Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Cesur Durak


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete. Liz Read! Talk! 08:16, 6 October 2022 (UTC)

Cesur Durak

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Fails WP:SIGCOV, WP:BIO. Blocked UPE. Promo. Man doing his job.  scope_creep Talk  07:37, 29 September 2022 (UTC) if you search from google you can find so many articles from Romanian national press that did't put as a link in wikipedia page yet.As it is known, other small or online news sites report the news made by the national media by quoting,As it mentions in discussion about turkish news you can see main news in Romanian national press.cesur durak wikipedia page made an english but 90% news are in Romanian so have to put more reference links from romanian not to delete.you can find articles below just a a few of them https://celebritatea.ro/cesur-durak-a-primit-premiul-pentru-best-detox-specialist-medical-tourism-consultant-la-gala-i-success-awards-cannes-edition/ https://www.wowbiz.ro/cesur-durak-recunoscut-la-nivel-global-pentru-sfaturile-de-detoxifiere-a-fost-premiat-la-cannes-a-fost-un-lucru-foarte-important-pentru-mine-20159416 https://www.wowbiz.ro/reteta-minune-a-lui-cesur-durak-pentru-un-colon-sanatos-si-un-sistem-imunitar-intarit-ce-contine-fresh-ul-care-te-scapa-de-durerile-de-colon-20173292 https://www.kanald.ro/teoshow/cesur-durak-a-descoperit-sucul-minune-pentru-sanatate-invitat-la-teo-show-ne-dezvaluie-reteta-18831306 https://www.wowbiz.ro/specialistul-in-nutritie-si-detox-cesur-durak-prepara-bautura-care-arde-grasimile-20056544 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ihcm (talk • contribs) 20:09, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete just a promo article, couldn't find any solid sources online.  Dr vulpes  (💬 • 📝) 07:48, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Businesspeople and Turkey. North America1000 13:34, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete – The Turkish sources in the article are all from non-RS publications and are mostly promotional, which gives me no reason to believe that the Romainian sources are different. Has won a non-notable award; no sign of meeting the GNG or NBIO. ~Styyx Talk ? 14:45, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete good amount of tabloid coverage, but nothing substantial in reliable sources that I could find. W 42  16:27, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete will agree with above, tabloids are not acceptable. Oaktree b (talk) 17:59, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment Two winning a corporate award and being on the show to talk about it. The 2nd is a blog article. All of them are primary and PR.   scope_creep Talk  20:38, 29 September 2022 (UTC)

