONTRIBUTING TO IF THIS IS WHAT YOU ADMINS DO ALL DAY. One Elephant went out to play... 19:13, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

IP Block Request
Someone with the IP 72.159.168.35 has been vandalizing the Edward%2C_the_Black_Prince entry – and I see from their [User Contributions] page that this is a recurring problem.

Brunellus 17:56, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * schoolblocked for a week, but this should really be brought up on WP:AIV; you'll get faster results that way. – Avi 18:25, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Inappropriate user-page?
Can user-pages be used for attacks on Wikipedia, Jimbo, Arbcom and former editors? Please see this --Mardavich 15:19, 11 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I'd say, in this case, yes. The user is upset and wants to let off some steam. We should let him. Theresa Knott | Taste the Korn 15:23, 11 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Doesn't seem to violate restrictions listed in WP:UP, so I think it's fine. AQu01rius (User &#149; Talk) 17:36, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh no the sky is falling. HighInBC(Need help? Ask me) 00:17, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Chicken Little to the rescue! -- AAA!  ( AAAA ) 00:24, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Sorry, this user has taken to attacking the user linked, and has made numerous other attacks against other editors of the 300 (film) article here, here, and here. From his talk and user page, he has been up to all sorts of nonsense, trying very hard to distract or remove editors who disagree with his POV (pro-Persian) and OR edits in the article. We have been trying to hold off on filing an AN/I complaint until the 300 (film) article was finished, but this f"ine gentleman" has seen fit to see our ignoring him as a further insult and simply renewed his efforts. Clearly, he needs some time away. User:Bignole, User:Erikster (trying to enjoy his Wiki-SpringBreak), User:Bignole (as the other people he has been harrassing) could offer heaps more information about the guy, being more well-spoken than I.Arcayne 13:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Irony. I post about my recent frustrations with WP, and that in itself becomes a wedge for a tendentious editor to attack me, leading to MORE frustrations with WP. I would like to thank all the other editors who responded here for supporting my right to put a simple, honest explanation up there while I figured things out, instead of just disappearing, which would've left others with no idea when/if I'd be helping them out ever again. I'll be editign some parts of it, but I'm still considering dropping this project entirely. That this is now being exploited by an editor who's already mentioned in a number of pro-iranian/pro-persian incidents around wikipedia is a problem. I'm not the only one he's seeking out to hassle, and 300 (film) isn't the only article he's caused trouble on. ThuranX 22:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Possibly offensive comments at the Humanities Ref Desk
Can I draw admins' attention to the following diff and subsequent edits to that section, as well as at the user's talk page. --Dweller 13:23, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Looks like the return of the Reference Desk troll who enjoys baiting RD editors over Jewish matters. Corvus cornix 23:30, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Requesting attention on dynamic IPs, possible sockpuppetry
I'm not sure exactly how to handle this, but I'm seeing a pattern of disruptive, if not always malicious, edits from a range of IP addresses that I gather are from the same editor:
 * 88.108.79.79, 88.108.14.150, 88.108.127.195, 88.108.11.164, 88.108.4.196, 88.108.42.29, 88.108.51.211, 88.108.114.10, 88.108.116.43, 88.108.70.203, and I'm sure there are more.

The following are typical edits from these IP addresses:
 * Groping:
 * Spaghetti strap:
 * Rape:
 * Women-only passenger car:

The edits are similar, all suggesting that men are victims of sex crimes by women, and inserting gender qualifiers into articles like spaghetti strap, hoodies and phat pants are part of men's fashion.

I also believe SteelAvenger and /Gothgirlangel1981 operate from these IP addresses. SteelAvenger's very first edit was to intervene in an edit war involving one of the IP accounts, and the edits mostly restore whatever IP edits that were reverted.

Similarly, Gothgirlangel1981 makes the same types of gender-related edits: vs, ,  and has created Men-only passenger car, a hoax article. Ytny (talk) 17:18, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * And based on this edit, I believe User:True:Raver may be a sockpuppet of the above users. Ytny (talk) 20:07, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

User:62.47.153.208 and copyvio ext. links?
I don't think this is an active problem at the moment but I wanted input and a heads-up. put external links to videos available through "rockmyspace.info" into articles such as Lee Harvey Oswald, Nostradamus, and Fundamentalist Christianity. The first two seem to be links to copyvio sources, the third seems completely inappropriate for the subject. I've corrected the problems but I'm keeping an eye on the IP. At least one of the edits the IP did today appears constructive. Am I overreacting to post here? -- Pig mandialogue 19:10, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * No, you aren't wrong to post here. That user is spamming. None of those videos are hosted at rockmyspace.info. They are google videos and Youtube videos. rockmyspace.info has just embedded them and this user is linking to those embedded pages to advertise rockmyspace. It is spam. IrishGuy</b> <sup style="color:blue;">talk 19:26, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Aha! Thanks! Now that you point to it, it seems obvious. I was confused by the .info (I really should know better than to trust such designations) and the one seemingly good edit. I'm not dumb but I sometimes act like it.  Pig mandialogue 19:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The ones you can trust are .gov, .mil, .edu, and .int. Everything else is fair game for spammers. --Carnildo 20:27, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Apparently, 62.47.153.81 has been at it too. <b style="color:green;">IrishGuy</b> <sup style="color:blue;">talk 20:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * And 62.47.143.235. <b style="color:green;">IrishGuy</b> <sup style="color:blue;">talk 20:37, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Threats from a user
After editing minor detail into the Adolf Hitler article it was immediately reverted by 'Golbez'. After discussion of the detail on our respective talkpages  and arriving at a conclusion  I reinserted the detail and left word on Talk:Adolf Hitler for the benefit of other editors explaining why the detail should be discussed before removal. 'Golbez' then responded to my note with a fascinating take on building an encyclopedia and 1 edit later blanked the entire note and his response from the Talk page citing "rm trolling". As a result of the blanking I left a vandalism warning on his talkpage and reinstated the note for the benefit of other users. 'Golbez' then edited my talkpage claiming that the vandalism warning constituted a "threat" against him and he threatened a block. This is not a content dispute, im being menaced by 'Golbez' who must not understand that threats are frowned upon. Can an admin ask 'Golbez' to stop threatening other editors? Thanks. Dee Mac Con Uladh 19:43, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * For what it’s worth, I endorse Golbez’s actions. You should really read Attribution, Civility and Vandalism in detail. —xyzzyn 20:00, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Looking over your contribs and snipes at Golbez, it's more than a little difficult to take this complaint seriously. You insulted someone, they got upset, and this surprises you? It'd be a lot more productive if the two of you just looked for a source, and removed the content if such a source couldn't be found. –  Luna Santin  (talk) 21:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * How in the world could golbez's actions here possibly be supported? I'll admit that I don't approve of substituting "common knowledge" for actual sources. However, it wasn't trolling. That was an outright false assertion. (Granted, it was somewhat uncivil, and not entirely helpful, but it was not trolling.) As such, he had no business blanking it from the talk page. That is vandalism. Removing material from an article's talk page simply because you don't like it is vandalism. If he disapproved, he could've simply said why right on the talk page as well.
 * As much as I disapprove of using templates (I find them too impersonal, and I prefer using my own words for things whenever possible), placing the vandalism template on his talk page was entirely acceptable.
 * Threatening a user for addressing vandalism is not in any way acceptable. A freaking admin should know that by now. There's already more and more growing distrust of wikipedia admins; concerns of them abusing their powers. When 'normal' editors have concerns about an admin's actions, threatening to block them is hardly an appropriate response. That's childish at best, but really just downright abusive. And unbecoming of a position of respect.Bladestorm 22:48, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Actually, I'd like to make sure something's really clear here: Even if removing the notice from the talk page was valid, mislabelling it as "trolling" was not. And, far more importantly, even if you think it's obvious that such an action (deleting content, and mislabelling the reason) isn't vandalism, it's still true that he should've explained why it wasn't vandalism. Simply threatening to vindictively block can't possibly be considered appropriate. Bladestorm 22:51, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Both users were more confrontational than I can see was necessary, I'll agree with that much. I may not have a complete picture. In Golbez's case, getting somebody with a redlinked talk into an offended and defensive posture right off the bat may not be the best move, and in Dee Mac Con Uladh's case, we do need to educate new users quickly that trolling isn't the right way to win an argument. I do believe both of them meant well, but didn't handle the situation as well as they might have. That's my current take, anyway. –  Luna Santin  (talk) 23:03, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

It was not a threat. It was a natural consequence of his actions. He had not made a single civil comment to me, and I called him out on it. When I did so, he threatened me with blocking, and I simply showed him the futile hilarity of his statement. As for removing his note from the talk page? Ok, I'll claim fault for that, though I'm positive it did not exist to educate, but to troll me. But I do apologize for removing it, and did not revert him when he put it back. --Golbez 23:36, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * That's entirely true, and worth noting. You didn't revert when he put it back. And that's probably the saving grace.
 * However, there's somewhat of a domino effect there. You admit that you shouldn't have removed that section from the talk page. (It's incredibly mature to admit that-don't think that's lost on me) That means it was appropriate to address the action somehow. He(/she) chose to treat it as vandalism.
 * It isn't fair to simply say, "he threatened me with blocking". More accurately, he used a standard vandalism warning. If you disapprove of that, then you should probably fix the template. Otherwise, what are 'normal' editors supposed to do in the very few occasions when admins vandalize? Absolutely nothing? I don't think that's fair.
 * Incidentally, saying that "It was not a threat", and following it by, "It was a natural consequence of his actions", specifically in response to the vandalism warning is, indeed, verifying that it was a threat. Bladestorm 23:48, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * You're mixing the issues. He made what I saw to be an unsuitable edit; I removed it. He responded with an incivil message to me. I responded educating him in a vaguely sarcastic fashion on how to make quality edits and how to be civil. He responded with further incivility, and included it in an edit summary as well. When he also included it in his talk page post (accusing me of incivility of all things) that was when I removed it as trolling, which it was. He could have made a statement about the article without that. The initial threat of a block was due to his incivility and prior to him reverting me in either circumstance. This has nothing to do with the content dispute. --Golbez 00:18, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Articles for deletion/Anne Zeller needs attention
This AfD needs closing (or relisting) for two weeks now. I can't do it, as I'm the nominator. Sandstein 19:47, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * closed no consensus – Avi 20:38, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Possible vandalism
I've received a report on IRC about someone vandalizing the globe image in the top-left corner of all pages. I don't think that this is possible, seeing as the image is locally stored on the server and hard-coded into MediaWiki's configs, but I figured I would put something here in case anyone sees it. It could just be a bored developer messing around, but who knows. Shadow1 (talk) 20:36, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I know that it's possible to overlay images in that position (see User:Misza13 for a prime example). Veinor (talk to me) 22:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Edit warring and vandalism by R9tgokunks
              and many others. He is constantly renaming czech cities to their german equivalents.  ≈Tulkolahten≈ ≈talk≈ 20:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

uncivil and unacademic comment
hi, particularly, one user User:Azerbaijani who is envolved in a dispute on Mammed Amin Rasulzade article, is adding a phrase "broken man" to the text and and etc, where every of us try to prevent edit warring and introduce new sources, this user deletes all new sources and inserts that phrase/ it is surely a personal attack, but not on users but on the now dead man about whom the article entry is about. so can wikipedia include such POV opinions, and non academic phrases? I and not only me tried to delete that pov, or discuss it, but that user certainly does not accepts any arguements and instead we are accused of edit warring. Elsanaturk 20:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * "Broken man" comes directly from Thomas Goltz, one of the most credible sources on the 20th century Caucasus. If you even bothered to participate constructively on the talk page, or read edit summaries, you would have known this, instead of blindly reverting. You continuously violate wikipedia's policy that third party sources and reliable sources be used. You keep trying to add information for an Azerbaijani nationalist website, which is unacceptable. Also, you continuously attempt to tarnish other users name by falsifying information, and in your process of edit warring you have broken the 1rr restriction that was put upon you.Azerbaijani 21:11, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * First, you are deleting paragraphs. Second, if Goltz said it, why don't you use that as a quote? 'Goltz described Rasulzade as a being a broken man at the time of his death in 1955" then source it. The two word phrase could've appeared anywhere in Goltz' work. source it, then use it. Further, I looked through talk and couldn't find where you explained why you were removing multiple paragraphs and inserting an unsourced quote. Can you provide diffs? ThuranX 00:49, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

and
I'm getting really sick of these two users' constant arguing in a content dispute; see their talk pages, contribs, and Articles for deletion/Mario Party 8. It's not solving anything, just causing more stress. –Llama mantalkcontribs 22:03, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm tired of it too. I try to ignore Henchman when I can, but it doesn't fix things. He still attacks me, and nothing is done about it. I started a RFC about him: that hasn't helped much either. RobJ1981 22:10, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

So that's why you haven't responded to any message I post to you. I try to ignore you as well, and it's working. Well, it's very hard not to end up attacking you as you are SO annoying and you are CONSTANTLY doing things to try and get me in trouble and now you're trying to say that I act like an admin, when I never said or acted like I did, almost straight after you had told Bowsy not to put words in your mouth, the cheek of you! And of course an RFC isn't working as I'm not the problem here, YOU ARE. Oh, and saying one harsh word about you isn't a personal attack, and you have falsely accused me of personally attcking you with "shut up about GameFAQs." Henchman 2000 11:19, 15 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Please stop. Bickering helps no one. Let's try to get some common ground. Maybe both of you should simply step back and let the other users take this one. If something get you angry, simply step away. No one will think any less of you. ~  PH  DrillSergeant ... §  20:06, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

