Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Brian Tarquin


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus. Given the debate has been relisted twice, and not much comment has been given to Tabletop123's rewrite, I don't think we can do much else with this for now. Ritchie333 (talk) (cont)  15:13, 28 August 2018 (UTC)

Brian Tarquin

 * – ( View AfD View log  Stats )

I'd be grateful if reviewers could consider this, and perhaps the linked articles on his discography. The article has been largely created by an editor with, what appears to be, a very direct but undeclared COI. They have existed in this state for some years. They don't have inline sourcing and would appear to be promotional. I suppose the first question is, does the subject meet our Music Notability criteria? If he doesn't, the answer's probably pretty easy. If he does, then the question as to what to do about the COI remains. I raised the issue at the COI noticeboard and the suggestion was to "stubify", but others appear not to favour this approach. Would really appreciate advice. I've let the author know. KJP1 (talk) 17:15, 26 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Bands and musicians-related deletion discussions. North America1000 18:05, 26 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of New York-related deletion discussions. Eastmain (talk • contribs) 18:07, 26 July 2018 (UTC)


 * Mr. Tarquin has won two Daytime Emmy Awards, in 2003 and in 2005  (page 4), for the music on All My Children. If these awards have the same status as the main Emmy Awards, then along with the AllMusic biography  and articles like this in Vintage Guitar  this looks like a straight keep according to criteria 1, 8 and 10 of WP:MUSICBIO. His album articles need looking at though – not sure any of them pass WP:NALBUM. Richard3120 (talk) 19:41, 26 July 2018 (UTC)
 *  Automatic keep. Subject is winner and nominee of major awards and has featured in independent sources of good standing. I have done some housekeeping to the article (structured the article, removed puffy statements, added sections, general cleanup and punctuation). With time and contribution this could evolve.--Tabletop123 (talk) 23:54, 26 July 2018 (UTC)
 * For the two Emmy awards his name is listed among a dozen or so of contributing composers for the entire TV season, all working under teams of musical directors. It's his good fortune to have been on the winning team, but he doesn't get singled out for significance (that is recognition that is given to the overall Music Supervisor and various Musical Directors). It looks good on a resume, I suppose, but much like those countless regional Emmys often touted by recipients, it's not the same as what we all usually associate with as being an Emmy Winner. Certainly not "marquee level." I'm refraining for ivoting for now, however, as 31 references are asking too much of my time to investigate, but at a glance most are the usual self-download, user submitted sites, although as mentioned above there may be a few good ones that add up worthy of a keep vote. But, yeah, cleaning up the reference clutter will help. ShelbyMarion (talk) 00:11, 27 July 2018 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Delete: Notability not established, clearly created by the subject himself and maintained as such along with several album articles. I've removed sources that were either dead links, links to his own website, or links to product pages. What is left appears to be a mix of blogs and PR content. WP:NMUSIC talks about winners of music awards; being listed in a large group for an Emmy isn't the same thing. Melcous (talk) 00:56, 27 July 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks,  Onel 5969  TT me 12:25, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Keep Multiple Emmy awards and nominations should easily satisfy WP:ANYBIO, enough coverage to satisfy WP:GNG. Hzh (talk) 14:03, 3 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete: At first sight the Emmys appear to signify a keep but on inspection it becomes apparent that the daytime emmys do not enjoy the same respect as the main awards and he was one of a dozen recipients in that category. I suspect if anyone else had created his page other than himself (and they were otherwise notable) they would not have chosen to mention these awards Lyndaship (talk) 15:17, 3 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Weak Delete I emphatically disagree there is such a thing as an “automatic” keep based on a rote checking off of bullet point criteria. The whole reason of Afd discussions is to debate how a subject meets criteria after editors have clicked on links to sources and verified the validity of claims, and research the deeper context behind references. As pointed out above, the Emmy’s are a bit of a red herring. Because several hundreds of these awards are cumulatively given out each year the TV academy has designated the Primetime Emmys as the major awards which equate to something like an Oscar or a Tony (I hesitate to include Grammy because those, too, are not equal in merit). Among the Daytime Emmys are several that could also be considered marquee. But here in one of the lesser recognized categories we have “All My Children” routinely being nominated (and at times winning) in a category contested by a very narrow pool of "Daytime Drama" candidates (in the 2000’s there were only around a half dozen Soap Operas left) Anyone who worked over the entire season is