Keep except the so many sources posted on the talk page of article there is more article in google Romania search didn't put yet and also if you visit youtube there is so many tv programs that he invited are the biggest National tv channel of Romania. Also last year He was invited to the L.A premiere of  Love on the Rock movie. By his friend Kira Katherine Reed also known as Kira Reed Lorsch, is an American actress, emmy winner, television host, writer, and producer https://www.wowbiz.ro/exclusiv-specialistul-in-nutritie-cesur-durak-invitat-special-de-actrita-kira-reed-la-ziua-sa-de-nastere-in-los-angeles-m-a-invitat-la-premiera-filmului-ei-love-on-the-rock-movie-si-la-petrecere-20174744 https://www.wowbiz.ro/cesur-durak-renumitul-specialist-in-nutritie-invitatul-special-al-celebrei-actrite-kira-reed-am-vorbit-tuturor-despre-romania-pentru-ca-eu-locuiesc-aici-20177872 https://www.alamy.com/universal-city-ca-october-13-2021-cesur-durak-attends-pinnacle-peak-pictures-premiere-film-love-on-the-rock-at-universal-city-hilton-universal-city-ca-on-october-13-2021-image447960136.html if you realy search you can find so many news in google about him if you don't have prejudices or personal problems — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ihcm (talk • contribs) 22:51, 29 September 2022 (UTC) NOT DELETE BECAUSE if we go this mantalty mr/mrs ~Styyx we will make mistake because there is so many wikipedia page about romanian people and referenca are from same Romanian media in this way all the english wikipedia pages will be complain from rest of the world country whom non-native English language.aND FOR MR/MRS. scope_creep none of the all videos watch millions the important think is where this video shoot and whic youtube chanell publish this so cesur durak offen is invited from one of the biggest Romanian national tv Kanal D progarms and the program presenter which is the one of the most popular [] so i will leave some more links here that you can check this one watched all most 27K https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F4JQoMaJdo This one watched all most 27Khttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWpSCBROwsg this one watched all most 9K https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzbI2mBi45s and i am addeing some links so if you realy search about cesur durak with positive way as you can see there is a lot tv programs and news as he make a lot naturel recipes and health advices https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WbkMFFatL0E  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y2qDRDdvt0Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUlWz7Bdhw8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8UZJsjXkDU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aevvRPpwBCo and also he was so many time at main news of the tv  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uCaX9YfBktI  in this Tv program prima tv program presenter talks about his succes and also his so many  puplic guest and friend that joined in his detox programs inculuding you can see princess Marina Sturdza Marina_Sturdza hand write letter in the screen to cesur durak  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmjpJKYeK5Q  so as you are seeing in this discussion  I write not only my opinion and comment, but also what I have written by proving it with references. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ihcm (talk • contribs) 13:43, 30 September 2022 (UTC) COMENT Although there are so many national TV channels news about cesur durak here in discussion with so many references links in the written press, mr/ mrs ~StyyxT' says  Turkish sources are absolute shit, I doubt the Romanian ones are any different This prejudiced and racist approach is unacceptable. it seems that who mr.mrs ~Styx doesn't read any reference link and just wants the page to be removed without putting any prejudiced information and reference this is so sad i am sure editors will check all the references links before to make decisions Ihcm (talk) 14:32, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Keep There is so many sources posted on the talk page of the article. However the majority of them are Romanian sites which I can't judge. However, after that post above, I came across his appearances on Kanal D. He has appeared on Kanal D multiple times over a span of several years. Several diffrent shows and in at least one news segment. Kanal D I am familiar with, it is a very big channel in Turkey and internationally, and its branch in Romania is quite significant. --Gazozlu (talk) 21:13, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Appearing on a show isn't notable, we need article that talk about him, that are substantial and unrelated to him. Paying him to be on a TV show isn't notable here. Oaktree b (talk) 22:38, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * if you reel search all the articles about him and watches tv programs that mainly he is invited to talk about healthy life style as a detox specialist i will just put some links because i can not put hundreds of links  https://www.stirilekanald.ro/cesur-durak-despre-vacanta-detox-din-bodrum-20200704 https://www.wowbiz.ro/reteta-minune-a-lui-cesur-durak-pentru-un-colon-sanatos-si-un-sistem-imunitar-intarit-ce-contine-fresh-ul-care-te-scapa-de-durerile-de-colon-20173292 https://www.wowbiz.ro/specialistul-in-nutritie-si-detox-cesur-durak-prepara-bautura-care-arde-grasimile-20056544 https://www.wowbiz.ro/reteta-minune-a-lui-cesur-durak-care-inlocuieste-cu-succes-antibioticele-de-ce-ingrediente-ai-nevoie-pentru-a-obtine-un-cocktail-natural-cu-proprietati-antiinflamatorii-20181656 https://www.wowbiz.ro/reteta-minune-a-lui-cesur-durak-care-inlocuieste-cu-succes-antibioticele-de-ce-ingrediente-ai-nevoie-pentru-a-obtine-un-cocktail-natural-cu-proprietati-antiinflamatorii-20181656 Ihcm (talk) 23:07, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * I think it can be notable depending on if they are a significant part of the program that they appear in. We are not talking about A TV show here. We're talking about stuff like being the feature guest on this womans show on national television, being the main guest on a show called the Teo Show on national television several times in 2019 and several in 2021 such as this example, being brought on as a contributor on a news segment on national TV. These are all on Kanal D. Then theres several features on the channel Prima TV such as this example. Being featured on shows goes back to even 2014 like this example on StarsDirect. I am not familiar with Prima TV and Stars, but Kanal D I do know, and it is big. I'm not saying this guy is doing anything useful for society, but he does appear to be, undeniably, notable in Romania. Gazozlu (talk) 23:36, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment Same style of refs above, except similiar to IMDB listing sites. One of the same ref. Primary. Not a single secondary source amongst it. Its all him. Its a complete PUFF piece ref list.   scope_creep Talk  22:56, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete Reads like a puff piece, area ripe for promotion. It would be nice to have someone who speaks Romanian to evaluate the sources more adeptly, but meh. Ovinus (talk) 22:58, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, but if you don't care about the news of Romania's national TV channels and national print media, if you don't know Romanian or if you don't read or translate in English, if you ignore hundreds of news links and TV programs and call them promotions, there's nothing to tell you, but you need to respect those who live in Romania and are well-known.i am sure soon this page will translate to romanian languages as well and i find one link also when he attend International Health Congress. The Turkish national and the Romanian Detox specialist Cesur Durak visited Baku to attend the International Health Congress. https://ednews.net/en/news/society/400354-baku-hosted-international-health-congress Ihcm (talk) 23:23, 29 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Of course I respect Romanian media, like that of any free country. But it’s difficult for me to evaluate Romanian sources for relevance and quality. You are welcome (and encouraged) to summarize some of the sources in English to help the rest of us. Ovinus (talk) 00:24, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
 * +1 the above. Though again, considering the Turkish sources are absolute shit, I doubt the Romanian ones are any different, so you need to be very good at convincing. ~Styyx Talk ? 11:37, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment This ref here is an event listing, where the detox specialist Durak is invited to the conference. It is primary again. They are all primary. The Youtube ref above has 177 views. It is non-notable. The 2nd one has 8k views and he is on the teo show making a concotion on the Teo show as guest.The 3rd Youtube vlog is a note with 4k views stating his clinic has opened. It is primary. The 4th is him on the Stars Direct. It has 600 views and is primary.  There is not a single secondary source been presented that proves he is notable. It all from the detox clinic.    scope_creep Talk  10:31, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
 * I think you are missing the point here by focusing on the view count of an archived recordings of programs that have appeared on air on national TV. Gazozlu (talk) 13:11, 30 September 2022 (UTC)