Admin assistance needed to revert page move
The article Sex has been moved without concensus to Biological sexes. Further edits at the (now redirect) Sex mean that an admin is needed to revert this move. Could someone look into it please? WjBscribe 23:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Reverted. — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  23:38, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Someone please repair Mother Jones
Someone just vandalized Mother Jones, about four consecutive edits. Busy, no time to repair right now. Thanks! Richard Myers 00:04, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Looks like somebody reverted it. Ryanjunk 00:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User:71.79.51.157


A vandal who has retaliated against me using numerous addresses at the University of Cincinnati is vandalizing again from (which I think of as his home computer). Since he has, over the past 5 weeks, vandalized my userpage through various IP about 25 times and vandalized a page that I started 8 times, I don’t want to do anything to draw his focus towards me. All I’m asking is that someone looks at his recent edits, make sure all have been reverted and put a warning on his talk page. He has vandalized 4 times in the past day but only received a single level 1 warning. Thanks,  Cynrin 00:40, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I see it's been blocked for a week. Appears to be a static, unshared IP – if you have any more problems, let me know, and it'll be taken care of. –  Luna Santin  (talk) 01:20, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the offer. I'll let you know if he continues to harrass me. Cynrin 01:28, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User:3ahmed
I have tried warning this user many times about various violations of policies and guidelines, including spamming and copyright issues. You can see his talk page is full of image warnings from bots. He continues to add advertorial text to his user page despite frequent warnings and requests to talk about it. It used to be worse (with fair use images and music clips), but the page is still being used to advertise. Could an administrator please see what can be done? <b style="color:CornflowerBlue;">Leebo</b> <sup style="color:#B22222;">T / C  01:34, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Chirchona
User:Chirchona is constantly disrupting the flow of the Disney Channel articles. He creates massive amounts of episode articles with little to no info. He constantly messes up coding to tables in lists of episodes and uploads massive amounts of poor quality screen shots which are most often left with out copyright info, and some even being orphaned and not needed. Me and another user have made many attempts to contact this user but he will not respond. He is a suspected sock puppet of User:TSLcrazier who was blocked for editing in much the same manner. It would be helpful if an admin could step in. --Malevious Userpage •Talk Page• Contributions 02:08, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * - User was previously blocked on February 19 for editing in the manner noted by User:Malevious (massively uploading images without needed information). If the action continues, another block should be warranted. AQu01rius (User &#149; Talk) 04:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Help wanted urgent
Over the past few months, significant problems have developed on a series of articles concerning disputes between Armenia and Azerbaijan. Several editors, many from that region, have become involved in edit wars and feuding. Dmcdevit, who had been keeping an eye on these articles, ultimately filed an arbitration case, which was accepted and is pending. See Requests for arbitration/Armenia-Azerbaijan and its evidence and workshop pages.

ArbCom has enacted a temporary injunction putting all participants in the case on 1RR parole pending resolution of the case. Dmcdevit had been using this as a basis for trying to restore some order on these articles, and Thatcher131 had also been keeping an eye on things. However, right now both of them are on wikibreaks.

I am receiving talkpage notes pretty much daily from parties claiming that someone else has violated the injuction or otherwise misbehaved. There have also been personal attacks and misuses of personal information. See my talk for some of the flavor. As the only arbitration clerk active right now, I have my hands full keeping an eye on the case pages themselves, plus would prefer to be able to respond neutrally to the parties' procedural questions rather than be in an enforcement mode at this time.

If an uninvolved administrator would kindly roll up his or her sleeves and help out with this situation, I will be very grateful and so will the good-faith editors of these articles. Thanks. Newyorkbrad 09:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The solution is locking all those articles and forget about the 1RR. It will do more good than harm, editors who are not involved are already scarred away contributing anyway. Fad (ix) 19:13, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Have you tried directing them to WP:AE (or WP:AN3 for the revert situations), with a specific note that there's an ArbCom 1RR injuction in place, much like the one that happened? I'd just tell them you're the clerk for the case, and therefore won't get involved in any disputes anyway. (I'll have a look though, guess this is what I signed up for right?) Seraphimblade Talk to me Please review me! 09:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the reply. AE is a good idea but is usually pretty backlogged (especially with Thatcher131 away, who's done a lot of the work there), and I'd rather have a little more continuity in the situation that AN/3RR can provide. Thanks! (P.S.: Your editor review is over now, update your sig!) Newyorkbrad 09:41, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * One thing that might make the whole mess a lot easier on enforcement, if the arbitrators could be talked into passing it, is that any content revert made by any party must contain "revert" or "rv" in the edit summary. A lot of those articles are getting edited a hundred times a minute, and the revert edit summaries look a whole lot like the normal mudslinging in any of them. (P.S. That was my editor review, not the RFA, which is still open, but RFA tends to be editor review to the tenth power anyway.) Seraphimblade Talk to me 10:00, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Good God, now there's an edit war going on the arbitration page itself! Does the 1RR apply to that? Seraphimblade Talk to me 10:12, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure that it does. We were told that 1RR applies to Armenia - Azerbaijan related articles, and I did not know that it applies to our arbcom case as well. Recently a person got blocked for trying to add a party to the arbcom case, while others were trying to remove it. I think it would be really helpful if the admins explained the procedure for adding new parties rather than blocking. I filed a formal motion for adding new parties after I was explained the procedure. Could you please look again into User:Atabek's block? Thanks in advance. Grandmaster 13:13, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I share the frustration with editing of the Armenia-Azerbaijan pages, where it seems like harsh treatment awaits Azerbaijani editors, such as myself and user Atabek, yet the Armenian users such as user:Artaxiad and user:Aivazovsky constantly get away easily – they either don't get blocked at all, or get blocked and immediately unblocked, or even tipped off by administrators to revert themselves in order to make them appear as if they didn't break the 1RR injunction.

Now for some reason Atabek is blocked, despite editing an ArbCom page, not an Armenia-Azerbaijan pages. This is fundamentally unfair and should not go on like this. --AdilBaguirov 17:53, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I have already complained about double standards of admin Dmcdevit who blocked me once and just warned user:Aivazovsky. It seems there is a trend among admins to support Armenians editors vs. Azeris.--Dacy69 19:02, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * That's your perception, it is just sad you think that way. Dmcdevit took a wikibreak reevaluating what he though of the community. Everything on Wikipedia doesn't revolve around the Armenian-Azeri issue as suprising as it might sound to you. If you really think that experienced administrators (in his case experience in arbitration) will bother checking what user is an Armenian and who is an Azeri before making a judgement on him/her then I am speachless. Fad (ix) 20:03, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Admins know what they do, I apologize for my mistakes, because I'm not 100% knowledgeable on the rules here, so I apologize and I do not want to get blocked so I try my best not to repeat my mistakes, when you guys get blocked, you report other users behavior while not talking about yours or even apologizing Adil you probably know what I'm saying when you called fadix a "fag" last time. Also assuming good faith is a great step to approach, regards. Artaxiad 23:40, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Your best bet is to post a complaint to the 3RR noticeboard with a link to the parole and links to the two reverts within 24 hours that constitute a violation. Alternatively you can post to arbitration enforcement.  I will watch there although I am on a semi-break.  I certainly can't watch all the pages related to this dispute to find violations (well, I could but I won't).  As for bias toward one side or the other, that's a laugh.  As if I could tell the difference.  Just don't edit war, please. Thatcher131 02:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Confirmed sockpuppets
Hi, jpgordon suggested I ask an admin to review this, a couple of confirmed sockpuppets. As a non-admin I can't block, obviously. Thanks. - Denny 15:09, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Err all indef-blocked, although a RFCU wasn't necessary. All of the three accounts were vandalism only, so it wouldn't matter whether they are the same guy or not. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Anonymous user keeps adding irrelevant information to article
keeps editing the articles Viet Kieu and Culture of Vietnam by adding irrelevant information. Attempts to communicate with user only resulted in hostile comments. Please prevent this user from editing these articles. DHN 02:17, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Those pages are on my watchlist now. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:35, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * And a warning about personal commentary and OR as well. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:41, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

legal danger?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan%27s_Law Assertions including identifiable individuals causing death with no citation of a source, and surely the legal proceedings involved have not been completed? Midgley 03:01, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Any negative assertion towards a living person can and should be removed right away. HighInBC(Need help? Ask me) 03:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Source it now or torch it. Mackensen (talk) 03:04, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The offending material was removed by Ptkfgs. I have deleted the 3 versions that contained it. A good idea to watchlist it, I think. It was created by Ombudsman, who is on probation for tendentious editing on medically-related articles, according to a note on his talk page. Tyrenius 03:44, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * ... and is currently editing tendentiously at Articles for deletion/Frequency of autism. MastCell 03:59, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * There was some more material I missed the first time around. You may wish to delete all but the most recent revision as well. &mdash;ptk✰fgs 04:04, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

WP:RFO sent re: deleted revisions. – Avi 05:26, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Miriam Rivera
Would someone mind stepping in over here? I am trying to remove a lot of unsourced information and apparent copyvio images (see history for my recommended text edits), and I am running into a very belligerent IP editor. I am going to take a day or so off, so I'm hoping someone would take a look and get the text to follow WP:RS. Thanks. Jokestress 04:35, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I left a message on Talk:Miriam Rivera. I'll keep an eye on this one and WP:RPA if necessary. The anon user's comments are inappropriate. Rhobite 05:48, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User subpage accusing famous musicians of rape and pedophilia
I stumbled across a very strange subpage, here; User:Zouavman Le Zouave/Deranged belonging to User:Zouavman Le Zouave. Its a faux "band" page, but attacks numerous real life people via linking musician names.

I'm not sure what needs doing about it, but I thought it wise to bring this to the attention of admins who are probably better positioned to deal with it. Thanks. - Deathrocker 04:44, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * At the very least, it reads more like a personal webpage and less like a page detailing Wikipedia contributions. --DavidShankBone 04:51, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * (ec) Apparently the page was deleted. I edited your post to remove the Libel information from this page too (although some may want to oversight this and that page just in case). – ReyBrujo 04:53, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Yeah the subpage was dealt with pretty quickly, good job. - Deathrocker 05:00, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Vandalism/Stalking/Sockpuppet/Harrassment Complaint
Original complaint: User 71.139.27.85, Griot, "stalking" articles by contributor since content dispute with Ralph Nader. Deleting sourced material. See User history and article history for details. Please assist. Thank you. 76.166.123.129 21:46, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * As a disinterested user, I see nothing wring with 72.139.27.85's recent editing history, although did only look at a few edits from the recent week. Are there any instances in particular of stalking articles that you could provide?  Kntrabssi 22:43, 11 March 2007 (UTC)

I would like to report, in addition to stalking/WP:HARASS, User Griot and 71.139.27.85 (confirmed by Otheus to be one and the same user, see 76.166.123.129 User talk) and now Mikesmash, continue to WP:HARASS, evidenced by user's repeated vandalism and reverts to vandalism on mine and others' Talk pages. Also, see evidence of WP:HARASS by User Griot/71.139.27.85 on articles which I have contributed to. User also deletes valuable, sourced material, that does not correspond to his POV (see Ralph Nader article history. His behavior is very disruptive and very harmful. Please assist. Thank you. 76.166.123.129 05:31, 14 March 2007 (UTC) 76.166.123.129 05:41, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

"Greatest" claims in several football articles.
I'd like some advice or a ruling on this situation. The main conversation relating to it is at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Football. Other conversations are on my talk page and on various talk pages of the articles concerned. They are Johan Cruijff, Pele, Diego Maradona, Puskas and a few others. Previously the articles have stated variously that the player is "the greatest", "one of the greatest", "widely regarded the greatest" or similar. I believe this contrary to WP:NPOV and WP:WEASEL. Those policies are specifically mention situations like this. Several editors have reverted my changes to reinsert the claims and an edit war has ensued. I fully realise I have broken 3RR. However as I believe I am following policy I've ignored the rule. Other editors have as well and one is using several (suspected) socks. Namely User:Marlon.sahetapy, who I believe is also User:Le Professeur70, User:PanteraNegro, User:Brasileiro1969 and User:Dr.Sauerkraut. This user has breached WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA I feel. See my talk page and User talk:Marlon.sahetapy. Stu  ’Bout ye!  14:15, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree that the statements should be removed if they aren't attributed to verifiable sources, but after a quick glance...
 * You edit warred to keep the statement in the George Best article. Then, when that didn't work, you edit warred to remove it from other articles. Then, after 10 days of edit warring, you come here with a complaint about other editors? --Onorem 14:34, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Yay! Everyone is the greatest! HighInBC(Need help? Ask me) 14:35, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Agree w/ Onorem. –  FayssalF  - Wiki me up ®  14:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I was inserting it in the George Best article for consistancy with the other articles it was included in. I didn't actually think it should be there in the first place. Stu   ’Bout ye!  14:52, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * By the way, my primary intention isn't to complain about other editors, it is to ascertain whether any of these claims should be used at all. Stu   ’Bout ye!  16:20, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

