Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative (2nd nomination)


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was speedy keep‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. Procedural close. Do not open a new AFD the day after the previous AFD closed. This is very questionable behavior from the nominator. When I said that a return trip to AFD was possible, I meant in a few weeks or months, not in a few hours. Liz Read! Talk! 03:02, 30 December 2023 (UTC)

Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative
AfDs for this article:


 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

I could not find any significant coverage in reliable secondary sources for this topic, let alone for the more stringent WP:CORPDEPTH.

The single reference present in the article does not contain "Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative".

Previous discussion was infested by an alt account who went off on a tangent on how it is not fair for him to get new user mentoring. This is why the close suggested no prejudice towards renominating at AfD. बिनोद थारू (talk) 14:24, 29 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Companies and North Dakota. बिनोद थारू (talk) 14:24, 29 December 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep - First of all, this looks to me like somebody didn't like the outcome and is running this within hours of the first close. The mentoring issue was irrelevant to this. It was a side issue that one editor had been assigned to "mentor" a specific editor without the mentored editor asking for mentoring, or even knowing about it ahead of time. What alt account and alt/sock puppet thing mentioned above?


 * Please see North Dakota's Electric Distribution Cooperatives and click on this particular coop. I also linked Rural Electrification Act, which is the detailed legislation that created these coops during the Franklin D. Roosevelt administration. I repeat here original comments about electric co-ops, so readers know what they are: Re Category:Electric cooperatives of the United States. In the United States, these electric coops are the energy-providing life blood of rural areas. Some articles are well-done and fairly well-sourced. Some  articles are done just like this one is done.  Prior to that, much of rural America had nothing but what a local area could put together, if anything.  That said ... you can nit-pick and delete the sparse ones like this, or you can come up with a better solution. — Maile  (talk) 15:58, 29 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment:
 * "Please see North Dakota's Electric Distribution Cooperatives"


 * This source only contains a link to their website. No coverage at all. Please see WP:ORGDEPTH for the criteria. This comment is not in line with WP:OR. If extremely sparse primary sources were to be patched together, then original research would be needed to complete the article (like drawing connections with the Rural Electrification Act, for example). बिनोद थारू (talk) 16:09, 29 December 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep per Maile66. Coverage almost always exists for such utilities and there is some coverage if someone with access searches on newspapers.com. Someone with access to WP:PAYWALLEDSOURCES can see the coverage. 72.172.120.125 (talk) 20:37, 29 December 2023 (UTC)
 * I have done the deed on Google News archive and none is significant coverage or one that meets WP:CORPDEPTH. Here's what I found:
 * Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative, Clearwater-Polk Electric Cooperative, Minnkota Power Cooperative, Nodak Electric Cooperative, North Star Electric Cooperative,: PKM Electric Cooperative, Red Lake Electric Cooperative, Red River [...] (Farmers Independent. ‎Mar 17, 1993)
 * They were cruising up and down the ditches having a good old time," said Kerry Mikkelsen, line superintendent for1 the Cavalier Rural Electric Co-op in Langdon (McCook Daily Gazette. ‎May 14, 2004)
 * Cavalier Rural Electric Board for over 30 years, taking his father's place when Irwhi retired from the board. (Turtle Mountain Star. ‎Dec 10, 2007)
 * Using those as basis for an article would be an egregious failure of WP:PRIMARY and the corporations guideline.
 * The best source I have been able to find, not a newspaper, is "Report of the Rural Electrification Administration (1953)". It is searchable on Google with the term "Cavalier Rural Electric" (with quotes).
 * The enthusiasm for the development of rural electrification in the Great Plains was vividly demonstrated at the meeting of Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative, shortly after VJ-day. More than 700 farmers and their families crowded into the little school auditorium at Langdon, N. Dak., to hear about the new Cavalier Co-op and what it could do for them. Co-op leaders, remembering the prewar skepticism of many North Dakota farmers when electricity for their homes and farms was discussed, had doubted that more than 40 would turn out for the meeting. The North Dakota farmers by thousands clamored for electricity. That demand spread across the Nation in every type of farming area. Even in Alaska [...]
 * The only information one can take out of that is that it was created between 1944-1953. Yet the creation date is present in all of the company articles that get routinely deleted here. And saying it was created in 1944-1953 can be construed as original research, since the source doesn't directly say it.
 * बिनोद थारू (talk) 20:45, 29 December 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete, mainly due to lack of WP:SIGCOV by independent secondary sources, no evidence thus far that WP:CORPDEPTH has been satisfied. Left guide (talk) 21:06, 29 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Obvious Keep
 * In order to build an encyclopedia, the community created tags.
 * The previous AfD came on the heels of this failed WP:PROD initiated by the nom, who is now using a different rationale. This is after the admin who closed out the previous AfD wrote I just want to emphasize that BEFORE is an important step prior to any AFD nomination and it's useful to share the results of any BEFORE search that was done. Here is WP:BEFORE.
 * The community is not obligated to tediously devote resources to flagrant wikilawyering by a single-purpose editor specializing in AfDs (contributions history).
 * As regards WP:SIGCOV, a non-profit electrical utility that serves an essential service (electricity) to many thousands of users is far-cry from some random Dairy Queen or “Al’s Tire-O-Rama” in nearby Belcourt on State Route 10. Citing WP:SIGCOV as a basis for deleting this article flies in the face of the very reason we have Category:Electric cooperatives of the United States.


 * Greg L (talk) 22:25, 29 December 2023 (UTC)


 * Speedy procedural close - The last AfD has only just concluded, and although Liz said there was no penalty against a return trip, I am sure she did not mean a return trip on the same day she closed it! The AfD was closed as no consensus. Leave it two months before re-nominating. It gives a chance to improve the page/find sources and if nothing changes, then sure, bring it back to AfD at the beginning of March. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 23:24, 29 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Comment. The previous discussion (which I didn't even start) was interrupted by three people (Locke Cole, Greg L and his alt MLee1957) who were angry at my prior nomination of a WP:FAKEARTICLE-type user page . So the closer allowed to renominate it with no prejudice.
 * If it were a case of no consensus due to strong keep/delete votes and no alts, then yes, it would be advisable to wait half a year before obtaining new consensus. बिनोद थारू (talk) 23:39, 29 December 2023 (UTC)
 * With regard to WP:FAKEARTICLE, you need to better familiarize yourself with Wikipedia and its processes and infrastructure. WP:Sandboxex are where editors work on articles outside of user-space; that’s what they’re there for. As for User:MLee1957 being an “Alt” account, this sockpuppet investigation resulted in the obvious conclusion as follows: which clearly indicates two people in two separate places. I ask you to not engage in baseless allegations on that score from hereon. Greg L (talk) 23:55, 29 December 2023 (UTC)


 * I second the motion for Speedy procedural close in part, per the reasons stated by Sirfurboy🏄. More importantly, I spent a small fraction of the time the community has so-far wasted on this disruption by adding two much-needed citations establishing where Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative is headquartered and what area it serves. Thus, the foundational premiss upon which this AfD is based is moot. Adding citations beats and endless cycle tendentious wikidrama. Greg L (talk) 00:12, 30 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Keep It has been established by others here that Cavalier Rural Electric Cooperative is A) notable (electrical co-ops have their own category here on Wikipedia), B) this AFD was improperly brought against the directions of the person who closed the last one, C) the article now has citations on two key facts. First a PROD, then an AFD. This new AFD, fresh on the heels of the previous one, should not have been started. MLee1957 (talk) 00:43, 30 December 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.