Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Blake Junior High School


 * This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.

The result of the debate was no consensus. – ABCD 02:22, 11 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Blake Junior High School
A junior high school. Does not establish notability. (previous vfd) &mdash;Korath (Talk) 04:47, Mar 23, 2005 (UTC)

GRider has made an attempt at vote-swinging for this nomination. (Added by User:Radiant!)
 * I categorically reject this statement as an unfounded personal attack. --GRider\talk 23:03, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Well-founded evidence of GRider's attempted vote swinging can be found at the request for arbitration currently in progress against him. Radiant_* 08:45, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)


 * Delete, not notable. Lacrimosus 06:03, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Make a mention in Tampa, Florida and delete. Not to mention the fact that the article is unclear whether this is a current or former name -- Skysmith 11:28, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete not notable. DaveTheRed 23:34, 23 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - Unless anything more historical to it. Saopaulo1 07:24, Mar 24, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. No potential to become encyclopedic. Jayjg (talk)  19:46, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * I strongly disagree, there is obviously some media coverage on the whole desegregation bussing. So the school is of itself notable. It desperately needs a rewrite but it should be kept.  ALKIVAR ™ 21:06, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Nn. Vlad M V  ٭ talk 21:24, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * There is something in there, but unless someone actually writes a decent article on whatever bussing is supposed to be, it's a claim to notability that doesn't actually explain why that makes it notable. Tentative delete. Chris 23:17, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Comment: Busing was a practice used to subtly desegregate schools by busing students from richer neighborhoods into poorer schools, and vice versa. This was most infamously seen in Boston in 1974:


 * In 1974, the city dealt with a crisis when a federal district court judge, W. Arthur Garrity, ordered busing to integrate the city's public schools. Racially-motivated violence erupted in several neighborhoods -- many white parents resisted the busing plan. Public schools - particularly public high schools - became scenes of unrest and violence. Tension continued throughout the mid-1970s, reinforcing Boston's reputation for discrimination. Mike H 09:04, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)
 * OK, I was originally thinking "Maybe keep if an explanation comes up", but it seems that the phenomenon is too widespread for any school affected to gain notability from it. My original vote stands. Chris 16:06, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)


 * Delete unless it can be rewritten. Also keep in mind that this barely survived VFD in October...not much has changed since then. Mike H 06:29, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)
 * Whoops. Sorry I overlooked that. &mdash;Korath (Talk) 08:52, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)
 * It's no problem. Mike H 09:01, Mar 25, 2005 (UTC)


