Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Abdalla Ahmed


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   Withdrawn by nominator per WP:ATHLETE. Zim Zala Bim talk  17:54, 24 October 2008 (UTC)

Abdalla Ahmed

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Simply being an Olympic athlete does not make one notable. Zim Zala Bim talk  00:52, 23 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Keep - An Olympic athlete is important.... He's also won gold medals at African Championships! What about Matt Barkley, a high school football player who has an article? --Smuckers It has to be good 01:42, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * First, the article makes not mention of any medals (which might not necessarily ensure notability, btw). Second, did you notice the 11 citations from reliable sources in Mr. Barkely's article? Or the fact he has won numerous major awards? There is no notability question for him. Your argument that "an Olympic athlete is important" is your opinion, but clearly not each of the 10,500 athletes who competed are notable. -- Zim Zala Bim talk  01:53, 23 October 2008 (UTC)


 * Ahmed has a polish Wikipedia article, that I didn't create, and it shows his medals. The article might not be long, but it's because I can't find anything on him, even though I looked & looked. The reason I brought up Barkley is because, Ahmed is a gold medal winning athlete who went to the Olympics and you said it wasn't notable, so I brought up a high school athlete, who even though he's won awards, I don't think he is more notable than an Olympic athlete from a different country. Someone requested a few months ago when the Olympics were on that people create articles for the Egyptian athletes, so I did the volleyball players. --Smuckers It has to be good 02:30, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * The fact that you "can't find anything on him, even though I looked & looked" should tip you off that we have a notability concern, since the basic notability criteria calls for the person having been "the subject of published secondary source material..." -- Zim Zala Bim talk  02:39, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Touche, but I don't think that makes him unnotable, I think its because the U.S. doesn't care to write about Egyptian volleyball players, since volleyball isn't as popular as basketball and football, even though it is growing in popularity year by year. I'm sure he's a star in Egypt.--Smuckers It has to be good 02:54, 23 October 2008 (UTC)


 * comment This FIVB report refers to him as a "Egyptian star" so it looks like he's at least recognised by the international federation as worthy of note. http://www.vbworldcup.jp/2007/en/archives/41 MadScot (talk) 02:56, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And USA today saw fit to run with a picture of him http://www.usatoday.com/travel/cruises/item.aspx?&type=photo&photo_id=04zd8g84rPgn1&pn=3&tid=000000000 - even the Americans know he exists! MadScot (talk) 02:59, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * This is a trivial mention. There are thousands of pool photos taken at international sporting events, each of which identifies who is in the image. This is just one of them. -- Zim Zala Bim talk  03:29, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And this Olympics qualifying report (note Egypt did qualify) refers to him as follows: "Man of the match Abdalla Ahmed inspired the North Africans" http://en.beijing2008.cn/news/sports/headlines/volleyball/2007volleyballcup-m/s214200358/n214207287.shtml MadScot (talk) 03:01, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And THIS report names him to the "all tournament" team for the "World Grand Champions Cup" http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Rec/rec.sport.volleyball/2005-11/msg00046.html which I think is basically the off-Olympic world championship for volleyball. MadScot (talk) 03:03, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * And finally, for now, this report from the 2007 African Volleyball Cup http://www.cavb.org/2007/09/top.html which specifically mentions him as a key part in Egypt winning the final: "The architect of “Operation Fight –Back” for Egypt was their mercurial playmaker, 'Abdalla Ahmed' whose magical fingers became the launching pad for his attack force."MadScot (talk) 03:07, 23 October 2008 (UTC)


 * keep In other words, if we're going to have thousands of American college sports nobodies listed, we could at least have someone who competes as a major player at the international level in an Olympic sport. MadScot (talk) 03:10, 23 October 2008 (UTC) (Apologies I forgot to sign my !vote)
 * Send me the links to the "thousands of American college sports nobodies" and I'll start the deletion process if they fail WP:BIO. -- Zim <b style="color:darkgreen;">Zala</b> Bim <sup style="color:black;">talk  03:27, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * You can start Intercollegiate athletics in the United States here ;-). More seriously, though that was hyperbole, when people are arguing that a Div III or NAIA player or coach for a year is notable, yet an international gold medallist struggles for notability .... it makes you wonder. MadScot (talk) 03:34, 23 October 2008 (UTC) Hells bells, how does one link to a category anyway?MadScot (talk) 03:35, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Assume good faith, especially considering the fact that the article in question fails to note any international gold medal. Regarding categories, you can link to them with this syntax (the preceding ":" prevents this page from actually joining that category): Category:Intercollegiate athletics in the United States -- Zim <b style="color:darkgreen;">Zala</b> Bim <sup style="color:black;">talk  04:07, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Actually being an Olympic athlete does make one notable. Competing at the Olympics is the very definition of competing at the highest level of any chosen sport and that's the bar for notability in sport on Wikipedia. Nick mallory (talk) 04:16, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I fail to see how participation in the Olympics grants one automatic notability. First, that doesn't necessarily mean you are competing at the "highest level" of a sport. For example, many Olympic basketball players would never make the NBA, showing that just being in the Olympics doesn't mean you're at the top. Second, host cities often get additional waivers into certain sports, ensuring they have a good "home" representation of atheletes. Such exemptions don't fit your rule. While I'm not saying that's the case here, your blanket notability seems flawed. -- Zim <b style="color:darkgreen;">Zala</b> Bim <sup style="color:black;">talk  05:09, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Athlete that has played his sport at the highest level. Duffbeerforme (talk) 10:56, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep. An athlete that has represented his country at the highest level is notable. Someone actually tried to speedy-delete this article a couple of weeks ago, would you believe? --Michig (talk) 11:28, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Aside from the longstanding consensus that all Olympians are notable (even those who didn't win medals), it should be rather easy to find sources: just this summer, I created John Kamyuka and was able to find several sources on him with only a few minutes of work. Nyttend (talk) 12:15, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I wasn't aware of this "longstanding consensus" - where is it stated? -- Zim <b style="color:darkgreen;">Zala</b> Bim <sup style="color:black;">talk  12:26, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * WP:ATHLETE says this, except in the rare cases where an olympic sport is also a professional sport - but for Volleyball - Olympics appears to be the highest level of competetion. Wily D 13:03, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, even if it was professional, the Olympics would still count, as it is the highest amateur level for the sport. --Smashville<sup style="color:#03F">talk 20:01, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Keep Being the subject of a body of independent, nontrivial coverage does make one notable, though. Wily D 12:25, 23 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Living people-related deletion discussions. --Erwin85Bot (talk) 00:01, 24 October 2008 (UTC)
 * Speedy Keep According to the notability guidelines for sports figures, "simply" being an Olympic athlete -does- make one notable. Edward321 (talk) 04:39, 24 October 2008 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.