 * The sources provided aren't reliable and substantive coverage of the subject, per wiki guidelines. Let's keep this discussion civil folks. Oaktree b (talk) 14:55, 30 September 2022 (UTC)
 * It seems like SPA's calling people racists in AfDs is the new trend? Whatever. I don't think anyone here cares about the YouTube links above, I've checked them and they are all his appearances in the exact same TV show. Appearing on TV is mentioned in no notability guideline so they are pretty much irrelevant. I've checked the Turkish sources in the article because I know Turkish, and came to the conclusion that they are all from unreliable vanity press sites that publish an article about you if you have some $$$ in hand, so yeah, these sources are shit. I don't know much about Romanian media, but common sense says that there is no reason to believe they are good when we consider the previous, especcialy when the sites are so insignificant to not even have an article on the Romanian Wikipedia. 80% of the sources are from a random website called Wowbiz (ro:Wowbiz, blue link but doesn't exist), which has a message at the very bottom on their website that says "If you want to write to us or if you want to make us a proposal, you can send your letter or message to one of the addresses below: [List of addresses]". Sorry, but we've seen enough paid editors to know what promotional sources are. ~Styyx Talk ? 16:27, 30 September 2022 (UTC)

Comment Mr/Mrs Dr vulpes there is not writing in this news about selling snake oil or snake etc that you put up The link ( https://evz.ro/reteta-pentru-detoxifierea-ficatului.html ) Translation of the news is ; ''Specialist Cesur Durak says that this liver detox drink should be consumed in two stages of 15 days, according to Drink parsley and lemon juice every morning, on an empty stomach, 30-45 minutes before breakfast, for 15 days. After a 7-day break, another 15-day cure is made, during which the liver detoxifying juice is consumed. Cesur Durak warnts that the program must be respected: 15 days of detoxification, 7 days of rest, another 15 days of detoxification''. And also in the news mentions that this news is a quote from wowbiz. ro and this is orginal and main news link https://www.wowbiz.ro/bautura-minune-cu-patrunjel-si-zeama-de-lamaie-care-iti-detoxifiaza-ficatul-specialistul-in-detox-cesur-durak-iti-arata-cum-se-prepara-20003582 So its show also in your this comment you give wrong information and translations .I am sorry but that much wrong informations and translations you comment here make me thinks you or any of your friend has personal problem with mr cesur durakIhcm (talk) 14:20, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment Yeah so there are some sources but we have WP:NBIO for a reason. The man is selling snake oil and we're here fighting about if the sources are good enough.  Dr vulpes  (💬 • 📝) 05:55, 1 October 2022 (UTC)
 * That is actually correct; I tend to find undisclosed paid editing almost always problematic. And the fact that you are still giving us those junk sites again doesn't make anything better. ~Styyx Talk ? 14:57, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Comment information Some more translation and information from Romanian media about cesur durak with refecance links.so why we do not look as a realistic way to think this part also, the reason Mr cesur Durak is often in Kanal D tv chanell.Kanal D is one of the three biggest national television channels in Romania as a TV channel. and is also one of Turkey's biggest TV station and press groups. Kanal_D_(Romania) and wowbiz.ro was the biggest reality show in canal D Romania and also is canal d Romania online news paper site. As we know, many well-known and famous people have an exlusive agreement with some TV channels and only appear in programs on that TV channel due to the protocol and agreement on their subjects. except that as i put in my comments so many links also so many another news mention about him i will put some more links with some translation from the news. https://okmagazine.ro/vedete/news/claudia-pavel-a-pierdut-5-kg-intr-o-saptamana-544176.html Translation ; ''Cesur Durak have become a real phenomenon on the domestic market, and so far, many personalities have turned to him: Oana Turcu and her husband, Cristi Brancu, Mădălin Ionescu and Cristina Şişcanu, Mihaela Tatu, Ileana Badiu, Daniela Nane, Adrian Mutu, Cătălin Botezatu and many others. It seems that Cesur Durak will soon become as famous in the country as his countryman, Dr Oz dın Amerıca.'' if you check the names that in the news mentions are Romanian national and some of them international know people that have been and following Cesur Durak detox health programs you can find so many articles like this in Romanian media one more link and translations https://www.eva.ro/shopping/divertisment/claudia-pavel-a-slabit-cu-detox-in-turcia-articol-123677.html Translation ; It seems that Cesur Durak will soon become as famous in the country as his countryman, Dr Oz dın Amerıca. this one of article with cesur durak and well know footbal player Adrian Mutu https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrian_Mutu while he was in his detox program https://www.wowbiz.ro/interviu-exclusiv-adrian-mutu-despre-vacanta-lui-in-turcia-e-liniste-si-pace-fostul-mare-fotbalist-si-sotia-lui-sandra-au-avut-parte-de-un-concediu-de-5-stele-alaturi-de-cesur-durak-specialist-in-programe-de-detoxifiere-16412325 well there is a lot news that shows soo many known public, politicions etc follows and joining his detox health program some more links from difrent news paper https://ziaruldebusiness.ro/cesur-durak-a-primit-premiul-pentru-best-detox-specialist-medical-tourism-consultant-la-gala-i-success-awards-cannes-edition/ https://celebritatea.ro/cesur-durak-a-primit-premiul-pentru-best-detox-specialist-medical-tourism-consultant-la-gala-i-success-awards-cannes-edition/ I think mr/mrs editors will see and check all this referance links puted i wish to every one great weekend and to be unbiased and researcher and of course to share the correct information and translation on the wikipedia platform without making any wrong translations.Ihcm (talk) 15:41, 1 October 2022 (UTC)

