Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Aylestone Park F.C. (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   delete.  Jujutacular  talk 03:34, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

Aylestone Park F.C.
AfDs for this article: 
 * – ( View AfD View log )

This article is about a non-notable football club. The previous AfD resulted in the page being kept because of a seemingly non-existent clause in WP:FOOTYN (I've been around WikiProject Football for over 5 years and have heard nothing of any level 10 "cut-off point" for notability). The fact of the matter is that this club has never participated in a national league or cup competition and there are not enough independent sources to infer notability per the general notability guidelines. Big Dom  23:06, 26 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in WikiProject Football's list of association football-related deletions. ChrisTheDude (talk) 19:55, 27 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Delete - club hasn't played above level 11 of the English football pyramid, and therefore isn't notable by current standards. GiantSnowman 16:02, 28 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Keep - my bad, hadn't realised this team's league was once reformatted. Notability is not temporary - if it was once notable, then it still is. GiantSnowman 23:36, 29 March 2011 (UTC)
 * But no guidelines or policies state anywhere that playing at level 10 infers notability. It just seems to be something a couple of you made up one day. Big  Dom  07:10, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * For current teams I understand its use because generally if a team gets to level 10 it means they qualify to play in the FA Cup, thus qualifying for an article according to guidelines anyway. In the past level 10 wasn't always the cut-off point for qualification (thus no Aylestone in the FA Cup). This is why I think the cut-off point should be playing in the FA Cup/FA Trophy/FA Vase (i.e. national cup competitions) instead. This case is particularly confusing for me as it's not exactly clear what level each league was at particular moments in time, between what time period was the Leicestershire Senior League level 10? Shouldn't this be mentioned in the article to prevent arguments? Personally I think there should be a guideline specifically for the notability of english football teams to avoid ambiguity. Delusion23 (talk) 09:57, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * But the NFOOTY guideline says that clubs that played in the FA Cup are notable, not clubs that are eligible to play. And I agree that we need some proof that the Leicestershire Senior League was a level 10 competition. Big  Dom  11:00, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * True. But every club at level 10 this season has now had a season in the FA Cup (e.g. least 1 game in the FA Cup, even if it's the extra preliminary), which is why it's often seen as the cut-off point for current teams. Whether it should track back to any club that has ever played at level 10 is another matter entirely. It's much easier to check if a team has played in the FA Cup/FA Vase than it is to check if any of the leagues they have played in were at level 10 equivalent at the time they were in them. Especially as there is no mention on many of the league articles of what level they have been during which seasons. Delusion23 (talk) 12:56, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * It's not true that every level 10 club has played in the FA Cup this season. Even though they are eligible, there's nothing to stop them (or teams in higher divisions, for that matter) from simply not applying to enter the Cup. For example, just from my local level 9/10 league (the North West Counties Football League) one of the Level 9 clubs (Barnoldswick Town) didn't compete (I don't think they have ever played in the FA Cup) and at least 5 of the Level 10 teams didn't enter. I think this might be a discussion better had at WT:WPF so that more people can see it. I definitely agree with you that it is much easier to check whether a club has played in the Cup than whether they have played in a Level 10 league. Big  Dom  16:24, 30 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Gary Lineker has started his career at the club. Surely that would be notable, right? -- S iva1979 Talk to me 08:24, 31 March 2011 (UTC)
 * WP:NOTINHERITED -- ChrisTheDude (talk) 08:31, 31 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Delete. Has never participated in the FA Cup, failing WP:FOOTYN. Argyle 4 Life  talk  19:06, 28 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment Level 10 cut-off point has been used as an argument to keep football team articles in the past. Though I don't actually agree with it, it does appear to be concensus. I nominated Colden Common F.C. for deletion under the same criteria (no FA cup, no FA Vase, playing at low level) but it was kept as the team once played at a league level that was once considered level 10. Here is the AfD conversation . According to this article's 1st AfD they played in a league that was at the time level 10. Thus from precedent it should be kept, both GiantSnowman and Argyle 4 life contributed to the keep argument. Delusion23 (talk) 21:51, 28 March 2011 (UTC)
 * My keep in the Colden Common AfD was based on the outcome of this discussion, which I forgot about when it came to this club. When judging the merits of Aylestone Park I used WP:FOOTYN, which only says that a club is notable if it competes in the national cup. The level 10 cut off didn't sit well with me, but I voted to keep Colden Common because it had been kept previously and nothing had changed since then. Argyle 4 Life  talk  22:46, 28 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Strong Keep - The club was once part of a Level 10 league. The consensus has been to have articles for Level 10 clubs. Even though at present the club got relegated, notability is not temporary, it is permanent. -- S iva1979 Talk to me 07:21, 29 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Regardless of whether or not in confers notability, do we have actually have any evidence that the club ever played in a level 10 league? Their own history page only mentions youth teams, and their tournaments page only under-12 competitions. WP:V is a policy and supersedes WP:FOOTYN, so unless someone can find any evidence, delete. Alzarian16 (talk) 16:57, 3 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Delete the team has not played in the national cup of England. Delusion23 (talk) 00:29, 4 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Delete. Not my job to source this article or second guess which level the club got to or interpret footyn for this very particular case. As it stands it fails footyn, if a ref demonstrating they played level 10 appears I'll change my vote. Szzuk (talk) 21:15, 4 April 2011 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.