Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Billy Pilgrim


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. No consensus to delete. The discussion wrt merging can continue on the article's talk page (non-admin closure) Ron Ritzman (talk) 00:17, 2 April 2009 (UTC)

Billy Pilgrim

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Entirely unsourced plot summary, any relevant info can be summarized in the novel's article. Suggest deletion, then moving Billy Pilgrim (group) to this title, with a hatnote pointing to Slaughterhouse-Five. Ten Pound Hammer and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 00:13, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Slaughterhouse-Five as it was the first use of the name. The hatnote should point to the group from the article on the book. As for this article, it consists of nothing but plot summary and should be replaced by the aforementioned redirect as it is a likely search term. Doc StrangeMailbox Logbook 01:05, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * I still think it would be better to move the band article to this title and leave a hatnote. This saves us from using a qualifier when there's no actual article for the qualifier-free name. Ten Pound Hammer  and his otters • (Broken clamshells • Otter chirps • HELP) 01:53, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment the band describes itself thusly on its own web page: "not currently active at this time, although this page will continue to remain a place where fans can come together and share their thoughts and memories, and also to keep tabs on the current endeavors of (its former members)" . It also states that its most recent album (2001) is "out of stock at CD Baby. At this time, no estimates are available for when this album will be available again". Compare that to the novel in which this character appears--continuously in print. Surely most people searching for Billy Pilgrim are looking for the character, not the defunct band? JJL (talk) 03:09, 29 March 2009 (UTC)


 * Keep, and then discuss whether or not to merge at the appropriate talk page, and which should be the primary title for the disam. . My view is that the protagonist of such a major novel is appropriate for an article, as all the sources on the novel and the film will talk about him also in a substantial way. There are multiple published guides and commentaries on them. When a character appears in both media, there are usually substantial comparisons   made. I know I'm saying, you other guys, go and do it.  But stop nominating articles on leading characters of major novels and I might have time to work more on content. DGG (talk) 02:26, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep protagonist of highly significant work and associated film. JJL (talk) 04:57, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Redirect to Slaughterhouse-Five. Billy Pilgrim isn't a notable character in himself and the article contains no content that evaluates him in an encyclopedic manner, nor does it contain any citations at all. At best, its plot summary and at worst its original research.  His notability apart from the book is little to none so this redirct should do little harm.  Them  From  Space  05:24, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment try a search on "Billy Pilgrim" on Google Books or Scholar. There are tons of sources. E.g.:, , . JJL (talk) 15:32, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Those sources all discuss Slaughterhouse 5, not Billy Pilgrim. It's impossible to discuss Pilgrim away from the works of Vonnegut because he's a character within the book. Notability isn't inherited from the book to the main character.  Them  From  Space  17:04, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Comment there are plenty that are on the character and his traits/circumstances:, , , , , . They are certainly not just analyses of Vonnegut's book(s). There's even a band named after the character . JJL (talk) 19:20, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep The major character in one of, if not the, most famous Vonnegut works, with many sources available focussing on the character,  making it clear that an article here is appropriate.John Z (talk) 21:19, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Keep and improve per project novels characters template. "The novel centers on Billy Pilgrim to a degree that excludes the development of the supporting characters, who exist in the text only as they relate to Billy's experience of events." pohick (talk) 23:24, 28 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Snow Keep per DGG and JohnZ. There are no lack of sources and any merge discussion should happen in talk pages, not here.   Speedy because I don't see  any chance this won't be kept.  Hobit (talk) 18:29, 29 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Merge with cull. Billy is Slaughterhouse-Five. The appropriate place for what's salvageable here is the article on the novel. This should be a redirect. I didn't look at the defunct band page… FWIW, I have read this; more than once and fairly recently. Cheers, Jack Merridew 07:22, 30 March 2009 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.