Summarising Comment - This conversation got really long and messy, but I think the underlying question that needs answering here is: Does apparent fame, celebrity, and prominent (TV)media presence = notability for wikipedia?--Gazozlu (talk) 12:38, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
 * The lead of WP:N says: "Determining notability does not necessarily depend on things such as fame, importance, or popularity". Appearing on TV doesn't either; that would mean that every news anchor is automatically notable. No thanks. ~Styyx Talk ? 19:50, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
 * I read that as, "The person does not have to be famous or popular in order to be notable" for wikipedia. Gazozlu (talk) 11:35, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * It goes both ways, so what you said is also correct. ~Styyx Talk ? 12:25, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * My reasoning for why I do read it as being implied one way:
 * It says "does not necessarily depend on things such as fame." Using necessarily in this sentence implies that notability may depend on fame.
 * (There may be cases where notability depends on fame)
 * If the sentence said "does not depend on things such as fame." Only then it would go both ways because if it is written that way it says that a subjects notability is not connected to its fame. Gazozlu (talk) 14:17, 3 October 2022 (UTC)

comment and Thanks Thank you Mr DavidnotMD for your usefull informations that you give me atTeahouse as i am very new in wikipedia to prove my self i wanted to contribute. As i live in Romania and i know romanian i will make sort translations for main news articles with referancet t links at talk page For Wikipedia reviewers, editors and Administrators i will contribute at article page.Because i know and i blieve that nobody cannot be invited from so many years AS A DETOX SPECIALIST to explain natural recipes and to talk about healthy lifestyle to the one of the bigest national TV station while for the tv raiting is very important and main in come. Thank you for all here that helpms me to use wikipedia and to be part for and contribute soon i will check Romanian persons and companies to contribute also Ihcm (talk) 14:32, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete - Sources are all unreliable sponcon junk. The 'award' he won is set up by a PR firm, apparently as a means of promoting their clients. - MrOllie (talk) 15:48, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete - As it exists on 2 October, most of the content in Career has nothing to do with any career, and the one award is so minor as to be useless to establish notability. David notMD (talk) 20:25, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment - Although at no point stated above, it is possible that User Ihcm is Cesur Durak. David notMD (talk) 20:35, 2 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment InfoI think if the prize was paid ″just i put couple of them″ these well-known people i put links wouldn't get paid prizes there either and wouldn't be that much national and international news in press an Tv channels l like to help and inform every one here because of i live and know about romania []   just some press links without Tv program links            There are online media that quote and report more news, but I didn't want to leave them all.Ihcm (talk) 10:14, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Comment - Name-dropping Wikilinked people that Durak has met or perhaps befriended does not add to his notability. David notMD (talk) 11:30, 3 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Delete, promotional article.-- Kadı   Message   14:59, 4 October 2022 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.