My thoughts about the phrase. Unless it is a direct quote, "one of the greatest" phrases should not be placed in articles. If a reliable secondary source has stated, "...is widely considered one of the greatest players of all time," then the article can state that they are "widely considered one of the greatest players of all time," attributing the statement to the source. Looking at the Diego Maradona article, I'd say that the statement should read that he was voted as the best player of the century by fans on the FIFA website, not that he is "regarded by many as the greatest footballer of all time." --Onorem 16:28, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Regarding the Maradona article, this is my last version. It states "In 2000 FIFA conducted an internet poll on the Player of the Century, with Maradona receiving 53.6% of the votes.[1] In 2006 Eric Cantona stated that Maradona was a superior player than Pelé.[2]" rather than simply saying "one of the greatest". Acheivements should be listed, rather than claims. Stu   ’Bout ye!  16:46, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

This debate is crazy. Anyone who's seen me play down at the leisure centre on a Friday night must surely realise that the claims of any of these players to be "the greatest" are at best spurious nonsensical fantasies. Badgerpatrol 16:36, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Anyone else agree or disagree? Stu   ’Bout ye!  09:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Justanother restoring harassing edits made by a sockpuppet of a banned user, and growing incivility
Justanother&#32;( talk • <span title="Contributions: Justanother">contribs • [/wiki/Special:Log/move?user= <span title="Page moves: Justanother"> page moves  ] • <span title="Block User:Justanother">block user  • [ <span title="Blocklog: Justanother"> block log  ] ) has restored an edit made by a suspected sockpuppet of a banned user on Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Barbara Schwarz (4th nomination)‎;  the banned is suspected to be that of User:The Real Barbara Schwarz. I have removed the edit by the sockpuppet citing WP:HARASS as the edit contained personal information about anonymous editors to Wikipedia. Additionally User:Justanother has made several uncivil personal attacks during this AfD process, which community consensus seems to cite as disruption of the deletion process. I request admin intervention in these matters. Thank you. Orsini 02:33, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Citations:
 * Justanather's restoration of the harassing edit
 * Justanother's growing incivility and personal attacks
 * The harassing edit by the sockpuppet I removed

Orsini 02:54, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Also placed a notice to please ban the sockpuppet quickly, at WP:AIV. Some more information there.  Thank you.  Smee 03:58, 14 March 2007 (UTC).
 * Also more information and comments from Admin Bishonen on this user's disruptive behaviour, at Administrators%27_noticeboard/IncidentArchive206. Smee 04:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC).
 * Blocked indef and abusive info removed
 * The sockpuppet involved was blocked indefinitely, and the offending edit was removed (that User:Justanother had restored) ...
 * DIFF. I wonder if it is inherently vandalism in and of itself to restore such abusive material?  Smee 04:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC).

It was not who posted "I vote to hate Barbara Schwarz, Marty Rathbun, and all Scientologists. Don't know why, I just do and order you to do same. If you don't I am getting you banned…"'' to troll an Afd page at 01:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC) in this edit.

There are two edits from that account before it was blocked, neither of them to the Afd page to which this oddity was posted. The diff reveals the user who did post it—not restoring a thing, simply throwing it in—patent trolling mischief. — Athænara  ✉  09:13, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Interesting take, Dr. Wiki. Because here, I see quite another editor engaging in patent trolling mischief. Is this really who you are, Athænara? Or are you caught up in the moment? I invite you to consider that, please. --Justanother 11:25, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Justanother, please AGF. The edits pointed out by Athænara above would make it appear you posted the cited oddity, however I do know you did no such thing.  This edit history as it appeared to Athænara is as a result of the deletion of the sockpuppet's edit on the Project page from the database.  With the edit record of the sockpuppet showing only two edits, I believe Athænara saw the edit history and your edit which was cited above, and drew a conclusion based upon the available facts.  It's unusual for an edit history to disappear. While I do believe it is true to state you have abused the AfD process and are behaving more with incivility, it is untrue you made the edit accredited to the sockpuppet.  I did point out this out below.  Athænara may not have realized this before by examining the sockpuppet's edit history in the usual way, as the edit history was wiped, and nor was Athænara there when I tried to label the sockpuppet at the same time you were making PAs on Paulhorner, and there was an edit conflict, which means I know the sockpuppet’s initial violation was not yours.  However, you did inappropriately restore that edit.  That said, I am not going to make false accusations against you, but neither will I sit back and see you accused of something you did not do due to highly unusual circumstances, however it is unfair to assume bad faith by Athænara since the circumstances here are very unusual, and the normally available evidence can be highly misleading.  Orsini 12:01, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thank you, Orsini, you are right that I did not make that edit but simply restored it. The funny thing is that I well know who ChrisO, a known "anti-Scientologist", is but even so did not catch that there was reference to his real name in that post so I doubt there was much harmful potential in it. But I agree, better safe than sorry, and had I caught that was what it was about, rather than seeming nonsense, I would not have restored it. If nonsense were grounds for removal of posts then I can think of any number which would disappear; perhaps even the bulk of talk page "discussion" (cynical joke). As to Athænara's trollish "diagnosis", my assessment stands, as does my question. --Justanother 12:37, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Indeed. When you show it that starkly with the DIFFs above, it does seem quite alarming.  Smee 09:24, 14 March 2007 (UTC).
 * Athaenara and Smee, please note that in fairness, this edit here  has been wiped out of the record.  This edit was made by the sockpuppet .  I presume this was done by an admin when the project page was unavailable for a short time, and it took the sockpuppet's edit log entry out of the record, along with the edit?   But it's clear to see what else was done by someone in restoring the edit I had deleted, and thank you for pointing this out.  Best, Orsini 09:36, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * PS: Please see here where the sockpuppet's third edit was removed.  Thanks John Reaves.  Best, Orsini 09:46, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * What else can be done about this pattern of abuse? Smee 09:47, 14 March 2007 (UTC).
 * There are suggestions in the motivation of a vandal, deny recognition, and what is a troll essays (note: not feeding the trolls) as well as some aspects of sock puppetry policy which apply here. An interesting quote from the latter: "The Arbitration Committee has ruled that, for the purpose of dispute resolution, when there is uncertainty whether a party is one user with sock puppets, or several users acting as meatpuppets, they may be treated as one individual."   — Æ.   ✉  10:38, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Please look at this editor
User:James McStub is new to editing and all the edits made are based on WP:EL and WP:SPAM. Here is what is concerning. All edits are exact. Ones I looked at are not spam or bad links. --Masterpedia 05:10, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I haven't looked at the links but because all the ones I saw were photobucket ones I can't see that they fall under WP:SPAM at all. Indeed some of them are provided as references... Viridae Talk 05:16, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Why are people using Photobucket images as sources in the first place? Take this revert of one of User:James McStub's edits, are people not aware that providing the magazine name and publication date are provided there is no need for the information to be available online? One Night In Hackney 303 05:18, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * This editor is also being discussed a couple of . . .... sections, postings, whatevers up. Carptrash 05:28, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * This was actually resolved a few posts up. User:James McStub was blocked by User:Jersey Devil for performing a malfunctioning automated task. – Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk 06:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Account used only for self-promotion
has apparently done nothing other than add mentions of the Time Machine Institute and its founder, all of which have been reverted or speedied. He/she is now using his/her user Talk page for... heaven knows what. Kla'quot 08:23, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I've blocked the user and protected the talk page.— Ryūlóng ( 竜龍 ) 08:30, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

vandalism by anonymous Telia user with shifting IPs (redux)
Earlier discussion on AN/I

- This has been a vandal-only account, and the vandalization has been rather insidious, with subtle errors introduced into a variety of articles before getting caught. Is 48 hours enough after dozens of vandalizations with maybe one or two legitimate edits of typos? The same editor has used at least four different IPs, each with dozens of vandalizations with the same MO, which have been blocked for a week. – TedFrank 09:54, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

JB196 back again
Today he's editing as SPmilkshakeGuru8, and is doing his usual trick of self promotion on Rob Zicari, Extreme Associates and Xtreme Pro Wrestling. A quick check of the recent history of those pages shows nothing except him spamming and being reverted then pages being protected, then as soon as the protection wears off it's back to square one with whatever new account or proxy IP he's using. He has a long term abuse report, so can anyone please semi-protect these pages for a reasonable amount of time? Thanks. One Night In Hackney 303 21:37, 11 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I've blocked indefinitely and added his sites to Shadowbot's blacklist. Shadow1  (talk) 21:57, 11 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You might want to undo the blacklisting, as the OWW site is used in many articles legitimately. One part of it is already blacklisted, but it would cause too much collateral damage to blacklist all of it. He's basically a long term problem who uses open proxies frequently, right now he's now back with his second IP since his user name block.  One Night In Hackney 303 22:00, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Could blacklist the Barber path, though. Guy (Help!) 23:28, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * It is blacklisted on meta. A week ago he was adding the link in this diff, now he's having to link to the front page as the columns/jonathanbarber path is blacklisted. One Night In Hackney 303 23:51, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * How many other pages use OWW as a source? beginning to wonder if it's benefits are outweighed by JB's tendency to use it as a spam target. Since he's using a combination of IP addresses and accounts... any chance that he's found new proxies to abuse? SirFozzie 16:57, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well there's a broader debate there, namely whether a wrestling fansite is a credible, reliable source for an encyclopedia in the first place. Simply having a domain name and being reasonably well known doesn't change the fact it's not really any different to a geocities or tripod site in terms of reliability. He's been using open proxies for a while now, but I post them all for checking on the open proxies Wikiproject for checking and blocking.  One Night In Hackney 303 22:50, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. At this point, we might want to look at the fact that OWW may just not qualify as a valid WP:EL. If we're agreed that it doesn't, then we may want to fully blacklist it. SirFozzie 23:37, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Looks like somebody has been bold. One Night In Hackney 303 21:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Hopefully they remove JB's columns from the site, that would allow us to take OWW out of the spamfilter and make it a LOT harder for him to spam links to his articles SirFozzie 16:46, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Reporting Aksi great
I am reporting Aksi great for his abuse of power as an administrator. It all started on a Vote in regards to the Category:Tamil_Americans here. I had noticed that both user accounts of Sarvagnya and Gnanapiti were used in this voting process. These two users have been confirmed by another administrator by the name of Dmcdevit that they were both the same user here. I then posted a comment on the vote page about these two users here that these two user accounts were used to vote here. After posting that, I received a warning to get blocked by Aksi great here. Furthermore, Aksi great has went to the extent to accuse me of having three sockpuppets here, here, and here without any userchecks for proof against me.

Background
Sarvagnya has been a trouble maker for some time now pushing his POV on wikipedia. I have reported him on numerous accounts of misbehavior, vandalism, trolling, and confirmed sockpuppeting here in which nothing has been resolved. That report also talked about the sockpuppet issue of Sarvagnya/Gnanapiti. Sadly, these user accounts have another administrator Blnguyen who backs them up biasedly. When I reported them, instead of Blnguyen dealing with the issue like a responsible administrator, he started picking on me about images I have posted on my page in which I have respectfully replied him and took care of the issue. In the end, nothing was resolved, and Blnguyen did not do a thing about my report. I have placed a report on Blnguyen in the past for his abuse this favoritism towards certain users here. And, once again, nothing happened.


 * Comment interfere – The second RFCU also done by Dmcdevit cleared them of being in the same physical location. Dmcdevit then unblocked them himself. Stop refusing to see what has already been presented to you over and over. As for the images, I had already resolved them the day before Sarvagnya and you started arguing on ANI about the already-resolved imaged, and I only told you guys to stop beating a dead horse....as is happening again now. And readers, please do note Sarvagnya's block log and who the admin was that blocked him....It was me. - Blnguyen  (bananabucket) 02:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Other interfere - and note who filed the original RFCU. It was me. Baka man  02:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

This problem goes even further when I was having problems with ARYAN818 in which I have reported his incivil and intollerant behavior towards other ethnic groups here. After this user was blocked here. After that, I have received a rather odd message from Bakasuprman here about how the Hindu editors on Wikipedia were upset that ARYAN818 was blocked.

