Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cantina Laredo


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was no consensus.  Sandstein  10:43, 19 December 2017 (UTC)

Cantina Laredo

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I prodded it with the following rationale: "The coverage (references, external links, etc.) does not seem sufficient to justify this article passing General notability guideline and the more detailed Notability (biographies) requirement. " It was deprodded by User:Necrothesp with the following rationale "has 35 branches throughout the USA, plus two abroad; probably notable". I don't think size matters - it is not a criteria on any notability guideline. The article doesn't cite a single source and is a pure WP:YELLOWPAGES entry. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 10:25, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Food and drink-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 10:28, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of United States-related deletion discussions. Necrothesp (talk) 10:28, 28 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Companies-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 04:45, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Texas-related deletion discussions. • Gene93k (talk) 04:45, 29 November 2017 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Keep. Large enough chain to be notable in its market. -- Necrothesp (talk) 15:55, 29 November 2017 (UTC)
 * Did you copypaste this vote from somewhere else? This article doesn't make any claim about size outside claiming it is a chain. A chain can be two outlets, you know. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 04:58, 1 December 2017 (UTC)
 * No, I actually bothered to look it up (and found it has 37 branches, as you even stated when you quoted me in your nomination above!). Did you do the same? Please try to WP:AGF! Your comments about copypasting seem anything but. -- Necrothesp (talk) 15:38, 4 December 2017 (UTC)
 * If you found a source that's better then company's homepage, please do share it. Adding to the article would be nice. --Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus&#124; reply here 04:58, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
 * That was from the company's homepage, which clearly lists the restaurants (so hardly only two!). Or do you maybe think it's all an elaborate hoax? -- Necrothesp (talk) 14:43, 5 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Strong delete total and complete failure of any even minimal standards of notability. There is not even an inkling of any source except the restaurant website. Wikipedia is not a free for all business ad platform.John Pack Lambert (talk) 02:43, 30 November 20[17 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Baby miss fortune 06:10, 5 December 2017 (UTC)  Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
 * Comment Sources on google books I've found so far: . Not sure why seems to think that there is no other sources (google books and news search at least? c'mon). Don't see much about a chain though - apart from the last source, it is just individual reviews of restaurants, so not sure about notability. Need national/atleast region attention for WP:NORG. Galobtter (pingó mió) 12:04, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, North America1000 01:32, 12 December 2017 (UTC)
 * Weak Delete Well individual restaurant reviews are routine according to WP:CORPDEPTH; so only one source of the first 5 is useful;I have been able to find twomore sources, but of all, only the the first has a full meaty paragraph on it. Not enough for WP:NCORP; I do think more sources could be found. Galobtter (pingó mió) 02:31, 12 December 2017 (UTC) It's actually an international chain - with 100 branches in the U.S., UK, and other countries; I was able to find a restaurant review in the independant, which again only has a few words on the chain itself. Galobtter (pingó mió) 02:34, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources.  The book notes: "Cantina Laredo is one of the more ambitious restaurants to participate in the large-scale, city-subsidized development of the area dubbed the 'Second Street District.' Although this one is actually on Third Street, it looks and feels more connected to the yup-and-coming new row of botiques and eateries on Second. We must first disclose that Cantina Laredo is unfortunately a subsidiary of Consolidated Restaurant Operations (the name alone makes us shudder), of Spaghetti Warehouse and El Chico fame. Designers have done an okay job of avoiding that chain-restaurant feel; although furnishings are trendified, they still manage to feel soothing and intimate. We are booth fans, and particularly like the cozy two-person booths here. Lighting is dim, and there's a certain pleasant bustle to the place. But Laredo really has been suffering from the Consolidated Restaurant Ooperations feel lately, with seemingly high staff turnover, an increasingly impersonal experience, and sketchy execution."  The article notes: "The upscale, Dallas-based chain Cantina Laredo boasts locations as diverse as Abu Dhabi, Branson, Chicago and, since October of last year, Clayton. Whether it resembles anything that you might find in Mexico itself is debatable. The menu nods at traditional Mexican fare, but it also includes more than a few concessions to the fajitas-and-margaritas crowd."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo, by comparison, is brand new in these parts: It’s the offspring of a national chain and potentially at odds with our locavore instincts. ... The 34-restaurant Cantina Laredo chain is at the upscale end of the even larger company, Consolidated Restaurant Operations. Each cantina is customized to its site. Destiny USA — the first mall to recruit a Cantina Laredo — inspired a linear, minimalist decor with polished wood, rustic stone and contemporary black leather."