Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/CC Slaughters


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was   keep. (non-admin closure) DavidLeighEllis (talk) 01:46, 15 February 2014 (UTC)

CC Slaughters

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Although this article about a gay bar does include references to reliable third-party sources, these sources consist of 1.) A listing in a Frommer's guide (Frommer's attempts to mention every gay and lesbian bar in the country in such guides) and 2.) two articles from the Willamette Weekly, which is a city paper in the state of Oregon, not a regional or national newspaper. On these grounds, the bar does not appear to meet WP:GNG and appears to be primarily a travel guide entry (see WP:NOTGUIDE). It exists, yes; it has had some news coverage, yes; but these things are true of many gay bars in Oregon which also don't have and so far do not appear to warrant Wikipedia articles about them (Scandals, Crush, The Egyptian Nightclub, etc.). This bar appears to not yet have risen to the level of notability required for a standalone article on Wikipedia, though I would be glad to withdraw the nomination if other editors could find evidence to the contrary... Also, I hear it's a fun bar. KDS 4444  Talk  04:45, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Keep, as creator:
 * http://www.wweek.com/portland/blog-29047-sorry_bachelorettes_no_more_penis_hats_at_cc_slaug.html
 * As I already mentioned, the Willamette Weekly is a local newspaper-- it can be used to augment the article but it doesn't work to establish a claim of genuine notability, per WP:AUD  KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://wweek.com/portland/article-21081-brides_denied.html
 * See previous comment  KDS 4444   Talk
 * http://www.zagat.com/n/cc-slaughters-nightclub-and-lounge-portland
 * Zagat is another travel guide that lists all bars and night clubs, does not meet WP:CORPDEPTH.  KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://www.frommers.com/destinations/portland-or/nightlife/236234
 * Frommers is another travel guide like Zagat, same issue with regard to WP:CORPDEPTH KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://travel.aol.com/travel-guide/united-states/oregon/portland/cc-slaughters-nightlife-detail-790478/
 * The online AOL travel guides have the same problem as Zagat and Frommers: WP:CORPDEPTH KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://nwda.orbiscascade.org/ark:/80444/xv64157
 * This is a record of correspondence that has been archived in a library. It is not an example of attention by a news source with editorial oversight, it is only a source of information about something which may or may not be notable.  This would be suitable in an External Links section, but not as evidence of notability per se.    KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://psuvanguard.com/specialsections/night-out-guide-2013/where-to-go-when-you-come-out/
 * Once again, this is a listing from a travel guide, not an example of notability.  KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19950130&slug=2102123
 * This is an article from the Seattle Times (a credible, regional newspaper) but it is about the deceased owner of the bar, John Adams II, in which the bar itself is only mentioned in passing once. This could be used to establish the notability of Mr. Adams, but not that of the bar.   KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * also, additional articles can be found at The Oregonian archives, accessible to Multnomah County Library cardholders
 * Here is a news source with broad regional circulation! I was able to conduct an on-line search of The Oregonians archives back to 1987 for any articles that included the word "Slaughters", but I came up with zero results.  Are you sure about this one? Because it would only take one article from such a source to make a claim of notability really stick (so far there don't appear to be any).  Since the article's creator has created over 1,400 Wikipedia articles, I am surprised this is not well understood by now (?).   KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * You consider The Oregonian reliable. The article includes Oregonian references. Problem solved, no? -- Another Believer ( Talk ) 00:02, 12 February 2014 (UTC)
 * The problem would be solved if those references in The Oregonian were anything more than listings for events. They are not articles about CC Slaughters, they are mentions of the bar either as the locations for parties (along with a lot of other places) or are mentions only in passing ("The group will be meeting at CC Slaughters, then will march on down to City Hall..." etc.).  I do not debate that The Oregonian is a paper of sufficient distribution to confer notability to a place like this one, but the the coverage has to be in greater depth than a mention in passing or appearing on a list.  I have yet to be able to find an actual article about CC Slaughters in a paper with at least regional distribution, and that is what this topic needs in order to warrant an article on Wikipedia and keep it from being just a travel listing. Can you come up with something more substantive?    KDS 4444   Talk  06:18, 14 February 2014 (UTC)


 * This would be a quick and easy article to expand to Good status with a little TLC. No reason to delete, just expand a bit! -- Another Believer ( Talk ) 05:52, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * I expanded the article a bit. Hopefully this helps to establish notability. -- Another Believer ( Talk ) 07:47, 8 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep, I think it edges over GNG, I don't expect to see much about bars except when there is a notable legal issue, the rest tend to be reviews. I also suggest working this history into the article, as helping readers understand the history of the place and the name. Sportfan5000 (talk) 13:38, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the suggestion, Sportfan5000. -- Another Believer ( Talk ) 16:49, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * And that should indeed be done... if the place is genuinely notable.   KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep. Editor Another Believer in these edits added more material and sources. -- do  ncr  am  17:49, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * And that's great! The problem is that the article still consists solely of references from travel guides, or from articles in magazines and newspapers of limited interest and circulation.  It doesn't appear to meet WP:ORG yet-- can this be fixed?  KDS 4444   Talk  11:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)
 * That is not true. The article includes The Oregonian references... -- Another Believer ( Talk ) 00:04, 12 February 2014 (UTC)
 * All of the references from The Oregonian are appearances in lists or are mentions in passing, as stated above. None of them are articles about CC Slaughters.  KDS 4444   Talk  06:22, 14 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Oregon-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 13:42, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Music-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 13:42, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Business-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 13:42, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Sexuality and gender-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 13:43, 8 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Keep, good deal of secondary source coverage. &mdash; Cirt (talk) 18:33, 8 February 2014 (UTC)
 * Could you be a little more specific?  KDS 4444   Talk  06:26, 14 February 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.