included with the award. It's really the luck of the assignment. He has also won ASCAP awards (not mentioned in the article) but these, too, are numerous and misleading the way the Emmys are. Otherwise, this subject appears to be a solid professional, making “musical pool” contributions to many projects/shows doing session work and composing, and releasing several CD’s on both small labels and his own. But a significant number of reliable, independent sources to indicate that this subject stands out are missing, just mostly niche industry “inside baseball” stuff and self-authored material. The AllMusic profile in particular seems suspect; over the years (since AllMusic acquisition by the Rovi database) the site has relied on less editorial oversight for its content, and the entry here, like this wiki article, seems more promotional and also suspiciously COI. But I give this a “weak delete” based on the Vintage Guitar article being a decent source, but it’s the only one. I could change my vote with more like it, though. ShelbyMarion (talk) 05:45, 4 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Keep A single Emmy, Grammy, Oscar, or Tony should be sufficient to earn a Wikipedia page. Same for a Nobel, Pulitzer, etc. While the delete votes have made a good case for minimizing the accomplishments of such a prestigious award, I respectfully disagree and submit that these folks deserve to have at least a brief history available for Wikipedia users to enjoy. Rusty Eichblatt, Aug 6, 2018
 * This vote was added by a new account, as their very first edit, immediately after the account was created.  ~Oshwah~  (talk) (contribs)   13:05, 6 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Removed unnecessary and confusing character-bolding. -The Gnome (talk) 14:45, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus. Relisting comment: Please note: There is no such thing as an automatic keep. A Nobel Prize is awarded to a maximum of 3 persons simultaneously and there's only a handful of awards worldwide once a year, which seems to be a fundamentally different situation from the awards listed here.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Randykitty (talk) 14:15, 12 August 2018 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep – This needs work, and I support shortening the article to remove the COI. But he's a multiple Emmy winner and he is notable for multiple things. This should be kept. Redditaddict6<b style="color:#3399FF">9</b> 12:59, 19 August 2018 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, — Alpha3031 (t • c) 13:03, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Delete. This reads like an advertisement (Brian Tarquin is an American multi Emmy award winning...), and I agree with the argument that being part of a big group award is meaningless. To be honest, this article is so badly referenced, it's difficult to evaluate it properly. For example, the statement, Three Emmy Awards for Outstanding Achievement in Music Direction and Composition for a Drama Series. has no reference. How can somebody go look up the awards he won if they're not specifically listed here? Also, citations such as, "Archived copy". Archived from the original on 2012-10-24. Retrieved 2013-05-10. make it impossible to make any judgement about the source without clicking through (and waiting for the archiving service to grovel its way to producing a page). -- RoySmith (talk) 13:06, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Rewrote the article. New matter, new references. The article definitely did harbor conflict of interest and needed proper referencing. Someone needs to look at the album articles too. --Tabletop123 (talk) 17:46, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the rewrite. A definite improvement to help editors more fairly judge the article. My "weak delete" vote from August 4 remains unchanged. New references do not substantially change the general feebleness of the sources and the fact that many of them are written by the subject himself. ShelbyMarion (talk) 18:21, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Cheers for the acknowledgement. The gent seems to be a solid professional and the fact that many guitar gurus have entrusted studio time at his furthers his case. Anyway, I've done my bit. Rest to be seen. Only fairness to be excercised @ final verdict, just 'casue he or his own have tried to promote his presence does not qualify a deletion of the article nor his professional crediblity. Editors have to excerciese a 'helicopter' view. Emotions apart.--Tabletop123 (talk) 01:45, 27 August 2018 (UTC)


 * Delete doesn't make the grade as far as notability goes the sources are too weak. The awards section is particularly telling, it contains claims that are only sourced to himself with the exception of the daytime Emmy joint awards, notably the best album and best book award which is a paid for award ($69 to enter one of the 100 or so categories). The claims to having sold 150,000 albums are unsourced, most of the charts info is self sourced and mostly non included in WP:Record charts. An autobiographical article surrounded by a walled garden of articles also created by the same user that will all need looking at. Over 10 years of COI and soapbox editing that has gone under the radar. Dom from Paris (talk) 23:14, 21 August 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. <b style="color:red">Please do not modify it.</b> Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.