Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Captain Martin Walker


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. (non-admin closure) CycloneYoris talk! 23:06, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

Captain Martin Walker

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

This is going to be a very odd AfD, I will admit, because at a glance this looks like a very feature complete article. However, a deeper look at it shows it's taking discussion about the game the characters is from, Spec Ops: The Line, and trying to inherit notability for the character separate of it. A massive amount of the reception section is discussing the game's plot and the impact of it, but not showing how the character itself is notable or examined on its own outside of it.

WP:BEFORE shows a similar case, where discussion of the character is completely bound to reactions to the game and its story. Walker isn't shown to be independently notable or discussed outside of that context. Even the cited book 100 Greatest Video Game Characters provides just a reduced summary of the game's plot with no examination of the character.

What little is here that is about the character could be merged into the game's article, what little is here that isn't already covered in said article. Kung Fu Man (talk) 18:49, 2 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Fictional elements and Video games. Kung Fu Man (talk) 18:49, 2 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep. I scrolled to the reception section and examined the first two references cited inline. Those alone are sufficient for WP:GNG:
 * The Andergard academic journal paper is a huge depth of secondary coverage focused on the character. Here's some:
 * "Captain Martin Walker is at first glance a conventional hero – white, male, representing not only western civilisation but also the US Armed Forces, which is to say upholding the hegemonic social order, as discussed by Hourihan (1997, 58). This ties in to various other narratives where a protagonist is in the service of the military – usually the US Armed Forces – and turns out to be the hero who rescues his comrades held as prisoners of war, or who thwarts the villainous enemy leader’s plans, and so on. Walker is assumed at the beginning of the game to be exactly this – a heroic soldier doing his duty in service of his country, and by extension in service of the western world. His mission is a rescue operation, and Konrad’s original task was assisting with the evacuation of the storm-riddled Dubai, both noble and heroic endeavours. ... "Later Walker faces US soldiers who have gone rogue, which represent an active force from within western society working to destabilise social order (Hourihan 1997, 144). Walker’s use of deadly force is at first portrayed as done in self-defence, as well as being further justified through the naturalisation of violence when performed by the hero (Hourihan 1997, 98). It can even be seen as ritualised (Hatto 1989, 228) because Walker is a soldier on a mission, and his enemies are ambushing him from unfair vantage points, and in general creating unfair situations to make the hero’s trials more challenging and thus more heroic. Walker also explicitly performs noble deeds in striving to reinstate a semblance of order to Dubai or at least to save the remains of the population, thus further solidifying him as a hero through his noble actions. However, this heroism ultimately breaks down piece by piece throughout the narrative."
 * The Keogh source in Vice is also good secondary coverage with choice quotes such as:
 * "By the end of the game, Walkers's squadmates are dead and he is an utterly broken man. The 'line' that the characters cross isn't a single moral choice but the constant, stubborn refusal to just stop killing people. "The majesty of The Line is in its character development, something completely absent from the majority of videogame stories. We are used to thinking of videogame characters as blank canvases, as mere vehicles for the player's intentions to travel from the start of a game to the end. Over the course of The Line, however, Walker is constantly changing, both mentally and physically. Every decision—especially the decisions he is unaware he is making—has a lasting effect on him. In the face of the horrors he witnesses and enacts, he slowly breaks down. At the start of the game, he is all military precision and calm, telling his squad to 'acquire targets.' By the end of the game, he is bloodied and torn, shouting at his squad to 'kill that fucker.' Voiced by videogame everyman Nolan North, Walker is a character study of the average videogame protagonist coming to terms with the messed up things we players make them do."
 * &mdash;siro&chi;o 02:07, 3 October 2023 (UTC)


 * Weak keep I personally think the in-article sources are insufficient, but I also found this article praising the casting choice for Walker, and talking specifically about Walker as a character. There also seem to be more mentions of Walker out there than are cited in the article. My personal opinion is that the article needs something of a rewrite or at least refocusing of its reception away from trivial mentions and listicles, as with many fictional character articles, as well as verbatim quotes of confusing academic terms, but that there is enough material to do it, per WP:NEXIST. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 07:43, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep Great in-depth source analysis by Siroxo.  Satellizer el Bridget (Talk)  01:52, 9 October 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep. Meets the general notability guideline with the significant coverage discussed above by siro. Jacona (talk) 12:25, 9 October 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.