Conclusion
It seems that there are a group of editors with the backing of a couple of administrators who are working together in regards to POV pushing using Wikipedia as their propoganda tool. I am being ganged up on by these particular editors for opposing their POV. This is really uncalled for and un-democratic with all this bias and bullying going on by certain administrators. I respectfully request for this matter to be looked into and my name be taken off those sockpuppet templates posted by Aksi great. Thank you. Wiki Raja 22:57, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm not quite sure I see what the problem is. At the very least, Aksi great should file a request for checkuser if he suspects sockpuppetry, but I can't really see where anyone did anything wrong. ARYAN818 was given plenty of time to find a new username, and regardless of how it's used in one part of the world, it would still be a valid username block due to its other uses. --Core desat  23:14, 11 March 2007 (UTC)
 * In regards to ARYAN818, he has also been engaged in a lot of incivility and trolling towards other users. Not to mention intollerance of other people's ethnic and religious backgrounds. As far as his name is concerned, that wasn't the issue with me unlike the others. Sorry to put all this in for you to read, but there are a group of biased editors backed by similar administrators who are just basically ganging up on me since ARYAN818 was blocked. Also, all of this is due to me disagreeing with their POV and voicing it. But, apart from all that commotion, Aksi great should not jump the gun and just slap my name on a sockpuppet template without proper confirmation. Don't you think that is a little irrational on his part as an administrator? Wiki Raja 00:09, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I think I spoke to soon. This group has eyes everywhere. Take a look at this post titled Ani report by Wikiraja. Wiki Raja 00:13, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't have the time to examine this at the moment, but the instructions for this page very clearly instruct you to notify someone on their talk page if you post about them on AN/I. Rama notifying Aksi that you started a thread on him/her is just cleaning up after your mistake.  Don't imagine conspiracies that aren't there, please.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  00:34, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The suspected sockpuppet case(here) filed by, has just now been closed with the conclusion "All named accounts have been blocked as sockpuppets of User:Wiki Raja". - KNM Talk 01:11, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * That is an irrelevant conclusion having done no usercheck on me and only basing this on suspicion. Wiki Raja 03:32, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * What? I don't understand this. What? I don't understand... What? I said I don't understand... What? There is nothing wrong... What? I said there is nothing wrong... What? There is nothing wrong in informing Aksi great that there is a discussion/complaint about him on ANI. There is no conspiracy... What? There is no conspiracy... What? There is no conspiracy against Wiki Raja or any other user on Wikipedia. Nobody is trying to gang up on anybody. What? Let's just build... What? Let's just build... What? I said let's just build an encyclopedia please. Rama's arrow  05:31, 12 March 2007 (UTC)


 * What the heck? Maybe you need to relax. Harassing me with a bunch of Whats would not solve anything. Come back and reply when you are ok. Wiki Raja 05:37, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * What? Rama's arrow  15:24, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * cant..er.. 'can't' Sarvagnya 05:43, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * What are you doing now? Stalking me? Wiki Raja 19:52, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * FYI: This was a simple mistake already taken care of here. So stop stalking me. Wiki Raja
 * Then again you know a couple things about stalking yourself., on account of a troll's dirty work. Baka man  02:19, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Patience and Modesty: User:Rama's Arrow response need modesty, being an Admin should know how to be patience, I appreciate his huge contribution to wikipedia and personally admire how much he is dedicated and how much knowledge this guy has but his respone to User:Wiki Raja is totally unacceptable from such as great admin and contributor. “To know oneself is to study oneself in action with another person.”John Paul 04:35, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * What? As admins are routinely assailed by baseless allegations from paranoid editors like Wiki Raja, I find it necessary to have a sense of humor. Wiki Raja's paranoia is self-evident when he sees a "group with eyes everywhere" after (a) he himself makes an ANI report, which almost everyone on WP can and prolly will see and (b) it was necessary to let Aksi great know about this discussion. There is nothing "totally unacceptable" about my response - the statement only rebuffs Wiki Raja's paranoia and I don't accuse him of anything but paranoia. "Patience" and "Modesty" are not ways to deal with paranoia. And in reference to where the "What?" catchphrase comes from, perhaps you'd like to visit the page Stone Cold Steve Austin. Sometimes a forceful response early on helps avoid blocking down the line. Rama's arrow  15:08, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Reply by Aksi - I don't know what all this fuss is all about. Dravidian Warrior and Tamilguy07 were not blocked by me. They were blocked by Nichalp. The only editor I blocked was Jhnnyrj. I put up a suspected sock template. Nowhere does it say that the sockpuppetry has been confirmed. It is within my powers to suspect some account for sockpuppetry and block them. I have not filed a RFCU as the vote was not over yet. As per the rules of RFCU a request must only be filed after the vote is over. - Aksi_great (talk) 11:35, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * So, when does this vote end? Wiki Raja 19:24, 12 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Err it's not a vote. =Nichalp   «Talk»=  13:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't think they would CU it anyway, since the closing admin would just ignore the SPA commentary, whether it is a sock or a meatpuppet in a different location. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

This allegation of abuse is baseless. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 02:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Stalking, Harassment and personal attacks from User:Dahn (new try)
I would like to report the inappropriate behavior of User:Dahn. There was a complaint about him on March 12, 2007 here and User:Khoikhoi banned the editor who initiated it and then dismissed the complaint. I am troubled because it was precisely User:Khoikhoi who assisted User:Dahn in reverting in order not to break the 3RR. The attitude of User:Dahn towards other editors is becoming intolerable. Could some Admins (not User:Khoikhoi please) look into this issue. Thanks. Icar 13:58, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Dahn admits watching my page here. I do not follow his changes, while he immediately reverts all my changes (except when he fears the 3RR). I would like to ask an Admin (not User:Khoikhoi please) to check also whether User:HIZKIAH was rightfully banned or not.Icar 14:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Unfortunately the link I provided became obsolete since the previous complaint disspeared. I updated the link documenting my complaint here. Thank you for your assistance. Icar 11:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Another proof that User:Dahn stalks me. He tries now to intimidate me (directly and through his associates) even about complaining. Icar 11:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, let's see. This person filed or participated in about three groundless complaints against me and user Khoikhoi in the past two days, and filed this one after being told that it constituted disruption.
 * All the articles he claims I intervened in are ones I contributed to substantially, and in virtually all I have contributed first or among the first. Checking his edit history will in fact reveal that most his contributions are removing things from texts I authored (breaking several wikipedia rules in the process). In fact, this dispute began because of his "revision" here (the massive removal of sourced information he disagrees with qualifies under simple vandalism). Note his justifications in erasing content: "I willingly eliminated only some vague remarks, that I found boring"; "no place for stalinist POV pushing here".
 * This person claims, ad nauseam, that I have broken the policy defined under Harassment.
 * Let him or her read the policy and tell me which point of it I have broken and where. Because, as he well knows by now, neither making constructive edits in articles that I contributed to before he did, nor checking out his edit history constitute stalking. In fact, as proof that this person is manipulating information, his at least one of the diffs he provided above proves that he follows my edit history (and his past trolling on my talk page shows that he has/had my talk page on his watchlist as well). To my mind, this person is mudslinging me, making many repetitive and fast-pace accusations that he cannot possibly prove, and that he knows to be untrue, in the hope that I will get too tired to answer them. It is exhausting, and, as all things this person has done ever since coming to wikipedia in the first place, highly disruptive. It goes hand in hand with his repeated trolling, for which he was already blocked once.
 * Furthermore, this person claims that the user he associated with in a previous complaint, who was revealed to be a sockpuppet of banned User:Bonaparte (verified by checkuser), was eliminated by Khoikhoi after the latter conspired with me etc. When he was told by other admins and editors not to disrupt any further, when several editors pointed out that his edits in articles were reducing the quality of the project (by removing biographical data, balnking sources, and manipulating sheer facts according to his POV), he came here and reopened the same flimsy "case" against me (ironically, under the same header chosen by Bonaparte's sockpuppet). As I was posting here, he attempted to begin separate inflammatory threads on two separate pages ( and ). Dahn 11:52, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * And, just so that admins know what the nature of Icar's discussions with or about me is. Icar has a tradition of calling me names, repeatedly describing me as "a pest", "a disruptive editor", "a Stalinist", and comparing me to persecutors of the 1950s and himself to a victim (see this, this, and this).


 * I have complained about this on Wikiquette alerts (please make note of what replies I received there).


 * In addition, he has argued that I have "hatred of all things Romanian", and, more recently, that I am a "(Communist) Party official". Inflammatory and grotesque comparisons between me and Stalin are still in abundence:, - when I pointed out to him (for the third time) that political epithets are infringements of WP:NPA, he repeated the allegation and added an inflammatory comment on my supposed sexuality. Dahn 12:41, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Typical inflammatory invention of User:Dahn: it was he who brought up the "sexuality" topic, I dismissed it as irrelevant, now he accuses me of making suppositions. Totally dishonest. Icar 13:48, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

The oppinion of other editors about User:Dahn

 * "My conflict with User:Dahn is unfortunately systematic, occurring on practically all articles where we edited together. My basic problem is that once User:Dahn feels my edits are not *perfectly* in line with his POV, he reverts entire posts wholesale.".
 * "As you may have noted, I repeatedly warned Dahn against disruptive behaviour. His reaction was – unfortunately – typical, simply erasing my edits.".
 * "That article is almost a pain to contribute to and in my opinion you're carrying the biggest part of the guilt (though I admit you are the autor of the largest part of the content)."
 * "I'd like to ask you to take a little more care to avoid the appearance of asserting ownership of articles"
 * "Why this self-righteous person is allowed to continue with such impunity and continue to threaten and bully other people is beyond my understanding."

User:Dahn removes all my messages from his talk page with a derogatory comment:, , ,. His comments above about being sole/main contributor to the articles I happen to modify is a clear sign of WP:OWN. Icar 13:48, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, not to help this poor excuse for a debate degenerate further, but:
 * one would have to ask about factual rule-breaking, not about what and why the same group of users like to discuss about me, especially when that group is the same one alleging stuff about me on the wikiquette page, and the same group urged on by manifestos such as and  (manifestos which have led to a warning for stalking). Three of the "third-party users" invoked here have actually been involved in every single groundless initiative against me (at least one of those manifestos calls for me be singled out and marginalized on wikipedia through a collective effort). Also note that one of them was warned after telling me to "fuck off" in a related discussion, and a newer battle cry here.
 * the only actual third-party source quoted by Icar above specifically indicates that the issue of "ownership" was only in relation to another disruptive editor and his disruptive edits.
 * what actual third-party sources say can be found in these posts, all of them from established and reliable editors:, , (and ), ,  (and ).
 * the diffs provided from my talk page by Icar can only indicate that he was in breach of harassment policies, by posting and reposting false warnings. Dahn 14:13, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

I really need input from neutral editors, thank you Icar 14:33, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Abusive behavior by User:SlimVirgin
I am going to briefly provide the context for my request, since the matter is complicated, and User:SlimVirgin is bound to attempt to put her own spin on it. There are two editors, User:Dking and User:Cberlet, who in my view have been consistently editing against policy by attempting to dominate the content of a number of articles in violation of WP:OWN, by excessive self-citing in violation of COI, and a pattern of personal attacks. There are also WP:BLP issues involved, since these two are published authors who specialize in "attack articles" on living persons. This is presently before the ArbCom and I am not asking for intervention on this particular problem.

However, SlimVirgin has been acting as a partisan on behalf of these two, bullying and threatening anyone who disputes their edits. I won't list the entire history of these incidents, only the most recent. On March 11 I posted four questions on the talk page of "Political views of Lyndon LaRouche," asking SlimVirgin to explain her positions. I found her answers to be evasive, particularly when she accused me of "promoting LaRouche," and I asked for clarification here. She refused to respond, and archived the page to hide the discussion (diff). I restored the page, asking her to please edit in a collegial manner (diff.) Her response was to threaten to ban me (diff,) saying that I was "causing disruption." I would like to ask that some administrators intervene. She should be reminded of WP:CIVIL, and admonished not to routinely ban people who disagree with her, as it appears to me that she does, by simply branding them as "troublemakers." --Tsunami Butler 14:45, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, I don't see any of those actions in any of the links you provide. Bastiq ▼ e demandez 17:38, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Tsunami Butler seems to be a follower of Lyndon LaRouche and is exhausting people's patience with his/her constant attempts either to talk LaRouche up or to play down criticism of him; incessant reverting; long pointless questions on talk; wikilawyering; baiting; and attempts to tie people up with mediation. Dennis King has written a biography of LaRouche that is used as a reference book by all interested researchers and journalists, and Chip Berlet is a professional researcher in the area of political cults, conspiracism, and LaRouche in particular. They are therefore experts, which is why Tsunami, and the LaRouche movement in general, is so hostile toward them. I won't respond to the other points in detail, except to note that when I "archived the page to hide the discussion," I was in fact archiving threads that were two years old; the discussion Tsunami is referring to is still there.
 * Any block will be discussed in advance with the ArbCom, which is what we usually do with LaRouche-related issues. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 17:58, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * After reviewing this case the reporting user has in fact been engaging in disruption. No policy violations, so this discussion is going to be resolved. I will say this to SV however regarding this final warning. Comments such as "and I've had enough" and "stop wasting people's time" make warnings sound needlessly hostile. For future purposes please just give the strait facts about warnings without needless commentary. Thank you.--Jersey Devil 18:24, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I must confess that I find it difficult to believe that SlimVirgin simply had the urge to archive the talk page at the point where I was attempting, with no cooperation from her, to ascertain her reasons for some of her actions. She deleted material that was sourced to Public Information Research, but was vague about her rationale. I asked her three times to explain: the first time diff, question #2 she evaded the question. The second time diff, question #4 she pretended that she thought I was speaking of a different organization. The third time diff, question #4 she didn't respond at all, but simply blanked the page and archived it. These are legitimate questions, related to disputes about the suitability of sources under WP:BLP, and I don't see how SlimVirgin's responses, or non-responses, can be seen as anything other than evasion. Her charges of wikilawyering and baiting are a red herring, as is the inevitable Poisoning the well ("Tsunami Butler seems to be a follower of Lyndon LaRouche,") and her deadpan dismissal of any issues concerning the excessive self-citing of Dking and Cberlet is a bluff. --Tsunami Butler 22:44, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Archiving material from September 2006 is hardly the same as blanking the page. No current discussions were removed. -Will Beback · † · 23:11, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * But, of course, the questions were evaded. --Tsunami Butler 23:14, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Let's see, you say of another editor's comments: "This is baloney, and self-serving baloney as well." Then after that editor archives old, dormant discussions you revert the archiving with accusatory edit summary: "(Is this what you call collegial editing?)" That appears to me to be antagonistic behavior. -Will Beback · † · 23:23, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Tsunami was responding to the accusation by SlimVirgin that she was "promoting LaRouche," clearly setting up the pretext for a ban. An editor who leaves such an accusation unchallenged, does so at his peril. --NathanDW 02:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia has a history of editors (or perhaps just one editor with many accounts) promoting LaRouche. We've even seen accounts that claim to have no special interest in that cause turn out to be single purpose accounts devoted to it. In this instance the charge that Tsunami Butler is an account dedicated to promoting LaRouche is borne out by the evidence. -Will Beback · † · 02:57, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Musical Linguist 03:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * However, as per Jersey Devil, SV comments to Tsunami were needlessly hostile which is also an issue here. MetsFan76 03:11, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia has numerous well-reasoned policies that are designed to make it useful and credible as an information source, beginning with WP:NPOV. There are also policies that are intended to prevent abuse, such as WP:BLP and WP:COI. From what I have seen, however, there is a peculiar state of affairs where articles pertaining to Lyndon LaRouche are exempt from all these policies. There seems to be some sort of special license to self-cite that has been given to Chip Berlet in his guise of Cberlet, and seems to have now been extended to Dennis King as Dking. The idea that "Wikipedia is not a soapbox" goes out the window here. WP:FRINGE is also inapplicable, it seems. I have reviewed some of the history of these articles, which is voluminous, and a pattern appears: whenever an editor comes along and says, "Hey, there seem to be policy violations here," there is a Rapid Response Team of SlimVirgin and Will Beback that immediately brands that editor a LaRouche supporter, and the threats and harassment commence, until the dissenting editor gives up or is banned. This can happen to editors with the best of neutral credentials – take a look at how User:Pascal.Tesson was treated at Talk:Lyndon_LaRouche/archive13. I have tried to raise these issues responsibly and appropriately through the various noticeboards, and for my trouble, I am accused of "promoting LaRouche" and judging from what I have seen, SlimVirgin will soon contrive an excuse to ban me, and Will Beback will applaud the action. --Tsunami Butler 14:36, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

