Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/András Gerevich


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus.  Sandstein  18:37, 31 March 2022 (UTC)

András Gerevich

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Fails per WP:BASIC, There are very few intellectually independent articles on this person to establish notability. Sid95Q (talk) 02:16, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Authors, Poetry, Austria, Hungary,  and Ireland.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 03:18, 9 March 2022 (UTC)


 * András is a notable hungarian poet who's poetry is used in education and has been translated to multiple languages. What would you like to see in the article for it to be worthy for Wikipedia? 193.226.244.209 (talk) 05:38, 9 March 2022 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz Read! Talk! 06:11, 16 March 2022 (UTC)
 * As per Notability (people) there should be multiple published secondary sources that are reliable and intellectually independent of each other but there hardly any independent articles in English or in Hungarian. Plus I can't see there contribution notable in academics per WP:PROF. Sid95Q (talk) 21:36, 9 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete we lack the indepdent secondary sources needed to build an article that is not original research.John Pack Lambert (talk) 20:06, 10 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment Keep. The relevant policy here is WP:NAUTHOR; to demonstrate that he has created... a significant or well-known work or collective body of work" the sourcing we're looking for is multiple reviews of multiple works. Frankly, anyone who has had the kind of published praise that is quoted in this article (from the preface to his translation) is someone I expect to be bountifully reviewed. If his works have taught in schools, that would also be a WP:NBOOK pass for the works in question. I don't have time at the moment to track down reviews myself but I think a delete is premature unless someone does do a thorough search for reviews of his works and makes the case that they are lacking. It's also my understanding that faculty profiles like this one, and interviews like the ones currently on the article, although they do not count as sigcov to establish notability, do count as RS to write a verifiable encyclopedia article -- which makes said article eminently writable. Even without those, the reviews of his works will let us summarize them, which is the most important part of an author's encyclopedia entry. ~ L 🌸  (talk) 03:32, 11 March 2022 (UTC)
 * No source mentions that "his works have been taught in schools", no mention even in the University profile. Sid95Q (talk) 13:48, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Since the IP editor said he was, I wanted to note that it would be a valid keep rationale. Nobody would mention that in their university profile, it would be weird, and it's also a little weird for news sources to comment on it. I don't typically try to prove NBOOK 4 because it usually requires primary sources which aren't as easy to find as reviews or as useful once you have them. However, a simple search of "'András Gerevich' syllabus" turns up one right away: he was taught in "Literature and the Place of Central Europe" spring 2011 at NYU (can't link the PDF download). Looking for Hungarian syllabi would likely turn up more. But as I said, I prefer NBOOK 1 to show his works are notable, which doesn't take many reviews: just two each for a couple works. As a source for a more GNG/sigcov route, worth noting he gets about a page in the book Queer Stories of Europe, where he is one of only two Hungarian poets discussed (p. 19-20). Argh, I should have just taken that time to do dig up reviews directly, as I have to go now, but I was curious about the syllabi... but I feel confident enough that reviews WP:NEXIST that I'd say "keep". ~ L 🌸  (talk) 17:00, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * While I'm closing tabs -- another PDF download, "Stephen Spender prize 2017," someone won second place for translating him & there are three people talking about his poetry & references to two others (next thread to pull-- what did Claire Pollard say about him? where?) ~ L 🌸  (talk) 17:04, 13 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Ok, I went looking for coverage of him / reviews of his books. Review of co-edited book on Heaney. Very long review of Tiresias’s Confession (this is Claire Pollard). Second review of Tiresias’s Confession (NBOOK pass). Article discussing Átadom a pórázt. Analysis of the poem "Men and Friends". Analysis of Gerevich, not sure which works. Analysis of Férfiak. Paragraph on Gerevich as a poet overall, discussing an anthology he's in. According to this book review, the book Szodoma és környéke: Homoszocialitás, barátságretorika és queer irányulások a magyar költészetben ('Sodom and its Environs: Homosociality, Friendship Rhetoric and Queer Orientations in Hungarian Poetry') (Zoltán Csehy 2014) discusses Gerevich. I feel like I am still missing things because I don't know Hungarian and my library website is down so I'm using Google Scholar instead (and can't access ProQuest). I also suspect there is more coverage out there from before he was a poet, since several of these mention award-winning animated films, but I haven't found the names of those films. Overall, I can only demonstrate one NBOOK pass, but his general body of work seems to get a lot of discussion as important queer Hungarian poetry. ~ L 🌸  (talk) 06:49, 14 March 2022 (UTC)
 * @LEvalyn The films might be these? -- asilvering (talk) 18:50, 16 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Also, I don't want to link this one in the article because it's about the least independent kind of interview possible, but there are some leads here for more, I think. . -- asilvering (talk) 18:54, 16 March 2022 (UTC)
 * and can't access ProQuest. For convenience, these are all the results I found in Proquest
 * is a German translation in Die Welt and a short bio
 * =, which you mention above as the analysis of Férfiak
 * is an English translation in Out and a short bio/review of his oeuvre
 * is an Independent article about literary circles in Budapest mentioning his Hungarian translations of Seamus Heaney
 * = mentions him as a Hungarian poet focusing on the gay experience in the early 21st century
 * Lemme know if anyone needs a PDF/ the text of any of these above. Additional ProQuest results which I don't have full access to via ProQuest (but luckily can generally still access):
 * Queer Stories of Europe 2016 Preview which looks promising based on what I can see for the first chapter. Google Books suggest all of the discussion of Gerevich is in the first chapter, which the preview has almost all of.
 * Dienstleister, kongeniale Mitautoren, Kulturvermittler? Literarische Übersetzer aus dem Ungarischen ins Deutsche, mentions the German translation Teiresias' Geständnisse
 * "Gender trouble in a grammatically genderless language: Hungarian" = discusses how he makes use of the ambiguity of the Hungarian pronoun ő and how his translators have had to adapt
 * Translation and Intercultural Communication 2019 p. 125 mentions him as part of the contemporary canon of Hungarian literature published in Szirtes's anthology An Island of Sound
 * Contested Identities: Literary Negotiations in Time and Place Sample 2015, just thanked in acknowledgements
 * Theatre of the Rule of Law: Transnational Legal Intervention in Theory and Practice = just thanked in acknowledgements
 * Obviously the ones that are just thanks in the acknowledgements aren't useful for this but I figured since you don't have access to ProQuest I'd let you know what ProQuest would have shown you and say what everything is to save others' time in finding out why ProQuest listed them. Of these I think the chapter "The End of Gay and Lesbian Literature as a Happy End" in Queer Stories of Europe is most helpful.
 * Umimmak (talk) 19:48, 16 March 2022 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Sexuality and gender-related deletion discussions.  ~ L 🌸  (talk) 18:29, 16 March 2022 (UTC)

Notified: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject LGBT studies. ~ L 🌸 (talk) 18:32, 16 March 2022 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Star   Mississippi  01:24, 24 March 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment: frankly, it would be extraordinary for someone with this much English-language coverage to not have enough Hungarian sources to be notable. Not voting yet because I expect I could turn up some more, but I've added some references to the article so it's no longer an unsourced BLP - someone can use the biographical information in those to fill out the biography. Before anyone chimes in to say "those sources aren't independent, though": yes, I know interviews are not independent. Queer Stories and Colin Herd's review are, though. (And in case anyone gets skeptical about the blogspot link: it's fine, we even have an article on that journal (Chroma: A Queer Literary Journal). Blogspot is free and queer academics are frequently broke.) -- asilvering (talk) 19:11, 16 March 2022 (UTC)
 *  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.