 * Delete unless expanded. This could be a good article with work. Doc13mets 21:29, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Schools are notable enough. --Dittaeva 21:32, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.
 * Delete this doens't establish notability. (ps. Thanks go to G.Rider for spamming two talk pages I happen to have on my watchlist with a list of schools on VfD) Thryduulf 22:05, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, no valid reason per policy to delete the topic - David Gerard 22:12, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * To quote the deletion policy, valid reasons for deletion include "No potential to become encyclopedic" and "vanity", both of which this article fulfils. Also a brief reminder that in VfD we vote on the article not the topic.  In some cases, it is appropriate to delete a useless article on a worthy subject, but retaining redlinks so someone can do a better job later. Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.
 * Delete. Not notable. --Carnildo 23:11, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Bussing was a nation-wide phenomenon, not just here, so that's not particularly notable. --Calton | Talk 00:27, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Contains useful information.  Being a real school is sufficient notability in an encyclopedia with 500,000 entries.  --Zero 02:16, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Do you see schools listed in real general encyclopaediae simply for being "a real school"? Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider. Chris 12:46, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Tell us a "real" general encyclopaediae which has 500,000 entries so I can see how your question is relevant to what I said.--Zero 23:55, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Zero said it better than anyone else.--Gene_poole 02:17, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.
 * Keep Contains interesting information - Wikipedia is not paper. --ShaunMacPherson 02:43, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.
 * Keep. Has potential to become encyclopedic. --Andylkl (talk) 04:10, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
 * Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.
 * Delete. School vanity. Not a notable subject, so no potential to become encyclopedic. Jonathunder 04:40, 2005 Mar 26 (UTC)
 * Keep. What Zero0000 said.  &mdash;RaD Man (talk) 08:18, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.
 * Uh, no. My vote is completely legitimate, thanks for asking.  &mdash;RaD Man (talk) 15:59, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Bzzt! Wrong.  The notice on your talk page clearly predates your vote here.  Chris 14:32, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Don't you have something better to do? Who cares if a notice on a talk page predates my vote.   Believe it or not, many people here are capable of making their own decisions.  To imply otherwise is a bit insulting.  &mdash;RaD Man (talk) 17:19, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete, what Jonathunder said. Radiant_* 09:00, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, WINP. (Sam Spade | talk | contributions) 09:18, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * WIAN a schools guide. Not every school is of encyclopaedic importance. Human settlements are, by virtue of their founding and persistence.  Schools come and go all the time.  Discount vote as result of ballot-stuffing by GRider.  Chris 12:46, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep and improve, if the existence of the school is not disputed. Notability is subjective, but schools with more than a few students should automatically pass the test. Wiki is not paper. Someone please wake me up when there is finally a policy vote about keeping school articles.  ~leif &#9786; HELO 20:26, Mar 26, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, as some other voters point out, deletion of this would be against policy. Pcb21| Pete 21:29, 26 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Please identify exactly how it would be against policy, when it fails two valid criteria for deletion? Chris 14:30, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Further up you identify two supposed reasons for deletion : "No potential to become encyclopedic" and "vanity". I assume these are the two valid criteria you refer to. Re the first one: It already is encyclopedic, so that isn't a reason. Oh you mean you have a different definition of "encyclopedic" to me... well I don't think we are saying anything ground-breaking when we suggest that that deletion reason is more or less useless. "Vanity"... that makes no sense... vanity is a human trait... not something a school can possess. Why do you really want this harmless, factual, article deleted? Pcb21| Pete 14:56, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * It already is encyclopedic, so that isn't a reason. 404 Logic not found.  Ah, I see your mistake.  "Encyclopedic" doesn't mean "it's in the encyclopaedia", otherwise every article here would be automatically so.  In answer to your question, not only does it not add anything that we don't already have ("the school was opened, then it closed" - as if that's not here already), but contrary to your claim, it is not harmless.  Every single article like this is a hit on Wikipedia, and its reputation as a serious source of information.  People elsewhere might think "So, you've got nothing on the culture of third-world nation, but you've got two lines on some unimportant school in Florida?"  Why should schools not have to meet the same expectations we have of companies, organisations, musicians, politicians, artists, and everything else? Chris 16:01, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Chris, I know I probably sound iteratable to you, but I can't help get a bit tired of responding to the same old non-sequiturs. People have been using your line of reasoning "someone might come along ands say Wikipedia is bad because...." literally for years. But it simply is not true! People who write critically about Wikipedia never ever say it has too much on trivial topics. They never do it. (The complaint these days is always about credibility and sources, as you might expect). If you have any evidence to the contrary, I'd love to hear it.
 * P.s. Re "encyclopedic", you seem to misunderstand me. I already said in what you replying to that it depends what "encyclopedic" means... and then you go and tell me the same thing ;-). Pcb21| Pete 17:31, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * For the record, in Vanity_page, writing an article about your high school is clearly defined as a form of vanity. Radiant_* 08:56, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)
 * re the notability, using DPBsmith's BEEFSTEW guidelines, this scores 3 (ADJ). Thryduulf 15:21, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep T h e St ev e  16:40, Mar 27, 2005 (UTC)
 * Note response. Chris 17:10, 27 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Seems like a valid stub to me.  --L33tminion | (talk) 23:50, Mar 27, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. This pointless anti-schoool vendetta is becoming quite tiresome. All schools are public institutions, and all public institutions and facilities are notable by definition. That's right - all public institutions and facilities. And Chris should stop posting abusive comments unless he wants someone to start an RfC on him. --Centauri 06:50, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, valid stub, already survived a Vfd. Kappa 19:53, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep.--BaronLarf 21:31, Mar 28, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete - no longer even called that name and not notable. violet/riga (t) 22:55, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC) Keep violet/riga (t) 23:20, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Fails BEEFSTEW. Delete or merge with Tampa, Florida. -- Riffsyphon1024 22:57, Mar 28, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. BEEFSTEW is not policy.  All educational institutions are notable and encyclopedic.  --GRider\talk 23:04, 28 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Even though GRider and I disagree on most VfD votes, the contention that anybody's votes are unacceptable because of some perceived ballot stuffing is not valid. Only anons' and sockpuppets' votes are discounted. Editors in good standing have a perfect right to have their votes counted. This supposed policy change is inappropriate to discuss on a VfD page, and should be taken to Talk. RickK 00:19, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Historic context. Would merit a short article if the school hadn't even reopened. Samaritan 03:08, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep! be inclusive. SchmuckyTheCat 03:24, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. See my points at Wikipedia:Village pump (policy)#Any policy regarding school articles?. -- Toytoy 04:41, Mar 29, 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Junior high schools are not notable unless very famous persons attended, or major historic events occurred there.  Just being integrated or closing at the time of racial integration doesn't make a school historic or notable.  Rlquall 05:01, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * keep or redirect, unless we delete Goomba, Template:mehorses and similar harmless but non-notable stuff. dab (ᛏ) 06:00, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Note that Template:mehorses was deleted, and its articles merged together into one comprehensive article. Radiant_* 10:15, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Provides interesting and notable background on a public institution. (I also reject  the idea that  being informed of a VFD by another user (even a user as controversial as GRider!) discounts you from participating in the VFD.) --Jacobw 08:53, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)--Jacobw 08:53, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete. Junior high schools are inherently nonencyclopedic. --Angr 12:52, 29 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. --Daniel C. Boyer 20:19, 30 Mar 2005 (UTC)
 * keep this. Yuckfoo 20:33, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep - Wikipedia is not paper.   &mdash; PhilHibbs | talk 15:36, 4 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Delete Junior High Schools are not notable Dsmdgold 00:20, Apr 6, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep - As already stated, Wikipedia is not paper. --Oarias 02:36, 7 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Wikipedia ain't not no paper.  As long as Sentret exists, so should this.  brian0918    02:24, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)


 * Delete. Non-notable.  Noisy | Talk 10:30, Apr 8, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep, needs expansion. -- Lochaber 16:47, 8 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * merge and redirect to segregation and desegregation in Florida if not needed there delete. Mozzerati 07:52, 2005 Apr 9 (UTC)
 * Keep, seems very notable to me. Dan100 20:21, Apr 9, 2005 (UTC)
 * Keep. Schools are worth of inclusion! --Zantastik 07:04, 10 Apr 2005 (UTC)
 * Keeep. Wiki != Paper. Mystache 15:45, 24 July 2005 (UTC)


 * This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.