</li> <li> The article notes: "A Texas-based chain's first foray into South Florida, Plantation's Cantina Laredo moved in last month with all sorts of corporate-concept banter promising authentic, gourmet Mexican cuisine in a sophisticated atmosphere. ... We weren't exactly wowed by Cantina Laredo's chicken dishes - the camarónes escondidos seemed way too salty, and the fajitas had an overwhelmingly smoky taste. The beef fajitas, on the other hand, were marvelous, and the achiote roasted pork quesadillas, pure comfort food."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo prides itself on gourmet Mexican fare, and the restaurant's food is indeed a step up from that you find at many Mexican eateries. So are the price tags. My favorite entrée at Cantina Laredo, the camarones escondidos -- or hidden shrimp -- cost $18.99. The cheaper things I tried tended to come in somewhat small portions. My overall impression of the restaurant was that the food was tasty but often overpriced by a few dollars per dish. Still, Cantina Laredo is a welcome addition to Twenty Ninth Street. The fare is interesting and the ambience inviting. ... One way Cantina Laredo distinguishes itself from many Mexican restaurants is with its sauces. Don't expect just the standard choices here, like red or green chile. The hidden shrimp, for instance, are topped with a delicious chipotle-wine sauce. The peppery flavor builds in your mouth as you chew, while a smoky undercurrent complements the sweetness of the shrimp."</li> <li> The article notes: "The location will depend finding a site and a financial partner, something Lemmer has done in Melbourne and with the white-tablecloth Mexican concept, Cantina Laredo, which he has opened in Plantation and Fort Myers. El Chico Cafe and Cantina Laredo are both concepts of Consolidated Restaurant Operations Inc. in Dallas. ... At $18 to $22 per check, Cantina Laredo patrons repast on grilled fish, chicken and steaks like those served in gourmet restaurants in Mexico City.  The company has been in Florida since 1984 and done well, said Harkey. 'Len Lemmer's Fort Myers store 'has proven to be the number one Cantina Laredo in our entire system.'  The first restaurant in this area will open in spring 2006 in Palm Beach Gardens on PGA Boulevard just west of Military Trail. That store is scheduled to open in spring 2006."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo, a 'gourmet Mexican restaurant, is opening in Penn Square Mall, replacing the space Garcia's once occupied. The new restaurant will be the first Cantina Laredo in the state. ... It's not an El Chico, but Cantina Laredo is one of the brands under Consolidated Restaurant Operations Inc., the company that operates El Chico, Spaghetti Warehouse and various other concepts. CRO did not return calls. ...  Cantina Laredo has 11 locations in Texas, Arizona and Florida. Menu items include signatures such as fajitas, tacos and enchiladas as well as specials including shrimp and 16 ounce ribeyes."</li> <li> The article notes: "GOOD-LOOKING: You'd be hard-pressed to find a more attractive Mexican restaurant than Cantina Laredo - both in drive-up appeal and décor. Its hacienda-style stucco exterior sets it apart from other tenants at the northeast corner of Preston and Royal. Dim, strategic lighting and upscale Southwestern appointments make the dining room a soothing spot in which to linger when there's not a crowd. When jammed, Cantina Laredo displays the jumpin' side of a dual personality. As the 3-year-old restaurant's name suggests, the huge bar (20-plus bar stools) is at the heart of the space, with a regular crowd bellying up for food and drink. ... A SECOND LOOK: Before checking out the restaurant for review, we had dined there on occasion, and though its attractiveness and handsome bar had us hooked for a while,we found the food to be inconsistent. On a recent return visit, we were delighted to find a significant improvement."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo is a chain restaurant, but it's not just another version of the Tex-Mex chains that popped up everywhere in the 1990s. The dishes are of a much higher quality, as are the ingredients. Although, beware; the prices are higher as well. ... Cantina Laredo provides Mexican fare a cut above the ordinary - and quite a few cuts above with some dishes. If you go, make sure to order the guacamole. But also be prepared to pay a bit more than you are used to at other Mexican chains."</li> <li> The article notes: "If you are expecting real gut-busting, jalapeno-laden Mexican food at Cantina Laredo, you are in the wrong place. Even the name should clue you in: Cantina Laredo. Can it get any more corporate than that? But if you are in the market for some relatively good Tex-Mex food in an elaborately styled 'cantina,' this is your spot. It is located in that little gold mining village the locals like to call 'the Town Center,' where even on a Wednesday night, the wait is 30 minutes long. We smartly made reservations and enjoyed some seriously good tequila while our table was being prepared. ... While the decor is refreshing, we found the food to be hit-and-miss. ...  All in all, I may not call Cantina Laredo true 'gourmet' Mexican food, but it definitely is an improvement on some of the more generic 'ground beef and taco shell' places around town. We'll go back, and we will definitely make reservations when we do."</li> <li> The article notes: "The Cantina Laredo in the Corner Shopping Center can't be judged so easily. The salsa is warmed, a nice touch, and it has large tomato pieces, also a plus. But it holds so little else -- scant onion and jalapeno burn -- that ultimately it is boring. Ditto for the pico de gallo, mostly onion and mushy tomatoes. But look past the batch-produced items and Catina Laredo, which is owned by El Chico, offers some out-of-the-ordinary fare. ... The original Cantina Laredo opened in Addison in 1984; this one last summer, and more are reportedly in the works. But don't judge them by their chain aspirations -- or their salsas. They offer good, reasonably priced Tex-Mex."