BhaiSaab and His_excellency
They've been evading their bans again using their IP range. See User:72.88.162.57 and the associated links. I think we might as well community ban them, since they clearly are just going to do whatever they like to promote their agenda. Blnguyen (bananabucket) 05:45, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * A phrase containing the words "door" and "don't let" comes to mind immediately. - Merzbow 07:33, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * As someone who have had enough with both, I support the ban. ←Humus sapiens ну? 09:55, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I strongly endorse a community ban on these guys (see Requests for checkuser/Case/BhaiSaab, Requests for checkuser/Case/MinaretDk). Rama's arrow  14:48, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * What do those results have to do with BhaiSaab? 72.88.159.80 16:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Blnguyen can't figure out which one it is so he figures he might as well ax both. Typical. 72.88.159.80 16:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * What? Rama's arrow  16:20, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * You read English perfectly well. What's so confusing?
 * What? Rama's arrow  16:41, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Perhaps I am assuming good faith naïvely but having known "both" of the editors being discussed here and having known their editing/communicating patterns and having reviewed how this anon has addressed themself to others I would estimate that he is User:His excellency and not User:BhaiSaab. I never saw User:BhaiSaab express himself with the same level of incivility that HE does so unless it is one person who's rather adept at playing Doctor Jekyl and Mister Hyde I see two separate individuals at play here. This anon strikes me more as HE than BhaiSaab. 16:30, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I didn't know HE, but I did know BhaiSaab, and his edits were characterised by edit warring, canvassing, arguing and obsessing over other people's Jewishness, but NEVER incivility. I'll give him that much. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 16:37, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Proposals for community bans used to go on WP:ANI but now go on the Community noticeboard per policy. The idea of the change is that bans are not a matter for admins specifically but for as broad a section of the community as possible. Please move this proposal there. Bishonen | talk 17:47, 14 March 2007 (UTC).

I never met BhaiSaab, but I do know His_excellency. He's probably the worst personal attacker ever allowed to edit Wikipedia, and has attacked nearly every ethnic and religious group on earth at one point or another. I say allowed because he's already been indefinitely banned twice by Tom Harrison and Jeffrey O. Gustafson, then blocked for a year by Tawker, but each time was unblocked by Bishonen or by someone she'd asked to unblock him. Then Bishonen helped him in his arbitration case. For this, some arbitrators wanted to "commend" her. His_excellency was supposed to be banned for a year, but some arbitrators said this was too long, so made it only four months. He got another two months for making more attacks on Jews during the case. Since his ban, he's returned with a bunch of sock puppets to attack Hindus as "cow-worshipers" and "dung-eaters," and now I guess to stalk people and harass them. I wonder if the people who helped him stay around are still proud of what they did. His_excellency should definitely be banned indefinitely.HEWatch 19:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Discussion moved to WP:CN Rama's arrow  19:16, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Out of control DRV alert
There's a serious problem over at the Zorpia DRV. I've already semi-protected that entire log page due to overwhelming SPA activity, and now some established users (namely ) are getting in on the action. Angrykeyboarder is attempting to turn the DRV into a soapbox against the current notability guidelines for websites, and pretty much using up every excuse detailed in WP:ATA in an incivil manner. This DRV is probably going to have to be restarted, but I can't do it myself if it's done at all. --Core desat  08:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Looks like users from Zorpia (which is on the spam blacklist) are also bothering various admins and editors involved in either the AFD or the current DRV:, , , pretty much all of Mailer diablo's current user talk page. --Core desat  08:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Link above updated since I've moved the discussion to a sub-page. I don't feel that this is totally out of control yet, but it could use an uninvolved admin that is good at explaining existing policy and has patience and time.  GRBerry 19:11, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Action on sock/meatpuppet confirmed by Checkuser
and both contribute to controversial parapsychology articles from a similar POV, and have tag-teamed to exceed 3RR. A checkuser request was filed which came back confirmed. After the checkuser was filed, Martinphi left this explanation, claiming that they are two different people who share the same computer, discuss their edits, edit the same articles, and have similar views, and that he urged Myriam Tobias to create an account because of their shared interest. Accepting this explanation at face value, it would still be a case of meatpuppetry to game the system and violate 3RR by an editor (Martinphi) who's been around long enough to know better. How should this situation be handled? Should either account be tagged? Martinphi's explanation suggests he doesn't see anything wrong with the two of them editing in such a fashion. I'm asking for an admin with a few minutes of spare time to help sort this out. Thanks. MastCell 16:51, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Personal attack on Shtove

 * I received this abuse on my talk page:
 * It probably relates to this edit by Wolfetone1000, which is spoof verging on libel in a BLP article:
 * In response, I'd put this message on the editor's page:
 * I have no problem leaving the abuse on my talk page - but could someone add one of those "Message left by ..." tags, and advise if the editor needs blocking?--Shtove 17:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Blocked indef and I've reverted his edits to your user and talk pages. I'm amazed he wasn't blocked sooner, looking at the contribs.  It was all vandalism and trolling user pages.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  17:33, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Oh, and since this person was such a blatant vandal, rather than leaving a message on his talk page asking that he should be blocked, you should add future users like that to WP:AIV and an administrator will take care of it. — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  17:35, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Understood. Hadn't even spotted the florid stuff on my user page! Thanks.--Shtove 18:18, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Verdict sock on Wikimedia Commons
I don't have an account on Wikimedia but it appears that the abusive sockpuppeteer, does. Could someone please block Flash Fusion on Wikimedia and remove all the contributions of this long-time abusive vandal? Thanks. --Yamla 18:08, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Have you tried asking at Commons:Commons:Administrators' noticeboard? —Quarl (talk) 2007-03-14 18:40Z 


 * No, will do. Thanks.  --Yamla 19:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Bolzano talk page
IMHO User:Taalo's way of communication is a problem. After protection of the page Bolzano we have been discussing the issue (Talk:Bolzano), but Taalo is continuously breaking most simple rules of politeness. I have been trying to react by deleting offensive contributions, instead of reacting offensively and disruptively myself. Taalo has now reverted even these edits, starting a kind of edit war even on a talk page. I would just like to have a productive discussion, but I cannot continue this way. Please look at Taalo's last contributions on that page. We have been occupied by useless warring, please help stop it. – PhJ 19:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * That's what you get from someone who went to the University of Michigan... (semi-)kidding aside though, diffs would be helpful here.--Isotope23 19:13, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Bastich. :P This user is blanking edits on talk pages after already a warning from an Admin.  See comment by Wknight94 here .  Also, see posting here on his talk page: .  This User PhJ has also been crying wolf (vandalism) previous to this: .  I.e., anything he dislikes he goes crying to the noticeboards (which IMHO is abuse in itself).  See his past claim of vandalism that was dismissed .  Bottom line, it is not up to this user to decide saying hey ladin dude is a personal attack (which it definitely was not).  There is some irony, because actually with all the blanking PhJ does, he is asking himself for some time off..hah. Anyway, Go blue. :P Taalo 19:37, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * These three diffs should be enough:, , – PhJ 06:16, 14 March 2007 (UTC) (sorry, forgot to sign)
 * enough for what? look, maybe be concerned with your own communication and politeness. It isn't so black-and-white like you try to make it, that you are the good guy and I'm the bad guy. Could it be even slightly possible that since you are not a native English speaker, that you may take things like "hey ladin dude" as offensive, when they are actually friendly?  Could it be a bit possible that you are instigating edit wars by doing things which are against wikipedia policies? Taalo 23:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * There are circumstances where anything but addressing one by proper name (or user name, respectively) can be felt as an offense. Obviously Emes didn't like it ("This was a personal attack"). I woudln't like to be called even friend by you either, and you should know that. So, I think, it is now up to you to remove these edits, I won't anymore. – PhJ 06:16, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * ohkayyyy o_O  Listen, the bottom line is that you can't go around and censor other's edits, full stop.  Try and muster an apology for doing that if you can.  If you have such problems that even hearing friend gets your knickers in a bind.. well I don't think anyone here can help you. Lets just agree to disagree, and go about our own way. Taalo 08:50, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree - with your last sentence. So just let's stop this kind of debate and let's talk about improving the pages, as far as it is possible. – PhJ 12:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * PhJ: hear, hear. Taalo 17:46, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

I think that there are obviously a ton of problems relating to this issue, and because of that both of you (and everyone else involved) needs to be extra careful to not to do anything which could be interpreted as a personal attack, even if it was not meant to be one, and to follow all of the appropriate policies and guidelines. Blanking talk pages or selectively filtering them is not acceptable under any circumstances barring extreme and obvious cases. — M ETS 501 (talk) 20:53, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree with Mets501 here. Both PhJ and Taalo have been incorrect, and I don't feel this needs to be elevated so high. Taalo needs to calm down and not take things so personally (and take care in the words he uses), however, PhJ has chosen to blatanly violate wiki rules while in the same breath attempt to report Taalo on the admin boards. PhJ blanked out comments on a talk page that he disagreed with (and were not necessarily a personal attack). Mets501 has stated this well, gentlemen. Both of you need to be careful with what you say or do so that it is not construed as a personal attack. PhJ - you need to understand that you clearly violate wiki policy by removing someone else's words from a talk page that you, yourself, deem inappropriate without the actions of an admin. This can be construed as vandalism or otherwise. So next time you disagree, state it on the talk page, attempt to communicate offline with Taalo (or on his talk page), or get the attention of an admin BEFORE you attempt to remove comments and violate wiki rules yourself. And for God's sake, Taalo - calm down and let this process breathe and we'll reach a more neutral and viable solution for all! :) Rarelibra 17:54, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Oi, why am only I being asked to calm down? :P I'm quite calm actually, however I can't just be quiet when my posts are deleted/edited/moved and I'm being declared problematic or anti-German. o_O This week I: reverted PhJ's edits, said hey ladin dude to Martin, and reverted PhJ's "editing" of Bolzano talk.  Bad Taalo, bad! :}  Anyway, yes, please.. neutral/fair solution.  All I've wanted from the beginning.  later... Taalo 22:57, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. Looking back at my message to Emes last Fall, I feel quite bad I stated things in such a way (that he should seek a mental professional).  At the time I was just amazed how much anger he was displaying (beyond his threat to leave en.wikipedia).  But, I'm being censored because I say "By (sic) God"?  Are there rules against blasphemy, as PhJ puts it? o_O Regardless, the selective filtering he is doing is completely out of line and really makes this feel like some sort of war.  Doing something like this  is like a wiki-censorship service? :-) Taalo 21:26, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I have to agree that User:Taalo's behaviour is quite problematic and the tone does not comply with Wikiquette or anything else for that matter. Users who are not the same opinion are accused of POVs, being "German" or whatever, every opposing comment gets inundated with a flood of comments that anyone reading this looses interest sooner or later. At the moment the user seems quite interested in pushing through a strange latter-day Italo-nationalism on issues concerning South Tyrol, Trentino-South Tyrol, Bolzano, Merano, etc. Quite unfortunate IMO. My comments to this user's behaviour will probably provoke another flood of comments from User:Taalo, something that is to be expected. Wikiquette alerts have been registered previously, so far to no avail. I can only hope this user will mature and respect other opinions some day. sincerely Gryffindor  15:19, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Laughable. You are by no means impartial in this debate, and popping your head into this particular discussion is something I find quite reprehensible.  It was you who initiated this whole argument by forcing some strange latter-day nationalist push for names which are not even common English usage.  You moved a page unilaterally and without consensus.  A poll was done after the fact and no consensus was found to move the page back to the common English usage, so it got stuck with your odd POV for all this time.  This was flat out wrong, and you know it (and should know it as an Admin).  What really gets me is you do this and never apologize or feel you did anything at all wrong (even though this debate now of almost two years clearly shows you initiated something very wrong, that has in the end hurt many feelings).  You have user PhJ here who also breaks protocol by going through and selectively editing out user comments.  Instead of either of you taking any responsibility what-so-ever for both of your actions, you make personal attacks on me: the one who called you both out incidentally. hmm.  So where is the maturity?  Where is the respect?  At least I have the courage to make apologies when I find I did something wrong.  I have both Italian and German heritage, and have roots in this region back to Roman times.  I've only wanted a fair solution, it is you who push some strange German POV.  Being I AM German, I have every right to self-criticize and I will certainly not have someone such as you telling me what to do.  I have been quite saddened at the German group-think, and I have every right to be! Now, as I've told PhJ, I've really had my fill of you all.  As far as I'm concerned, that neither of you have the capability to see anything wrong in what you do, and simply try to make this so black and white that I'm bad and you guys are good, just accents this giant waste of time.  But you know what, my field is Engineering, from your user page I see yours is Politics.  So, please, just go along your own way. Taalo 17:22, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Lastly. This discussion was about reverting edits on Bolzano's talk page.  Edits which were against Wikipedia policy by selectively editing out other editor's sentences.  A mature approach might be for both PhJ and Gryffindor to stick to this topic, without trying to divert this into a referendum against me (i.e. take responsibility for your own actions). Taalo 17:31, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

