Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Billingsley High School


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. Randykitty (talk) 17:23, 10 April 2021 (UTC)

Billingsley High School

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K-12 school, Single source in article is to a government database report, BEFORE showed no SIGCOV with direct and indepth coverage (mill coverage of sports scores in local paper). Article does not meet GNG or ORGCRIT. No school district article exists. No objection to a redirect to town article if there is a consensus.  // Timothy :: talk  09:14, 10 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Schools-related deletion discussions.  // Timothy :: talk  09:14, 10 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Alabama-related deletion discussions.  // Timothy :: talk  09:14, 10 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Education-related deletion discussions. Shellwood (talk) 10:10, 10 March 2021 (UTC)


 * Delete nothing even close to the level of sources we need to have an article. There is just not coverage out there to justify having articles on every school in the world that instructs at the level that in the US is considered high school.John Pack Lambert (talk) 13:37, 10 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep - BEFORE doesn't mean "type the current school name in Google. If nothing good comes up, delete." This is a rural area, but there are newspapers there, and to think that no coverage exists on a school that once burnt down, and has been rebuilt twice since then, has won two state athletic championships and had a staff member win a statewide honor is, well, ludicrous. The scope of sources doesn't end at the end of Google. There are hundreds of smaller papers that have not been digitized at all. Wikipedia's scope doesn't end at encyclopedia, either. We are also a gazetteer and an almanac. This should be kept, but even if there were no chance of a viable article here, the title should be redirected, not deleted. 174.254.192.241 (talk) 18:07, 10 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Delete There's actually news coverage of this school from local outlets on Google News. So, I'm not sure what the IP user is talking about. My guess is they didn't bother to look and just assumed there wasn't because "small town" or something. The issue is that the existing coverage is extremely trivial and doesn't pass WP:NORG. That would also go for any potential articles about the school "burning down" as it does for anything else that there is available coverage on. Plus, there has to be at least coverage in a regional or national outlet for notability to be a thing anyway and I'm just not seeing it. It would be hard to argue that is simply because of a regional or national paper not being digitized. Compared to just because something like a fire at a small town high school is trivial enough that isn't worth a national outlet covering. --Adamant1 (talk) 02:57, 11 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Please cite policy for your claim that before a school is notable, it must be covered nationally. That too is ludicrous. 174.254.192.241 (talk) 18:05, 11 March 2021 (UTC)
 * That's not what I said. So, I'm good. Although, WP:AUD does say "attention solely from local media, or media of limited interest and circulation, is not an indication of notability; at least one regional, statewide, provincial, national, or international source is necessary." Which to me means just local sources doesn't work for notability. Your free to interpret it how you want though. --Adamant1 (talk) 18:18, 11 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment - In previous practice there had been requests for elementary and middle schools to have "national" level coverage to be included, but high schools were let by with local sourcing. WhisperToMe (talk) 06:10, 12 March 2021 (UTC)

