Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chōsokabe Chikatada


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was keep.  Sandstein  14:07, 8 January 2019 (UTC)

Chōsokabe Chikatada

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A year ago, this article was proposed for deletion. It has been the product of someone's imagination since 2009 (no references). The PROD was deleted with the reasoning that only a Japanese speaker is qualified to referee. English-only speakers are unqualified to evaluate this article in the English language Wikipedia. Rhadow (talk) 18:35, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Japan-related deletion discussions. IntoThinAir (talk) 19:19, 25 December 2018 (UTC)


 * Keep Finding information about this person isn't easy, but it is out there. I found two books on Google books who have Chikatada in the index (not just one page)(I can't access the books). Wikipedia.jp has an article on the clan (it would take a little to get all the information, but it might help clear up other, similar articles). Wikipedia.it also has information. A site called The Samurai Archives also has a short article about them (unsure of the source, but they are interested in Japanese history and not gaming or anime). Aurornisxui (talk) 20:30, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Note I added a See Also section with links to the below mentioned Wikipedia.jp article, the list of books on Google.jp, and the Samuri Archive I mentioned. I do not know Japanese, but I will attempt to add actual references. At the least, I will add a tag for a professional to help with the problem. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Aurornisxui (talk • contribs) 17:16, 26 December 2018 (UTC)
 * "The Samurai Archives" is pretty clearly not a reliable source. Few reputable historians would brag about being associated with the History Channel in 2018. Something like half the proper nouns (not to mention more than a few of the common English words) in this page are misspelled. This variously marks and doesn't mark long vowels, then thinks that two words that in Japanese are distinguished by vowel length are the same word ("taiko"). This includes the hilariously anachronistic he traveled to Kamakura, which had become the military capitol of Japan after the Minamoto overcame the Fujiwara clan. This page appears to be a copy-paste of another source that misspelled the name of Empress Jingū, and appears to think "Taika" is the name of an emperor. Maybe some of their interviews are useful as primary sources for the opinions of the interviewees, but we can't rely on such a website for basic information when said information has a good chance of being wrong, let alone for notability. Hijiri 88 ( 聖やや ) 15:32, 1 January 2019 (UTC)


 * Note: the Japanese version of the article has his name at Tsuno Chikatada, which is actually the kanji (津野 親忠) that our article gives for his name. The J-article does cite sources, by the way¸ and his name gets several hundred GBooks hits, so the article's definitely not a "product of someone's imagination".  Per WP:BEFORE, I would have expected someone to at least have GBook searched the kanji of his name, even if they weren't a J-speaker. Curly "JFC" Turkey 🍁 ¡gobble! 21:23, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
 * While echoing the above, I am sympathetic to the nomination because as it stands the article basically doesn't assert individual notability. Dekimasu よ! 22:13, 25 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 01:07, 26 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of History-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 01:07, 26 December 2018 (UTC)

 Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.

Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Jovanmilic97 (talk) 12:27, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
 * COMMENT We shouldn't be deleting this article without getting input from the Japanese project. I'll send them a message FOARP (talk) 14:51, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Neutral Not all that much lost or gained if this article is deleted/redirected. I don't know (or have the ability to quickly find out) a whole lot about this time period, but the article is messy and doesn't demonstrate or claim independent notability. I saw this AFD yesterday and thought about the same but didn't think it was worth noting. I took a look at some of the several hundred GBooks hits and what I saw was either name-drops with nothing much to add to our article or works of fiction. Hijiri 88 ( 聖やや ) 15:07, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
 * If TSA's (unreliable) claim that is was because of his being murdered by his own people that Tokugawa Ieyasu harshly judged Morichika for this and used it as a basis to deprive him of his domain. can be attributed to a reliable source, that would probably be the basis for a standalone article, but our article doesn't currently make this claim and it can't be attributed to TSA. Hijiri 88 ( 聖やや ) 15:32, 1 January 2019 (UTC)


 * We could probably draftify this, but that would be tantamount to deletion because it doesn't seem likely anyone will pick the article up and work on it. This is one of the most "meh" AfD discussions I've seen. With respect to input from editors who understand Japanese, we're already fine on that count. But the answer still seems to be "meh". Dekimasu よ! 19:19, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
 * No problem with deleting it then. FOARP (talk) 22:08, 1 January 2019 (UTC)
 * Weak keep: I do not see a strong reason for deleting this; I have made a start by correcting the Japanese names, so it at least is plausible to Japanese readers. Imaginatorium (talk) 12:55, 3 January 2019 (UTC)
 * If you're willing to work on this, wouldn't it make sense to put it in your userspace per User:Dekimasu's suggestion? Hijiri 88 ( 聖やや ) 23:56, 3 January 2019 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.