Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Chelmer Valley High School


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.  

The result was keep. W.marsh 03:01, 20 October 2007 (UTC)

Chelmer Valley High School

 * – (View AfD) (View log)

does not meet Wikipedia:Notability and a google produces nothing of note Valenciano 14:37, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete: Does not appear to be notable in any way. - Rjd0060 15:01, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Very weak Keep: Based on new information on the Gymnastic Display Team. I don' think that is extremely notable; weak because there is no other notability present. - Rjd0060 17:38, 18 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Comment American high schools are considered inherently notable. Could someone please find a policy statement on British high schools?  Nyttend 15:03, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * No, there is no policy at all for schools, be they high, American, elementary, Tanganykinan, or whatnot. The community has failed to reach a consensus on that. See Schools So, there is only the general criteria (wp:not, wp:nfo, wp:n, wp:rs, wp:v, etc) for inclusion available. The fact that high schools tend to not get deleted is that their pupils make more of a fuss when they are nominated than ten-year olds.--Victor falk 16:20, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Um, no, most high schools are kept because they can be shown to pass WP:NOTE with a little bit of research. Not because their "pupils make a fuss". That said, I'm out of my element when it comes to British schools, so I'll just hope that someone with access to British newspapers can make a fair judgment about this place. Zagalejo ^ ^  ^  19:33, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Exactly, the "notability" of most schools in wikipedia is that fleeting mentions of them have been made of them in local media coverage. And the vast majority does not even assert such notability--Victor falk 23:15, 13 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete I'm very sorry, but I'm afraid the fact that "The school are very sad to say that Mrs Godfrey will be leaving on maternity leave very soon and a temporary replacement will be needed" and "that the blue coated Mr Barnard" received "THE UNSUNG HERO AWARD" can not be considered worthy of an encyclopedic article. To be unsung is the fate of a hero. --Victor falk 16:20, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Remember that we are discussing the subject of the article, not the present content. If we have to, we can cut out most of the fluff and turn this into a stub. Zagalejo ^ ^  ^  19:34, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * It's all fluff. Have you looked at it? You have nothing absolutely to start with, nothing. Just the title. What makes Chelmer Valley not run-of-the-mill? Is it located in a medieval castle? Have pupils or teachers achieved something outstanding? Did a scandal with political repercussions happen there? Just say something that could make an article encyclopedic instead of a mere yellow poages entry.--Victor falk 23:15, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, I've looked at the article. The first paragraph, at least, seems to have legitimately encyclopedic information. It needs sourcing and cleanup, but it's a start.
 * A school doesn't have to be located in a castle or the site of a political scandal to be notable. As long as it's received non-trivial media coverage, it's notable enough for Wikipedia. This particular school has received some attention, although again, I would apreciate if someone with access to more English sources could chime in. Zagalejo ^ ^  ^  23:39, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * non-trivial? 42 google news hits? from the archives?!--Victor falk 01:34, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Your point being...? It's hard to respond to a series of exclamations. Give me a real sentence or two.
 * In any case, I'm not saying those articles establish notability. I don't know much about the nature of those particular sources, which is why I'd still like for someone with more expertise in this area to chime in. I was just throwing the link out there to show that some coverage exists. Zagalejo ^ ^  ^  01:48, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm sorry, I was a bit stumped. In one sentence, "do you consider 42 hits from google news' archive non-trivial coverage". --Victor falk 04:18, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, newspaper articles are better than random mentions on the web. The fact that they're archived is nothing to *gasp* about; they're just as valid as any other sources. I do wish that there were articles from a broader variety of newspapers, which is why I haven't actually recommended to keep this article. But it is possible that more coverage exists somewhere, so I'm hoping someone with access to additional English sources could stop by this discussion.Zagalejo ^  ^  ^  04:50, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * What we've learned so far is that if that school was a news story, its headline'd be "dog barks at man".--Victor falk 06:02, 14 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete Non-notable. &mdash; trey  omg he's back 21:11, 13 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Weak Keep Based on improvements. &mdash; trey  omg he's back 21:15, 19 October 2007 (UTC)