I asked Taalo to remove his "message" to me (Talk:Bolzano), which does not belong on that page because it is disruptive for other users who just want to discuss the Bolzano article. I ask hereby for approval by an admin to delete it myself (as I'd be free to do it on my talk page, where it actually belongs). – PhJ 20:39, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * o_O Taalo 22:53, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Talk:Essjay controversy & User:QuackGuru
has been heavily editing/commenting on the Essjay controversy talk page, and it's becoming a bit disruptive, as pointed out to him by multiple people. could some admins take a look into this? it's been everything from practically waging war on the article (which he spilled over into other articles) over whether Wales or Sanger is founder of WP, to formatting, to sourcing, to... well, everything. We have tried to work with him and even offered compromise but it seems to be going nowhere, and appears to be the last lingering drama on this entire otherwise stablized/correctly sourced/written/now NPOV mess. I would appreciate it if some admins could have a word with him, as it's disruptive to the other editors there. thank you. - Denny 21:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * This comment might be what is inciting him... - Denny 21:52, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Bad advice can do a lot of damage. HighInBC(Need help? Ask me) 21:54, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Interesting. He's made his userpage into a version of the article, presumably the one he keeps trying to force on everyone else. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 21:55, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Even more interesting, he just blanked it... Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 21:56, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * He was warned earlier about a 3rr vio. Gwen Gale 21:57, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I've participated (very minimally) in the talk page, so I'm recusing myself, but I must agree with Denny about this user. To be honest, the whole endeavor has smelled fishy to me. and several others (such as Denny) have done an admirable job at attempting to appease all of QG's numerous whimsical problems with the article, but it's been incredibly burdensome so far. I can't call it outright disruption, though. — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  22:01, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

So far, seven editors have made or endorsed statements about QuackGuru which use the term disruption. Gwen Gale 22:16, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I suspect that User:HighInBC has hit the nail on the head. I couldn't find anything specific in WP:USER to press the issue of the copy of the article on User:QuackGuru's userpage, though I did leave him a message about how to create a sandbox. Risker 22:28, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * This is really getting out of hand. I've struck my earlier comment that I can't call it disruption, because I can.  It is.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  20:09, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

This is getting out of hand when other editors make abnormal remarks towards me.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Essjay_controversy&diff=next&oldid=115144987

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk%3AEssjay_controversy&diff=115142598&oldid=115142331

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Essjay_controversy&diff=next&oldid=115143831

This in not fair. Q uack   G uru    TALK 20:39, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I stand by my edits to QuackGuru. Moreover, given QuackGuru's disruption, I personally find both his signature and username exacerbating to it. Gwen Gale 21:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Personal Attacks by 66.93.144.171
Both parties agree to cool off a bit, and go their separate ways for a time. – Avi 00:48, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

66.93.144.171 has publicly accused me of cyberstalking several times over the last few days. Cyberstalking is a serious ethical and criminal matter, and I can assure everyone I do not do it. This user first made this accusation in response to a single comment I made about one of his/her edits (in fact, my first post ever directed towards this person). That initial accusation is here (note the part where I am called a "known cyberstalker"): [|Here]

This user then accused me of cyberstalking here: []. Note that despite the policy that users should be notified if someone has made an accusation against them, I was not notified about the post about me in the incident archive --- I only found out about this accusation because another user emailed me.

In response to this accusation I voiced my concerns that this user seems to have a history of violating WP:CIVIL here: []. Note at the bottom of this post 66.93.144.171 again accuses me of cyberstalking.

Finally, I just found out today that 66.93.144.171 has shifted to making accusations of cyberstalking on Jreferee's talk page, again without notifying me of the accusation. That accusation is here: []

To summarize, 66.93.144.171 is making unfounded and serious accusations against me, and appears to be deliberately hiding these accusations from me to deny me the chance to set the record straight. This appears to be a concerted effort to sully my name in revenge for disagreement over a single edit, and I believe it violates WP:CIVIL and WP:NPA, at least.

Can anyone help me stop this behavior? SkipSmith 05:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Uhm, Skip, you have a history of rampant sockpuppet use, and I know personally that you stalked myself and user:TheActuary here from the Actuarial Outpost, and shall we begin to discuss your (and your friends)little website started when y'all were banned from the Outpost? It doesn't feel so good, does it? [[image:smile.gif]]. Regardless, I'll look into this anon's comments for you. – Avi 05:34, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Ugh. Hey Avi, long time no talk --- thanks for checking this out for me.  Now, on to the sparring: the best way to settle your sockpuppetry and stalking accusations would have been to do a CheckUser, which would have revealed that I didn't do anything wrong.  For some reason this was never done, and I've still got these accusations hanging over my head because nobody could be bothered to investigate a sock puppet case correctly.  As far as the non-wiki stuff you brought up, I was banned from the Outpost because I protested the treatment of Abducens (who by the way, was ultimately reinstated, but refused to return).  I never had anything to do with the protest site --- again, a CheckUser several months ago would have cleared that up.  On second thought, maybe it's good that nobody did a CheckUser on me --- I wouldn't want to get a fax at work ... SkipSmith 05:58, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * After looking at the edits brought, I agree that your initial comment telling him not to hyperventilate was not the worst edit, and should have been laughed off. However, you do play into his hands by commenting under every one of his edits. There are, at best, a minor lacking of good faith on all sides here. I would suggest you let sleeping dogs lie, and ignore this issue. Likely it will die down. If it does not, there is always dispute resolution, but a little time may be all that is needed. If it escalates, bring it back here. – Avi 06:01, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Avi, there is something you need to understand. I did not leave the comment I did based solely on his edit. This user has cyberstalked me for years over various websites. He came to that article simply because I mentioned it in my blog. I did not file my complaint because of the content of his comment, but because of WHO he was. If claiming that he is cyberstalking me is such a painful lack of civility, then this user only needs to finally learn how to do one thing: LEAVE ME ALONE. - 66.93.144.171 18:40, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Or you could leave a message on my talk page, as the anon did to Jref. There isn't anything wrong with that per se – Avi 06:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks Avi. Yeah, I was debating whether to kid around with my edit on that page because I didn't want to offend anyone, but I had no idea it would set someone off like that.  I remember how upset you were when you misunderstood me and thought I was accusing you of harassment [|here], so you can imagine how I felt when this person unfairly accused me of cyberstalking.  However, it appears that nobody is taking this person's accusations seriously, and as long as he/she doesn't make a habit of libel, I'm willing to forgive and forget. SkipSmith 06:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I think that's the best, but feel free to drop me a line if you need. – Avi 06:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Thanks Avi. SkipSmith 06:32, 14 March 2007

Template vandalism to main page FA
Appears that someone has managed to tamper with one of the templates on today's mainpage FA, Same-sex marriage in Spain. There are images of penises floating above it. Would appreciate help tracking down the affected template. WjBscribe 16:04, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Problem has been fixed. However some of the template used in it (i.e. Infobox Legislation and Same-sex marriage) remain unprotected- is cascading protection not working at the moment? If not, templates may need to be protected manually. WjBscribe 16:09, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Cascading only applies to the main page. The FA isn't edit-protected (so even if cascading protection were enabled, there would be no edit protection to cascade).  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  16:43, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I see, I had misunderstood the cascading protection function. Is it still current practice to protect the templates currently being used in the main page FA to avoid vandalism of those templates? WjBscribe 16:54, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure if we should do so pre-emptively, but if we're having problems with it, I don't see why we shouldn't protect those templates. Cascading protection – last I heard, anyway – doesn't have an option for semi (although that may have been updated?). At the bottom of the "edit this page" screen, you should get a list of all pages currently transcluded onto the page you're editing, along with their protection status, which is helpful for this sort of thing. –  Luna Santin  (talk) 21:58, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * OK, I usually watchlist the mainpage FA- I'll also watchlist any unprotected templates used in it... WjBscribe 22:50, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Potential conflict of interest issue
While doing some normal IP vandalism reversions, I noticed that is registered to the Stephen S. Wise Temple (SSWT) in LA, CA, US. Looking at the IP contributions, the IP has edied extensively on Milken Community High School, which is associated with the SSWT. I presume a warning is appropriate? – Avi 16:17, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Looks it to me. Eli Falk 16:20, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Strongly oppose. This is the abuse of the policy. Any extension of its interpretation will lead to creeping disaster. IU've already been advised not to edit articles about Soviet Union! `'mikka 22:30, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Opposed to what? That an employee of a related institution needs to take care (NOT is forbidden from editing) when they edit? Please see the warning I left, and then I would appreciate knowing what in particular you oppose. Thank you. – Avi 00:51, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Avi's concern is fine, and the "please be careful" warning to 72.166.141.248 is fine. No news here, which article isn't being edited by someone with a conflict of interest? :) —Quarl (talk) 2007-03-15 18:07Z 

Fraudulent uploads
User:Nubova has repeatedly uploaded images with text a la "I took this picture myself" and license tags such as pd-self or gfdl-self for images which are clearly CVs. These include: Image:Egan1.jpg (recently speedied, CV with ), Image:Carroll1.jpg (CV with ), Image:Carroll2.jpg (CV with ), Image:Barat1.gif (CV with ). This is a blockable offense (at least, according to Special:Upload). The user's talk page is littered with IFD notices. All of this user's images need to be scrutinized for CV. - Keith D. Tyler &para; (AMA) 16:18, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I've sent some of the blatant image violations to IFD or tagged them for speedy deletion, but there's still a few more tagged PD that need to be looked at more closely.
 * Image:Centennial.jpg – No source, tagged for speedy deletion 7 days from now. &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk  20:43, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Image:West Campus 456.jpg – Sent to IFD as orphaned. &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk  20:43, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Image:West Campus123.jpg – Sent to IFD as orphaned. &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk  20:43, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Image:Northeastern long.jpg – I can't find this image anywhere. I really don't buy the PD-Self tag, though, so I've gone ahead and sent it over to Possibly unfree images. &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk 21:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Image:Libraryinteriorbcls.jpg – Taken to Copyright problems; violation from here. &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk  20:54, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Image:NEU boathouse.jpg – Taken to Copyright problems; violation from here. &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk  20:54, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * &mdash; Rebelguys2 <sup style="color:#CC5500;">talk 20:38, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

King Edward VIII and his American date
The article for Edward VIII of the United Kingdom was the subject of an extensive edit by G2bambino, changing all dates in the article into American Dating format. I had words with him here in which his defence was that the British king was sovereign of many nations, not just the UK. Presumably the title King of Canada justifies the change. I asked him to change the date formats back, but he has not done so. Can some admin beat him over the head with Jguk, or must I resign myself to following him around and reverting inappropriate style changes? --Pete 17:27, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Wasn't there a way to set one's display preferences? I feel like there used to be some default date format that would get parsed into the user's preferred way of viewing them.  Did I imagine this?  --Selket Talk 18:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Pete, you're right, but Canada isn't much of an excuse for changing formats since they apparently accept both US and UK styles, see our article on Calendar date. Since E8 was born in England, and is generally most famous for his influence on the UK, I'd say UK format is appropriate. Selket, you're not mistaken, see Special:Preferences. WP:DATE is a great article for trying it out, since it uses every legal and several illegal formats. If you set your preferences, you will see most of them look alike - try to edit the article (without saving!) to see the "before" view. --AnonEMouse (squeak) 19:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * The date preferences thing is great (though implementing it through wikilinks is a little tacky) but the big problem is that this only works for registered users (i.e. editors) and most of our readers don't have accounts, so therefore see the "raw" formats. Seeing American dates in an article about a British king is as jarring as seeing International dates used in (say) an article about President Kennedy. --Pete 00:59, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

