Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Albanian colonisation of Kosovo


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete. I don't think there's any original content to be merged, but if someone would like to check, I can userfy for them or restore and redirect. Stifle (talk) 08:36, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Albanian colonisation of Kosovo

 * – ( View AfD View log  •  )

This was originally going to be speedy deleted as G3 (obvious vandalism), but I'd much prefer an AfD - it doesn't quite meet the standards for G3. Opinions Chase me ladies, I&#39;m the Cavalry (talk) 18:30, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Kosovo-related deletion discussions.  -- • Gene93k (talk) 20:03, 11 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Redirect to History of Ottoman Kosovo. Essentially a pov fork. Ray  Talk 21:08, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Delete per nom.  kedadi al  22:00, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Delete This can also be covered in Albanians in Kosovo. Mandsford (talk) 22:05, 11 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep Numerous sources has been removed from article, in order to minimize its importance, and now, it is requested on AfD, by POV pushing pro-Albanian editor. Give article a chance. This is historical information that need it's own article, specially in the moment of Kosovo disputed status. Citing from talk page:

This article has been created by the editor of Serbian nationality in order to offend Ethnic Albanians living in Kosovo

It is unrelated who created this article. Is this main reason for the delete? I think so. Article should be expanded, so it's relevance can be seen easier then. -- Tadijataking 00:19, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Aren't you Kosovo-topic banned, for 2 weeks?  kedadi al  18:34, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
 * No. And you should not worry about me, thanks anyway! -- Tadijataking 01:32, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Tadija is Balkans topic banned but only regarding articles.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 16:18, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * No, i am not topic banned. You should stop talking about me, that is violation of wiki rules. -- Tadijataking 17:30, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * according to this you are under editing restrictions.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 17:34, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * As the administrator who placed that restriction, I can confirm that it applies only to articlespace and not the Wikipedia: namespace (such as AFD discussions). The Wordsmith Communicate 17:45, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete, it must be delete because it is historical nonsense, it where the serbs that came from oeral to colonise the balkan--Vinie 007 04:53, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete, it is a wp:cfork as Ray says. In fact the article is a copy/paste of parts of History of Ottoman Kosovo and History of Kosovo. The creator of the article seems also to misuse the term colonisation applying it broadly to minor unorganized migration.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 10:42, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete, This article represents serbian POV. It's title is formed in a propagandistic style, trying to build a historical falseness. Piasoft (talk) 17:15, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete, This article is a provocation written by a serb nationalist. it's difficult to define the migration of albanian in Kosovo colonozation.User:Lucifero4


 * Delete, per piasoft-- LONTECH    Talk  19:12, 12 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep There is a lot to be written here. --Alexmilt (talk) 12:15, 13 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete, as per piasoft and Lucifero4 reasoning. If someone is interested in population movements inside Kosovo, we can create an article about that since prehistorical times, but in my opinion is useless anyway Aigest (talk) 16:19, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Comment: I see that wp:Albania was already informed about this afd, so I posted a notice on wp:serbia and wp:kosovo too.Alexikoua (talk) 19:30, 13 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete or Redirect to History of Ottoman Kosovo, Albanians in Kosovo or History of Kosovo.___Kebeta (talk) 20:05, 13 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Notes from the starter of the article: I haven't edited since i started the article and i'm about to expand the article, you can clearly see that the ones that oppose the article are all ethnic Albanians. The colonization of Kosovo was part of the wider Ottoman colonization, however this article will only encompasse the colonization of Albanians by the Ottoman Empire and later in the 19th and 20th centuries. Strong Keep / Ajdebre (talk) 20:25, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 * No, they're not. You're suggesting that even the nominator is an Albanian, which he isn't.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 20:29, 13 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, it is. Nominator is Lontech, Chase me just moved it to AfD. -- Tadijataking 01:29, 14 April 2010 (UTC)


 * He wasn't obligated to move to AfD, as Manford, Kebeta and others who voted for its deletion aren't Albanians.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 09:28, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Delete, pov fork article with subject mentioned in other articles.--Kushtrim123 (talk) 20:28, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

