Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/ABNKKBSNPLAko?!


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   redirect to Bob Ong. –  Juliancolton  &#124; Talk 03:48, 15 November 2013 (UTC)

ABNKKBSNPLAko?!

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marginally notable author, this book has no references, none found. Mercurywoodrose (talk) 06:28, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Philippines-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:04, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Literature-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 18:04, 27 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Keep The author is quite popular, ranked 23,003 according to LibraryThing holdings (there are a couple million authors cataloged on LT). This book is the author's most popular book, with 182 members on LibraryThing, ranked 61,912 most popular out of 7 million titles cataloged. This source says it has sold over 700,000 copies. Simply, this is a popular book by a popular author. Popularity further described in this cover story of the Philippine Daily Inquirer. The book has been adapted to film. -- Green Cardamom (talk) 18:52, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Comment: library thing rankings are not usable as a reference to show notability, especially "members" who have tagged the book, or their sales rankings. the source for sales is not a reliable/significant one, being a small blog type site. the inquirer is a good ref, but it only mentions the book in passing, and is only a good ref for the author (it would be nice to have more than that for the author, but i think its enough for him). the film has NOT been adapted into a film yet, and that link doesnt discuss the book in any detail. Maybe when its a film, someone will actually write a review of the book. PS i suspect there are good tagalog language refs for the book, but i wouldnt be able to find them, not reading tagalog. I would strongly recommend that someone try to create the article for the book on the tagalog WP.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 19:58, 27 October 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree that, given how popular this book is as evidenced by LibraryThing and other sources, it is quite likely indeed positive that there are more sources in Tagalog or whatever, which is why it might be good to show a little generosity in the spirit of systemic bias. The film does pass it on NBOOK #3, unless folks demand it be deleted immediately and recreated in 3 months when the film is released, a little busy work. -- Green Cardamom (talk) 23:56, 27 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Redirect for now to Bob Ong without prejudice against recreation when its film adaptation is released. I doubt that library rankings are an indication of notability in this case; although the author is actually pretty popular in the Philippines and gets coverage every once in a while (although his anonymity does kind of remind me of a certain Japanese pop idol duo), his books individually don't get as much significant coverage; at the moment, most of what I'm seeing is that it is being adapted into a film, which normally I would consider as a claim to notability, but with the lack of coverage of the book itself (which is surprising given the book's popularity and the fact that most Philippine mass media these days is in English), I think redirecting to the author's article (which probably needs works as well) would be the better option in this case, until the film is released and the article be spun-off again. On a side note though, someone please improve and expand the Bob Ong article. His anonymity would make an excellent DYK blub, though unlike the aforementioned Japanese pop idol duo, who are anonymous because of school work, Ong doesn't even give an exact reason as to why he wants his identity to be like that! (other than that he just wants it that way, as said in the interview) Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 05:30, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
 * That's because the local book publishing industry is barely covered at all by the media. The only local books that are selling are Tagalog pocketbooks, Bob Ong books and college textbooks (lol). – H T  D  14:27, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Redirect per Naruto, this from the nominator who always forgets to offer that option when afd'ing. We can't help it if the book business in the philippines is not covered more. I know in northern california the book business gets the word out very well, thus its possible to get more articles on it here.Mercurywoodrose (talk) 15:43, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
 * "We can't help it.." see WP:SYSTEMIC. We regularly give other countries a break on stuff like this when there is other evidence of notability available outside the standard western-style book review, a symptom of a book industry that doesn't exist everywhere. -- Green Cardamom (talk) 16:43, 28 October 2013 (UTC)
 * Personally, I am against systemic bias myself (if this were a book by an American author under similar circumstances, I would want a redirection as well). However, there's simply not enough coverage for the book itself for some reason (even in print media, and I read the newspapers all the time), but there is for the author, so for now, the author's article should be expanded and improved (DYK anyone?), and when the time comes that coverage for each book increases, then the book can have its own article. If the movie's release date were a bit nearer, then I'd actually support keeping the article, but right now the movie appears to be a bit far away, so too soon I guess. Of course, we could try something like our article for Pay It Forward, where the article is primarily about the movie and not the novel it is based on (whether that style is acceptable according to our guidelines or not is another story). As the final nail in the coffin, for some reason, I haven't heard of the book before the announcement of the movie (although I am familiar with the author), although that's probably because I don't read pocket books and the like. Narutolovehinata5 tccsdnew 23:59, 28 October 2013 (UTC)


 * Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion so a clearer consensus may be reached.


 * Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, &mdash; Coffee //  have a cup  //  essay  // 22:41, 7 November 2013 (UTC)


 * Redirect per above. Risker (talk) 03:11, 14 November 2013 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.