Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Collective responsibility in Russia and the Russian invasion of Ukraine


 * The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review).  No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was delete‎__EXPECTED_UNCONNECTED_PAGE__. Extraordinary Writ (talk) 18:24, 25 August 2023 (UTC)

Collective responsibility in Russia and the Russian invasion of Ukraine

 * – ( View AfD View log | edits since nomination)

Looks like a textbook case of WP:SYNTH and WP:COATRACK. A large part of the article covers the tangential topic of German collective guilt, and another large part is based on a single Carnegie source that says nothing about collective guilt, but only about the Russian society's reaction to war. The rest is a bunch of sensation-mongering media op-eds discussing ad nauseam who's to blame for the war, and whether or not there's "collective guilt". As there's no concept of "collective guilt" in international law, the idea is purely abstract/philosophical, and hence the requirements for academic RS are particularly stringent (say, German collective guilt gained notability because figures like Jaspers, Adorno and Arendt wrote extensively on it - nothing like that appears here so far). --HPfan4 (talk) 03:54, 18 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Comment. I have not looked at the current version closely yet but it is worth noting that this article was a translation of the Ukrainian Wikipedia article which was written by a sock of a LTA (User:Jafaz) who was originally topic banned from the area for POV-pushing. Mellk (talk) 09:02, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Russia-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 09:33, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Military-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 09:33, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Ukraine-related deletion discussions.  CAPTAIN RAJU (T) 09:33, 18 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Keep. The nomination seems to accept that this is a possible valid subject, but I’ll reinforce that by noting that we have articles on overlapping and closely related subjects: Collective responsibility, German collective guilt, Collective punishment, Good Russians, Great Russian chauvinism, Russian imperialism, Ruscism, Russian world, Russian irredentism, Krymnash, Accusations of genocide in Donbas, Ukrainian nationalism, Banderite, Disinformation in the Russian invasion of Ukraine, Internet Research Agency, Crucified boy, &c.
 * But the crux is WP:GNG, and the nomination claims there’re no sources on the subject. The article does already reference at least one. In a quick search I found some more sources on the subject or on major aspects of it in web search,, in scholarly articles, and in books. So I believe there is sufficient coverage. —Michael Z. 20:20, 18 August 2023 (UTC)
 * It looks like you did not bother to read all of those sources. Mellk (talk) 03:27, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
 * How many of them support keeping the article, in your opinion? —Michael Z. 14:36, 19 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete per nomination, a textbook example of COATRACK Ymblanter (talk) 01:47, 20 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Delete - I don't see COATRACK here as much as POV, NOR, NOTESSAY and SYNTH. The POV is especially strong, to the point that there isn't anything to salvage (even if there were a good target for a Merge or Redir, which there is not). Cheers, Last1in (talk) 03:08, 22 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Delete commenting current version COATRACK exists (3 out of 4 paragraphs in section History), but is not the biggest issue here. As I see it, the article suffers from the same disease most articles dealing with current events: Synth. For example. Look at section "Volodymyr Zelenskyy", the first two big paragraphs. Two references, non of them discusses the "collective responsibility of russians". The Editor(s) of the WP article, changed the context of the newspaper articles, but cited them to "verify" the points made in the WP article. I consider this as OR and Synth. So, my verdict is: Delete. Cinadon36 23:41, 24 August 2023 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.