* Keep. I think that this article should exist and should broadly cover this topic than History of Ottoman Kosovo solely from demographic aspects. History of Ottoman Kosovo should be reserved for fighting between Balkan nations, Serbian and Albanian national revival, etc. -- Bojan   Talk  02:39, 15 April 2010 (UTC) I have just seen this Demographics of Kosovo. So, I'm neutral on existence of this article as long as same facts are standing in article Demographics of Kosovo. -- Bojan   Talk  02:46, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep and stick to historicity. This is historically accurate, if presently politically-loaded. --Chris (クリス • フィッチュ) (talk) 03:57, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Keep ... demografic data is referenced. Like Bokica, I'm neutral on existence of this article as long as same facts are standing in article Demographics of Kosovo. --Kaster (talk) 12:29, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete, not based on historical facts and pure fictional. Add it to stupidities section if it exists.--Joe The Dassaret 03:39, 16 April 2010 (UTC) — Joe The Dassaret (talk • contribs) has made few or no other edits outside this topic.
 * Comment This user has zero contribs prior to voting here. Most likely a meat-puppet recruited off-wiki to participate here. Athenean (talk) 21:17, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep - There are many articles describing process of colonization of some territory. I don't see a problem with such articles especially if there are referenced sources in them.--Antidiskriminator (talk) 13:15, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Strongly Delete. It is quite clear that the author of that article has created a POV-ish article, without the needed sources. It is the same as saying that the Slavic migration in the Balkans is a case of a Slavic colonisation (which it is a bit true). Even if Albanians would have gone in Kosovo after 1500, which is totally untrue (ask any historian as says Noel Malcolm) it can not be a different article, except of just a passage in Ottoman Kosovo. As for who colonised who, somebody may read Colonisation of Kosovo 1918-1941... Thanks, Balkanian`s word (talk) 18:49, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep, possibly rename to something more neutral like "Albanian migration to Kosovo". Subject is notable, there is no record of Albanians in Kosovo before the Ottoman conquest.  I fail to see what article it is a content fork of, that is an inane argument.  I also note most of the delete votes come from members of the Albanian National Wikipedia Team, all of whom have voted (some have even come out of retirement to do so), and are of the WP:IDONTLIKEIT type.  Athenean (talk) 22:20, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Comment: 90-95% of users who have voted keep are either Serbs or Greeks. Obviously this AfD has turned into a polarized debate, with some users openly asking support from other users (the message is in Serbian).-- — ZjarriRrethues —  talk 23:26, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment: First, and most important, that is not true, and second, you forgot to mentioned that higher percentage of Delete votes are Albanian, then Serbs and Greeks on Keep. -- Tadijaspeaks 12:22, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment: From the users who have voted delete most are Serbs, that's a plain fact.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 14:13, 17 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Delete pov copyfork-- Kënga  Jonë  10:50, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment:This vote is user's 8th edit, not included user space. Also likely a meat-puppet. -- Tadijaspeaks
 * Comment: If you actually checked this user's contributions you would see that he has written Sotir Peçi entirely by himself, managed to take it to DYK and his low number of article space edits is because if you check his contributions he's writing articles in his userspace before transfering them to article space. Also I see that this user has written several articles in the Albanian wikipedia as he says on his userpage. So no he's not a meatpuppet just because you don't like his opinion Tadija.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 13:07, 17 April 2010 (UTC)
 * ! -- Tadijaspeaks 14:26, 17 April 2010 (UTC)

Keep: I dont see a reason why we should remove this. It's a historical article that needs expantion, that's all. It is noteworthy that the Albanian side mobilized all their member very quickly informing their Wikiproject 'only'.Alexikoua (talk) 15:45, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Comment:Discussion about the article was started days before the article being nominated for deletion, so your theory is absolutely unreal. On another majority who want this article kept are Serbs or Greeks, as Alexikoua's keep opinion verified.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 16:27, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Comment: We don't need a wikilaywer. The Albanian lobby informed wp:Albania 'only' and this is a fact. No wonder it was immediately mobilized.Alexikoua (talk) 19:24, 18 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Removing of almost entire article

User:Kedadi deleted almost entire article that was expanded in order to push article deletion. Also, here should be noted that meatpuppetry is stricltly forbiden on wikipedia. -- Tadijataking 01:42, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, it is . Alexmit should stop trying to get support.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 09:31, 14 April 2010 (UTC)

Artical is on voting here, so stop vandalising it now by deleting huge parts of it.--Alexmilt (talk) 08:30, 14 April 2010 (UTC) you don't like it. That is essence of vandalism. -- Tadijataking 17:40, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * That's not the definition of vandalising, because most of the article is wp:or.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 09:28, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Stop with that. No, you are not right. If you doubt about source, than you should ask for opinion on WP:RS. You ARE NOT allowed to delete all of that just because
 * I'm not doubting the source, because there isn't a source for most of the article. It's a copy/paste article and the the only source related to the article is about the first sentence.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 17:46, 14 April 2010 (UTC)
 * That's not true, sources are throughout entire article. And there is nothing bad in one copy from related article. As you see, article is under expansion. -- Tadijataking 08:57, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * 99% of the sources have no relation to the subject itself. Being entirely a copy/paste from other articles is the essence of WP:CFORK and as such the article should be deleted.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 09:38, 15 April 2010 (UTC)
 * You are completely out of point. First, it is not true, sources are ok, and highly related. Second, even that sources are not good, that cannot be reason for deletion. -- Tadijataking 19:09, 15 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Goal of the page

This page is trying to explain the proces of chaniging the demographic picture of Kosovo through Osmanian empire. And to answer on question how is it possible that the province that was more than 95% serbian in 14th century, come into 20th century when albanian population is more than 60%. How this happend? Was this just a normal thing where is no place for a topic or there were some proces that change demographic structure so dramaticly. There is a lot to be written but in this moment no one can work under the pressure of this voting. So I would like to get few monts (2-3) period when we can really work and make a credibile artical. I am sorry if this topic heart someones feelings but I can promise that everything what would be written can have credibile references. --Alexmilt (talk) 00:05, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Read History of Kosovo, Demographics of Kosovo, Kosovo Province, Ottoman Empire, Albanians in Kosovo, Serbs in Kosovo and wp:cfork(the essence of this article)-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 10:44, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * With this logic we should delete also Colonisation of Kosovo 1918-1941? --Alexmilt (talk) 13:46, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * If most of its content was found in the articles I mentioned then yes, but its content isn't mentioned in any of those articles.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 13:47, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * But the article Albanian colonisation of Kosovo is just started to be written! How you know that this content is mentioned somewhere else? This article is on beginning. So stop with this sabotage, give people freedom to work and after some period of time it will be clear is there space for something like this or not. --Alexmilt (talk) 13:59, 16 April 2010 (UTC)
 * Please read wp:cfork.-- — ZjarriRrethues — talk 14:03, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Keep: Article appears to be well sourced, even though there have been attempts to remove sources, by many of the same users trying to delete the article now. POV problems are not a criteria for deletion. This deletion seems to be based on WP:JUSTDONTLIKEIT type arguments. Kostja (talk) 16:43, 18 April 2010 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.