Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Benjamín De Hoyos


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. The discussion indicates the subject currently lacks sufficient coverage that is independent and significant. RL0919 (talk) 03:02, 8 February 2019 (UTC)

Benjamín De Hoyos

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A non-notable subject that does not meet the bar of WP:BASIC. Primary sources, passing mentions, passing quotations and name checks do not establish notability. WP:BEFORE searches have provided no better. North America1000 21:29, 16 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of People-related deletion discussions. North America1000 21:29, 16 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. North America1000 21:29, 16 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Mexico-related deletion discussions. North America1000 21:29, 16 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete – I checked a few Mexican sources and they only mention him in passing. No in-depth coverage from third-party (non-LDS affiliated) sources. MX ( ✉  •  ✎  ) 21:50, 16 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Keep His leadership of Latter-day Saint opposition to the redefinition of marriage in Mexico made major headlines in multiple locations. See here, here from the Religion News service , the article from the Salt Lake Tribune already linked to in the article. Here is a very biased against De Hoyos source that leads with a half-page photo of him . This is multiple locations, multiple coverage. We have multiple sources mentioning him and his actions. This is clearly enough to pass any reasonable reading of the general notability guidelines.John Pack Lambert (talk) 22:51, 16 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Comment from nominator – The sources presented above demonstrate that this is a WP:BLP1E situation, whereby the coverage is all about one event, specifically, Hoyos being against gay marriage. All of the articles linked above are from June 1-2, 2016. Regarding content in the sources presented directly above:
 * – contains some content, but I feel that it falls short of significant coverage. There's a quotation, there's a mention of where the quote occurred, a mention of the LDS Church asking local bishops to parrot Hoyos' comment, and a mention that Hoyos "encouraged members of the church to join family and religious advocacy groups who oppose same-sex marriage." That's it.
 * – A single passing mention, not much more than a name check: "Signed by the Area Authority president, Benjamin De Hoyos, and his two counselors, Paul B. Pieper and Arnulfo Valenzuela, the statement exhorted Mexico’s Mormons to push government leaders to “promote those measures designed to strengthen the family and to maintain it as the fundamental unit of society." This is not significant coverage. The subject signed something; no other information about the subject is presented.
 * – Provides marginally significant coverage. So, this is one source.
 * However, the fact remains that this is a WP:BLP1E situation, meaning that the subject is not notable as per Wikipedia's standards. North America1000 00:14, 17 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Leaning toward keep. I may come up with other reasons later, but it should count for something that Elder De Hoyos has spoken thrice in General Conference. DavidLeeLambert (talk) 11:26, 17 January 2019 (UTC) — Note: An editor has expressed a concern that DavidLeeLambert (talk • contribs) has been canvassed to this discussion.
 * A primary source stating that a subject has given speeches does not confer notability on English Wikipedia. Primary sources are not usable to establish notability. North America1000 18:03, 17 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Delete First, community consensus is that LDS leaders have to meet WP:GNG (see discussions in 2014, 2016, 2017, and 2018). Most of the sources in the article are not independent (lds.org, MormonNewsroom.org, Church News, Liahona, Ensign, the Almanac that says Deseret News on the label but is actually assembled by official Church News staff) or not reliable ("Grampa Bill"). Search finds mostly passing mentions and routine coverage (e.g. this person was at the temple opening), plus some quotes reprinted from church press releases. However, there is also coverage of this subject's leadership in opposing the constitutional amendment to legalize same-sex marriage in Mexico. (Note that I have removed the "traditional definition of marriage" POV from the article that did not reflect the cited source's characterizations.) But, as the nominator notes above, that simply makes this a WP:BLP1E issue, as the individual is otherwise low-profile and the event itself was not even significant enough to merit a mention in the The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in Mexico article. So, even though some coverage exists, WP:BLP1E policy trumps guidelines. Bakazaka (talk) 21:32, 23 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Keep This source, from a non-LDS source, says De Hoyos is the highest LDS Authority in South America. Whether that's true or not, it attests to notability and is well outside the same-sex marriage timeframe. jj (talk) 05:41, 24 January 2019 (UTC) https://www.eltribuno.com/salta/nota/2018-9-25-19-4-0--urtubey-se-reunio-con-autoridades-de-la-iglesia-de-jesucristo-de-los-santos-de-los-ultimos-dias — Preceding unsigned comment added by JasonJack (talk • contribs) 05:41, 24 January 2019 (UTC)
 * A matter, though, is that religious subjects do not have any presumed notability on English Wikipedia. Also, the source you provided is only a one sentence, passing mention that states, "There was also Elder Benjamín De Hoyos, member of the Seventy and highest authority in South America." This is not significant coverage, which is needed to qualify notability. North America1000 14:48, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, DannyS712 (talk) 08:23, 24 January 2019 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete - This subject is non-notable and fails WP:BASIC and WP:GNG. Skirts89 (talk) 15:11, 24 January 2019 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Ad Orientem (talk) 00:37, 1 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Delete. I respectfully disagree with : this doesn't even rise to BLP1E. There is no significant coverage of the subject independent of the church in which he has a leadership position, hence failure of WP:BIO. The leadership position does not by itself imply notability. Lagrange613 10:29, 3 February 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.