Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Calvary Church of Santa Ana


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep. (non-admin closure)  J 947  18:22, 16 March 2017 (UTC)

Calvary Church of Santa Ana

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Non-notable church, no coverage in reliable sources independent of subject. Jrheller1 (talk) 03:34, 9 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Delete - I have reverted to a better, less spammy version of the article and added a reference. However, I can't find any other coverage in reliable, independant sources. I don't think there is enough here to prove notability, but I am willing to change my !vote if any more sources can be found. Sarahj2107 (talk) 09:18, 9 March 2017 (UTC) to take a second look.E.M.Gregory (talk) 19:44, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Changing to Keep per the sources found by . Sarahj2107 (talk) 08:01, 13 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Organizations-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 14:57, 9 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Christianity-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 14:57, 9 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of California-related deletion discussions. Shawn in Montreal (talk) 14:57, 9 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Keep I did a modest expand source. I like to check sources before dismissing a church as non-notable, and find that one of the crucial aspects of checking is to get the search term right, in this case, I searched "Calvary Chursh" + "Santa Ana" instead of "Calvary Church of Santa Ana"  What came up on a Proquest news archives search was over 1,000 news articles about funerals held at the church.  The sheer volume indicated that this is no small-potatoes church.  So I scanned a few of the pages, clicking on those article that were not news accounts of funerals.  Turns out that it is - or at least was at the time it dedicated its enormous campus - the largest Church in Orange County - a populous County dense with churches (I mean that literally, this is conservative Christian territory); half the member states of the United Nations have fewer people than Orange County.   Very large, notable congregation.E.M.Gregory (talk) 19:31, 12 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Keep -- A local church with 4500 members is probably large enough to be notable. Peterkingiron (talk) 11:24, 13 March 2017 (UTC)
 * They had 4500 members in 1992. They probably have fewer members than that today since most churches have been shrinking over the last two decades.  Regardless of the number of members today, this is a fallacious argument.  There are people with millions of subscribers on YouTube who don't warrant their own article on Wikipedia.  The most recent sources E. M. Gregory provided are from more than twenty years ago; they both deal with a sex scandal.  There is no ongoing significant coverage of the church in non-local media.  Jrheller1 (talk) 15:33, 13 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Notability is not temporary, it doesn't matter that the sources are from 20 years ago they still count towards establishing notability. Sarahj2107 (talk) 17:35, 13 March 2017 (UTC)
 * But there was never any significant coverage. The only coverage was the very brief coverage relating to the sex scandal back in 1992 (and the only major newspaper reporting was LA times).  The reference from 1967 is a notice that a new sanctuary was being built; this is no more significant than a birth notice or obituary in the New York Times.  Jrheller1 (talk) 18:53, 13 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Keep as large church, even though it does not pass my standards for historic churches, because it does appear to pass general notability. Bearian (talk) 02:36, 14 March 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Architecture-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 14:08, 15 March 2017 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.