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. Knight, Barbara. (1998-10-25). "Billingsley getting great present for 100th birthday" (pages 1 and 2). The Prattville Progress. Archived from the original (pages 1 and 2) on 2021-03-15. Retrieved 2021-03-15 – via Newspapers.com. The article notes that Billingsley School had a centennial in 1998. When the school opened, the schedule was influenced by the agricultural calendar. In October 1998, the school started work on a $8.2 million campus. The school's principal, Van Smith, studied at Billinglsey, where he received a high school diploma in 1971. His father graduated in 1936 and his two sons graduated in 1995 and 1998. His mother was a Billinglsey teacher for three decades. In the early part of the twentieth century, the school kept is classroom heated through firewood provided by parents. Students had to fetch water and cut the firewood for the wood stove. The school started in 1898 as a "the first one-room school in Billingsley". The people who spearheaded the school's creation were Dr. A.J. Marlar, T.L. Patrick, W.I. Gandy, and W.W. Carter. The school was first based on a Baptist Church property. The school's next building was constructed in 1906. In Fall 1932, the school building was ravaged by a fire. The students resumed their classes that year in the Methodist Church and the Masonic Hall. The school was rebuilt during the Great Depression.  The article notes that Billingsley School had a centennial in 1998. The school is on 104,000-square-foot lot. The school spent $8.2 million to construct a new campus. Jackson, John. (1987-09-09). "50 years later, Billingsley School is showing age, outgrowing space" (pages 1 and 2). Alabama Journal. Archived from the original (pages 1 and 2) on 2021-03-15. Retrieved 2021-03-15 – via Newspapers.com. The article discusses Billingsley School. The article notes, "Billingsley School, which serves about 540 Autauga County students, is something of a rarity in modern public education. One schooll serves youngsters in kindergarten through grade 12." The article notes that the school building was built in the 1930s, two additional buildings were constructed in the 1930s, and a gym was added in 1961. The article notes that "Billingsley is a school that is showing its age and has outgrown its campus". Plunkett, David. (1987-12-12). "Billingsley School parents face battle seeking 'sound of music'" (pages 1 and 2). The Prattville Progress. Archived from the original (pages 1 and 2) on 2021-03-15. Retrieved 2021-03-15 – via Newspapers.com. </li> <li></li> </ol>There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Billingsley High School to pass Notability, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". Cunard (talk) 01:47, 15 March 2021 (UTC) </li></ul>
 * The school passes Notability (organizations and companies), which says: "All universities, colleges and schools, including high schools, middle schools, primary (elementary) schools, and schools that only provide a support to mainstream education must either satisfy WP:ORG, general notability guideline, or both. For-profit educational organizations and institutions are considered commercial organizations and must satisfy those criteria. (See also WP:SCHOOLOUTCOMES, especially for universities.)" Since Billingsley High School is a public school so is not a "commercial organization", it can satisfy either WP:ORG or WP:GNG or both which means that it does not need to pass Notability (organizations and companies). My evaluation of the sources is that it passes WP:GNG. Cunard (talk) 01:47, 15 March 2021 (UTC)
 * As I'm sure you know, there was recently an RfC which determined that subject specific notability guidelines take precedent over WP:GNG. It doesn't matter if it's a private or public organization. It's still an organization. So in this case the subject specific notability guidelines are WP:ORG. Period. Since that's clearly what the consensus about it is.--Adamant1 (talk) 02:09, 15 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Billingsley High School passes the subject-specific notability guideline Notability (organizations and companies). Cunard (talk) 04:29, 15 March 2021 (UTC)


 * Comment: Clearly the sources provided above are normal routine mill coverage, the type any school in the United States would receive; they don't demonstate notability, they show this is a normal average high school. None of it meets either ORGCRIT or GNG. If the above was considered enough to meet guidelines, then all high schools in the United States (and probably most schools in general) would automatically be notable.  // Timothy :: talk  05:03, 15 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Notability (organizations and companies) says a non-profit school is notable if it meets Notability, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". Neither guideline requires a school to be more than "a normal average high school". Neither guideline requires schools to have received coverage beyond "normal routine mill coverage, the type any school in the United States would receive". Cunard (talk) 05:35, 15 March 2021 (UTC)
 * There's still a requirement that what is in the articles is "notable" though and no one is going to argue that "Billingsley School parents face battle seeking 'sound of music'" is in any way notable as a topic. Anymore then what restaurant a random person went to on the weekend would be just because it's mentioned in TMZ or some other gossip outlet. --Adamant1 (talk) 08:07, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

<div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep per the excellent work by Cunard. The sources provided are definitely reliable secondary sources. However, it is debatable as to whether these sources are independent. Montgomery, Alabama, is located in the Southeast end of one county, but this school is located in the northeast end of the neighboring northwest county. That makes it hard to tell whether we can dismiss these references on the grounds that they are local sources. There are plenty of schools that are unambiguously unnotable, but this likely isn't one of them. Scorpions13256 (talk) 03:51, 20 March 2021 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Go  Phightins  !  15:21, 20 March 2021 (UTC) <div class="xfd_relist" style="border-top: 1px solid #AAA; border-bottom: 1px solid #AAA; padding: 0px 25px;"> Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ~ Aseleste  (t, e &#124; c, l) 11:05, 28 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep per my comment on Isabella High School, considering everyone else apparently copy-pasted their objections as well. <b style="color:#000">Vaticidal</b><b style="color:#66023C">prophet</b> 23:44, 28 March 2021 (UTC)
 * Comment The article in its current form won't pass WP:GNG. If someone wants to improve it to WP:HEY standard then I can reconsider. Considering the news report, a redirect to Billingsley, Alabama, where I made a brief mention, might be appropriate. Vikram Vincent 13:46, 3 April 2021 (UTC)
 * The current form of an article has no bearing on its notability. Eddie891 Talk Work 12:12, 4 April 2021 (UTC)


 * Keep - another school with objectively significant coverage. Bearian (talk) 16:00, 7 April 2021 (UTC)
 * Keep. Enough sourcing to establish notability, as with any American high school. -- Necrothesp (talk) 10:22, 8 April 2021 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.