 * there is nothing wrong with it, keep it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Chelmsfordcityfc (talk • contribs) 21:52, 13 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Delete. An article on Chelmer Valley HS could be written but this is definitely not it; there's barely a single salvageable piece of information in it. Sam Blacketer 23:41, 13 October 2007 (UTC) As rewritten this should now be kept. Sam Blacketer 09:44, 19 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Weak keep based on WP:AFDP. — xDanielx T/C 01:24, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * You do realize that that is no different than saying "Keep based on WP:ILIKEIT"? That essay (meaning just the opinion of those who wrote it, it is NOT a policy or even a guideline) is just saying what the common outcome for articles are (and even that I would debate, since high school articles are no longer kept most of the time).
 * Just curious, when was the last time a high school article was deleted? (For notability reasons, not copyvio or something like that.) Zagalejo ^ ^  ^  02:29, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Well, WP:CONSENSUS is a policy, and a rather key one at that. Sure, WP:AFDP can be modified by anyone, at least in theory -- so can almost any policy or guideline. Precedents aren't strictly binding, but they are relevant in evaluating consensus, especially in cases like these -- high schools tend to share relatively similar degrees of significance, so the precedent is very much pertinent to the discussion. AFD has seen many hundreds, perhaps thousands of high school nominations, so the discrepancy in sample sizes of this particular AfD and the much broader precedent is significant. So no, my rationale wasn't WP:ILIKEIT, or anything of that sort; it was WP:ILIKEFOLLOWINGCONSENSUS. And do note the weak keep. — xDanielx T/C 06:06, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete Nothing notable about the school. TJ Spyke 01:58, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep. Multiple sources exist to write a credible article on a notable school. I've started to tidy the article up, though there is lots more to be done. The school is particularly notable for its Blue Gymnastics display team which seems to have a place in the Guinness Book of Records. References are still needed but will no doubt be available. Will try and do some more later if no one else gets there first. Dahliarose 11:14, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Comment. I've now tidied up the article and added a section on the World Record-holding Blue Falcons display team. The notability of the school is clearly established. It's a potential Do You Know candidate for the front page if anyone has the time to expand the article five-fold within the next four days. Dahliarose 11:47, 18 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Note: This debate has been included in the list of Schools-related deletions.   —Noroton 03:55, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete per Victor and Rjd. CRGreathouse (t | c) 19:54, 14 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Delete as nn school. Eusebeus 23:03, 15 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep per Dahliasose. VivianDarkbloom 21:46, 16 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep - Notable school as shown by the Blue Falcons world record and public appearances. Rated Outstanding by Ofsted. Multiple sources meet WP:N. TerriersFan 17:19, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Weak delete, as written and referenced, notability is not asserted (and I don't by the inherent notability line), however if it's a specialist engineering school, that might confer some notability if good refs could be found, especially if any awards or special competitions have been won.  AK Radecki Speaketh  16:13, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep - rewrite has established notability based on the gymnastics team notability. I still feel that further notability based on the engineering school is likely, and the article could use better references, but that lack is not, in itself, a reason to delete.  AK Radecki Speaketh  13:18, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep LordHarris 19:28, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Strong Keep One of Wikipedia's goals is to attract younger users. We have templates for high schools with bunches of red links waiting for articles to be created. Nothing will turn off a fledging Wikipedian faster than to delete his or her high school. Older Wikipedians can help the younger ones by showing them how to do it. If you delete an article, chances are it will never be recreated, because whoever tries will get messages such as "You're are trying to recreate an article that has been deleted," etc, and will give up. So why not help them out. Suggest to the students that they dig into their local libraries to see what they can find out about the school, I've done this in the high school I graduated from as well as others that I came across only by a link in an article on the locality they were in. clariosophic 21:06, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep. Well-sourced and marginally notable.  I don't buy into the whole "all schools are notable" nonsense, but this article passes in my book.  &#10154; Hi DrNick ! 22:37, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Keep Nice research, people! Zagalejo ^ ^  ^  23:10, 18 October 2007 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.