User:HEWatch
Please review an indefinite block of this account per the "reason for being" on its user page (and matching contributions). I'm hoping the rule on "we don't make user accounts specifically to fight with other users, even temporarily banned ones" fits under WP:SOCK or other places, but if it's not there, consider me blocking under WP:IAR ... and I don't write that lightly. This is ridiculous. --AnonEMouse (squeak) 20:05, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Endorse, w/o doubt. We are an encyclopedia, period. Rama's arrow  20:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Endorse. - Merzbow 00:02, 15 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Self admitted single purpose, stalking account... yeap. Georgewilliamherbert 00:04, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Since I'm "involved" with this puppeteer (here, here and here), would someone be kind enough to review this edit and take any appropriate action? Thanks. <tt style="color:#161;">RadioKirk (u|t|c) </tt> 19:57, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Blocked. Only for 24 hours, but will reblock if you let me know it is required.  --Yamla 20:06, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Most kind. I can't help but wonder how many of those "new" users who periodically show up there and argue (badly, because it's false) that I have WP:OWN and WP:NPOV issues are this same person... ;) <tt style="color:#161;">RadioKirk (u|t|c) </tt> 20:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User 195.8.168.107
This user has repeatedly vadalized numerous pages, and been warned several times. Please check his user history for specifics. Thanks. Markysdad 20:36, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * He made four edits total, all on March 6. I don't think any action needs to be taken. If he starts vandalizing again, you can report him to WP:AIV. Picaroon 20:39, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Disregard that; I was looking at 81.152.88.116, the one who Markysdad warned on March 6. Picaroon 20:45, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I just warned the address for today's vandalism. For future reference, this is not the place to report this kind of thing. If someone has vandalized repeatedly and received a final warning (and ignored it), they can be reported to WP:AIV. This user hadn't done anything for several days. <b style="color:CornflowerBlue;">Leebo</b> <sup style="color:#B22222;">T / C  20:42, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Could somebody please take a look at what they think of this diff. I'm one of those that has reverted the person trolling his userpage. I even gave the IP a stern warning and ended up reporting it at AIV where it was blocked for three months. Sufficed to say though, I find the comments of Street Scholar himself (once more!) seriously offensive.

Perhaps he should be told (yet again!) that his own personal belief system and values are not an excuse for his poor behaviour on wikipedia. Alternatively, because it is a case of "yet again", perhaps something else may be in order? Crimsone 20:53, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * This person has a long history of personal attacks on religious lines. I've blocked him for 1 month. Rama's arrow  21:42, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Saint Patrick
Insane amount of vandalism today so I semi-protected it. Just letting you all know. Feel free to reverse it if you feel like I jumped the gun. <b style="color:green;">IrishGuy</b> <sup style="color:blue;">talk 20:56, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Seems okay to me ... Yuser31415 20:59, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Don't they know they're supposed to wait until Saturday? Natalie 22:50, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User:JJonathan and socks at Talk:Kylie Minogue
Socks:

One user, using three anonymous and two named accounts. Repeated and persistent deletion of talk page discussion on Talk:Kylie Minogue over the past two months. A partial list of diffs:

Has been blocked twice for 24 hours already and once for a week, but keeps on deleting using either one of the non-blocked accounts, in true whack-a-mole style. Has been asked to participate in the discussion instead of deleting it (examples: ), and has been warned on all five accounts already, but keeps deleting user talk page warnings (examples: ). --Plek 21:48, 7 March 2007 (UTC)


 * User:JJonathan just blanked this section. Restored and warned user. --Kurt Shaped Box 01:32, 8 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Vandalism continues, so I reinstated this message. --Plek 21:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Added information: the talk page vandalism is probably meant to push through this edit (with summary "The categories are staying don't turn it off anyone"), without any intention to discuss matters first. --Plek 21:49, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Lt. Col. Cole
This user is happily uploading images from multiple sources but the licenses he chose on most images are at least dubious if not completely wrong. These images may need an Admin verifying sources and licenses. --Denniss 22:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * See above. —xyzzyn 22:44, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * User's talk page is littered with dozens image copyvio warnings. I blocked the account for 31h and posted a message on the talk page, and proceeding to delete their uploads. `'mikka 22:45, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Shomari16.
I know for sure that this user is a sockpuppet of Shomari15, who was blocked indefinitely for disruption, and continually uploading copyrighted images. Take a look at this user's contributions and compare them with Shomari15's contributions. Compare the talk pages too, for more proof. Acalamari 22:47, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Blocked indef as a sockpuppet. --Core desat  23:05, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Excellent, thank you; I was lucky to come across him. I keep an eye out for more. Acalamari 23:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Evanescence
Well, there are many problems. First, the user ed g2s has been deleting images from the Evanescence articles, because according to him the use of album cover images violates thes Fair use criteria. This is totally fake, and it can be proved. Nirvana (band) and Nightwish have images of album covers, and these articles are Featured articles. If the use use of album cover images is forbidden, then these articles would never have passed the FA. Now, he is also contradicting himself, because he has also deleted an logo ([[:Image:Evanescence early.png, an earlier logo of the band). Logo are not album covers, so...? He has deleted it with no reasons. The only thing he said was that the use of the images hasn't been discussed. What's that??

Some edits he made (deleting images):
 * 14:42, March 14, 2007
 * 14:43, March 14, 2007
 * 17:23, March 14, 2007
 * 18:45, March 14, 2007

Another problem is that he has nominated an free-use image created by me, Image:EV-In.svg, with a very vague reason. He says this is a derivated work of the Evanescence logo. It would be a derivated logo if I would have copied the Evanescence logo and added something like some lines or whatever. Here's the, but it's going nowhere.

And the last thing, he has tagged the Image:Evlithium1.jpg for deletion. This is a fair-use image, but many of the contributors in the Evanescence articles including me, reached a consensus. (this.

Also the fair use rationable stated the reasons why we are using a fair-use image by now.

No free equivalent is available or could be created that would adequately give the same information. While Evanescence is a very popular band and would probably be easier to get user-created pictures of than most, the fact remains that in general it's incredibly difficult to get good free use images of bands. The reasons are two-fold: the majority of user-contributed images are going to be from 1) dark concerts with bad lighting, where the band is spread across the stage and difficult to see, or 2) individual members posing with a fan. Highly unlikely that a decent picture of just the band outside of a concert setting could be found. (Check the fair use rationable for more reasons).

You should also check this discussion.

I really don't understand his reasons. I can even compare the fair use rationable of the main image of Nirvana (FA) with the rationable of the Evanescence (GA) rationable. The Evanescence images is very very very detailed.

Well, I hope these problems end and we can continue our Wikipedian lives normally... Armando.O talk • Ev 00:59, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Block on User:Gnetwerker
I received an e-mail from in which he states that he is indefinitely blocked for no valid reason that he understands, and in which he asks to be allowed to edit again as long as he stays within policy. Now I am unfamiliar with this user, but a casual glance at his talk page shows there's quite a bit of nastiness going around, although he denies most of it, and I note several unblock requests denied by several admins. Based on that I wonder whether he should be allowed to edit again, or whether he should be considered under community ban.  &gt; R a d i a n t &lt;  11:50, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * It's hard for the rest of the community to evaluate a ban since we don't have access to the checkuser information. I mean, I have every reason to trust Jayjg and SlimVirgin's decision; but for me to vote for a community ban, to my mind, would mean something else.  So I guess I'm saying I would accept the status quo.  --Ideogram 12:03, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I would suggest that a reason for the block besides You've been blocked indefinitely, and you know why. Please don't bother with the protestations of innocence, they ring hollow. would bring clarity. Catchpole 12:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * He was a pain, and I can't say that I'm sorry to see him gone – but I agree that the reason given for the indefinite block is close to being an abuse. The actual reason needs to be given. --Mel Etitis  ( Talk ) 13:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Gnetwerker spent several months harassing IronDuke after they got into a content dispute that went to mediation and the ArbCom in January 2006. The harassment consisted of posting ID's personal details; creating sockpuppets to post complaints about ID on AN/I; and inventing user names that mimicked ID. After several months of putting up with it, ID asked me for help, at which point Gnetwerker turned on me too, and has since posted what he thinks are my personal details several times, which he's copied from an attack site.


 * He vehemently denies the sockpuppetry even when it's obviously him. For example, on July 24, 2006, as, he posted one of his frequent complaints on AN/I about ID. During the discussion, he made the classic sockpuppet error of forgetting which account he'd logged in as, and posted as Gnetwerker; he then tried to retrieve the situation by pretending Gnetwerker was simply joining the discussion. Even when the sockpuppetry was this obvious, he still protested his innocence. Here are his known and suspected sockpuppets.


 * After many warnings stretching over almost a year, he was blocked indefinitely in December 2006 for posting personal details. I e-mailed several ArbCom members about the situation a few weeks before the block, and I understand the entire ArbCom was alerted to the proposed block just before it happened. Since then, he has written to everyone he can think of to try to get them to kick up a fuss on his behalf, including at least one bureaucrat (trying to get a name change), and an appeal to the ArbCom, which was turned down.


 * At any point throughout this, including now, he could simply have opened a new account and started editing quietly; if he'd behaved, no one would have known it was him. But instead, what he wants is to cause me to have to write this kind of explanation, endlessly, in response to his many e-mails to other admins. He then picks apart what I've written and tries to use it as the basis of another complaint, which is why I don't want to go into more detail. I'll e-mail more information to the admins who've responded here. SlimVirgin <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 14:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

That seems reasonable to me. I wish that the notice of the block had been more factual and dispassionate, though. --Mel Etitis ( Talk ) 14:35, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * To mildly counteract the echo-chamber effect, let me add this: the events that SlimVirgin describe happened in July 2006, whereas the block (which amounts to a non-community-sanctioned ban) did not occur until December. I don't think it was the case that it took her and Jayjg five months to weigh the evidence.  Something occurred – even I'm not certain what – that they ascribe to me, and I got blocked in the crossfire.  I am sure that if there was evidence it would be presented.  There is no record of a checkuser connecting me with any account past the one incident in July, which I explained to everyone involved.   In reference to the ArbCom case, there were more votes to hear it than not, but a failure to hear an unblock case does not make a community ban (its final state can be seen here).  WP:BLOCK states that "indefinite blocks of established users are always controversial".  If I am to be community-banned, please do it correctly on WP:CN, stating the reasons and giving me a chance to (briefly) argue my case.  If SlimVirgin and Jayjg would rather not bring their "evidence" to that venue, then I ask (as I have been offline) to be afforded my putative Right to Vanish.  Finally, let me post a question.  My reading of WP:BLOCK, in distinction to WP:BAN, is that accounts are blocked, and if one is indef-blocked, in the absence of a community ban of the user in quetion, he or she is free to create another account and edit, provided of course, that the behavior that caused the block is not repeated.  Is this a correct reading? – Gnetwerker 15:55, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I suspect you are at present community banned by the old definition, which is that of a thousand admins not one can be found who is willing to unblock you. And, as Slim suggests, you could simply open a new account and start editing quietly; if you'd behave, no one would know it was you. But per Slim's explanation and yours, let me ask simply - are there objections to a "formal" community ban?  &gt; R a d i a n t &lt;  16:19, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * The counter-example of this would seem to be User:BurningCandy who, despite not actually being me, was indef-blocked by SlimVirgin as "a suspected sockpuppet of banned user Gnetwerker". The "no other admin will unblock" rule seems to fail to take into account the power of the blocking admins.  I have had more than one admin say privately I shouldn't have been indef'd, but that they can't take action because it would put them on the wrong side of two very powerful people. But let me repeat: block me, ban me – that is up to the community here, no problem.  But if you do, please allow me my Right to Vanish. – Gnetwerker 17:26, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Slimvirgin, a sysop, should not individually hold the kind of power described above. I would support taking this to arbcom. --Random832 00:38, 15 March 2007 (UTC) Regardless, User:BurningCandy should be unblocked _immediately_ as Gnetwerker is not, at present, a banned user. Falsely making such a claim does not put SlimVirgin's argument in a particularly good light. --Random832 00:40, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * It is stated above that the matter was already taken to ArbCom, which declined to hear the case. If Gnetworker has further evidence to present he can e-mail the arbitrators' mailing list, but it sounds like they are already familiar with the situation. Newyorkbrad 00:44, 15 March 2007 (UTC)


 * How about User:SlimVirgin posts whatever evidence was the basis for it to WP:CN and proposes a community ban? The burden should NOT be on Gnetwerker to initiate this. --Random832 02:15, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

User:UntoldLegend
Can an Admin take a look at this very new editors and work out the best approach to them? So far he is hitting the Bullying article and replacing it with text not unlike that currently on his user page, the first paragraph of which is in questionable taste (beginning "ANY CHILD BULLIED NEEDS TO DO SUICIDE NOW") and the rest of which seems to be plagiarised. --Zeraeph 23:30, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * User page deleted, user given a stern warning. Keep an eye on him, if he continues report either here or on WP:AIV. --Core desat  23:37, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Eye duly kept, but hope someone else will too? --Zeraeph 00:39, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Also keeping. Newyorkbrad 05:38, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

