Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/2019 Queens subway shooting


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus defaulting to Keep and w/o prejudice to a future renomination. In this situation I do suggest a reasonable waiting period to see if coverage is SUSTAINED and what LASTING effects of this are. Ad Orientem (talk) 00:44, 20 February 2019 (UTC)

2019 Queens subway shooting

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While tragic, this appears to be a run-of-the-mill gang shooting. It is probably not notable as a standalone article per WP:NOTNEWS and WP:CRIME. epicgenius (talk) 14:39, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom. 2601:188:180:1481:65F5:930C:B0B2:CD63 (talk) 15:12, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. KCVelaga (talk) 17:13, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Crime-related deletion discussions. Bakazaka (talk) 18:32, 5 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 00:48, 6 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep I will agree, that when I originally created this article, it may not have been notable enough. However, it has since been mentioned by President Trump in the State of the Union address, which greatly increases its notability. Puzzledvegetable (talk) 03:34, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
 * True, but Trump likes to talk about MS-13 killings a lot. Besides, this section of the MS-13 article already talks about the shooting. As nominator, I'm not going to pressure you to make any decision; just saying that it would probably be better off being merged. epicgenius (talk) 03:43, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep per WP:RAPID. Breaking news story getting intense coverage and drawing wide attention.E.M.Gregory (talk) 11:36, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
 * WP:HEY Expanded the article. But this is now far more than a breaking news story.  The State of the Union is significant.  And the fact that the shooter had been caught-and-released by NYPD three times last year for property crimes and would have been in detention awaiting deportation in other cities but was on the street because NYC doesn't do ICE holds is drawing attention.  Plus teh MS-13 connection was getting WP:SIGCOV nationally even before the SotU speech. E.M.Gregory (talk) 13:48, 6 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete per WP:RECENTISM. We could dozens of such articles from when subway crime was very high in the 1970s and 1980s.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 17:29, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
 * WP:OTHERSTUFF. The question at AfD is: Does this crime have WP:SIGCOV.E.M.Gregory (talk) 17:38, 6 February 2019 (UTC)


 * That is assuredly not an OTHERSTUFF argument, but perhaps a read of WP:BLUDGEON might be in order. This crime does not have SIGCOV - the cheeto in chief's mention of it does. Not the same thing. John from Idegon (talk) 17:40, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
 * The comment above betrays an alarming lack of familiarity with the 22 WP:RS currently extant refs in the article. The majority of those RS do not even mention the President of the United States. XavierItzm (talk) 22:13, 8 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep per WP:RAPID and WP:GNG .Now the only real question here is does this pass WP:LASTING  that cannot be determined at this point.But given Trump's mention in the in the State of the Union address it may do do so but for now it is keep.Pharaoh of the Wizards (talk) 21:32, 6 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Most definitively a Keep It now meets WP:SIGCOV following the President of the U.S. raising the issue at the State of the Union report. XavierItzm (talk) 23:18, 7 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete - clearly fails WP:CRIME and WP:NOTNEWS. A possible WP:ATD solution might be to redirect it to an article on the 2019 State of the Union address. John from Idegon (talk) 17:36, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Doesn't work because only a small part of the coverage is SotU-related.E.M.Gregory (talk) 19:31, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Another, WP:HEY, multiple editors have improved the article with new, non-ROUTINE coverage; something new comes up every day and been covered by NATIONAL media largely related to the political buttons this crime pushes, but there is nothing run-of-the-mill about this level of  ONGOING, NATIONAL coverage. E.M.Gregory (talk) 19:26, 8 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Leading the news on New York's local WNYC National Public Radio tonight are constituents of Ocasio-Cortez, who have formed a new organization called "Latinos for ICE" and are standing on the subway platform where the murder took place, denouncing their congresswoman, and calling on ICE to step up deportations of illegal alien members of criminal gangs.E.M.Gregory (talk) 23:48, 10 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Agree the coverage is ONGOING... I just added the Feb 10th New York Public Radio report on Francisco Moya opening up town hall meetings and otherwise reacting to "Latinos for ICE" which was formed as a result of this event. XavierItzm (talk) 16:41, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Sandstein   17:23, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete This is a New York-centric news story that would've only gotten Daily News blotter mention without the magic 'scary 'in' gang affiliation' words going on and use in political rhetoric (and all the stuff in 'Political attention' is weighted on one side outside 2 'but they said' links for a false balance). Come back in 6-12 months and this will get a 30 second mention on Fox 5 at sentencing, at best. Complete NOTNEWS failure.  Nate  • ( chatter ) 18:12, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * ��Please note WP:CRYSTALBALL. Nobody knows what will happen in 6-12 months.  As of now, though, the issue meets WP:GNG and coverage is ongoing.  Just added the news from CBS today, 12 February. XavierItzm (talk) 22:55, 12 February 2019 (UTC)
 * This is a New York-centric news story that would've only gotten Daily News blotter mention without the magic 'scary 'in' gang affiliation' words going on and use in political rhetoric.... Perhaps that is true, but the reality is that this crime does involve a gang and has been used in no less "political rhetoric" than the State of the Union address. Additionally, if you feel the article is unbalanced, you are more than invited to try to fix it. Deletion is not the solution to articles that may need cleanup. Puzzledvegetable (talk) 01:58, 13 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep This is a Ms-13 shooting but it speaked volume because it was in a crowded area where a lot of people saw it. Also there was a big manhunt for the gunman. So thats a lot for a no notable story. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 11S117 (talk • contribs) 15:28, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep per WP:RAPID and WP:GNG. Per good sources.BabbaQ (talk) 16:08, 14 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep significant coverage in multiple sources.Patapsco913 (talk) 21:11, 15 February 2019 (UTC)
 * and ONGONING KOLD-TV Tucson, Arizona: "highly publicized incidents involving MS-13 - such as the arrest this month of an undocumented member accused of killing a rival gang member on the New York City subway.


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.