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo, Gene Street's stylish new place at Preston Royal, sure looks good. Dallas' Mr. Restaurant has broken away from the border cliche of earlier Cantinas and their sibling El Chico cafes. Employee-designed, it's muy nuevo Laredo, all cool and contemporary, with rough-plastered sand-colored walls, low ceilings, track and recessed lighting - sort of postmodern Southwestern with a splash of mission style. No kitschy, Disney-esque touches here. ... But if you look this pretty, you ought to cook this pretty. And we hit some ugly spots on our first visit. Most of our entrees were served tepid. At the other extreme, a dessert brownie was burned. Chicken came in various guises, but all of them were dry and unappealing.  The kitchen couldn't plead a rush-hour crunch; the restaurant was less than a quarter full when we dined on a Sunday afternoon.  ...  Service on both visits was prompt, polite and eager. Cantina Laredo's task is to see that the food's consistency comes up to the same level. Until then, we're thinking 'Never on Sunday.'"</li> <li> The article notes: "The restaurant is the first Ohio iteration of the 30-unit chain. ... Cantina Laredo aims for sophistication in its menu and decor, the latter through blond wood and black leather, with a sweeping bar, a series of dining rooms, an all-weather patio and a small, three-season space. That bar is covered with Texas limestone, and behind it, along with regular offerings, are 50 brands of tequila, available by the drink or in flights for tastings."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo, an upscale Mexican chain with nearly a dozen locations in Texas, opened its first Austin site three months ago in the new Second Street shopping and entertainment district on the ground floor of the AMLI building. The place has two things going for it: a location in a vibrant area and a sleek, stylish dining room that has the feel of a hip, urban environment. That's good, because the one thing it doesn't have is food worth going there for. ... Cantina Laredo has a lot of work to do. On average, the food there is merely acceptable, which merits neither a star nor a recommendation to drive across town to eat there."</li> <li> The article notes: "Cantina Laredo is a Mexican restaurant that defies easy categorization. It's not your neighborhood Tex-Mex joint, where you head for a cheese-laden combo platter, endless bowls of chips and maybe a frozen margarita (or two or three). Nor does it quite qualify as a citadel of sophisticated Mexican cooking a la Rosa Mexicano. Instead, Cantina Laredo aspires to be a mix of the two, appealing to a slightly upscale crowd but not one that wants to be too daring with its choice of cuisine. The result? An altogether different approach to south-of-the-border-style dining. Call it Suburban Mex. ... Cantina is part of a growing nationwide chain, with more than 20 restaurants throughout the country. So its Suburban Mex formula may not be so new, after all. But the appeal is still there, provided you go in with the right expectations."</li> <li> The article notes: "The restaurant is owned by local investors and Consolidated Restaurant Operations is a partner as well, in addition to being the operator, he said. “It’s a 50-50 partnership,” he said. Cantina Laredo first opened in 1984 in Addison, Texas, a suburb of Dallas. There are 35 locations in the United States, with additional locations in Abu Dhabi and London."</li> <li> The article notes: "True to its Orwellian-sounding name, Consolidated Restaurant Operations Inc. is a Texas-based corporation that operates more than 100 restaurants in the United States, the United Kingdom, the United Arab Emirates and Egypt. Of those, more than 30 are Cantina Laredos and seven are III Forks steakhouses, each of which recently opened a Chicago location. The two-story behemoth that is Cantina Laredo takes up a good chunk of a city block near the finally-not-under-construction Grand Red Line stop, while a few blocks to the east..."</li> <li> The article notes: "Spoiler alert. This review contains details of the single worst dish the reviewer has yet encountered in her professional career. If you don't want to know the ending, or are reading this in the hope of finding a great new Mexican restaurant, look away now. I didn't want to hate Cantina Laredo. Good Mexican food can be a wonderful thing, and the arrival in central London of an American institution serving 'gourmet Mexican food' sounded like something to celebrate. ... So trust me, I went to Cantina Laredo in the genuine hope of some vivid, authentic Mexican food. Founded in Dallas, the brand is already well established in the States. The London branch, operating under franchise, occupies a new development on the traffic-clogged edge of Covent Garden, just up the road from Stringfellows. Border country, in other words, patrolled by hungry travellers who have journeyed many miles by bridge and by tunnel in search of sustenance."</li> </ol>There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Cantina Laredo to pass Notability, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject". Cunard (talk) 06:25, 19 December 2017 (UTC) </li></ul>
 * Cantina Laredo received significant coverage in a Robin Goldstein book. It has received significant coverage in multiple regions: Colorado (Daily Camera), Florida (The Florida Times-Union, Miami Herald, The Palm Beach Post, The Stuart News, and The Tampa Tribune), Mississippi (The Clarion-Ledger), Missouri (St. Louis Post-Dispatch), New York (The Post-Standard), Ohio (The Columbus Dispatch), Oklahoma (The Oklahoman), and Texas (Austin American-Statesman and The Dallas Morning News). Cantina Laredo received significant coverage in a UK newspaper, The Independent. It has received persistent coverage between 1991 and 2017. It clearly passes Notability and Notability (organizations and companies). Cunard (talk) 06:25, 19 December 2017 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.