User:JINXTENGU sockpuppet.
This is the second sockpuppet I've discovered within two hours: Drgiblet. They admitted to being JINXTENGU with this edit: 1. They also vandalized Persian Poet Gal's talk page with this edit: 2. Acalamari 01:51, 15 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Sock blocked by yours truly.<b style="font-family:comic sans ms; color:purple;">¤~Persian Poet Gal</b> <sup style="color:purple;">(talk) 02:19, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Excellent; thank you. Acalamari 02:41, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Sockpuppets of 199.80.117.24 circumventing block
This IP user, with a history of personal attacks and disruptive editing on several IPs, was blocked for six months several days ago. He is already back on Wiki, using the IP address 74.195.5.83. User 74.195.5.83 is continuing discussions that were started by 199.80.117.24, using the exact same tone and language. .
 * ;
 * 

I have an open sock puppet case against this user's various socks, but reading through other cases and their suggestions, and given that the user is currently actively evading their block, it seemed like a good idea to bring it up here too.DanielEng 05:34, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

User:Chamot 07
Could someone look in on after a bit? They're creating "game clan" articles, the first of which Elite Drug Squad. I've put on that, but now they are busy with List of Australian Allied Assault Players and I don't want to just leap down their throat. But it just doesn't look like anything good is going to develop here, and I've got to toddle off now. Shenme 06:40, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

inapropriate name
User:G W BUSH IS A TERRORIST It dishonors the U.S president —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bloddyfriday (talk • contribs) 17:26, 13 March 2007 (UTC). Sorry forgot to sign Bloddyfriday 17:28, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * "Dishonoring a president" seems to be missing from WP:U, but "Harassing or defamatory usernames" seems to cover the situation. - C HAIRBOY (☎) 17:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Already blocked, in the future please report obvious usernamevios / vandals to WP:AIV-- VectorPotential Talk 17:31, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * sorry. Bloddyfriday 17:33, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * No prob, just a request for the future. - C HAIRBOY (☎) 17:34, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

Um, in order to dishonor a person, that said person has to have honor in the first place. (joke) Hbdragon88 00:18, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I object - Wikipedia is not censored, George W Bush is technically a terrorist, i.e he causes terror by death --MiddleEastern 13:14, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Uh, moving on... -- AAA!  ( AAAA ) 07:57, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Big Trouble in Little China
There are very siuspicious edis going on to Chinese - and specifically Hong Kong - articles involving one relatively new user and one brand new user, with the usernames and. One will edit the page one way (usually involving the term "Mainland China"), then the other will come along and edit it back. Call me suspicious, and apologies to both if I'm wrong, but it looks like user:Instantnood and user: Huaiwei using socks to get around their bans on editing specific pages. Grutness...<small style="color:#008822;">wha?  01:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * This could also go here. By the way, User:Privacy is an editor of two years, not exactly "relatively new." &mdash; Michael Linnear   02:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I have not investigated, but I have experience with Instantnood and Huaiwei and this does not seem like their MO. --Ideogram 02:42, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Can you provide the page differences so we can investigate on the suspected issue? AQu01rius (User &#149; Talk) 04:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * You can find the diffs yourself. It's not hard.  Look at the two contributions histories from the past couple of days and pick any page that the two have in common.  Uncle G 17:02, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * This is just the tip of the iceberg. There are a ton of very mysterious "new" users editing China/Taiwan pages lately that immediately make either very POV or very obscure edits. Takes these for example: Special:Contributions/Quitepick, Special:Contributions/Trendsure. Two users with names that are 5letter/4letter random word combos.  The first four contributions of each two are the same edits made to two different articles. If those aren't socks of existing users I'll eat some clothing.  And of those, there are a few more.  I'm betting on finding some edit/move wars on sprotected pages soon.
 * In this specific instance though, I find it hilarious that Secrecy follows Privacy to vote pages and comments on the three users who showed up after Instantnoods disappearance. Secrecy obviously isn't Huaiwei.  I've never seen Huaiwei run sockpuppets and he is never afraid to play the revert games with those he suspects of being sockpuppets using his own account.  He's also not banned from editing any of the articles Secrecy reverted (I don't think) as the OP suggests.  SchmuckyTheCat 21:45, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Secrecy seems to be actively trying to disrupt Instantnood's Sandbox. Privacy has left a DRV notice on Instantnood's talk page, which seems like a totally unnecessary bit of misdirection since he could just ignore Instantnood and no one would be the wiser.  --Ideogram 22:01, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * On closer inspection Privacy seems to be a problem editor. I hope people will keep a close eye on him.  --Ideogram 22:31, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I personally noted at least three editors who's edits are a source of personal concern. I doubt it will be constructive to the site if I were to try prevent this recent spat of edits (and run the risk of violating ArbCom rulings once again), so I plead for help from the community.--Huaiwei 23:11, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Looking at the claim "Secrecy seems to be actively trying to disrupt Instantnood's Sandbox." And, well, Instantnood's sandbox needs disrupting. He's storing a bunch of his classic POV forks and they show up in Google searches. This one  shows up higher than the primary article depending on the order of the words.  That is a discussion for MfD that can wait until he returns. SchmuckyTheCat 02:38, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I have tagged all these pages with Userpage otheruse. --Ideogram 12:00, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Brought up this topic at Wikipedia:Village pump (policy)#User pages on Google. --Ideogram 12:46, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I may be speculating, but I cant help but wonder if there is a possibility of users creating sockpuppets, using these to revert one's own edit or POV, and then subsequently pinning the blame squarely on the other party, particularly when charges of sockpuppetry are pressed on them. Of course, the same scenario may be applied by me as well, but whatever the case, I hope investigations will be thorough, transparent, and not based purely on subjectivity and assumptions.--Huaiwei 09:28, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't see any evidence of this. --Ideogram 12:00, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * (responding to SchmuckyTheCat's comment at 02:38, March 15) " Instantnood's sandbox needs disrupting. He's storing a bunch of his classic POV forks and they show up in Google searches. This one [186] shows up higher than the primary article depending on the order of the words. " - Perhaps that's simply because Google knows what the English word country is meant to be. :-) Don't think those are POV forks. – Instantnood 22:51, 17 March 2007 (UTC)

I'm not going to speculate as to who might be whose sockpuppet, though it's hard not to suspect various sorts of co-ordinated editing, at the least, and what are close – or in a couple of cases, right in the middle of – being SPA accounts (whether socks or fresh recruits to 'the cause'). There's a legimate content issue in here somewhere (how to refer to, and whether to categorise by, the entity-that-used-to-be-the-PRC-pre-1997, now somewhat inexactly and less than formally refered to as "mainland China"), but there doesn't seem to be a clear-cut consensus on it at present, and very clearly there's no willingness to "leave well enough alone" on either side, much less to achieve even pro temps consistency either way. As less than ideal as the heavy-handed resolution of the "highways" issue was, I'm beginning to think that something similar might be required here. Preferably not "policy by narrow majority vote", but at least a solution to be adopted pending definitive resolution, and some fairly zealous enforcement of the "cease fire line", whatever that turns out to be. Alai 03:54, 15 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I've been trying to have a discussion on this very issue at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject China, but it is going slowly. So far the votes are exactly split between leaving things alone, and applying "China" as the common name of the PRC.  Ironically, many of those who want to leave things alone think it will be less edit-warring.  --Ideogram 11:44, 15 March 2007 (UTC)



but can't before someone checks this out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/James_McStub Carptrash 02:21, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * No policy violation, just removal of spam photobucket picture links. Case resolved.--Jersey Devil 02:35, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Hold on. When the user is deleting these links, the other text inside the link is also being deleted. like this one, or worse, this one. Looks like an unapproved automated task malfunctioning. Gimmetrow 03:10, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, I would like a second opinion in this matter. Carptrash 03:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * My apologies, I thought the complaint was solely regarding the type of links he was removing. It looks like the account was preforming a malfunctioning automated task. I will block it indefinitely.--Jersey Devil 03:15, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Now could you point me to the policy that all photobucket/imageshack links are forbidden? In some cases they might be fair use, such as the old image removed in this edit. I don't know if it is, but where would this be hashed out? Gimmetrow 03:29, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * WP:EL would be a good start. --Edokter (Talk) 13:07, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * It's not blacklisted, so "All links are forbidden" is not a judgement that seems supportable. --Random832 13:14, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

What happens to the mess that the user left behind? Katr67 14:39, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Perhaps the admin who prematurely Resolved the issue can deal with it?  Sort of a penance or something?"  It might slow down his/her trigger finger a bit. Carptrash 15:39, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

Matters concerning advocacy of pedophilia
Please refer all matters concerning advocacy of pedophilia directly to the Arbitration Committee. Please don't bring the matter up in other forums. Fred Bauder 12:32, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

Possible sock?
Edits by user:Konstable are pretty new and contreversial. Definatelly violated 3RR as demonstrated [here. I think 24 hours has passed so no need to give a block but perhaps he is someone's sock, seeing as he had only a couple edits in his history. --[[User:CyclePat|CyclePat]] 06:30, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * humm... I'm surprised on the low level of edits on his talk page compared to his edit history (I got those mixed up... sorry) --CyclePat 06:35, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * WP:SOCK? A better identifier might be WP:LAME. The reason Konstable's talk page is so short on content is because he blanks it whenever Moe Epsilon posts there. From what I've seen there is no good guy in the argument between those two: Konstable is overreacting horribly, while Moe is continuing the behaviour with no purpose whatsoever but annoying Konstable. --tjstrf talk 09:14, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * With a mere 7000+ edits, clearly a sock. Perhaps the sockpuppeteer isUser:KonstableSock? Seriously though, I can't help but agree wholeheartedly with tjstrf on the whole WP:LAME issue. --woggly 09:52, 15 March 2007 (UTC)

AGF Problem User:Okedem
Hi, Okedem is repeatedly reverting my edits to Allegations of Israeli Apartheid, I added a factual accuracy dispute tag and he reverted, saying I was a "troll making personal attacks". Please see User talk:Okedem, and THIS DIFF. ---MiddleEastern 15:36, 13 March 2007 (UTC)

I don't see anything wrong there. I looked at your userpage and you seem to have a large axe to grind. Please remember, Wikipedia is not a soapbox. If you've got issues on the page, the talk page is the first step. One Elephant went out to play... 15:39, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'd like to comment on the AGF - look at his edit here: . Good faith? okedem 15:41, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * No sir, the problem is the removal of a tag, it is simply a more specific tag drawing attention to the faults of the article. --MiddleEastern 15:42, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * If you have issues, that's what the talk page is for. You do not deserve the protection of the AGF policy, as you have proven you're not acting in good faith, but to promote your agenda, however way possible. okedem 15:44, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * I'll also comment that he used his edits "adding a tag" to also remove sources and change the lead to his liking: . okedem 15:47, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I didn't I did an accidental revert to previous version, I did't mean to change the text, all users are covered with AGF, yes that's right.... even Palestinians --MiddleEastern 15:48, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * You have proven you are not acting in good faith. okedem 15:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Please, administrators. I request outside opinion. I did not come here to argue with this man. --MiddleEastern 15:51, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I'll quote from WP:AGF: "This guideline does not require that editors continue to assume good faith in the presence of evidence to the contrary." (emphasis in the original) There is evidence to the contrary, as provided by One Elephant and okedem.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  15:50, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I gave no insult, I ONLY ADDED A TAG! I have not vandalised or something. --MiddleEastern 15:53, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Uh... THIS is pretty clear. Sorry.  — bbatsell   ¿?   ✍  16:06, 13 March 2007 (UTC)


 * One of my first edits, please present recent evidence --MiddleEastern 13:12, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh, yesterday isn't recent enough? Your actions are obvious. You're not acting with good faith, but with a clear agenda, which is also clearly stated on your user page. okedem 13:31, 14 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Oh, by the way, this edit seems to be on the same line. Though it's a legitimate opinion, it also sheds more light on this user's political goals here. okedem 13:40, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * So a socialist Muslim cannot be respected, but a right wing American, who is a believer in Zionism and a devout Christian/Jew (and says so on his userpage) e.g User:LonghornJohnny, who it took me fives minutes to find can be respected! --MiddleEastern 14:13, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * I see MiddleEastern is doing some important encyclopedic work - creating some tags for harassing people: Template:De-sysop, Template:AdministratorsNoticeBoardDiscussion, Template messages/UserPage Namespace, . okedem 15:13, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * How dare you! I'm trying to do non-article maintanance to stay out of the way, is that alright by you? --MiddleEastern 18:16, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Of course we assume good faith and do not bite newcomers, but so far User:MiddleEastern caused nothing but disruption. ←Humus sapiens ну? 20:38, 14 March 2007 (UTC)


 * How can it be fair for two JEWISH editors to make decisions about me! Of course their judgement will be effected, they probably live in the country were this fight is happening, just as I do, albeit they live in the safe and army protected area --MiddleEastern 14:07, 15 March 2007 (UTC)
 * MiddleEastern, you are not being persecuted for your ethnicity or beliefs. You ARE being criticized for being disruptive. You have made offensive statements and allegations at your RfA, the MfD for your subpage, and in this very thread, just for starters. You on track for a community ban in short order if your attitude does not improve. Editing Wikipedia is a privilage that can be revoked, not an inalienable right. The diff that you point out at the beginning of this thread is misleading because you removed quite a bit of content from the article and made no reference to that in your edit summary. And one more thing: even though it is completely irrelevant to the matter at hand, I am not a "Jewish editor". A Train take the 15:47, 15 March 2007 (UTC)